Should parents stop pretending that Santa is real?

osarusan

I don't really care whether families do the santa thing or not, and I think the idea that they are bad parents for denying their kids that pleasure is silly, but equally silly is the argument that letting them believe in santa will somehow damage them down the line.

Just leave it as a preference without making up stuff to try and add more weight to that preference.

Summer wind

What kind of fool would resent their parents for loving them and being nice to them at Christmas? Children are only young and innocent for a very short time in their lives. In our school the children bring in shoe boxes full of gifts for children living in poorer countries so they know everyone else may not be as lucky as they themselves are. Watching the children excitedly opening their presents is lovely and a person would want to be truly miserable to take that away from them.

DredFX

ScumLord wrote: »

like I said they could be doing just about anything else and having as much fun without us all having to maintain this consumermiss delusion.

You sound like mighty craic, buck.

Shenshen

_Jamie_ wrote: »

Another thing that I object to that has people saying 'Bah, humbug' to me is all the different Kris Kindles that people are expected to take part in. Sure that work Secret Santa is "only" €20, but €20 isn't inconsiderable when your finances are already stretched to breaking point. And of course, nobody wants to pipe up in work that they are broke. See? Pressure. And things like work Secret Santas are what really highlight to me the pointless commercialism of Christmas. Going out to buy a present you don't want to buy for somebody whose tastes you don't know and therefore probably won't even like what you buy them? Pure distilled pointless commercialism.

I don't know, I kind of like them - I love giving gifts, and I just see it as another chance of finding something for someone I would normally not get a present for. Let's face it, people look at you strangely if you just give a random colleague a present. But I understand that if your finances are tight, you would grow to hate that.

_Jamie_

seamus wrote: »

I always got decent pressies, when Santa left the pressies just became more focussed because I was asked exactly what I wanted.

Huh? Kids are usually asked exactly want they want from Santa, aren't they? And there might be financial restrictions on that, but those would still be place once the belief goes.

As for parents reverting to less expensive presents when the illusion went, and this not happening to you - er, good for you? Your parents could afford to continue with good presents but not every family might be able to do that.

thegodlife

I struggled with this one when we had our first and did not want to encourage it but once my eldest started playing and interacting with other children it was out of my control. I know it is a big consumerism thing but what can you do about it and hate the connection between Coke Cola and the red suit which emphases just how powerful marketing is.

whoopsadoodles

Shenshen wrote: »

I don't know, I kind of like them - I love giving gifts, and I just see it as another chance of finding something for someone I would normally not get a present for. Let's face it, people look at you strangely if you just give a random colleague a present.

Autonomous Cowherd

Shenshen wrote: »

I don't know, I kind of like them - I love giving gifts, and I just see it as another chance of finding something for someone I would normally not get a present for. Let's face it, people look at you strangely if you just give a random colleague a present. But I understand that if your finances are tight, you would grow to hate that.

I don't know if some people really know how much a twenty euro sum can mean in the budget of someone who is really struggling to make ends meet. I have been in that place often in the past and it is impossible/utterly embarrassing to explain to people that yes - 20 euro either goes on food or on kris kindle. And this is from a flamboyant Leo who when finances allow loves to be generous and lavish gifts

DredFX

endacl wrote: »

penumbra
Which definition did you have in mind? Neither appears to make sense, penumbrically speaking...

I felt insecure about my lexicon and had exhausted my supply of synonyms for 'darkness' so I went for the next big thing, really.

whoopsadoodles

Shenshen wrote: »

As I said, I'm not qualified here, as nobody ever pretended to me there was such a thing as Santa. But I don't know how I would feel in retrospect if my parents had let me get to that age actively trying to keep me ignorant. We had started sex ed in school the year before that.
Again, please don't get me wrong, but I suspect I would be quite creeped out about it now.

Ah you probably only think that because it's not something you had, whereas those of us who were used to having santa think it's absolutely normal (most of us!).

seamus

_Jamie_ wrote: »

Huh? Kids are usually asked exactly want they want from Santa, aren't they? And there might be financial restrictions on that, but those would still be place once the belief goes.

