Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

UFC 212 Holloway v Aldo Sat 3rd June

Options
1…45679

Comments

  • Options
    #242
    Gamebred
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,269 ✭✭✭Gamebred


    Lads hes hardly comparing Ronda and Aldo skill wise.


  • Options
    #243
    darced
    Registered Users Posts: 7,056 ✭✭✭darced


    This post has been deleted.


  • Options
    #244
    Brussels Sprout
    Registered Users Posts: 6,543 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    Fun fact: The featherweight belt has now not been successfully defended since October 2014!


  • Options
    #245
    Ultimate Seduction
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,464 ✭✭✭Ultimate Seduction


    Aldo lost 2 of his last 3 by strikes

    Probably the best takedown defence I've seen and probably the best leg kicks I've seen but let's be honest, he's only ever met 2 good strikers and lost to both by tko/up to strikes.

    The evolution of MMA passed him by


  • Options
    #246
    Ultimate Seduction
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,464 ✭✭✭Ultimate Seduction


    Fun fact: Max Holloway holds the following records in the FW division..

    Most fights

    Most wins

    Most TKOs

    Most stoppages

    Most significant strikes

    The stats prove my point that Max is the greatest featherweight ever.
    He just needs to beat Frankie to really cement it.

    It's an emotional time for me, I love Max, he proved me right and made me a nice few quid

    **Conor didn't hang around FW long enough to be considered GOAT of FW, obviously I think Conor knocks everyone at FW out


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #247
    Ultimate Seduction
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,464 ✭✭✭Ultimate Seduction


    GerryDerpy wrote:
    When you say greatest of all time, do you mean based on his excellent win streak? Or do you mean on the balance of everything, he is the greatest featherweight?


    Post 246 for detailed answer


  • Options
    #248
    wonderfullife
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,924 ✭✭✭wonderfullife


    darced wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    MMA is cyclical so this will change but right now we are in the era of specialists and Aldo, as you point out, is more of an all-rounder.

    Conor and Maia are probably the 2 best current proponents of this. Everyone knows Maia is going to take you down and try strangle you. Everyone knows Conor is going to find a way to land the left hand on your chin. It's hard to stop either man because they are so good.

    Being so good at one specialty > all-rounder.

    MMA has a way of being cyclical and just like Ronda's downfall, I expect in the coming years we will see people figure out the blueprint to defeat Conor and Maia's specialties too.

    As for Aldo, he was outclassed and exposed in a fashion. Sure, he wasn't dominated pillar to post and he was absolutely up 20-18 on all scorecards.

    But that's not the point.

    The point is Max said coming in what he was going to do. Everyone knew he'd be picking up the pace from the 3rd Round onwards. In between the 2nd and 3rd round Max's corner told him to start picking up the pace with more volume. As soon as he did it, which Aldo knew was coming, he had no answers.

    For someone to come into a fight and say "I'll KO you in the 1st" (Conor) or "I'll get rid of you in the later rounds" (Max) and then do it, it does expose the weaknesses.

    It's not as if we can just say Aldo has a stylistic problem with taller strikers because he performed well against Florian. I just think the new breed of MMA strikers have moved past Aldo's more traditional muay thai.


  • Options
    #249
    EagererBeaver
    Registered Users Posts: 6,413 ✭✭✭EagererBeaver


    I don't think he was outclassed in the slightest. Not sure how you can say he was outclassed and then state he was definitely 20-18 up.

    He got caught with a shot and Holloway was too good to let him away with it.


  • Options
    #250
    cletus
    Registered Users Posts: 7,879 ✭✭✭cletus


    I agree with eagererbeaver. Aldo in no way looked outclassed, nor was he found out. He looked probably as good as he did against Edgar. He had Holloway in trouble at a couple of points, and as you said, was 20-18 up.


  • Options
    #251
    Mellor
    Registered Users Posts: 39,038 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    I only got to catch up on this now. GreT main event. Happy for Max, he's looks great ever since the lose to Conor. Put the head down and got back on the ladder.


    Round 1
    Not much happened initially, both were very tentative, especially Aldo. He was keeping that right hand on the jaw.
    At the halfway point, Aldo unloaded, that probably took the round for him. But as soon as he did, the right hand was back at his chest. Not good.

    Round 2
    More of the same. Home judges might have shaded it for Jose. But Max's bravado at the end makes a big judge impression too. He was clearly getting comfortable towards the end.
    Overall I felt it was very very close strikes landed. Drawn round for me.

    Rd 3
    Max can out oooking to keep momentum going. Starting to show confidence in his combos. Aldo breathing hard, and that right hand dropping down into wild Aldo mode again.
    Max eventually caught him with a double one-two on the button. From there it was just survival. Haven't seen Aldo guard tore up like that so he must have been hurt.

