Dairy chit chat II

yewtree

mahoney_j wrote: »

Johnny public didn't know that tho sndcwill read these articles and think were on the pigs back and that we should all be producing milk at those figures ,coops /supermarkets etc will use those figures too
Pm is totally outdated and its info used and abused by the journos who print articles in the ifj and dairy farmers magazine etc .i even fail to understand why it's used in comparing different farms as no 2 farms are the same .my yearly monitoring /comparadion are between 2. Different years accounts .there honest figures that I use for my own benefit .i could blow ****e out my ears using pm figures but they don't contain accurate figures

I agree o the public perception.

I think PM has value for benchmarking provided people are clearly aware of limitations. I think there are a lot of similarities between farms aswell i have learn awful lot from guys in DG and a big part of that was comparing PM, we all have to be wise enough to know the stuff that wont work on our farms.
I am sure there is awful lot of nonsense in some PMs but i trust the lads in my group to be honest and i have no interest in deluding myself, so i know my own figures are accurate.

Signpost

PM is pointless without having open bank accounts to compare them to. I know that one lad in my discussion group last year spent 70 euro for phone & broadband & 100 euro on machinery repairs, in comparison I'm spending 65 per month on phone broadband (over 11 times his spending), and last year around 1300 on repair costs (13 times) as I'd a few kicks along the way & with the exception of the repair costs would be about normal. Put him well up the top of the pile % wise but it doesn't take a genius to read between the lines... This is where there should be a sanity check on a percentage of the PM's to see from the accounts if they actually add up or not. Grand you might have spent money from farm account to avoid tax etc but if its spent, its spent and becomes an expense.
There could be an argument that unless lads actually go through the figures they genuinely wont know what they are spending but I do question a lot of the PM reports you see and these are what Teagasc use to feed the Journal etc about production costs. Eventually these 'super efficient' farmers are going to become what production costs will be based around and no one will be able to produce at a breakeven.

OverRide

A profit monitor should be divided into categories
1. Direct cost of production excluding items that vary hugely farm to farm e.g. Machinery
2.Available to spend on whichever variable inputs you're excluding from category 1
3.Available for drawings/pay the farmer

It's very simple

jaymla627

Signpost wrote: »

PM is pointless without having open bank accounts to compare them to. I know that one lad in my discussion group last year spent 70 euro for phone & broadband & 100 euro on machinery repairs, in comparison I'm spending 65 per month on phone broadband (over 11 times his spending), and last year around 1300 on repair costs (13 times) as I'd a few kicks along the way & with the exception of the repair costs would be about normal. Put him well up the top of the pile % wise but it doesn't take a genius to read between the lines... This is where there should be a sanity check on a percentage of the PM's to see from the accounts if they actually add up or not. Grand you might have spent money from farm account to avoid tax etc but if its spent, its spent and becomes an expense.
There could be an argument that unless lads actually go through the figures they genuinely wont know what they are spending but I do question a lot of the PM reports you see and these are what Teagasc use to feed the Journal etc about production costs. Eventually these 'super efficient' farmers are going to become what production costs will be based around and no one will be able to produce at a breakeven.

Personally I would of called him out on the two above costs, their isn't a hope they where realistic unless he's robbing the neighbours broadband and was only putting a fiver a month call credit into the phone, was their any machinery on the farm even,the 100 euro repair costs is b.s.....
The journal/teagasc can keep beating the drum irish dairy farmers will happily produce milk for low 20's and be profitable and thrive but a bit of realism and them acknowledging that if milk prices hadn't of turned around and creep up past the 30 cent mark heading into the spring the vast majority of dairy farmers in the country where in the s**t myself included and operating below cop

Timmaay

Simple as is we all need to utterly drop the terms profit monitor and cost of production. Because neither terms are anyway correct. Instead we should be using something like what NZ dairyfarmers use, EBTIDA (earnings before tax/interest/depreciation and amortization), yes its alot more of a mouthful to say, however it is very definitive in what it means, that's its only part the earnings, and not a full profit/cost of production figure that the normal Joe soap, or equally as bad the prospective young farmer who wildly thinks there will be 16c/l pure take home profit for him based on 18/20c/l cop etc.

