Hail To The Chief (Read Mod Warning In OP)

conorhal

Grayson wrote: »

The point is that refugees aren't dangerous.

Tell that to the women of Cologne or Bastille day revellers in Nice.

Grayson wrote: »

I read somewhere that there's more americans fighting with ISIS than there are ISIS members in the US. Iraq is actually an ally in fighting ISIS.

Do the joined up thinking, might that be because they allow so few migrants from the Middle east into the country in the first place? Sure Japan has no Isis fighters at all!

Grayson wrote: »

The number of people in the US that are killed by terrorism is tiny. Should measures be taken to lower that number? Of course. No-one is saying we should ignore terrorism. But this response is like using a sledgehammer to crack a walnut. It's excessive and won't do any good at all.

Says you. Others disagree.

C. Montgomery Gurns

Zaph wrote: »

He's also given Jared Kushner a regular seat on the NSC. So basically what Trump is saying is that his son-in-law knows more about national security and intelligence than the two most senior security and intelligence officials in the country. It's beyond mind-boggling trying to work out what thought processes are running through that little straw covered head of his, but it's inconceivable to think that this will end well.

The intelligence establishment were in Clinton's pocket.

The last president who fell out with the CIA got his head blown over the back seat of a Cadillac, so he is probably right to get rid of these clowns.

Zaph

C. Montgomery Gurns wrote: »

The intelligence establishment were in Clinton's pocket.

The last president who fell out with the CIA got his head blown over the back seat of a Cadillac, so he is probably right to get rid of these clowns.

So you replace them with people who actually know what they're doing and not a new troupe of clowns.

Christy42

C. Montgomery Gurns wrote: »

The intelligence establishment were in Clinton's pocket.

The last president who fell out with the CIA got his head blown over the back seat of a Cadillac, so he is probably right to get rid of these clowns.

Oh good. I was worried we would move back to the realm of conspiracy theories. The evidence provided in this post is overwhelming.

metaoblivia

conorhal wrote: »

Money and back scratching, the same reason Clinton grounded organ transplant flights on 9/11 but allowed Saudi royals to fly out.
Not that we can talk, after lowering our flags on state buildings to half mast as a token of respect to their odious regime when the last king died.

Clinton? Funny, wasn't aware he still had that kind of power on 9/11/2001.

Manic Moran

Woodville56 wrote: »

Trump's latest move at making America great is to give Breitbart's Steve Bannon and son in law Jared Kushner seats on the National Security Council, but excludes chairman of Joint Chiefs of Staff and the Director of National Intelligence except on an " as required" basis. Keeping it in the family eh ? Ya couldn't make it up ! Neither Bannon nor Kushner have any public service or security /intelligence experience, yet both now privy to inner sanctum on national security ? How can Republicans be happy with this ?

A friend of mine is a senior Field Grade in the Pentagon. He posted the following on his FB feed:
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]

---

[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]For the love of all that is worth loving....[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]The DNI and CJCS were NOT removed from the National Security Council.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]They are statutory positions mandated by law.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]The only difference is that when the Principals Committee meets on any issue outside of direct national security interests, such as an economic, cultural or social issue (and that is generally rare), the DNI and CJCS are not invited to those meetings.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Please read the actual Executive Orders before claiming that the Alien Hitler Youth is coming to place us all in FEMA death camps designed to harvest our organs.[/font]

rossie1977

conorhal wrote: »

Says you. Others disagree.

Actual research on the matter

Tomorrow, President Trump is expected to sign an executive order enacting a 30-day suspension of all visas for nationals from Iraq, Iran, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, and Yemen. Foreigners from those seven nations have killed zero Americans in terrorist attacks on U.S. soil between 1975 and the end of 2015. Six Iranians, six Sudanese, two Somalis, two Iraqis, and one Yemini have been convicted of attempting or carrying out terrorist attacks on U.S. soil. Zero Libyans or Syrians have been convicted of planning a terrorist attack on U.S. soil during that time period.

https://www.cato.org/blog/little-national-security-benefit-trumps-executive-order-immigration

conorhal

metaoblivia wrote: »

Clinton? Funny, wasn't aware he still had that kind of power on 9/11/2001.

