Dublin routes news and general chat

Kcormahs

From now 2018 is starting in less than 6 months. I'd say new routes will soon be announced, specially in the months of September/October. It will all depend on Dublin Airport prices and how attractive their fees are to the airlines flying out of Dublin.

Rumours that Ryanair will launch Dublin Tel Aviv for 2018?
Aer Lingus Las Vegas route, may we see this coming? the talking has been quiet now
Ethiad dropping their AUH route?

honru

Will we finally see a Far East route I wonder? Hainan to Beijing being the most likely I'd say, though could we see Cathay Pacific or Singapore?

Things have been quiet in relation to Ryanair entering the Russian market, with the World Cup held there in the summer, 2018 could be a good year to start.

Also remember talk of AL launching a route to Dallas, but guess we might hear of that sometime after Vegas.

Tenger

Kcormahs wrote: »

.......
Aer Lingus Las Vegas route, may we see this coming? the talking has been quiet now....

The whole DUB-LAS rumour is based on an interview in the Indo last year in which the EI CEO stated something alone the lines of "Las Vegas is an interesting city, we are examining demand for this route"
It was a very throwaway comment following on from his point about MIA being a good use of the A330 in the traditional low season.
Personally I dont think there is anything in this rumour. EI serve the LAS market with connections through LAX and even feeding pax into the multiple VS flights from Manchester.

honru wrote: »

.......
Also remember talk of AL launching a route to Dallas, but guess we might hear of that sometime after Vegas.

This was clarified before as the Indo journalist hearing the German CEO saying "Dulles" and thinking it was "Dallas". EI returned to Dulles a couple of years ago.
Personally I think DFW is an obvious unserved major hub in the US for EI. Look a routemap and you can see how DFW would fill that gap between Chicago and the West Coast. I cant see it happening soon however but I think its a more viable option that Las Vegas.

*obvious my opinions could be completely wrong on this!!!!

EDIT; Dammit, too late for a ninja edit of putting in DTW instead of DFW!!!

Marcusm

Tenger wrote: »

The whole DUB-LAS rumour is based on an interview in the Indo last year in which the EI CEO stated something alone the lines of "Las Vegas is an interesting city, we are examining demand for this route"It was a very throwaway comment following on from his point about MIA being a good use of the A330 in the traditional low season.
Personally I dont think there is anything in this rumour. EI server the LAS market with connections through LAX and even feeding pax into the multiple VS flights from Manchester.

This was clarified before as the INdo journalist mishearing the German CEO saying "Dulles" and thinking it was "Dallas". EI returned to Dulles a couple of years ago.
Personally I think DTW is an obvious unserved major hub in the US for EI. Look a routemap and you can see how DTW would fill that gap between Chicago and the West Coast. I cant see it happening soon however but I think its a more viable option that Las Vegas.

*obvious my opinions could be completely wrong on this!!!!

Not sure how Detroit could fill a gap between Chicago and the west coast as Detroit is east of Chicago. Additionally it is a Delta hub (ex Northwest) so not a natural connecting point for EI and its US partners, AA predominantly.

TheFitz13

Kcormahs wrote: »

Ethiad dropping their AUH route?

I don't see why Etihad would drop their AUH route... Running at 2x daily it seems to have good loads. If it wasn't doing as well maybe they would cut it down to 1x daily rather than cut it all together. Has there been suggestions that it will be dropped? I'd be pretty shocked

john boye

The whole Vegas route story never seemed to have anything concrete in it I thought. As Tenger says above, it was based on a very throwaway comment and the media just ran with it as pretty much a done deal. I'd be amazed if it were to happen.

That said, I couldn't confidently predict EI's next TATL route atm. Possibly DFW but I wouldn't hang my hat on it.

Bussywussy

Vegas is not happening

Noxegon

honru wrote: »

Will we finally see a Far East route I wonder? Hainan to Beijing being the most likely I'd say, though could we see Cathay Pacific or Singapore?

