Apple Athenry data centre

dubhthach

ezstreet5 wrote: »

You are probably right - Microsoft are probably still king. DUB03 thru DUB05 (to the northwest and not shown) are an additional 40MW. Altogether, when construction on DUB09 thru DUB13 is complete, MSFT will be 180MW on 44ha. (For reference, Apple was to be 240MW on 197ha).

Turning to a slightly different topic, I wandered down to the RDS for Host in Ireland's Data Centres Ireland 2018 conference last week. With regard to the size/scale and energy use of hypersacale facilities, two innovations caught my eye. First, South Dublin Council appear committed to develop a district heating system to use waste heat from Amazon: https://irl.eu-supply.com/ctm/Supplier/PublicTenders/ViewNotice/207744.

Second, there were two exhibitors advocating immersion cooling. 3M has developed a two-phase system: https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/novec-us/applications/immersion-cooling/, and a Swiss company, Immersion4, has developed a single-phase solution: www.immersion4.com/. While the single-phase solution seems simpler (and therefore preferable), the general shift from air cooling to liquid cooling promises to reduce energy consumption by >30% (over free air cooling) and data centre building area by >80%. The technology seems fairly mature, and would indeed transform the industry. Thoughts?

You also got Google south of the Nangor Road (Profile Park), I'd imagine in general the whole Grange Castle area probably got the most dense concentration of DC's in Dublin area.

Well what 3m is proposing isn't that new tbh, it's basically what CDC were doing back in the 1960's and what Cray used in 70's (though obviously on individual mainframes and not fully immersive), various people have been proposing it over the last 10 years. I imagine given limits we are seeing on clock speed (and effect on single threaded performance) that you might see some takeup. Though obviously I imagine the picture might be very different by 2030 particulary given increased spotlight on DC providers when it comes to energy consumption etc.

salmocab

dubhthach wrote: »

You also got Google south of the Nangor Road (Profile Park), I'd imagine in general the whole Grange Castle area probably got the most dense concentration of DC's in Dublin area.

Well what 3m is proposing isn't that new tbh, it's basically what CDC were doing back in the 1960's and what Cray used in 70's (though obviously on individual mainframes and not fully immersive), various people have been proposing it over the last 10 years. I imagine given limits we are seeing on clock speed (and effect on single threaded performance) that you might see some takeup. Though obviously I imagine the picture might be very different by 2030 particulary given increased spotlight on DC providers when it comes to energy consumption etc.

2 more planned for grangecastle I think, one was 40mw can’t remember the other. Sirus I think was one of them. Both announced in the last 8 weeks. Don’t know where the tradesmen will come from for building with The children’s hospital, FB expansion, Big Amazon in blanch, Intel kicking off as well as all the work in the city.

ezstreet5

Deleted User wrote: »

The project was canned

Canned!

Robbo

For the first time sitting in Galway, the Supreme Court will hear the appeal of Allan Daly & Sinead Fitzpatrick on March 6th.

There should be a judgment published this week on the preliminary matters decided in the above report.

whineflu

I work in a multinational tech firm doing live services. We have 400 onsite here in Galway and a data centre on the East Coast. We had a joint Christmas party last week and discovered the full contingent of staff in the data centre is... 4.
You heard it... 4.
Jobs me ar$e

salmocab

whineflu wrote: »

I work in a multinational tech firm doing live services. We have 400 onsite here in Galway and a data centre on the East Coast. We had a joint Christmas party last week and discovered the full contingent of staff in the data centre is... 4.
You heard it... 4.
Jobs me ar$e

Don’t think anyone thinks there are huge amounts working in DCs, the Apple one was to be a big site with decent numbers there. The 4 ye have aren’t knocking about the building on their own there are security and cleaners too. It’s obviously quite a small DC, are the 4 doing IT stuff or are they the techs who look after the electrical and mechanical parts of the building?

whineflu

salmocab wrote: »

It’s obviously quite a small DC, are the 4 doing IT stuff or are they the techs who look after the electrical and mechanical parts of the building?

From my brief conversation... those four are the guys who need to be on site for physical access. Most of the actual configuration is done remotely. I didn't ask about the army of cleaners and security. I should have while I had the chance, to put that one to bed.

Mrs OBumble

salmocab wrote: »

Don’t think anyone thinks there are huge amounts working in DCs, the Apple one was to be a big site with decent numbers there. The 4 ye have aren’t knocking about the building on their own there are security and cleaners too. It’s obviously quite a small DC, are the 4 doing IT stuff or are they the techs who look after the electrical and mechanical parts of the building?

How many cleaners does it take to look after 4 core staff?

I can understand a few security staff say 5 FTE and one casual to provide 24x7x365 cover. But cleaners .... maybe two hours/week.

Gadgetman496

http://www.onepartner.com/news/clean-the-data-center

dubhthach

No one can run a datacenter full time 24*7*365 on 4 staff. Sounds to me like a fairly small setup. For example DEG in Kilcarberry Park (Equinix DB02) which is fairly small colocation DC (compared to Hyperscalers) has a minimum of 2 staff on for the night shift. Night Shift staff tend to work 7 night on and 7 days off. So just for night staff they require a minimum of 4 staff members to cover 365 operation. During the day whenever I'm out there there is usually between 4-6 in the NOC (Network Operations) + security guard + various contractors such as Electricians, plumbers etc.

