Do men bother approaching women anymore?

Glenster

MrMorooka wrote: »

Well, I don't bother with those other two either.

But yeah, it's easier now to just focus on work and spend free time playing video games or watching movies or going to the gym alone, or whatever. People don't need to live in groups to survive any more, with modern technology and society everything is more individualistic. I'm not sure if it's better or worse, but it's reality.

Its worse.

pilly

MrMorooka wrote: »

Well, I don't bother with those other two either.

But yeah, it's easier now to just focus on work and spend free time playing video games or watching movies or going to the gym alone, or whatever. People don't need to live in groups to survive any more, with modern technology and society everything is more individualistic. I'm not sure if it's better or worse, but it's reality.

Jesus, that's definitely a bad thing man.

indioblack

Samaris wrote: »

I want to know how I've been irretrievably destroyed by social media! I didn't notice it happening.........

That's After Hours for ya.
Insidious like.

wakka12

MrMorooka wrote: »

Well, I don't bother with those other two either.

But yeah, it's easier now to just focus on work and spend free time playing video games or watching movies or going to the gym alone, or whatever. People don't need to live in groups to survive any more, with modern technology and society everything is more individualistic. I'm not sure if it's better or worse, but it's reality.

How could that possibly be a better thing for society

ThinkProgress

ThisRegard wrote: »

Who said anything about pestering and harassing? And are you saying attraction is only a physical thing? And how does it become organic, through a phone app? That's not at all organic.

And I hate to put it to you, the pursuit of a partner is actually a most natural thing.

When there is drink involved... (and this is Ireland, so there usually is)... that's how it generally goes down! And whether you like it or not, that is how it's perceived by a lot of people!

I never said anything about it just being physical or anything about phone apps.

Men and women cross paths in their everyday lives. Those are the opportunities that I am thinking about when I refer to "organic" situations!

Obviously if you are someone that lives a very sheltered existence, where you mostly just go from work to the pub/club... then perhaps your options are limited.

I just don't find the whole alcohol+club/pub approach to be a very natural way to strike up a meaningful relationship with someone. But it's a huge part of our culture, so I guess a lot of people would be of a different opinion on that...

Each to their own I guess!

MrMorooka

Well I mean yeah, I am desperately lonely. But I don't enjoy talking to people anyway. If I could skip to the "let's just cuddle on the sofa while watching a movie" stage instead of watching it myself, or the "let's go for a walk together" instead of going for a walk on my own and listening to music, that would be nice, and it's all I really want, but it's a lot of work to get to that stage. I'm fully aware of how to do it, either pick up drinking and then go out and talk to drunk people, or get into some hobbies(with appropriate gender mixes, so not tabletop gaming or something) and build relationships, but I can't be bothered- talking to people is difficult and you don't really have to do it anymore.

Rather than making this all about me, my general point is that there is much less pressure these days to be in a relationship. It's not as necessary as it once was- like I said, it's possible to just focus on career and waste the rest of your time online or in games. Lots of young men are doing it, which is why you're not seeing them approach women. Go play an MMO for a few months, see how many young men there are on there who are doing nothing social with their lives in the real world, but they still get by. In the past they would have been forced into interacting with people by society and necessity. Nowadays in our urban modern world, they have other options to live 'easier'..

The J Stands for Jay

wonderfullife wrote: »

I'm nostalgic for After Hours circa 2010 when the ONLY acceptable response to this would have been "pics or GTFO".

Blast it with yore ma?

wakka12

ThinkProgress wrote: »

When there is drink involved... (and this is Ireland, so there usually is)... that's how it generally goes down! And whether you like it or not, that is how it's perceived by a lot of people!

I never said anything about it just being physical or anything about phone apps.

Men and women cross paths in their everyday lives. Those are the opportunities that I am thinking about when I refer to "organic" situations!

Obviously if you are someone that lives a very sheltered existence, where you mostly just go from work to the pub/club... then perhaps your options are limited.

I just don't find the whole alcohol+club/pub approach to be a very natural way to strike up a meaningful relationship with someone. But it's a huge part of our culture, so I guess a lot of people would be of a different opinion on that...

Each to their own I guess!

