Terrorist Attack in Manchester (Read MOD WARNING in OP Updated 24/05/2017))

darced

This post has been deleted.

shocksy

_oveless_ wrote: »

My heart goes out to Muslims everywhere who will be treated with suspicion and scrutiny after this unfortunate incident, Islam & Muslims in general are the biggest victim in all of this. The responsibility for this attack has more to do with brexit and trump than it does to Islam. Europe needs to learn to live with these unfortunate events, we just need to not dwell on them and move on as quickly as possible.

That's easy for you to say. Tell that to the families of the victims :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Exeggcute

The worrying thing is that the do-gooders have become so divorced from reality that you can't be sure of the above comment is a piss take or not

BalcombeSt4

Exeggcute wrote: »

The father was a member of a former Al-Qaeda backed group in Libya.

A Libyan security official that personally knows the father said he was a member of the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group in the 1990's

He said the father belongs to the Salafi Jihafi movement, the most extreme sect of Salafism and from which Al Qaeda and ISIS hail.


My my my...no wonder he thinks his son is innocent. How this ****er was ever allowed into the UK is beyond me.

The west supported these radical Islam groups to fight the more secular nationalist regimes in the region, thats how.

_oveless_

_oveless_ wrote: »

My heart goes out to Muslims everywhere who will be treated with suspicion and scrutiny after this unfortunate incident, Islam & Muslims in general are the biggest victim in all of this. The responsibility for this attack has more to do with brexit and trump than it does to Islam. Europe needs to learn to live with these unfortunate events, we just need to not dwell on them and move on as quickly as possible.

Amazing. Only took you two days. :rolleyes:

ilkhanid

Son Of A Vidic wrote: »

You completely missed the point of my post and as a medical professional myself who trained in London in the Ninties and worked there into the Noughties, I was caught up in the horror of 7/7. I'll never forget the smell and the body parts in Russell Square. So I really don't need you lecturing me about about the dignity of patients and their care and what has you working with Muslim colleagues, got to do with what I said in my post? I lived and worked in the most multicultural city in the world, not that this has any relevance to my original point.

Indeed, as a fellow medical person, you should have clearly seen the medical analogy in the content of my post. I was talking about treating the underlying cause of such brutality and not just the symptoms(Manchester, Paris,ect). Monday night's terrorist attack and the warped motivation is a manifest symptom of a disease and the disease is Wahhabism, espoused, supported and funded by The House Of Saud and it all being conveniently ignored by successive American administrations for oil and trillion dollar investments.

I go along with you part of the way. But your focus is too narrow. The root of this is (as much as it can be followed to one root) is salafi'ism of which Wa'habism is but-albeit a major one-branch.
Wa'habism itself was relatively quiescent until the Islamic revolution in Iran, stirred it into action, partly to compete with, partly to oppose Shi'a radicalism. The second stream is of Egyptian Jihadism that has existed since the sixties and traces it's intellectual origins back to the executed writer Sayid Qutb. Egyptian Jihadis were the ones who assassinated Sadat. The third stream originated in the Indian sub-continent and is responsible for the radicalism in Pakistan and Afghanistan. In the decades since the Iranian revolution and the Russian war in Afghanistan, the streams have flowed together and reinforced each other. They are out of the control of the Saudis now (and by the way, the other Gulf states are nearly as much to blame. In efforts to compete with and outbid Saudi influence in the region, they sponsored different and rival Jihadi groups to play out their feuds on the battlefields of Iraq and Syria). But focusing solely on the Saudis ignores one salient fact, that there has always been a stream, sometimes overt, often underground, of this kind of thinking in Islam. It goes back as far as history records. Call it what you will, Salafism, Wa''habism, Qutbism-it had other names in other centuries-and it never goes away.In times of crisis in the Muslim world it erupts, like dying embers, never quite extinguished, stirred again into flame.

FrancieBrady wrote: »

To my original point, like you, the people of Britain are not ready to look rationally at the root cause of the problem (whatever they may be, I am only speculating).

The problem is multi-causal, the result of a perfect storm of actions of multiple parties over half a century....and beyond.

wonderfullife

Exeggcute wrote: »

The father was a member of a former Al-Qaeda backed group in Libya.

A Libyan security official that personally knows the father said he was a member of the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group in the 1990's

He said the father belongs to the Salafi Jihafi movement, the most extreme sect of Salafism and from which Al Qaeda and ISIS hail.


My my my...no wonder he thinks his son is innocent. How this ****er was ever allowed into the UK is beyond me.

He was given political asylum by the UK government.

