At what salary in Ireland can you be considered to have a decent life?

Steve The Barman

steddyeddy wrote: »

Obviously this is highly subjective and dependent on your dependents but let's say talk about single life and married/partnered with two kids. A lot of people say the harder you work in this country the more screwed over you get and in some ways I agree. So what would you have to do to have the sort of life you want?

Which professions would you bank on to have a decent life here?

about Tree Fiddy

lawred2

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

While the headline % looks bad you forgetting that people on the higher tax bands can offset lots of things.

Bin charges, pensions, bike to work, commuter tickets, health insurance etc. all get a bigger discount than someone on minimum wage. It all adds up.



There are lots of unhappy millionaires.
IIRC in the US they found that after $170,000 people didn't get happier.
So it's a rough figure that frees you up from financial worries.

Bin charges? What?

Wheeliebin30

lawred2 wrote: »

Bin charges? What?

That jumped out at me too.

myshirt

uch wrote: »

South Dublin, Mortgage, earn about 45k, haven't a pot to piss in, kids are grown up, I bought a council house at the wrong time, but I'm one of them Rich Civil servants that people are talkin about, sure me 100k pension payout will cover everything!!
More like about 35k after 35 years, dont believe everything you read in the papers lads,

You haven't a clue how a pension pot is valued do you?

Between a lump sum and a weekly pension, have you any idea how much the state puts away each year on your behalf to fund it? And who pays for that?

The fact that you are not within an asses roar of demonstrating a morsel of comprehension says it all. Our public service bill is insane. Absolutely insane my friend. Those workers and your unions should be f#cking ashamed of themselves. Young workers amongst paying off other excesses of the overpaid public service class are also paying up to 50% of their take home on rent to that generation, have limited chance of home ownership at the same age as you, or salary level as you, no gilt edged pension, see homelessness amongst their peers, suicides, kids saddled with your bills before they are even born, you name it, a raft of issues that while complex always come back to economics as a key driver.

€45k, mortgage, south Dublin, 35 years in public service, and not a pot to piss in, will you come out of the fog mate and stop pissing on the youth today who haven't got a fair shake at this world so you can come on and describe that as not having a pot to piss in.

In a properly functioning economy, many public servants would be living in a hovel such is the extent of their piss poor performance

Graces7

Qs wrote: »

Even if you had 5 times what you earn now you'd always be able to say "but I'm never short on things I would spend money on if I had more."

Generally I believe you could be living a "decent" life on a pretty modest income but it would take a lot of preparation and luck. The luck being that nothing popped up to mess up your preparation. Or the luck to have a good support system, etc

I was on disability many years, then the UK pension. Now with a little more from Ireland. As someone else has said even on a low income we are far better than many in this world.

I live simply and carefully but lack nothing I really need. Rent in the wilder areas, at present a small old car but in a very few years will not be driving ,

Never was one for eating out or anything like that, which so many value now,

If i had five times what I have now I would give it away.

Wanderer78

It's very hard to see positives at any income level at the moment, I feel most workers are getting screwed, work simply isn't paying, and most are getting poor return for the taxes they pay. It's disgraceful really and unsustainable.

Sam Kade

thierry14 wrote: »

That's surviving



To do that in Dublin you'd need 200 - 250k

Rural like Kerry etc 125k - 150k

I'm on 50k and wife 30k

We have to watch the pennies, we are not broke but it's not the decent A decent life is having very little financial worries and being able to enjoy finer things in life.

2 good holidays a year, nearly new car, good clothes, eating out in good restaurants regularly, down time for hobbies like golf, cycling clubs, big house, 2 dogs, 2 kids, pretty wife at home, only works part time at most, weekends away from kids.living you see in the movies

Eg Home Alone type family

Trip to France for Christmas, big house, few kids, house wife, 2 cars, new kitchen/ renovated house etc

That's called living the high life, which is miles away from a decent living.

Parchment

thierry14 wrote: »

That's surviving

A decent life is having very little financial worries and being able to enjoy finer things in life.

2 good holidays a year, nearly new car, good clothes, eating out in good restaurants regularly, down time for hobbies like golf, cycling clubs, big house, 2 dogs, 2 kids, pretty wife at home, only works part time at most, weekends away from kids.