This ireland is obsessed with alcohol and club culture myth needs to die
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_alcohol_consumption_per_capita

Irelands alchohol consumption rate is a mile behind all of eastern europe, less than france portugal australia finland and south korea, and similar to luxembourg, the UK, germany denmark and spain

Ubbquittious

MrMorooka wrote: »

Rather than making this all about me, my general point is that there is much less pressure these days to be in a relationship. It's not as necessary as it once was- like I said, it's possible to just focus on career and waste the rest of your time online or in games. Lots of young men are doing it, which is why you're not seeing them approach women. Go play an MMO for a few months, see how many young men there are on there who are doing nothing social with their lives in the real world, but they still get by. In the past they would have been forced into interacting with people by society and necessity. Nowadays in our urban modern world, they have other options to live 'easier'..

They still get by but they're the human equivalent of caged hens. Except they don't produce anything useful.

Lock'em up in a small box, keep them happy with some different-coloured pixels on a screen and leave em be. If you could only figure out a way to make them reproduce it would be a very efficient way of farming humans.

professore

Widdershins wrote: »

Is friendship not a big part of a relationship anymore? It's not like platonic friendship, but I'm half asleep and don't have the words for it.


I'm curious about the airbrushed social media photos. Is this common and to what extent do people alter their pictures? I often put a decorative theme on mine, but they do nothing to alter my appearance.

I suspect it's hard to have a friendship if both of you are glued to your phones in half a dozen conversations and snapchats and whatever else the youngsters are into these days.

Four Phucs Ache

I approached a nice looking girl years ago standing at the bar drink in hand and with a few on me I asked her " How many bones has a grown up Scot" and she gave me a face and said " let me guess , 1" I said I haven't a fooking clue but whoever tells me can have a free Eddie rockets at 3am.Went out with her for 5 months.

RoboRat

I find this thread quite amusing, when I was in my 20's women were always complaining about men pestering them and they couldn't have a night out and just enjoy themselves with their friends. You could say hello to a woman and get looked at like you were a deviant for just trying to make conversation.

I also remember a few years later and I was going out with my now wife and one of her friends met a bloke, she was going on that he was great, really nice, very good looking and then she got a text from him and said... "Oh, too desperate texting the next day, pity." I couldn't believe it and I was then told that no woman likes a bloke who is too keen, it's off putting!

Now we have a scenario where a woman can arrange to meet up with a bloke if she likes, she can go out and not get chatted up.... but now the men lack balls for not approaching them!

Reminds me of the 80's where women didn't want to stay at home, they wanted jobs.... now most women I know want to stay at home and not have to work!

Perhaps the issue is not with men, it's with women?

professore

ThinkProgress wrote: »

From my observations, most women don't really want to be harassed by men all night long...

I consider it quite unnatural for either men or women to be pestering each other. If there is an attraction there, it should be mutual... and frankly it should be organic and not forced by either party!

The problem, is that I guess people have always felt under pressure to find someone... so pursuing or being pursued became the cultural norm.

But as with many things in life, when you try too hard to force something to happen... it often ironically becomes less likely to happen as a direct result.

organic = friendzone

Glenster

RoboRat wrote: »

Perhaps the issue is not with men, it's with women?

I suppose the issue is if you take 50% of humanity and strip it down to one characteristic (being a woman) its easy to assume that they all might want the same thing (they're all women right? All women are the same right?),

then when some of them say "I want to work" and others say "I don't want to work" or some say "I want to be chatted up" and others say "I don't want to be chatted up", because you've reduced them to being all the same in your head you can say something like "Bloody women, make your minds up"

professore

RoboRat wrote: »

I also remember a few years later and I was going out with my now wife and one of her friends met a bloke, she was going on that he was great, really nice, very good looking and then she got a text from him and said... "Oh, too desperate texting the next day, pity." I couldn't believe it and I was then told that no woman likes a bloke who is too keen, it's off putting!
?

Never understood the logic. So this type of woman prefers a guy who is not interested in her and will be cheating with half a dozen other women at the same time? Or is it some sort of excuse? OK if he sends her 20 texts or something fair enough but one the next day? Weird.

frozenfrozen

LaVail wrote: »

I've witnessed this many a time...Guy approaches a girl who is in company with other girls...girl proceeds to turn a guy down without even entering conversation and then proceeds to have a good laugh with her mates. Women are moaning that guys make no effort but when they do they are mocked and laughed at.