Yeah, but it's usually more general. We gave a list like "Star Wars stuff and a surprise" and "Santa" would figure it out. But later on you could ask for a Sony ABD-134-T Cassette Player.

As for parents reverting to less expensive presents when the illusion went, and this not happening to you - er, good for you? Your parents could afford to continue with good presents but not every family might be able to do that.

That was basically my point. That clearly some families were resenting the whole Santa thing and struggling to maintain a facade before breathing a sigh of relief when the kids stopped believing. It's sad that some people think going nuts on the presents is a necessary part of Santa. Kids are just as happy with one nice present as they are with fifty.

Delphinium

I'm well into middle age and never believed in Santa. My father always told us that Santa didn't exist and we got presents from our parents. But strangely we never told our friends that he didn't exist though we did always make it clear that the presents were from our parents. My own children had a day out choosing the big Christmas present but got a stocking on the morning. They figured it out early on but enjoyed the make belief. I have to say that my parents were practicing Catholics and had great faith. I can never remember believing in a God or any religion but kept up a pretence for their sakes. Now I am open about my lack of faith..

DredFX

Delphinium wrote: »

I'm well into middle age and never believed in Santa. My father always told us that Santa didn't exist and we got presents from our parents. But strangely we never told our friends that he didn't exist though we did always make it clear that the presents were from our parents.

At the time they probably thought that Santy just hated you.

ScumLord

Delphinium wrote: »

I'm well into middle age and never believed in Santa. My father always told us that Santa didn't exist and we got presents from our parents.

My father would always make a point of getting me a better present than santa. He couldn't take being trumped by some fictional character. When we finally gave in and admitted we didn't believe in santa he said we could get whatever we wanted in the January sales.

pilly

Autonomous Cowherd wrote: »

I don't know if some people really know how much a twenty euro sum can mean in the budget of someone who is really struggling to make ends meet. I have been in that place often in the past and it is impossible/utterly embarrassing to explain to people that yes - 20 euro either goes on food or on kris kindle. And this is from a flamboyant Leo who when finances allow loves to be generous and lavish gifts

It is a lot of money, any kris kindle I've ever organised in a work setting was €5 tops to take into account everyone's circumstances. I certainly understand that a lot of people couldn't afford €20.

Delphinium

They took no notice of our lack of Santa but we often wondered aloud why their parents got them no presents or just some token. It was pathetic to find children of 10 still being hoodwinked.

whoopsadoodles

Delphinium wrote: »

They took no notice of our lack of Santa but we often wondered aloud why their parents got them no presents or just some token. It was pathetic to find children of 10 still being hoodwinked.

But you knew there was no Santa, so you knew all their presents came from their parents.....

seamus

nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »

I suspect this is mostly from what could be called the "Diverging from the Narrative" effect. Because what they spew makes little sense otherwise.

I doubt it is "mostly" down to just diverting from the narrative, but certainly a fair amount of it is.

However I would say in the majority people find it hard to comprehend why you wouldn't do it. For 99% of people, Santa was/is a wonderful thing. Something which brings great excitement for relatively little effort.

So people find it very difficult to comprehend why someone would "deny" themselves and their children of that, because they don't understand that other people may have never done the Santa and therefore it holds no specific value to them.

In most cases it's not that they're angry with you for diverting from the narrative or jealous that you can, but they're genuinely trying to understand why and how you could ever feel that way. Because they cannot imagine an existence where they didn't value Santa so much.

Outlaw Pete

What I like to do is go down to Smyths and when I see kids in the aisles at least ten feet from their parents, I kneel down beside them as if I'm tying my laces and tell them there is no Santa and that their parents are just liars. Once their bottom lip starts quivering, I'm outta there.