My understanding is that Singapore can't happen until we have the second runway – there's not enough distance available with 28/10.

Captain_Crash

Marcusm wrote: »

Not sure how Detroit could fill a gap between Chicago and the west coast as Detroit is east of Chicago. Additionally it is a Delta hub (ex Northwest) so not a natural connecting point for EI and its US partners, AA predominantly.

To be fair, I'm guessing Tenger meant DFW, which for me is a no brainer for EI once in the Atlantic JV with AA and BA.

With regards to EY dropping AUH, not going to happen. I'll say it here first, I suspect the route will using 789 by the end of 2018.

Captain_Crash

Captain_Crash wrote: »

To be fair, I'm guessing Tenger meant DFW, which for me is a no brainer for EI once in the Atlantic JV with AA and BA.

With regards to EY dropping AUH, not going to happen. I'll say it here first, I suspect the route will using 789 by the end of 2018.

No Tenger has said it several times before he means DETROIT.

With regards to Etihad and the 787 it is well known that it will be transferring over to the 787 at some stage even Etihad themselves have said it.

https://www.ittn.ie/news/etihad-to-operate-b787-dreamliner-on-dublin-abu-dhabi/

Old article but they've repeated it recently at trade shows

Captain_Crash

/snip

Tenger

[Deleted User] wrote: »

No Tenger has said it several times before he means DETROIT.

Have I?
I must have been drunk.

Detroit is a silly place to expand to.
I think Dallas-Fort Worth should be the next route for EI. Huge hub thats cover the entire SouthWest of the US. And its an Americsn Airlines hub so going forward, solid IAG/OneWorld connectivity.

F and T are a little too close on the phone keypad for my fat fingers. DFW vs DTW!!

Van.Bosch

How many more US/Canada routes do you think EI will go with before they go east/south?

Fattes

Van.Bosch wrote: »

How many more US/Canada routes do you think EI will go with before they go east/south?

They won't ever go east, the removal of the A350 is the biggest hint that they will be focusing on Pre clearance US routes and feeding IAG partners for east and southern destinations

Captain_Crash

Fattes wrote: »

They won't ever go east, the removal of the A350 is the biggest hint that they will be focusing on Pre clearance and feeding IAG partners for east and southern destinations

I agree they wont go east, but I wouldn't completely rule out them going south to JNB or CPT (the latter being the more likely of the two in my opinion)

L1011

I'm probably the only one who has suggested DTW here - within 757/321LR range and has a sizeable community of Irish extraction as well as a decent business base (outside the old City Council area) as well as effectively everyone in Windsor who uses it in preference to paying Canadian airport tax.

Fattes

Captain_Crash wrote: »

I agree they wont go east, but I wouldn't completely rule out them going south to JNB or CPT (the latter being the more likely of the two in my opinion)

SA is well served by BA some which had a few flights a day and a partner airline in Comair in SA. Really don't think the market is there for direct flights from Dublin. Just my opinion though

MoeJay

I'd say another Canadian destination is likely, YUL.....?

Marcusm

john boye wrote: »

The whole Vegas route story never seemed to have anything concrete in it I thought. As Tenger says above, it was based on a very throwaway comment and the media just ran with it as pretty much a done deal. I'd be amazed if it were to happen.

That said, I couldn't confidently predict EI's next TATL route atm. Possibly DFW but I wouldn't hang my hat on it.

I genuinely thought he had Dismissed Dallas and was suggesting Detroit. Personally I agree that DFW (and MIA) were the obvious new routes for 2017. Amongst other things it opens up the Caribbean, Central and South America via network partners. While Iberia has a great LatAm network, DUB-MAD connectivity isn't great.