Keepgrowing

Signpost wrote: »

PM is pointless without having open bank accounts to compare them to. I know that one lad in my discussion group last year spent 70 euro for phone & broadband & 100 euro on machinery repairs, in comparison I'm spending 65 per month on phone broadband (over 11 times his spending), and last year around 1300 on repair costs (13 times) as I'd a few kicks along the way & with the exception of the repair costs would be about normal. Put him well up the top of the pile % wise but it doesn't take a genius to read between the lines... This is where there should be a sanity check on a percentage of the PM's to see from the accounts if they actually add up or not. Grand you might have spent money from farm account to avoid tax etc but if its spent, its spent and becomes an expense.
There could be an argument that unless lads actually go through the figures they genuinely wont know what they are spending but I do question a lot of the PM reports you see and these are what Teagasc use to feed the Journal etc about production costs. Eventually these 'super efficient' farmers are going to become what production costs will be based around and no one will be able to produce at a breakeven.

Was this guy called out on these figures? He should be able to stand them up so the DG can learn from him.

Did facilitator call him out?

No way you'd get away with that shyte in my group. He needs to be made explain or removed or alternatively you need to change group as I suspect your facilitator is incompetent

C0N0R

Came across a cow out here today,

1552 days in milk
Currently supplying 49.4 lts a day
Peaked at 79.2
This lactation to date 68846 litres!

Pretty impressive figures in my eyes!

whelan2

C0N0R wrote: »

Came across a cow out here today,

1552 days in milk
Currently supplying 49.4 lts a day
Peaked at 79.2
This lactation to date 68846 litres!

Pretty impressive figures in my eyes!

What breed?

Timmaay

C0N0R wrote: »

Came across a cow out here today,

1552 days in milk
Currently supplying 49.4 lts a day
Peaked at 79.2
This lactation to date 68846 litres!

Pretty impressive figures in my eyes!

4years hmmm, someone forget to register a calf? Or 2 maybe ha?

C0N0R

whelan2 wrote: »

C0N0R wrote: »

Came across a cow out here today,

1552 days in milk
Currently supplying 49.4 lts a day
Peaked at 79.2
This lactation to date 68846 litres!

Pretty impressive figures in my eyes!

What breed?

Holstein/friesan I guess but the cows wouldn't be your typical leggy Holstein, big cows but with big capacity.

Ha and no Timmaay no mistakes with not registering calves, took mastitis once, in 2014 I think!

Timmaay

C0N0R wrote: »

Holstein/friesan I guess but the cows wouldn't be your typical leggy Holstein, big cows but with big capacity.

Ha and no Timmaay no mistakes with not registering calves, took mastitis once, in 2014 I think!

Ha, it definitely happened here afew times with my dad back in the day!

Injuryprone

With output like that, I don't see why she'd need to be put in calf.

C0N0R

Injuryprone wrote: »

With output like that, I don't see why she'd need to be put in calf.

She was in calf but aborted around 300 days in milk so she won't see an ai gun again

GrasstoMilk

Any ideas what cull cows and empty heifers are making?
Well enough fleshed

whelan2

GrasstoMilk wrote: »

Any ideas what cull cows and empty heifers are making?
Well enough fleshed

Dry ?

RightTurnClyde

GrasstoMilk wrote: »

Any ideas what cull cows and empty heifers are making?
Well enough fleshed

Had a dealer in yesterday offering €1/kg for well covered ~700kg cows.
I'm going to hold off for another while.
I'm hearing of .80-1€/kg in marts

Mooooo

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

Had a dealer in yesterday offering €1/kg for well covered ~700kg cows.
I'm going to hold off for another while.
I'm hearing of .80-1€/kg in marts

They probably make more than 700 in the factory if they had a cover? Sent 4 culls two with bad feet 2 old girls to factory straight from parlour, not very fleshy will post what they come back with. Sent the vasectomied bull as well as the AA didn't like him so nowhere for him to go

mahoney_j

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

Had a dealer in yesterday offering €1/kg for well covered ~700kg cows.
I'm going to hold off for another while.
I'm hearing of .80-1€/kg in marts

1.40 for that 700 kg cow if not tool old ,good feet and dry .u need weight to break 1 e a kg 650 kg + .went for a gwak last week anything from 60 cent a kg to 1.50 .anything straight out ofvoarlour that needs feeding and any x bred types are friendless .seen a black 2012 born hex 480 kg 350 euro .mine still milking and will be till Xmas week .will dry then and sell before end Jan .

pedigree 6

If selling in Mart. They want cows dried off a month with well soaked up bags and then the heavier the better.
Anything from 80cent to 1.50 Euro a kilo with the 80 cent for cows from parlour.
Anyone selling in the factory then meal means the difference in killout grade and not. All depends on cow too of course.

kowtow

Did anyone ever have or use one of those walk behind Honda powered yard scraper thingies (you see them on done deal & at the ploughing, they look like a rotavator..)