Or Bush, I get confused sometimes, I admit, it's hard to remember who's deeper in the Saudi pockets (hint, it's Bush, Unger's book House of Bush, House of Saud is an enlightening read)

conorhal

rossie1977 wrote: »

Actual research on the matter


https://www.cato.org/blog/little-national-security-benefit-trumps-executive-order-immigration

So what? Please explain how handing out visas to the citizens of failed states with a serious islamist terror problem is a good idea?
The only answer I can imagine is to rectify the fact that they haven't produced a terror plot on US soil. There is noting but common sense to that order. Would you sign an order that gave visa free travel from Iraq or Syria?

jobbridge4life

Manic Moran wrote: »

A friend of mine is a senior Field Grade in the Pentagon. He posted the following on his FB feed:
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]

---

[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]For the love of all that is worth loving....[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]The DNI and CJCS were NOT removed from the National Security Council.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]They are statutory positions mandated by law.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]The only difference is that when the Principals Committee meets on any issue outside of direct national security interests, such as an economic, cultural or social issue (and that is generally rare), the DNI and CJCS are not invited to those meetings.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Please read the actual Executive Orders before claiming that the Alien Hitler Youth is coming to place us all in FEMA death camps designed to harvest our organs.[/font]

John McCain, veteran, US Senator, Chair of the Senate Armed Services Committee, disagrees with your friend from Facebook.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/01/mccain-bannon-nsc-234329

jobbridge4life

conorhal wrote: »

Or Bush, I get confused sometimes, I admit, it's hard to remember who's deeper in the Saudi pockets (hint, it's Bush, Unger's book House of Bush, House of Saud is an enlightening read)

FFS...

Mr. Incognito

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

Sounds like fake news. Name one war that people have suffered in.

If this isnt sarcasm its the stupidest thing ive ever read

MightyMandarin

Manic Moran wrote: »

A friend of mine is a senior Field Grade in the Pentagon. He posted the following on his FB feed:
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]

---

[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]For the love of all that is worth loving....[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]The DNI and CJCS were NOT removed from the National Security Council.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]They are statutory positions mandated by law.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]The only difference is that when the Principals Committee meets on any issue outside of direct national security interests, such as an economic, cultural or social issue (and that is generally rare), the DNI and CJCS are not invited to those meetings.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Please read the actual Executive Orders before claiming that the Alien Hitler Youth is coming to place us all in FEMA death camps designed to harvest our organs.[/font]

Give that is in fact the case, what is your opinion on the likes of Bannon and Kushner - particularly Bannon given his clear contempt for any sort of establishment- getting seats on the NSC?
Do you believe they are qualified for these positions in any way?

peasant

Manic Moran wrote: »

A friend of mine is a senior Field Grade in the Pentagon. He posted the following on his FB feed:
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]

---

[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]For the love of all that is worth loving....[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]The DNI and CJCS were NOT removed from the National Security Council.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]They are statutory positions mandated by law.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]The only difference is that when the Principals Committee meets on any issue outside of direct national security interests, such as an economic, cultural or social issue (and that is generally rare), the DNI and CJCS are not invited to those meetings.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Please read the actual Executive Orders before claiming that the Alien Hitler Youth is coming to place us all in FEMA death camps designed to harvest our organs.[/font]

Would you please ask your facebook friend if he's convinced that when the NSC (in it's new form) meets to discuss ...say business relationships with Taiwan for example ... they are going to halt their meeting and invite the DNI and CJCS and play solitaire until they show up BEFORE they touch on China's possible reactions and how to deal with them?
Or will the hotheads just be allowed to plough on and the real security experts will only find out about the invasion on the news ...like the rest of us

...and before you're going to tell me that's an "unlikely scenario"..please go back over the last few weeks and check how much porcelain has already been broken by the bull in the China shop

Manic Moran

jobbridge4life wrote: »

Manic Moran wrote: »

A friend of mine is a senior Field Grade in the Pentagon. He posted the following on his FB feed:
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]

---

[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]For the love of all that is worth loving....[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]The DNI and CJCS were NOT removed from the National Security Council.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]They are statutory positions mandated by law.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]The only difference is that when the Principals Committee meets on any issue outside of direct national security interests, such as an economic, cultural or social issue (and that is generally rare), the DNI and CJCS are not invited to those meetings.[/font]
[font=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Please read the actual Executive Orders before claiming that the Alien Hitler Youth is coming to place us all in FEMA death camps designed to harvest our organs.[/font]

John McCain, veteran, US Senator, Chair of the Senate Armed Services Committee, disagrees with your friend from Facebook.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/01/mccain-bannon-nsc-234329

McCain seemed to more be blasting the inclusion of the new guys, he does not mention the exclusion of CJCS or DNI, and as my friend observes, the executive order cannot override either the National Security Act, or the Homeland Security Act. Even Trump's order references their statutory position: They will attend the NSC meetings whether Trump (or the CJCS/DNI) like it or not.