Why don't women approach a guy if they're interested in them?

Once I approached a girl in the smoking area of a pub and said hi. She looked at me like I had three heads, turned to her friend and gave her a strange look and said "hi.. Ok Bye now." in the most dismissive way possible.

I said *name* you obviously don't recognise me as *my sisters name*'s brother, I was only saying hi to you.

she was SOooOOoOoOoooOOoooo sorry and was just really confused apparently; not being the horrible bitch that lads deal with on nights out when saying something as innocuous as hi. Maybe that's why people prefer to just be swiped 'no' on tinder and not have to face that level of needlessly rude rejection...

bnt

There might be more conversations going on in nightclubs if the proprietors would only turn the bloody volume down. It's hard to start a conversation if you have to shout everything three times just to have a chance of being understood. To people like me, the noise just kills the chance of anything happening naturally. :rolleyes:

wakka12

frozenfrozen wrote: »

Once I approached a girl in the smoking area of a pub and said hi. She looked at me like I had three heads, turned to her friend and gave her a strange look and said "hi.. Ok Bye now." in the most dismissive way possible.

I said *name* you obviously don't recognise me as *my sisters name*'s brother, I was only saying hi to you.

she was SOooOOoOoOoooOOoooo sorry and was just really confused apparently; not being the horrible bitch that lads deal with on nights out when saying something as innocuous as hi. Maybe that's why people prefer to just be swiped 'no' on tinder and not have to face that level of needlessly rude rejection...

Haha good story to tell the sister! Bet the sis thinks less of her now
I seriously don't understand this though, like Im not a woman, Im a gay man but if some guy in a club came up to me and I wasnt interested in him even a little I would just still never think of replying like that to him for saying hi.. why is it so hard to say just hi how are you? having a good night? And if he tries anything just say you have a boyfriend. if he tries again then you have grounds to be rude

oneilla

Floppybits wrote: »

10 years ago I would have agreed with her but lads are now starting to look after themselves a lot better. ?Well that's the way it seems to me. ?Ok a lot of them are not beefed up body builders but they are fit and lean. ?What age bracket is she talking about?

Nice username :PAC:

ThisRegard

bnt wrote: »

There might be more conversations going on in nightclubs if the proprietors would only turn the bloody volume down. It's hard to start a conversation if you have to shout everything three times just to have a chance of being understood. To people like me, the noise just kills the chance of anything happening naturally. :rolleyes:

You don't go to a nightclub to have a proper chat!

Ubbquittious

ThisRegard wrote: »

You don't go to a nightclub to have a proper chat!

I don't think I ever had a proper chat in a nightclub. The only people who have them seem to be the smokers

Ben Gadot

Apps like Tinder never really effected my mentality in a negative way as I simply never took it seriously.

It's the horror stories that you read on a forum like boards and the increasing wave of deluded ,and quite frankly dangerous, bloggers (I refuse to call them journalists) that do far more damage to the mentality of young men in this country than a nothing app like Tinder ever could.

ThinkProgress

professore wrote: »

organic = friendzone

Well, I've never chased or pursued any woman in my life... and I have no issues getting attention from them. So make what you will of that.

I think most guys are just too obvious and come across too desperate.

I'm sure there are some women who enjoy being chased... but like I said, IME most women don't like being pestered all night by potential suitors. And I can understand exactly why they would feel that way tbh!

That "friendzone" stuff is BS too, because friendship is what you should be looking for in a partner anyway. If you base everything on sex, you're almost guaranteed to fail.

I definitely think a lot of people try too hard. If more people just relaxed a bit... allowed interactions to flow naturally and don't be in such a big rush, they would have much more success!

RoboRat

Glenster wrote: »

I suppose the issue is if you take 50% of humanity and strip it down to one characteristic (being a woman) its easy to assume that they all might want the same thing (they're all women right? All women are the same right?),

then when some of them say "I want to work" and others say "I don't want to work" or some say "I want to be chatted up" and others say "I don't want to be chatted up", because you've reduced them to being all the same in your head you can say something like "Bloody women, make your minds up"

Nope, that's just daft, I am using percentiles garnered from my own experience in life and making broad stroke generalisations... like people do, including many responses on this thread which I was countering with a broad stroke reply of my own.