Marcusm

Captain_Crash wrote: »

I agree they wont go east, but I wouldn't completely rule out them going south to JNB or CPT (the latter being the more likely of the two in my opinion)

Can't see it; too long, too thin. Plenty of service through London and no natural O/D base to ground it on.

john boye

[Deleted User] wrote: »

No Tenger has said it several times before he means DETROIT.

With regards to Etihad and the 787 it is well known that it will be transferring over to the 787 at some stage even Etihad themselves have said it.

https://www.ittn.ie/news/etihad-to-operate-b787-dreamliner-on-dublin-abu-dhabi/

Old article but they've repeated it recently at trade shows

Have to say I think the B789 would be a big downgrade from the A332. I've been on a couple and Economy looks very cramped. Even more so than the 10-abreast B77Ws.

Luke-m

Noxegon wrote: »

My understanding is that Singapore can't happen until we have the second runway – there's not enough distance available with 28/10.

Im not sure thats the case if SQ were to serve the route with the a350, I think 10/28 can take such an aircraft, (open to being wrong on that one) Certainly the 777 and 380 would be severely payload restricted and frankly too big an aircraft for such a route.

In relation to SQ ever serving Dublin, I wouldn’t rule it out in a few years, as they seem to be slowly targeting secondary cities in Europe with Stockholm and Dusseldorf recently added in a fight to take back some passengers off the Middle East 3.

Don’t see EI ever serve a route to Singapore. Somebody can quote me now, ~”il eat my own hat” if they do

Noxegon

Luke-m wrote: »

Im not sure thats the case if SQ were to serve the route with the a350, I think 10/28 can take such an aircraft, (open to being wrong on that one) Certainly the 777 and 380 would be severely payload restricted and frankly too big an aircraft for such a route.

In relation to SQ ever serving Dublin, I wouldn’t rule it out in a few years, as they seem to be slowly targeting secondary cities in Europe with Stockholm and Dusseldorf recently added in a fight to take back some passengers off the Middle East 3

I expect that any service would be with their low cost brand Scoot. I wouldn't put up with that for a thirteen hour flight.

Luke-m

Noxegon wrote: »

I expect that any service would be with their low cost brand Scoot. I wouldn't put up with that for a thirteen hour flight.

Neither would I. I suspect you may be right as regards Scoot being on the scene first.

Probably wishful thinking here but what leads me to think otherwise (as regards sq) is, they have said years back(2005) that Dublin was a route that appealed to them but for the runway length. But now with Dublin ranked as the fastest-growing airport in Europe and a new runway on the way just maybe its back on the radar again.

cson

How close is DUB to its capacity in terms of pax numbers? The new runway will surely fuel a bit of an increase in routes & with IAG probably routing a few UK/EU pax through DUB for transatlantic routes are we in for a return to the circa 2007 ****show?
Perhaps time to invest in infrastructure rather than tax cuts...

The Veteran

cson wrote: »

How close is DUB to its capacity in terms of pax numbers? The new runway will surely fuel a bit of an increase in routes & with IAG probably routing a few UK/EU pax through DUB for transatlantic routes are we in for a return to the circa 2007 ****show?
Perhaps time to invest in infrastructure rather than tax cuts...

Thought that Terminals capacity is said to be 35 million annually so still a bit to go but remember the old T1 handled 23 million plus in 2007/2008 before T2. Pier 2 is now segregated and therefore can be used for more flights; there is the South apron Gates and 5G (with bussing) so I'd say the Terminals are fine for a number of years - in general. See separate thread about passport queues!

L1011

T1 at 23 had the portakabins, car park check in, area 14 etc. It was a particularly nasty experience

pclive

Probably further out than 2018 but Norwegian are looking at flights to Asia

http://www.independent.ie/business/world/norwegian-plans-direct-flights-from-ireland-to-asia-if-russia-agrees-35876477.html

Locker10a

L1011 wrote: »

T1 at 23 had the portakabins, car park check in, area 14 etc. It was a particularly nasty experience

I'll never forget those security ques in the mornings, I recall two security points in T1 at the time, both would be seriously long and chaotic ques.
I don't remember car park check in though!!

trellheim

Security at T1 most mornings in the peak the queue is now back to the barcode gates and beyond. Don't get me wrong the staff are professional and a joy to deal with, and go as fast as they can but the numbers mean it.