And that's a fairly small DC, just look at it here compare to the surronding Microsoft Azure behemoths

salmocab

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

How many cleaners does it take to look after 4 core staff?

I can understand a few security staff say 5 FTE and one casual to provide 24x7x365 cover. But cleaners .... maybe two hours/week.

Yeah minimal cleaners but the point I was making is there are more than 4 people working there. Nobody is claiming that they create a pile of jobs but they do create jobs both high paid tech jobs and lower paid roles such as security and cleaning. Then there is a pile of contractors who are kept going coming back to these places to service the cooling systems, generators, UPSs fire alarms, sprinklers AHUs etc.

salmocab

whineflu wrote: »

From my brief conversation... those four are the guys who need to be on site for physical access. Most of the actual configuration is done remotely. I didn't ask about the army of cleaners and security. I should have while I had the chance, to put that one to bed.

So by physical access I presume you mean to do work on the actual servers, it’s likely there are also electricians working there full time looking after the building

The Supreme Court has reserved judgment in the case i.e. They are deferring their decision to a later date

At this stage, I think this is going to end up in the European Courts either by the Supreme Court referring the case or an appeal if they make a decision

https://www.galwaydaily.com/news/apple-athenry-saga-goes-on-as-supreme-court-reserves-judgement/

what_traffic

Spotted following article in the Irish Times today. https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/high-court/court-to-rule-later-on-an-bord-plean%C3%A1la-s-handling-of-apple-data-centre-plan-1.3816666

"
An appeal by two local residents over the board’s decision was heard by a five judge Supreme Court, sitting at NUI Galway, on Wednesday.
"

dubhthach

Meanwhile Facebook got Planning on the contuined expansion of their Clonee campus. This will increase it from 2 to 4 data halls, the plan is to get to 8 eventually.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/technology/facebook-set-to-double-size-of-data-centre-in-co-meath-1.3816269

The best outcome that can come from this now is these two objectors ending up on the street due debt from losing court cases so we can at least laugh at them.

salmocab

dubhthach wrote: »

Meanwhile Facebook got Planning on the contuined expansion of their Clonee campus. This will increase it from 2 to 4 data halls, the plan is to get to 8 eventually.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/technology/facebook-set-to-double-size-of-data-centre-in-co-meath-1.3816269

It’s from 3 buildings to 5 with 4 data halls in each. FB seem to have more staff per site than any other DC so it’s good news

Ardent

Johnny Poor Lemonade wrote: »

The best outcome that can come from this now is these two objectors ending up on the street due debt from losing court cases so we can at least laugh at them.

That won't happen. They are no doubt bankrolled by interested parties.

Robbo

Deleted User wrote: »

The Supreme Court has reserved judgment in the case i.e. They are deferring their decision to a later date

At this stage, I think this is going to end up in the European Courts either by the Supreme Court referring the case or an appeal if they make a decision

https://www.galwaydaily.com/news/apple-athenry-saga-goes-on-as-supreme-court-reserves-judgement/

There's no appeal from the Supreme Court to the CJEU. A referral may be made, the CJEU may make a decision and then send the matter back to the Supreme Court. Indeed in the interim judgment published last year, the Supreme Court has acknowledged the possibility that a referral may be necessary to decide the matter.

You may be confusing the CJEU with the ECtHR.

salmocab

Those appeals are just a waste, I know lads working in Denmark on the second building for Apple it’s effectively the one that should have been in Athenry.

Robbo

Appeal rejected, unanimously. No issue of European Law raised that would merit a referral to the CJEU.

ezstreet5

The news from Denmark is not fantastic either....

Construction Halts on Apple Data Center in Denmark
https://www.cultofmac.com/619370/construction-halted-apple-data-center-denmark/

Tech Told to Pay for Wind Farms
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/business/tech-told-pay-for-wind-farms-917493.html?fbclid=IwAR1ul3kc-FbiMrl8OJ7TELcxyD6i05roh-Vjd1uJt6ECHVTewIDiNG__qL8

Hyperscalers Unlikely to Feed Danish District Heat Systems, Says Study
https://www.datacenterdynamics.com/news/hyperscalers-unlikely-feed-danish-district-heat-systems-says-study/

salmocab

The first link is odd but the others aren’t really any kind of news.

ezstreet5

salmocab wrote: »

The first link is odd but the others aren’t really any kind of news.

The third article shows how environmental comittments are reneged upon when not written into planning conditions.

For example, Apple's 2017 Environmental Sustainability Report says (of the Viborg DC), "The facility is designed to capture excess heat from its equipment and conduct it to the local district heating system to warm homes in the community."

That sentence has been conspiculously scrubbed from Apple's 2018 report. Apple's inability to deliver that aspect of the project is news for those that care about such things. Bad news.

salmocab

I’m honestly not seeing a story here, the Danes could force that on them through planning if they wished but aren’t.