Ever hear of Lockerbie? Google it. The British weren't exactly best buddies with Gaddafi after that. Guess who was opposed to Gaddafi? The Libyan Islamic Fighting Group.

MI6 actually funded the group! Times were different. They wanted Gaddafi dead and the best chance of that was through those folks, so they financed the group.

If you're paying lads like Abedi Senior to try kill Gaddafi and it goes south, then yeah the next step is getting them out of dodge.

BalcombeSt4

JPCN1 wrote: »

Send them to Syria.

Send who or what to Syria?

Exeggcute

The Libyans just arrested the father.

Help!!!!

Hears an interesting videos with Maajid Nawaz who is an ex Islamic extremist but watch from the start because theres some interesting data about Muslims around the world

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whHwYQTSdV8

buried

Exeggcute wrote: »

The father was a member of a former Al-Qaeda backed group in Libya.

A Libyan security official that personally knows the father said he was a member of the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group in the 1990's

He said the father belongs to the Salafi Jihafi movement, the most extreme sect of Salafism and from which Al Qaeda and ISIS hail.


My my my...no wonder he thinks his son is innocent. How this ****er was ever allowed into the UK is beyond me.

Two words, Saudi Arabia.

ceadaoin.

_oveless_ wrote: »

My heart goes out to Muslims everywhere who will be treated with suspicion and scrutiny after this unfortunate incident, Islam & Muslims in general are the biggest victim in all of this. The responsibility for this attack has more to do with brexit and trump than it does to Islam. Europe needs to learn to live with these unfortunate events, we just need to not dwell on them and move on as quickly as possible.

Ok, be sure to tell the families of the victims and the traumatized children who were there that they need to move on ASAP :rolleyes:

There were attacks like this before brexit and trump btw and there are attacks in places that have nothing to do with them. Indonesia for example, which I've just read has had a suicide bombing at a bus stop. What's the excuse for that? It's almost like there is some other common denominator...god knows that could be though

Erik Shin

A family of bombers?.... How can a whole family be so brainwashed...how could one member not just say....ah no lads....fck this for a game of cowboys...this is a little bit off North for my moral compass

Help!!!!

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Ok, be sure to tell the families of the victims and the traumatized children who were there that they need to move on ASAP :rolleyes:

There were attacks like this before brexit and trump btw and there attacks in places that have nothing to do with them. Indonesia for example, which I've just read has had a suicide bombing at a bus stop. What's the excuse for that?

Philippines had a police chief beheaded by ISIS affiliated group

ceadaoin.

Erik Shin wrote: »

A family of bombers?.... How can a whole family be so brainwashed...how could one member not just say....ah no lads....fck this for a game of cowboys...this is a little bit off North for my moral compass

Brainwashing and indoctrination are powerful things.

BalcombeSt4

Help!!!! wrote: »

Hears an interesting videos with Maajid Nawaz who is an ex Islamic extremist but watch from the start because theres some interesting data about Muslims around the world

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whHwYQTSdV8

Oh thats good Fox News & Katie Hopkins is here to offer their fair and balanced, rational coverage:rolleyes:

Help!!!!

Erik Shin wrote: »

A family of bombers?.... How can a whole family be so brainwashed...how could one member not just say....ah no lads....fck this for a game of cowboys...this is a little bit off North for my moral compass

Maybe has to do something with a religious book that they were reading. Trying not to generalise but when there were cartoons drawn of Mr M, it wasnt just one or two calling on death to the west. Although I'm sure there will be someone along soon to tell me I'm wrong

Help!!!!

BalcombeSt4 wrote: »

Oh thats good Fox News is here to offer their fair and balanced coverage:rolleyes:

Watch it first then decide:rolleyes:

dav3

Exeggcute wrote: »

The father was a member of a former Al-Qaeda backed group in Libya.

A Libyan security official that personally knows the father said he was a member of the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group in the 1990's

He said the father belongs to the Salafi Jihafi movement, the most extreme sect of Salafism and from which Al Qaeda and ISIS hail.


My my my...no wonder he thinks his son is innocent. How this ****er was ever allowed into the UK is beyond me.

Because he was one of the good guys according to the Brits, he was fighting the nasty evil Gaddafi who had aligned himself with socialist states, refused to share his oil with the Brits and Americans and refused to buy their weapons.
The Brits decided to take in all the brave Islamic terrorists who stood up to the nasty Gaddafi. Then they decided to overthrow the regime altogether, armed the terrorists, took the oil and handed out rebuilding infrastructure deals to their mates.