Autonomous Cowherd

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

What I like to do is go down to Smyths and when I see kids in the aisles at least ten feet from their parents, I kneel down beside them as if I'm tying my laces and tell them there is no Santa and that their parents are just liars. Once their bottom lip starts quivering, I'm outta there.

hahah...sorry, that made me laugh, ya wretch

Goya

whoopsadoodles wrote: »

But you knew there was no Santa, so you knew all their presents came from their parents.....

Think they mean they - being the delightful youngsters that they were - sneered it to the Santa believers.

It's amusing the way ten is being viewed - conveniently - as so OLD on this thread.

If parents don't do the Santa thing, that's their business but they and their children feeling so great about how enlightened they are kinda... dampen any good if they're gonna be sneering at and looking down on others.

A 10-year-old is a child. 12/13 is weird to be still believing but no need to lose one's sh*t over a child (yep, a child) still believing at 10. I partially did - it was all absolutely fine.

Autonomous Cowherd

seamus wrote: »

I doubt it is "mostly" down to just diverting from the narrative, but certainly a fair amount of it is.

However I would say in the majority people find it hard to comprehend why you wouldn't do it. For 99% of people, Santa was/is a wonderful thing. Something which brings great excitement for relatively little effort.

So people find it very difficult to comprehend why someone would "deny" themselves and their children of that, because they don't understand that other people may have never done the Santa and therefore it holds no specific value to them.

In most cases it's not that they're angry with you for diverting from the narrative or jealous that you can, but they're genuinely trying to understand why and how you could ever feel that way. Because they cannot imagine an existence where they didn't value Santa so much.

Couldn't be 99% of people - there are non-Christians in the world, a whole 70% of them.

seamus

Autonomous Cowherd wrote: »

Couldn't be 99% of people - there are non-Christians in the world, a whole 70% of them.

When I say 99%, I'm talking in the context of Ireland, not the world.

Plenty of non-Christians continue on the whole Santa thing too.

DredFX

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

What I like to do is go down to Smyths and when I see kids in the aisles at least ten feet from their parents, I kneel down beside them as if I'm tying my laces and tell them there is no Santa and that their parents are just liars.

I go the extra mile and just tell them they're adopted.

H3llR4iser

_Jamie_ wrote: »

Dunno about anyone else but we were always told that Santa hadn't endless money to be spending on us so there was a limit. My memories on how they explained why some kids gets more stuff is a bit foggy though.

Coming from Italy, one of the "rules" that there were about Santa when we were kids was that "he" only brought one "big" present per child; It worked very well - my parents had modest financial availability during most of my childhood, but I never remember thinking that some kids in the neighbourhood or my class had "more" from Santa; Of course, thinking back there'd be massive differences with the value of presents "Santa" brought, but you (luckily) don't really understand that when you're 6

Our parents were also very crafty folks...I clearly remember them "steering" me and my brother carefully and swiftly towards affordable presents, something most of my friends recall about their childhood as well.

pilly

seamus wrote: »

When I say 99%, I'm talking in the context of Ireland, not the world.

Plenty of non-Christians continue on the whole Santa thing too.

I never associated Santa with religion at all??

Special Circumstances

Next they'll be telling us some of boards most well known posters are not real people!

_Jamie_

Shenshen wrote: »

I don't know, I kind of like them - I love giving gifts, and I just see it as another chance of finding something for someone I would normally not get a present for. Let's face it, people look at you strangely if you just give a random colleague a present. But I understand that if your finances are tight, you would grow to hate that.

I love giving gift too.. to my loved ones. Adding in work secret santas just loads on the pressure and hassle. Lots of people dislike them and have to go along with it anyway out of fear of being called a grinch. I love Christmas and hate pointless Kris Kringles. And €15, €20 can be a lot to someone already stretched to the limit.

_Jamie_

seamus wrote: »

Yeah, but it's usually more general. We gave a list like "Star Wars stuff and a surprise" and "Santa" would figure it out. But later on you could ask for a Sony ABD-134-T Cassette Player.

Ha, no, my Santa lists were always that exact. :pac:

MeatTwoVeg

Without Santa I'm not sure how I'd be able to explain to my children why they didn't get any presents at Christmas.