Wompa1

Apple have a history or reneging. I'm living in Arizona right now. The committed to a deal with a company based in Mesa for iPhone screens. They reneged 6 months before the company was expected to be operating at full capacity. A $578 million contract cancelled. The company in question had to immediately file for bankruptcy.

The real kick is they built the factory and leased it to the company they contracted with. When the company went out of business and unable to fund a legacy challenge, Apple just rolled forward and repurposed the building into a new data center.

They credited the Mesa for being so quick with permits and making it easy to get it setup. Internally now using them as an example and referring to it as "the Mesa way"

700 people lost their jobs when the contract was reneged. They state they will employ up to 500 people for the DC.

https://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/news/2018/08/15/see-inside-apples-2-billion-data-center-in-mesa.html

If Panorama showed anything, it's that Apple doesn't give a sh1t about people.

ezstreet5

Despite the construction delays (and now reported stoppage) at Viborg, it's interesting to see that the Viborg planning authority is approving an expansion of that DC for 3 additional data halls (9 total). And some locals do not appear happy. The planning file includes a petition signed by 55 objectors stating (auto translated):

"Protest signatures against Viborg municipality's planning for enlargement of the business area east of Blichersalle. NO THANKS - For an extension of the business area into a further 25ha of good agricultural land! Apple - enough is enough!"

My Danish isn't great, but it appears from the record that the main concern is that construction is causing a royal nuisance for a variety of reasons.

https://kommune.viborg.dk/Borger/Byggeri,-bolig-og-flytning/Kommune-og-lokalplanlaegning/Lokalplaner/Lokalplanforslag/Lokalplan_518_Forslag

threeball

salmocab wrote: »

The first link is odd but the others aren’t really any kind of news.

Nonsense, it shows that these Tech companies have zero social or environmental responsibility. They place massive strain on resources whilst giving next to nothing back to the economy. They make silly claims of running on renewable energy because they enter into a contract with a windfarm in offaly or donegal to feed their datacentre in dublin yet feed it off the same grid as the rest of us. This depletes our renewable contributions and reduces our ability to meet european CO2 targets so we the tax payer end up paying fines.

The data centres send millions of kw of heat energy to atmosphere that can be used to heat thousands of homes and reneging on such obligations shows what these companies are all about. Its actually beneficial to the datacentre as it would be cheaper to cool.

pure.conya

Wompa1 wrote: »

Apple have a history or reneging. I'm living in Arizona right now. The committed to a deal with a company based in Mesa for iPhone screens. They reneged 6 months before the company was expected to be operating at full capacity. A $578 million contract cancelled. The company in question had to immediately file for bankruptcy.

The real kick is they built the factory and leased it to the company they contracted with. When the company went out of business and unable to fund a legacy challenge, Apple just rolled forward and repurposed the building into a new data center.

They credited the Mesa for being so quick with permits and making it easy to get it setup. Internally now using them as an example and referring to it as "the Mesa way"

700 people lost their jobs when the contract was reneged. They state they will employ up to 500 people for the DC.

https://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/news/2018/08/15/see-inside-apples-2-billion-data-center-in-mesa.html

If Panorama showed anything, it's that Apple doesn't give a sh1t about people.

but think of the breakfast rolls that would be produced in the building process

ezstreet5

Wompa1 wrote: »

Apple have a history or reneging. I'm living in Arizona right now. The committed to a deal with a company based in Mesa for iPhone screens. They reneged 6 months before the company was expected to be operating at full capacity. A $578 million contract cancelled. The company in question had to immediately file for bankruptcy.

The real kick is they built the factory and leased it to the company they contracted with. When the company went out of business and unable to fund a legacy challenge, Apple just rolled forward and repurposed the building into a new data center.

They credited the Mesa for being so quick with permits and making it easy to get it setup. Internally now using them as an example and referring to it as "the Mesa way"

700 people lost their jobs when the contract was reneged. They state they will employ up to 500 people for the DC.

https://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/news/2018/08/15/see-inside-apples-2-billion-data-center-in-mesa.html

If Panorama showed anything, it's that Apple doesn't give a sh1t about people.

Apple's Mesa, Arizona, $2 billion "Global Data Command Centre" is peculiar indeed. At the same time that the company was plámásing Ireland and Denmark as ideal DC locations due to cool climates (thus allowing free air cooling), they build a massive data centre in the absolute hottest major metro area of USA, with massive mechanical cooling???

Then, after a section of the solar array on the roof caught fire, they simply removed the PV panels entirely.

And once up and running, we can see perhaps 100 cars in the carpark at times. But at other times, there are as few as ten cars? (See the latest aerial photo on Google Earth taken 13/1/2018).

So for fun, I searched for current job openings at all of Apple's existing and planned data centre locations in USA and Europe (surely there must always be some level of turnover). Draw your own conclusions, but I for one am not self-harming over lost jobs for Athenry: https://jobs.apple.com/en-us/search?location=maiden-MDN+mesa-MEA+prineville-PVE+reno-REO+newark-NWR+viborg-state1187+aabenraa-AJ1