( BTW not all belts are always operating either even in the peak , complain to DAA about staffing on twitter or any channel you can find )

Why did they ever close the 2nd security screen in T1 anyway at the Ryanair end, that always struck me as silly

L1011

Locker10a wrote: »

I don't remember car park check in though!!

Was in the Atrium building in T1.

Jamie2k9

L1011 wrote: »

I'm probably the only one who has suggested DTW here - within 757/321LR range and has a sizeable community of Irish extraction as well as a decent business base (outside the old City Council area) as well as effectively everyone in Windsor who uses it in preference to paying Canadian airport tax.

I think Delta will get on this before EI do, they considered it a few years ago.

EI will most likely go for a route to Canada next year and most likely frequency on others over new routes.

Cravens

Also, with DL packing up PHL-LHR on the 752 at the end of March, it would free up a frame to do a service like DUB-DTW or DUB-MSP (bit of a stretch for a 752, but maybe doable in the summer months), both of which hubs offer good connections to the midwest and pacific northwest respectively. I've also been seeing on another forum that DL might do well to consider sending the 763 on the DUB-BOS, considering their BOS-LHR run is supposedly doing quite poorly.

PukkaStukka

Any update if Dallas - Dublin is going to happen or not?

L1011

PukkaStukka wrote: »

Any update if Dallas - Dublin is going to happen or not?

No, as its mostly only been discussed on here!

Jamie2k9

EI to LAS will not be happening any time soon.

JCX BXC

Just noticed something earlier, Ryanair Dublin to Tel Aviv, would that not be pushing the limits for the 737-800 in terms of payload/range and utilisation a little further than Ryanair usually like to go?

It must be what, a 6/6 1/2hour flight?

Growler!!!

Flydubai go to Prague and Bangkok with block hours around that and they have to contend with high ambient temperatures out of DXB.

DXB to PRG 6.40
DXB to BKK 6.20

From their website:
When you fly with us, you’ll fly on the latest Boeing 737-800 aircraft, with up to 189 seats and a flying range of just over 6 hours.
flydubai aircraft are among the most environmentally-friendly planes in the sky today. A combination of CFM56-7B engines from CFM International and blended winglets from Aviation Partners Boeing mean our planes use less fuel, reduce emissions and make less noise.


But in answer to your question re utilisation - I don't know.

la ultima guagua

JCX BXC wrote: »

Just noticed something earlier, Ryanair Dublin to Tel Aviv, would that not be pushing the limits for the 737-800 in terms of payload/range and utilisation a little further than Ryanair usually like to go?

It must be what, a 6/6 1/2hour flight?

TOM did DUB -SSH with a 738 for a number of years

Idbatterim

EI to LAS will not be happening any time soon.

for sure?! I am sick of not being able to fly direct. The amount of irish travelling there any time I fly, is substantial enough. Hope Norwegian come in and do it, which would be more likely if Ryanair start feeding traffic into them via the Dublin hub...

JCX BXC

Idbatterim wrote: »

for sure?! I am sick of not being able to fly direct. The amount of irish travelling there any time I fly, is substantial enough. Hope Norwegian come in and do it, which would be more likely if Ryanair start feeding traffic into them via the Dublin hub...

It's been explained why several times.

I can't see NAI doing it, if TCX longhaul keeps going well in the UK maybe they may look at it but it's either them or EI in my opinion.

January

Idbatterim wrote: »

for sure?! I am sick of not being able to fly direct. The amount of irish travelling there any time I fly, is substantial enough. Hope Norwegian come in and do it, which would be more likely if Ryanair start feeding traffic into them via the Dublin hub...

