Dairy chit chat II

Mooooo

whelan2 wrote: »

Do all creameries now test for milk urea at every collection?

Dairygold don't test for it at all

mahoney_j

whelan2 wrote: »

Do all creameries now test for milk urea at every collection?

Arrabawn do anyway ,also started testing for thermos as well over the last 6 months but no penalties as of yet

Mooooo

the only newish one here is TCM, tetrachloromethane, which can cause black specks in product and comes about if the detergent mixes with milk residue and not rinsed put properly, part of the reason I do split water rinse after milking and washing. No fines for it tho just a text if it's high. A couple of years they've been testing it but only ever got one or two texts

Buford T. Justice XIX

Mooooo wrote: »

Dairygold don't test for it at all

Or Kerry either. It would be handy to have alright though.

orm0nd

jaymla627 wrote: »

Over 30 and it becomes a issue I reckon, had serious issues last year aswell with embryo losses and milk urea was running at 35-40 for alot of the summer, held back on n put out this year for the first 3 rounds and buffering cows with hulls/pk/flaked maize mix before evening milking milk urea currently running at 20 average at the minute and bf at 3.65 was down at 3.4 this time last year

mahoney_j wrote: »

Over 30 I'd be getting concerned

was running 18 to 20 , last test 28,

was in drought situation here for a few weeks.

and stopped spreading n.. growth still slow so reckon n spread lately not being utilized

b/f 3.75 p3.4 lac 4.95 mu28.. yield 28.5 ltr.. feeding 3 kgs 16 % hi cereal nut

trying to get grass quality back up after dry spell

Water John

The urea test is handy, but the scutter at the rear end of the cow will tell you too.

pedigree 6

Water John wrote: »

The urea test is handy, but the scutter at the rear end of the cow will tell you too.

If you have to wait for that, you might as well check the pasture and see that it's not round up coming out of their back end and by that I mean you'll see burnt grass patches where they have urinated in the next grazing round. But if you see that the damage is already done.

On milk urea lots of lads and lassies are forgetting about the meal fed.
I use the the meal to bring down the overall pr% of the cows diet. The higher the nitrite in the grass the higher the protein. The high the protein in the diet that's what causes all your dietry problems in the cow and then you have problems with cows not going in calf or aborting and getting lame.

What's this that some people say that the cows total pr% diet should be 16%?
You feed a 16% nut and 22% grass, what do you get?

It's that reason why i feed a 14% nut atm.

whelan2

I dont understand though surely if a lad rings and orders a load of 18%nuts at this time of year should the mill not tell him he should be feeding a lower p nut?

pedigree 6

whelan2 wrote: »

I dont understand though surely if a lad rings and orders a load of 18%nuts at this time of year should the mill not tell him he should be feeding a lower p nut?

How does the mill know if you spread nitrogen or maybe have no clover?

I have a salesman here though and he would be fairly on the ball that way but you do need to know a lot yourself.
If a customer rings and says I want an elite 18 for milk the mill won't say no.

whelan2

pedigree 6 wrote: »

How does the mill know if you spread nitrogen or maybe have no clover?

I have a salesman here though and he would be fairly on the ball that way but you do need to know a lot yourself.
If a customer rings and says I want an elite 18 for milk the mill won't say no.

I buy off 3places. They always ask me a few questions before I place the order. Cal/mag required, feed rate, and why I want the %nut I am getting. Last rep also asked what way my milk urea was.

Keepgrowing

Milk urea 39 here
12% nut
Cows milking like engines
Same every year, make not one jot of difference. Calving 12 weeks, empty rate 8-10%.

pedigree 6

Keepgrowing wrote: »

Milk urea 39 here
12% nut
Cows milking like engines
Same every year, make not one jot of difference. Calving 12 weeks, empty rate 8-10%.

You can recycle any cows not calving in those 12 weeks into either spring or Autumn.
That option is not available to 100% spring calving.
Or is that a complete empty rate after 12 weeks and not just your cull rate?

Mooooo

Are crossbreed more resistant to acidosis? If urea is up and nothing else wrong you'd say they're fine but sillycave above obviously has an issue with bf below 3

Keepgrowing

pedigree 6 wrote: »

You can recycle any cows not calving in those 12 weeks into either spring or Autumn.
That option is not available to 100% spring calving.
Or is that a complete empty rate after 12 weeks and not just your cull rate?

Empty rate after 12 weeks breeding, what becomes of them after has nothing to do with urea iykwim

Sillycave

blackdog1 wrote: »

Also you need to put bread soda in the feed. I'd say 100 grammes a cow to start then drop it. I'd see if I could get a tonne or 2 of soya hulls with it mixed in and bucket 1-2kgs to them until new load of feed. Also see if you can get some good hay that they might eat.

Have a couple of bales of hay left, will put one out for them to eat after milking

jaymla627 wrote: »

How much n have you out/following the cows with, wouldn't get to hung up on the nut I'd reckon its high n grass doing the damage to your bf, if possible try get two kilos of soya hulls into your cows, what's your milk urea at the minute if its gone sky high your in big danger of embryo losses too

There is a bag of CAN out on paddocks in the last 3 weeks following the cows

orm0nd wrote: »

At what level should we get concerned about milk urea ? starting to creep up here, had a few cows lose embyro last year & blamed high mu

Creamery doesnt test for MU

Mooooo wrote: »

Are crossbreed more resistant to acidosis? If urea is up and nothing else wrong you'd say they're fine but sillycave above obviously has an issue with bf below 3

The cows here would be HO x BR cross, more HO

thanks for the advice, will try hay and introducing some bread soda into the feed and see what that does

Dwag

I wouldn't get concerned until mu starts exceeding 40. At 44 I'd be getting alarmed.
Can't go into detail now...I'm flat out.

pedigree 6

Keepgrowing wrote: »

Empty rate after 12 weeks breeding, what becomes of them after has nothing to do with urea iykwim

If you had carryovers?
Would you keep milking them and serve in the next block of breeding?
We're talking fertility here so average days from calving to calving matters.

whelan2

pedigree 6 wrote: »

If you had carryovers?
Would you keep milking them and serve in the next block of breeding?
We're talking fertility here so average days from calving to calving matters.