To do that in Dublin you'd need 200 - 250k

Rural like Kerry etc 125k - 150k

I'm on 50k and wife 30k

We have to watch the pennies, we are not broke but it's not the decent living you see in the movies

Eg Home Alone type family

Trip to France for Christmas, big house, few kids, house wife, 2 cars, new kitchen/ renovated house etc

You are off the mark here - the OP said single people.

Also your definition of a decent life is kind what most people would consider a pretty plush life. also i dont know where salary comes into getting "a pretty wife at home".

The Rape of Lucretia

Wanderer78 wrote: »

I feel most workers are getting screwed, work simply isn't paying

No they arent. Almost all, except voluntary workers are being paid. There is a minimum wage, so anyone not getting paid, should have a word with their boss, or move to a job that does pay.

Wanderer78

The Rape of Lucretia wrote:

No they arent. Almost all, except voluntary workers are being paid. There is a minimum wage, so anyone not getting paid, should have a word with their boss, or move to a job that does pay.

I disagree there, we 're in an era of increasing worker insecurity, apparently it's 'good for the economy', in fact it's bad for the long term prospects of the economy and for society as a whole

homewardbound11

myshirt wrote: »

You haven't a clue how a pension pot is valued do you?

Between a lump sum and a weekly pension, have you any idea how much the state puts away each year on your behalf to fund it? And who pays for that?

The fact that you are not within an asses roar of demonstrating a morsel of comprehension says it all. Our public service bill is insane. Absolutely insane my friend. Those workers and your unions should be f#cking ashamed of themselves. Young workers amongst paying off other excesses of the overpaid public service class are also paying up to 50% of their take home on rent to that generation, have limited chance of home ownership at the same age as you, or salary level as you, no gilt edged pension, see homelessness amongst their peers, suicides, kids saddled with your bills before they are even born, you name it, a raft of issues that while complex always come back to economics as a key driver.

€45k, mortgage, south Dublin, 35 years in public service, and not a pot to piss in, will you come out of the fog mate and stop pissing on the youth today who haven't got a fair shake at this world so you can come on and describe that as not having a pot to piss in.

In a properly functioning economy, many public servants would be living in a hovel such is the extent of their piss poor performance

A little hard there poster but my rough figures , starting a pension now at 43 and having at retirement fund of 35 k a year would require an investment of above 20 k a year (before tax) . Am I reading this correctly or are pensions not that well performing after all . I used one of the online calculators . Sorry , going off topic here .

Pkiernan

This is the price we pay for the relatively constant 160000 layabouts we have in this country.
Multi generational welfare is a failure, and just encourages more and more layabouts.

Wanderer78

Pkiernan wrote:

This is the price we pay for the relatively constant 160000 layabouts we have in this country. Multi generational welfare is a failure, and just encourages more and more layabouts.

Completely disagree there, I believe it is largely due to the implementation of neoliberal and free market economic policies, which is causing increasing worker insecurity, amongst other things of course. The root causes of long-term unemployment are very complex

76544567

I think once you own your own home and have it paid off, your requirements reduce dramatically.
You would need a lot less to live on then.

But every time I think I have enough, my lifestyle seems to grow with the amount of money available and I spend even more.
I suspect it works the opposite way too, but would not like to test the theory.

I hear people going on about how much the public sector pensions cost, but I know someone who is a public worker and they told me they wont get the regular state contributory pension.

So how much does the equivalent of the contributory state pension that I will get cost.
Probably hell of a lot more that the PRSI that I am paying for it. And some people pay hardly any PRSI and will still get the full state pension.

lawred2

myshirt wrote: »

You haven't a clue how a pension pot is valued do you?

Between a lump sum and a weekly pension, have you any idea how much the state puts away each year on your behalf to fund it? And who pays for that?

The fact that you are not within an asses roar of demonstrating a morsel of comprehension says it all. Our public service bill is insane. Absolutely insane my friend. Those workers and your unions should be f#cking ashamed of themselves. Young workers amongst paying off other excesses of the overpaid public service class are also paying up to 50% of their take home on rent to that generation, have limited chance of home ownership at the same age as you, or salary level as you, no gilt edged pension, see homelessness amongst their peers, suicides, kids saddled with your bills before they are even born, you name it, a raft of issues that while complex always come back to economics as a key driver.

€45k, mortgage, south Dublin, 35 years in public service, and not a pot to piss in, will you come out of the fog mate and stop pissing on the youth today who haven't got a fair shake at this world so you can come on and describe that as not having a pot to piss in.