    I've no issue with the stoppage. Aldo took a lot of strikes when on his back. Then just curled up and took it. Turtling up is not defending in MMA.
    I know he was giving the thumbs up to say he was fine. But that doesn't cut it. He knows he had to get out of there. He couldn't.
    Reminded me of the finish in Faber v Barao II

    Surprised he didn't throw more of leg kicks. They were right there. Broken foot in camp?


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #252
    Mellor
    Registered Users Posts: 39,038 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    wonderfullife wrote: »
    MMA is cyclical so this will change but right now we are in the era of specialists and Aldo, as you point out, is more of an all-rounder.

    Conor and Maia are probably the 2 best current proponents of this. Everyone knows Maia is going to take you down and try strangle you. Everyone knows Conor is going to find a way to land the left hand on your chin. It's hard to stop either man because they are so good.

    Being so good at one specialty > all-rounder.
    You are using really selective examples there tbh. Specialist v all-rounder is meaningless really.

    Firstly, for every Maia or Conor dominating with one attribute. There are dozens of guys with a lob-sided skill set getting their ass handed to them. Only a few weeks ago people where slagging off Cian Crowley for thinking his Muay Thai experience would be enough in MMA. He was taken down and strangled.
    Conor as a striking specialist got taken down and choked out easily by Joe Duffy. Apparently that was the loss that prompted him to work on his grappling. The fact is, Conor and Maia have both worked very hard on the other areas of their game to be able to impose their specialist advantages.

    Calling Aldo an all rounder is a bit misleading. He has/had the best defensive grappling in the division. And his Muay Thai is probably the best too. In both of those regards, he is a specialist.
    But he's noteithout his flaws. His aggressive style of Muay Thai left gaps. I've commented on that before. The gaps were always there, but other fighters backpeddled and cowered. Conor did, he exposed a gap. Last night, Max didn't fight like the rest either. Instead of backpedalling he circled back-across-and forward again to attack. Toe to toe, he eventually found the button. Max did his homework and found the gap.

    Aldo lost last night, but that doesn't mean he's lost it. When two high level fighters clash. One of them has to lose.


  • Options
    #253
    Gamebred
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,269 ✭✭✭Gamebred


    Would guess Aldo's chin could be gone now and that damage he took the weekend wont help him in future, the Mendes war followed by Conor ko'ing him now this on top of all the gym wars he's probably had, he looks 30 going on 40 odd too dont care if he was 2 rounds up its a 25 minute fight he was never close to hurting Holloway in any serious way.


  • Options
    #254
    Mellor
    Registered Users Posts: 39,038 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    Max caught him flush with 4 shots with 2 seconds. Most fighters go down after than imo. He wasn't sparked out, although I thought he went out for a sec while on his back. Just before the 3min mark.


  • Options
    #255
    Brussels Sprout
    Registered Users Posts: 6,543 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    Went back and watched the title fight again last night. From the moment he was floored in the 3rd to the eventual stoppage was roughly 110 seconds. So nearly 2 minutes of being hurt, on the ground and frantically trying to fight off Holloway's blows and submission attempts as his situation gradually deteriorated. It looked like a rough way to go but he can have no complaints. He can't say it was a flukey punch and John McCarthy gave him more than enough time. Was listening to Luke Thomas discuss it afterwards and he had a good analogy when contrasting Aldo's two recent losses. It went something like:
    It's a bit like thinking of different ways of dying. You can die instantly from being hit by a truck which was how it went down against McGregor. The method of defeat against Holloway was more like watching a man get eaten slowly by a shark.


  • Options
    #256
    darced
    Registered Users Posts: 7,056 ✭✭✭darced


    This post has been deleted.


  • Options
    #257
    Paully D
    Registered Users Posts: 28,710 ✭✭✭✭Paully D


    I haven't watched it back yet, but how much trouble did Aldo have Holloway in in round one?


  • Options
    #258
    wonderfullife
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,924 ✭✭✭wonderfullife


    Paully D wrote: »
    I haven't watched it back yet, but how much trouble did Aldo have Holloway in in round one?

    In my opinion, none. No real danger.

    He landed a couple of decent punches. Max didn't look bothered by his power whatsoever in any round.

    Watch the end of the 2nd round.... he literally Stockton b1tch slapped Aldo and threw his hands up like "whatcha gonna do, you'll do nuttin".


  • Options
    #259
    Ultimate Seduction
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,464 ✭✭✭Ultimate Seduction


    Paully D wrote:
    I haven't watched it back yet, but how much trouble did Aldo have Holloway in in round one?