You're only fooling yourself keeping carryovers, 2 distinct groups and thats it, if they are not in calf after each breeding season, its burgers.

yosemitesam1

Mooooo wrote: »

Are crossbreed more resistant to acidosis? If urea is up and nothing else wrong you'd say they're fine but sillycave above obviously has an issue with bf below 3

Doubt they're more resistant to acidosis but jerseys/guernseys don't suffer from the high oil grass induced low milk fats

yosemitesam1

pedigree 6 wrote: »

If you have to wait for that, you might as well check the pasture and see that it's not round up coming out of their back end and by that I mean you'll see burnt grass patches where they have urinated in the next grazing round. But if you see that the damage is already done.

On milk urea lots of lads and lassies are forgetting about the meal fed.
I use the the meal to bring down the overall pr% of the cows diet. The higher the nitrite in the grass the higher the protein. The high the protein in the diet that's what causes all your dietry problems in the cow and then you have problems with cows not going in calf or aborting and getting lame.

What's this that some people say that the cows total pr% diet should be 16%?
You feed a 16% nut and 22% grass, what do you get?

It's that reason why i feed a 14% nut atm.

Meal pr% won't really effect it much, 4kg of 14 versus 18% is 160g protein difference, that's equal to about 0.1 ufl to get rid of it.
Compare that to grass where there could be 15kg of 27% pr, roughly 10 times more excess protein with more of this being rapidly available so gives a large burst of nitrogen to the cows blood.
By supplementing you're reducing mu by reducing the % grass in the diet, reducing cows incentive to graze hard so the big rush of nitrogen is not absorbed in one go or else just giving the cow the little extra boost of energy she needs to cope.
Drenching cows with pectin between bites would be the only way to fully stop any rise in mu's

Keepgrowing

pedigree 6 wrote: »

If you had carryovers?
Would you keep milking them and serve in the next block of breeding?
We're talking fertility here so average days from calving to calving matters.

I'd keep milking them and cull when going dry if their expected calving was outside 6 weeks for winter ladies or 12 weeks for spring.

The empty rates I posted are all spring cows after 12 weeks breeding.

How is a person coddling themselves by rolling over cows? Surely they know they've done it?

Mooooo

Keepgrowing wrote: »

I'd keep milking them and cull when going dry if their expected calving was outside 6 weeks for winter ladies or 12 weeks for spring.

The empty rates I posted are all spring cows after 12 weeks breeding.

How is a person coddling themselves by rolling over cows? Surely they know they've done it?

It's more breeding from cows that roll over or roll over too often I'd say, guilty of that here

Timmaay

Got one lady here who is a hangover from our pure ho days, she calved in Feb 2015 and not again till April this year! But milk recorded about 14kl over them 2yrs, and flat rate fed like the rest of the cows and no issues that I can remember over that time. Still in good shape now for a 10yr old cow and has been served again. Cows like her are the exception, but she has certainly proven very profitable over the last 2yrs despite her alone adding about 4 days onto the CI here ha! Obviously this only works because I don't switch off over the winter I'll admit!

Keepgrowing

Mooooo wrote: »

It's more breeding from cows that roll over or roll over too often I'd say, guilty of that here

He bull sorts that

All milking stock bred from 3 weeks dairy AI in May. All other breeding He Bulls inc winter

whelan2

Keepgrowing wrote: »

I'd keep milking them and cull when going dry if their expected calving was outside 6 weeks for winter ladies or 12 weeks for spring.



How is a person coddling themselves by rolling over cows? Surely they know they've done it?

I have kept them. They normally dont go in calf in the next group either. I milk them on and then culled out. It's a long time from calving in march one year to calving in September/ October the next year.

C0N0R

Cow 6263
1722 days in milk
Calved 8 September 2012
Yesterday 54.9 litres
Peak 79.2 litres
Yield this lactation 77943 litres.

Sure why would you bother putting them in calf!!

kevthegaff

C0N0R wrote:

Cow 6263 1722 days in milk Calved 8 September 2012 Yesterday 54.9 litres Peak 79.2 litres Yield this lactation 77943 litres.

Are they on hormones

Dwag

kevthegaff wrote: »

Are they on hormones

Ah no Kev...they'd be smokin' the grass...

Dwag

C0N0R wrote: »

Cow 6263
1722 days in milk
Calved 8 September 2012
Yesterday 54.9 litres
Peak 79.2 litres
Yield this lactation 77943 litres.

Sure why would you bother putting them in calf!!

Xbred? Kiwi cross or jex?

Do you know where I could get a few of those Conor?
Or...should we search for the cow that has two calves a year? Answers on a ...



Edit. I don't doubt you.

Mooooo

Dwag wrote: »

Xbred? Kiwi cross or jex?

Do you know where I could get a few of those Conor?
Or...should we search for the cow that has two calves a year? Answers on a ...



Edit. I don't doubt you.

He's milking in a dessert in the Middle East if I'm not mistaken