Anyway, it’s all worked out well for the Brits in the end. Just like the Americans who've been running amok in the middle east for decades. They've got their oil, infrastructure contracts and arms deals.

Meanwhile we have Trump gobbling on the c*ck of the Saudis while handing over $110 billion dollars worth of weapons to them. What could possibly go wrong?

BalcombeSt4

Help!!!! wrote: »

Watch it first then decide:rolleyes:

I've already decided that Katie Hopkins is a rat faced **** troll.

Help!!!!

BalcombeSt4 wrote: »

I've already decided that Katie Hopkins is a rat faced **** troll.

What about Maajid?? He telling porkies as well??

twinytwo

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Sadly this kind of thing is not going away. It is like Hydra's head, as soon as you stop one (or they kill themselves), there are many others looking for glory to take their place.

Very unnerving TBH. They are everywhere.

Security services have probably stopped many potential acts of terrorism that we know nothing about, but when they cannot stop something like Manchester, Westminster, 7/7, Nice, Bataclan and so many others, it would appear we are fighting a losing battle.

I am not being negative, just realistic, and it scares the bejaysus out of me.

Oh this is very easy to stop but all the do gooders get up on their high horses and scream about rights etc etc

Help!!!!

twinytwo wrote: »

Oh this is very easy to stop but all the do gooders get up on their high horses and scream about rights etc etc

Yeah watch when a ex SAS has his say on what should be done

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQ1Kz6DFU-E

kopite386

Persephone kindness wrote: »

The family is obv covering for him.

I just read a report I'll have to find the link after the younger brother was arrested that it seems to be a family affair apparently there is multiple members of the whole family involved

BalcombeSt4

Help!!!! wrote: »

What about Maajid?? He telling porkies as well??

Yeah didn't offer any solutions, which is what I'm concerned about instead of running around screaming hystericl slogans.

Help!!!!

BalcombeSt4 wrote: »

Yeah didn't offer any solutions, which is what I'm concerned about instead of running around screaming hystericl slogans.

Well I've not heard any solutions from the Liberals only how to make the situation worse by inviting more in to Europe

BalcombeSt4

Help!!!! wrote: »

Well I've not heard any solutions from the Liberals only how to make the situation worse by inviting more in to Europe

Well I'm not a Liberal, but a good start would be to stop supplying & financing these types of extreme Islamist groups & regimes, starting with the £110 million Trump pledged to Saudi Arabia a few days ago.

Another would be to stop sending our militaries into places their not wanted, welcomed or needed.

kopite386

The father has apparently been arrested aswell in Libya

Help!!!!

BalcombeSt4 wrote: »

Well I'm not a Liberal, but a good start would be to stop supplying & financing these types of extreme Islamist groups & regimes, starting with the £110 million Trump pledged to Saudi Arabia a few days ago.

Another would be to stop sending our militaries into places their not wanted, welcomed or needed.

Yep that would be a start, another would be deportations for all family members of a terrorist, if they are British the they all do jail time. Might seem harsh but would give these terrorists something to think about

wonderfullife

2 of the top 4 worst terrorist attacks in this decade in Europe have been committed by white men. That's just a fact.

Anders Breivik meticulously planned and massacred 77 people, targeting children at a youth camp and gave Neo-Nazi salutes at his trial. Andreas Lubitz meticulously planned and killed 149 people by flying the plane into a mountain. Reasons apparently unknown.

Lubitz act of terrorism was the single worst in Europe in the decade.

The excuses made for these 2 men reflect the fact that people only see "terrorism" when it's done by brown people who speak another language or follow another culture.

If it's just a regular old European white person, then they were "troubled", "disaffected", "sick".

In the aftermath of the Germanwings crash, almost all media attention was focused on Lubitz state of mind. Not one publication is pondering whether Salman Abedi was suffering from depression or mental illness. Why? Why should it matter what Lubitz state of mind was and not what Abedi's was?

If the roles were reversed we'd be seeing Abedi immediately declared a terrorist and not one iota of thought given to whether he suffered from a mental illness or not before crashing the plane. We'd be seeing the same focus on Lubitz state of mind when seeking to explain why he killed kids at a concert.

People want to bash Islam because it's a soft target. It's much more difficult to address why white people shoot up schools, crash planes, plant bombs and massacre people. We don't have a neat and tidy thing to blame.

The bottom line is whether someone uses a religious excuse or no excuse at all, there will always and HAS ALWAYS been lunatics willing to die and massacre other humans in the process.

Deporting Muslims, locking them up, persecuting them, internment ....none of that will prevent future terrorist mass-murder by people whether they are white or brown.