Here is the text of the order. Excerpts follow, and note that the order differentiates between "Shall attend", "May attend", and "are invited".https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2017/01/28/presidential-memorandum-organization-national-security-council-and

"The NSC and HSC shall have as their regular attendees (both statutory and non-statutory) the President, the Vice President, the Secretary of State, the Secretary of the Treasury, the Secretary of Defense, the Attorney General, the Secretary of Energy, the Secretary of Homeland Security, the National Security Advisor, the Homeland Security Advisor, and the Representative of the United States to the United Nations.  When international economic issues are on the agenda of the NSC, the NSC's regular attendees will include the Secretary of Commerce, the United States Trade Representative, and the Assistant to the President for Economic Policy.  The Director of National Intelligence and the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, as statutory advisers to the NSC, shall also attend NSC meetings. 
[...]

The Principles Committee shall have as its regular attendees the Secretary of State, the Secretary of the Treasury, the Secretary of Defense, the Attorney General, the Secretary of Homeland Security, the Assistant to the President and Chief of Staff, the Assistant to the President and Chief Strategist, the National Security Advisor, and the Homeland Security Advisor.  The Director of National Intelligence and the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff shall attend where issues pertaining to their responsibilities and expertise are to be discussed. 

---

I don't know what the previous order stated which this replaces. If it said that CJCS and DNI 'shall' show up even when the topic is not relevant to their areas, then this may be an improvement. I'm going to wager that their time is more important than sitting around at meetings just because the meeting is on.

Manic Moran

Would you please ask your facebook friend if he's convinced that when the NSC (in it's new form) meets to discuss ...say business relationships with Taiwan for example ... they are going to halt their meeting and invite the DNI and CJCS and play solitaire until they show up BEFORE they touch on China's possible reactions and how to deal with them?

See above. If the NSC meets, the DNI and CJCS must attend. There is no wiggle room in either Trump's order or the legislation.
As for the inclusion of Bannon or Kushner, I am not in a position to declare their suitability for the roles they hold. But the positions themselves seem relevant to the meetings regardless of who is in them.

MadYaker

Anyone else ever read anything on here: https://www.reddit.com/r/The_Donald/

It's mind bending stuff. I think it's just all a big joke though, most people posting there don't actually believe the things they are posting.

jobbridge4life

Manic Moran wrote: »

McCain seemed to more be blasting the inclusion of the new guys, he does not mention the exclusion of CJCS or DNI, and as my friend observes, the executive order cannot override either the National Security Act, or the Homeland Security Act. Even Trump's order references their statutory position: They will attend the NSC meetings whether Trump (or the CJCS/DNI) like it or not.

Here is the text of the order. Excerpts follow, and note that the order differentiates between "Shall attend", "May attend", and "are invited".https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2017/01/28/presidential-memorandum-organization-national-security-council-and

"The NSC and HSC shall have as their regular attendees (both statutory and non-statutory) the President, the Vice President, the Secretary of State, the Secretary of the Treasury, the Secretary of Defense, the Attorney General, the Secretary of Energy, the Secretary of Homeland Security, the National Security Advisor, the Homeland Security Advisor, and the Representative of the United States to the United Nations.  When international economic issues are on the agenda of the NSC, the NSC's regular attendees will include the Secretary of Commerce, the United States Trade Representative, and the Assistant to the President for Economic Policy.  The Director of National Intelligence and the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, as statutory advisers to the NSC, shall also attend NSC meetings. 
[...]

The Principles Committee shall have as its regular attendees the Secretary of State, the Secretary of the Treasury, the Secretary of Defense, the Attorney General, the Secretary of Homeland Security, the Assistant to the President and Chief of Staff, the Assistant to the President and Chief Strategist, the National Security Advisor, and the Homeland Security Advisor.  The Director of National Intelligence and the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff shall attend where issues pertaining to their responsibilities and expertise are to be discussed. 

---

I don't know what the previous order stated which this replaces. If it said that CJCS and DNI 'shall' show up even when the topic is not relevant to their areas, then this may be an improvement. I'm going to wager that their time is more important than sitting around at meetings just because the meeting is on.