In a properly functioning economy, many public servants would be living in a hovel such is the extent of their piss poor performance

While your point about actuarial value is correct the notion that the state is prudent enough to put enough away each year to fund future pension requirements is naive. Will and always will be paid out of current expenditure.

ted1

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

There is no squeezed middle.

The problem today is that people's expectations are way out of whack with their earnings. People buy first, or take on mortgages, loans, insurances, fee schools, etc, and then complain afterwords that they dont have the money to pay for it all. And that they are squeezed and its a struggle. Everybody in Ireland thinks they are in the middle - whether they have the money for it or not. Those who dont have the money or describe themselves as squeezed, are. in fact, not in the middle at all.

There's certinaly is a squeezed middle , who after paying for their own rent/mortgage , Elec and gas bills etc have no money left for basic needs such as doctor appointments. Those on welfare get free rent , free doctors etc. The higher paid have to plenty of cash left to do what they want.

ted1

VW 1 wrote: »

You only get charged on flights for a child over 3, not 2

It's definitely 2.

Fuzzytrooper

ted1 wrote: »

There's certinaly is a squeezed middle , who after paying for their own rent/mortgage , Elec and gas bills etc have no money left for basic needs such as doctor appointments. Those on welfare get free rent , free doctors etc. The higher paid have to plenty of cash left to do what they want.

Agreed. I haven't been to the dentist in ages and I know that's a terrible strategy to have but there's always something more pressing e.g. need to repair my old car, that pesky matter of food etc

76544567

ted1 wrote: »

There's certinaly is a squeezed middle , who after paying for their own rent/mortgage , Elec and gas bills etc have no money left for basic needs such as doctor appointments. Those on welfare get free rent , free doctors etc. The higher paid have to plenty of cash left to do what they want.

I always include myself in the squeezed middle.
I consider anyone on more than 10k above whatever im earning at the time to be above the squeezed middle though.

mariaalice

It needs to be divided in to needs
and wants for a sensible answer.

ted1

mariaalice wrote: »

It needs to be divided in to needs
and wants for a sensible answer.

Needs are addressed by our generous welfare system. Wants are why we work hard.

TimeToShine

mariaalice wrote: »

It needs to be divided in to needs
and wants for a sensible answer.

OK. I'll start with the big one.

Buying a house is a WANT, not a god given right as some people seem to think. Buying a nice semi detached house in a town or city that's worth more than triple your salary/15 times its annual rental income a year is a luxury that only a small minority should be able to afford.

The sooner we get out of this Irish post famine obsession with owning property the quicker we can truly distinguish between wants and needs, because the property ladder is the root of the problem. There are rumblings that the Celtic tiger is starting to purr again - I'd like to believe this isn't true but it I've just lived through the most lavish Christmas I've seen in a decade. People are getting salary rises back to the old days numbers and the rental market is turning into a squeeze again.

History repeats itself and once again the same generation are on course to screw those below them.

Wanderer78

ted1 wrote: »

Needs are addressed by our generous welfare system. Wants are why we work hard.

id disagree there, i firmly beleive many peoples needs are not being addressed largely due to a failure in neoliberal and free market policies, to both the employed and unemployed.

76544567

TimeToShine wrote: »

OK. I'll start with the big one.

Buying a house is a WANT, not a god given right as some people seem to think. Buying a nice semi detached house in a town or city that's worth more than triple your salary/15 times its annual rental income a year is a luxury that only a small minority should be able to afford.

The sooner we get out of this Irish post famine obsession with owning property the quicker we can truly distinguish between wants and needs, because the property ladder is the root of the problem. There are rumblings that the Celtic tiger is starting to purr again - I'd like to believe this isn't true but it I've just lived through the most lavish Christmas I've seen in a decade. People are getting salary rises back to the old days numbers and the rental market is turning into a squeeze again.

History repeats itself and once again the same generation are on course to screw those below them.

Many people renting now, who had the view for the last few years that renting was fine for life have now changed that view.
To a lot of them owning a home is a need.
If you own your own house then you are not subject to the rental market changing.

drunkmonkey

Wanderer78 wrote: »

id disagree there, i firmly beleive many peoples needs are not being addressed largely due to a failure in neoliberal and free market policies, to both the employed and unemployed.