For sure.

Idbatterim

I will never fly there via Gatwick again that's for sure, did it via Phili a few weeks back...

Jamie2k9

Idbatterim wrote: »

for sure?! I am sick of not being able to fly direct. The amount of irish travelling there any time I fly, is substantial enough. Hope Norwegian come in and do it, which would be more likely if Ryanair start feeding traffic into them via the Dublin hub...

Yeah EI have no plans to start it anytime soon, they did consider it but the commercial case wasn't strong enough.

Doltanian

Las Vegas would be an leisure and thus economy heavy route, I don't think there would large enough business links between Ireland and Las Vegas to drive business class demand unless freight considering mostly everything in Las Vegas is imported from everywhere else.

I think it is a case of Aer Lingus and other carriers being able to get better returns on their aircraft on other routes. EI should pick up a few cheap second hand 777-200's for low yield routes like this. Profits might be low but extra profits are extra profits either way, but with IAG setting the agenda now this won't likely happen. In my fantasy Aer Lingus I'd have connectivity to Hong Kong, Dubai and Sydney.

L1011

Doltanian wrote: »

Las Vegas would be an leisure and thus economy heavy route, I don't think there would large enough business links between Ireland and Las Vegas to drive business class demand unless freight considering mostly everything in Las Vegas is imported from everywhere else.

The biz demand to Vegas is for conferences, which are year-round and is surprisingly high.

Irishweather

JCX BXC wrote: »

Just noticed something earlier, Ryanair Dublin to Tel Aviv, would that not be pushing the limits for the 737-800 in terms of payload/range and utilisation a little further than Ryanair usually like to go?

It must be what, a 6/6 1/2hour flight?

No?
Norweigan have been flying passengers from Dublin, Belfast, Shannon and Cork to the NE coast of the United States for over two weeks now.

Have you not been around?

Irish Steve

Doltanian wrote: »

In my fantasy Aer Lingus I'd have connectivity to Hong Kong, Dubai and Sydney.

With a little encouragement, and some fifth freedom rights, I could imagine Sydney happening at some stage, given that Beijing is very close to the great circle route from Dublin to Sydney. I have to believe that there would be sufficient traffic on the Dublin Beijing sectors with both freight and passengers to make that sector viable, and Beijing to Sydney should also be reasonable. The crewing logistics would be heavy though.

Having said that, Hong Kong is also very close to the great circle, so either of them would be an ideal mid point for that route, DUB - SYD is not possible with a 330-200 non stop, both from a crew duty and aircraft range aspect.

IE 222

Is it possible for Aer lingus to look at serving more medium hual with overnight flights to the likes of Moscow, St. Petersburg, Tel - Aviv, Larnaca, Keiv and Istanbul. Aircraft should be back in time for normal short haul morning departures.

Irish Steve

IE 222 wrote: »

Is it possible for Aer lingus to look at serving more medium hual with overnight flights to the likes of Moscow, St. Petersburg, Tel - Aviv, Larnaca, Keiv and Istanbul. Aircraft should be back in time for normal short haul morning departures.

Istanbul would be a bit too far for an overnight, the round trip including on the ground time would be between 9 and 10 hours, so that would not work with the present structure of very early departures for the short haul routes, and there could be problems with the arrival time at Istanbul, I don't think there's a curfew as such, but departures from about 01 to 05 are not encouraged, due to the numbers living close to the airport.

Tel Aviv and Larnaca would be equally time constrained, flight times to them would be as long, or slightly longer. The other constraint is that the overnight period is used to perform maintenance checks, and carry out other tasks that are better performed when not under pressure to meet departure times.

Noxegon

Doltanian wrote: »

In my fantasy Aer Lingus I'd have connectivity to Hong Kong, Dubai and Sydney.

Dubai was tried a few years ago and it didn't last – and that was before the entry of Emirates into the market here.