"The role of the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff has been diminished, I understand, with this reorganization. The one person who is indispensable would be the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, in my view," McCain said of Dunford. "So it’s of concern, this 'reorganization.'" - John McCain.

jobbridge4life

Manic Moran wrote: »

See above. If the NSC meets, the DNI and CJCS must attend. There is no wiggle room in either Trump's order or the legislation.
As for the inclusion of Bannon or Kushner, I am not in a position to declare their suitability for the roles they hold. But the positions themselves seem relevant to the meetings regardless of who is in them.

I'm sorry but if you can't see that this 'radical' departure from convention and the appointment of the editor of a website that pushes white nationalism and 'alt-right' fascists to any position in relation to national security is prima facie inappropriate... I just don't know...

MightyMandarin

MadYaker wrote: »

Anyone else ever read anything on here: https://www.reddit.com/r/The_Donald/

It's mind bending stuff. I think it's just all a big joke though, most people posting there don't actually believe the things they are posting.

Avoid that place, it's just an extension of /pol/. Trump's online supporters are nothing like his real supporters. You think 70yr old retirees, coal-miners, factory workers or evangelicals post rare pepes and Trump memes in their spare time? t_D is just made up of Russian trolls, 13yr old kids and a bunch of sleazebag Richard Spencer types.

Haha found this in the_Donald.. Obama's brother is pro-Trump. Even wears a Maga cap.

https://twitter.com/ObamaMalik/status/825636542836269056

Little CuChulainn

Deleted User wrote: »

Haha found this in the_Donald.. Obama's brother is pro-Trump. Even wears a Maga cap.

https://twitter.com/ObamaMalik/status/825636542836269056

I see he is using the same idiotic analogy of the locked house. Locked house is no good if the bad guys have a key.

Arne_Saknussem

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

I see he is using the same idiotic analogy of the locked house. Locked house is no good if the bad guys have a key.

That's where one of these comes in.

dav3

Manic Moran wrote: »

A friend of mine is a senior Field Grade in the Pentagon. He posted the following on his FB feed:

The only difference is that when the Principals Committee meets on any issue outside of direct national security interests, such as an economic, cultural or social issue (and that is generally rare), the DNI and CJCS are not invited to those meetings.

That's wonderful that you have friend on facebook posting such an objective and detailed explanation.

Does your friend see the potential risks involved?

jobbridge4life

MightyMandarin wrote: »

Avoid that place, it's just an extension of /pol/. Trump's online supporters are nothing like his real supporters. You think 70yr old retirees, coal-miners, factory workers or evangelicals post rare pepes and Trump memes in their spare time? t_D is just made up of Russian trolls, 13yr old kids and a bunch of sleazebag Richard Spencer types.

*emphasis added*

The regime of President Donald J Trump, POTUS45, is populated with 'sleazebag Richard Spencer' types. Steve Bannon.

Billy86

conorhal wrote: »

Or Bush, I get confused sometimes, I admit, it's hard to remember who's deeper in the Saudi pockets (hint, it's Bush, Unger's book House of Bush, House of Saud is an enlightening read)

I'm pretty sure Trump could give most a run for their money when it comes to Saudi connections.

PopePalpatine

MightyMandarin wrote: »

Avoid that place, it's just an extension of /pol/. Trump's online supporters are nothing like his real supporters. You think 70yr old retirees, coal-miners, factory workers or evangelicals post rare pepes and Trump memes in their spare time? t_D is just made up of Russian trolls, 13yr old kids and a bunch of sleazebag Richard Spencer types.

You forgot the PUA Neanderthals.

BabyCheeses

Trump said it isn't a muslim ban. Where is the ban he promised?

He also said it is working out very nicely, having students and employees trapped out of their homes is working nicely to him.

BabyCheeses

MadYaker wrote: »

Anyone else ever read anything on here: https://www.reddit.com/r/The_Donald/

It's mind bending stuff. I think it's just all a big joke though, most people posting there don't actually believe the things they are posting.

It is useful for seeing what will be posted here within a few hours.

jobbridge4life

Arne_Saknussem wrote: »

That's where one of these comes in.

This response echoes the kind of juvenile, (and what comes next is fodder to the Trumpistas but it is true) stunted masculinity, that is the heart of Trumpolini's support and the USA's stubborn unwillingness to acknowledge the fact that they make themselves less safe.

'Me and my shotgun, getting all ready, getting all ready for war'

Shotguns under the bed, guns in every fridge, every shelf, every class room, every campus, every street, EVERYWHERE, kill more Americans than they save.

I'd lol at the idea that they were going to guarantee American freedom in the face of a regime hostile to the very core principals of America... if it wasn't so real a threat.