How about blaming the things we can control like parents and teachers. Education is key. Our current system works for a lot but the ones that get left behind are screwed for life that's not the free market or any neoliberals fault.

Link child allowance to school attendance for starters and let the government hold some of it in trust for 3rd level education for chlldrens parents who are dependent on the state. It'll give little Jonny at least a sporting chance if he makes it through secondary school.

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

myshirt wrote: »

You haven't a clue how a pension pot is valued do you?

Between a lump sum and a weekly pension, have you any idea how much the state puts away each year on your behalf to fund it? And who pays for that?

The fact that you are not within an asses roar of demonstrating a morsel of comprehension says it all. Our public service bill is insane. Absolutely insane my friend. Those workers and your unions should be f#cking ashamed of themselves. Young workers amongst paying off other excesses of the overpaid public service class are also paying up to 50% of their take home on rent to that generation, have limited chance of home ownership at the same age as you, or salary level as you, no gilt edged pension, see homelessness amongst their peers, suicides, kids saddled with your bills before they are even born, you name it, a raft of issues that while complex always come back to economics as a key driver.

€45k, mortgage, south Dublin, 35 years in public service, and not a pot to piss in, will you come out of the fog mate and stop pissing on the youth today who haven't got a fair shake at this world so you can come on and describe that as not having a pot to piss in.

In a properly functioning economy, many public servants would be living in a hovel such is the extent of their piss poor performance

You have the makings of a point there but your evident hatred of public servants is getting in the way of you making it properly.

The poster stated that he or she had nothing left at the end of the week and that they live in a purchased council house in south Dublin. Didn't read the bit where they stated they should be being paid more.

Wheeliebin30

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Completely disagree there, I believe it is largely due to the implementation of neoliberal and free market economic policies, which is causing increasing worker insecurity, amongst other things of course. The root causes of long-term unemployment are very complex

Yeah pure laziness and selfishness.

Not really complex.

Highest jobless houses in Europe. Why can other countries with the same free market as us not have as many lazy families?

Graces7

76544567 wrote: »

Many people renting now, who had the view for the last few years that renting was fine for life have now changed that view.
To a lot of them owning a home is a need.
If you own your own house then you are not subject to the rental market changing.

Some small comments if i may,, We on welfare and pensions do not get free rent, and we get the lowest end of the market; not complaining by the way. Three generations ago it'd/ve been the workhouse

Also we do not get free dental treatment beyond a very small ration. I think there were some threads on that a while ago? (I am OK: I have my NHS plastic gnashers I got over three decades ago..)

I actually sold a small( inheritance) old cottage;I realised I could not afford the maintenance, or to replace appliances etc. It is a decision I have not regretted financially and I sold just before the crash

It is not the rental fluctuations that worry but the basic uncertainty of renting. My current landlord ( for another few days) wants to sell. I have a one year lease on the new place and no idea which way the owner will jump after that.

Rainman16

I guess money is not directly related to quality of life. You could be on 70k a year and be a miserable ****, or you could be on 25k and live happy.

Yourself isit

TimeToShine wrote: »

OK. I'll start with the big one.

Buying a house is a WANT, not a god given right as some people seem to think. Buying a nice semi detached house in a town or city that's worth more than triple your salary/15 times its annual rental income a year is a luxury that only a small minority should be able to afford.

The sooner we get out of this Irish post famine obsession with owning property the quicker we can truly distinguish between wants and needs, because the property ladder is the root of the problem. There are rumblings that the Celtic tiger is starting to purr again - I'd like to believe this isn't true but it I've just lived through the most lavish Christmas I've seen in a decade. People are getting salary rises back to the old days numbers and the rental market is turning into a squeeze again.

History repeats itself and once again the same generation are on course to screw those below them.

Sorry this is tosh. Firstly owning a semi detached house isn't living the high life. It's a small house attached to another house. It's what working class people used to buy. Or what council housing used to be (and still is). That the prices are out of joint is based on government policy.

Secondly this "it's the famine" bollocks is trite. Owning a home gives security. Private renters are insecure. No family would want to be turned out every two-four years. And most European countries have higher house ownership levels than Ireland despite the myths.

The lavish Christmas is an anecdote. Salaries are where they were, or lower, than 2008. Taxes are higher. In most decades salaries increase by 10+%.

Rents are increasing but is not like that is a form of conspicuous consumption by renters.

You've mistaken the costs that make a decent life impossible with extravagant spending.