The problem is that with experience, people tend to make generalisations to safeguard themselves. For example, if I met encountered 10 cats in my life and each time I got scratched, I would think that a cat is a snake with fur and thus avoid them like the plague - unfair on the many nice cats, but its life experience and human nature - we are not robots so therefore we make assumptions based on experience.

I do however think that many Irish women have an underlying sense on entitlement and/or distaste when it comes to Irish men... this is especially relevant to the city dwellers IMO. Perhaps it's their own experience or some handed down ideology that is driving this, I don't know? I can say that when I lived in the UK, if you chatted a woman up, it was a far nicer experience and even if they weren't interested, they would be happy to chat away and not be rude.

There are plenty of lovely Irish women, I married one, but from my own experience I got fed up with the games and nastiness of going out and trying to chat up women when I was in my 20's.

Mr.H

ThinkProgress wrote:

I consider it quite unnatural for either men or women to be pestering each other. If there is an attraction there, it should be mutual... and frankly it should be organic and not forced by either party!

How does it happen organically if neither party will approach each other?

I find it's the whole feminist and mgtow to be a real problem. They keep unfairly labelling the other gender and destroying our relationship with each other. We will end up like Kuala bears if we are not careful. Not at all trying to mate out of fear that we will be labeled as creeps or potential rapists or bitchs or slits and so on. I mean FFS stop slagging each other and just hetero know each other.

Not all men are pigs and not all women are "up themselves". Of course there are exceptions but even though they are very vocal they are a minority.

I myself think I am a lovely guy. I have my flaws like everyone but I'm loyal caring and fun (and very modest haha). My girlfriend is amazing and caring and sweet and perfect. We are not the only ones who are normal. There are loads of people out there who are cool.

So while you maybe labeled a creep or a freak or any other nasty thing by someone of either gender, don't let it stop you.

If you are male or female and you see someone who you are attracted to just say hi. If they converse with you that's great. If not who cares. Either they had a reason or they didn't. But the point is don't leave it put you off.

We are not just men and women we are humans and we are social animals. Just say hi to each other whether you wanna get into each others pants or not.

Maybe next time a guy approaches a woman in a bar they don't buy them a drink. I've known girls who because they were saving money used to go on dates for free dinner. Likewise guys who buy abseil for someone because they wanna ride.

I used to talk to girls in bars but just talk randomly. If we clicked me met again if not there is nothing lost

Gravelly

Mr.H wrote: »

How does it happen organically if neither party will approach each other?

I find it's the whole feminist and mgtow to be a real problem. They keep unfairly labelling the other gender and destroying our relationship with each other. We will end up like Kuala bears if we are not careful. Not at all trying to mate out of fear that we will be labeled as creeps or potential rapists or bitchs or slits and so on. I mean FFS stop slagging each other and just hetero know each other.

Agree with most of your sentiments, but I think you mean Panda bears, not koalas - afaik koalas ride each other like rented mules, it's pandas that are useless at it.

The Moldy Gowl

A lot of irish women do tend to have a sense of entitlement.
Just look st how many girls knock back guys because they arent over 6 foot.

Gravelly

The Moldy Gowl wrote: »

A lot of irish women do tend to have a sense of entitlement.
Just look st how many girls knock back guys because they arent over 6 foot.

They only do that until they hit their mid thirties - after that any dwarf will do.

wakka12

The Moldy Gowl wrote: »

A lot of irish women do tend to have a sense of entitlement.
Just look st how many girls knock back guys because they arent over 6 foot.

Guarantee you men in every country on earth say that about their own country, 'women in (insert any other country) are so much less shallow'

Its because theres shallow men and women in every country on earth and as far as I can see ireland doesn't seem any more or less shallow than anywhere else

Sam Kade

Richard Hillman wrote: »

There is no way to approach a female without giving off the impression that you are a psycho or a sex offender.

Are you saying chatting up a woman is a thing of the past? What should a fella do so if he fancies a woman, get her phone number and text her?