    Zero trouble. Was very little action in round 1 at all.


  • Options
    #260
    Paully D
    Registered Users Posts: 28,710 ✭✭✭✭Paully D


    Ultimate Seduction wrote: »
    Zero trouble. Was very little action in round 1 at all.

    Maybe it was round two then. I can't really remember. But in one of the first two rounds Aldo landed a few punches, a knee, and seemed to have him a little trouble up against the cage.

    I was half asleep and haven't watched it back however.


  • Options
    #261
    dubrov
    Registered Users Posts: 3,549 ✭✭✭dubrov


    It was strange because Aldo connected more punches in round one and two but after each exchange Holloway seemed to come out looking the stronger.

    Aldo looked more and more tired as the fight went on and it seemed inevitable that he was going to lose.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #262
    mailburner
    Registered Users Posts: 23,828 ✭✭✭✭mailburner


    would love to know what odds max was after round one and two myself


  • Options
    #263
    dubrov
    Registered Users Posts: 3,549 ✭✭✭dubrov


    mailburner wrote: »
    would love to know what odds max was after round one and two myself

    I'd say he was at least 1 round down on the judge's card after round 2 but yet his odds might have been shorter than before the fight.


  • Options
    #264
    Mellor
    Registered Users Posts: 39,038 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    Paully D wrote: »

    Maybe it was round two then. I can't really remember. But in one of the first two rounds Aldo landed a few punches, a knee, and seemed to have him a little trouble up against the cage.

    I was half asleep and haven't watched it back however.
    You are thinking of rd 1. Around the midpoint of the round. Aldo landed a few shots and charged in and landed a knee against the cage. There was a agressive uppercut a few seconds later.
    Max shook it off easily enough but looking like nothing is not the same as being nothing.

    Edit:
    https://streamable.com/rs8gn


  • Options
    #265
    darced
    Registered Users Posts: 7,056 ✭✭✭darced


    This post has been deleted.


  • Options
    #266
    Easy Rod
    Registered Users Posts: 1,876 ✭✭✭Easy Rod


    darced wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    Yeah that knee especially would've taken most out.


  • Options
    #267
    Easy Rod
    Registered Users Posts: 1,876 ✭✭✭Easy Rod


    wonderfullife wrote: »
    In my opinion, none. No real danger.

    He landed a couple of decent punches. Max didn't look bothered by his power whatsoever in any round.

    Watch the end of the 2nd round.... he literally Stockton b1tch slapped Aldo and threw his hands up like "whatcha gonna do, you'll do nuttin".

    I'd like to see a side by side of how Max was showboating compared to Conor, it looked virtually identical from memory. The sideways tilt of the head with arms outstretched wide. I wonder if it was intentional to get him wound up.


  • Options
    #268
    Spudman_20000
    Registered Users Posts: 1,198 ✭✭✭Spudman_20000


    Easy Rod wrote: »
    I'd like to see a side by side of how Max was showboating compared to Conor, it looked virtually identical from memory. The sideways tilt of the head with arms outstretched wide. I wonder if it was intentional to get him wound up.

    He got some Stockton slaps in too iirc :)

    Very impressed with Max, really thought Aldo would be too quick for him. Max even said post-fight that he expected Aldo to be quicker. Jose faded badly too as the fight went on.


  • Options
    #269
    Ultimate Seduction
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,464 ✭✭✭Ultimate Seduction


    Spudman_20000 wrote:
    Very impressed with Max, really thought Aldo would be too quick for him. Max even said post-fight that he expected Aldo to be quicker. Jose faded badly too as the fight went on.


    Timing beats speed....


  • Options
    #270
    Utopia Parkway
    Registered Users Posts: 17,321 ✭✭✭✭Utopia Parkway


    EagererBeaver wrote: »
    I don't think he was outclassed in the slightest. Not sure how you can say he was outclassed and then state he was definitely 20-18 up.

    He got caught with a shot and Holloway was too good to let him away with it.

    True but you could definitely feel the momentum of the fight turning even before the stoppage. Holloway was picking up the pace and striking with more volume. Aldo looked to be slowing down. Had he not stopped him I sense Holloway would have won the last 3 rounds and won a decision.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #271
    EagererBeaver
    Registered Users Posts: 6,413 ✭✭✭EagererBeaver


    Utopia Parkway wrote: »
    True but you could definitely feel the momentum of the fight turning even before the stoppage. Holloway was picking up the pace and striking with more volume. Aldo looked to be slowing down. Had he not stopped him I sense Holloway would have won the last 3 rounds and won a decision.

    I agree, but still don't think that means he was outclassed.


Advertisement