Have my existing dairymaster hydraulic scraper working in the new feed passage but not massively pleased with the results.. we put quite a deep square pattern in the concrete so that doesn't seem to be helping although I'm sure it will improve with time as the surface wears a bit and the grooves fill up.

Still have to get a scraper for the cubicles, and the passage is wide (10 or 11 feet I think) so rather than another hydraulic one I was thinking either of a scraper tractor or one of those little powered things. I do have an old ride-on mower I could convert as well, but we have a lot of steps in the sheds and the yard and was also thinking one of those walk behind ones might be just as handy.

I know people have very mixed views on the wheeled ones, perhaps they are just as bad?

freedominacup

mahoney_j wrote: »

1.40 for that 700 kg cow if not tool old ,good feet and dry .u need weight to break 1 e a kg 650 kg + .went for a gwak last week anything from 60 cent a kg to 1.50 .anything straight out ofvoarlour that needs feeding and any x bred types are friendless .seen a black 2012 born hex 480 kg 350 euro .mine still milking and will be till Xmas week .will dry then and sell before end Jan .

We're doing the same. I felt like I got a bit of a hosing on the last few sent from the parlour. The next batch will get a month to straighten out and start to put on a bit of condition.

Buford T. Justice XIX

kowtow wrote: »

Did anyone ever have or use one of those walk behind Honda powered yard scraper thingies (you see them on done deal & at the ploughing, they look like a rotavator..)

Have my existing dairymaster hydraulic scraper working in the new feed passage but not massively pleased with the results.. we put quite a deep square pattern in the concrete so that doesn't seem to be helping although I'm sure it will improve with time as the surface wears a bit and the grooves fill up.

Still have to get a scraper for the cubicles, and the passage is wide (10 or 11 feet I think) so rather than another hydraulic one I was thinking either of a scraper tractor or one of those little powered things. I do have an old ride-on mower I could convert as well, but we have a lot of steps in the sheds and the yard and was also thinking one of those walk behind ones might be just as handy.

I know people have very mixed views on the wheeled ones, perhaps they are just as bad?

I priced one of those a while back for a passage too narrow for a tractor. Something around 1300 euro iirc. I use the wheeled scraper instead now:rolleyes:.

I would be inclined to put a scraper into that passage as well. During the quiet times it's grand spending 15 minutes scraping a passage but when things get busy will it be a job that's left till the following day?

kowtow

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

I priced one of those a while back for a passage too narrow for a tractor. Something around 1300 euro iirc. I use the wheeled scraper instead now:rolleyes:.

I would be inclined to put a scraper into that passage as well. During the quiet times it's grand spending 15 minutes scraping a passage but when things get busy will it be a job that's left till the following day?

I know what you mean.

Trouble is with the deep square pattern it's barely clean after the scraper has been down, don't mind so much with my existing scraper as I already had it but would be irritating to buy a new one and then have a half clean passage.

Haven't tried even a hand scraper, wheeled or not, yet but I've a feeling the cobble effect might make that a bit depressing.

Perhaps I should rubber line the whole thing next year, clean smooth passages and grip!!

GrasstoMilk

There 3 heifers in it there were incalf and lost them
2 very big ones - I'd say 580 kilos
6 dry well over a month and the. 5 just gone dry.
All going tomorrow
All fairly well fleshed

whelan2

Did you find out why they lost the calves? 3 is alot

Mooooo

kowtow wrote: »

I know what you mean.

Trouble is with the deep square pattern it's barely clean after the scraper has been down, don't mind so much with my existing scraper as I already had it but would be irritating to buy a new one and then have a half clean passage.

Haven't tried even a hand scraper, wheeled or not, yet but I've a feeling the cobble effect might make that a bit depressing.

Perhaps I should rubber line the whole thing next year, clean smooth passages and grip!!

Try bolting and old bit of mat rubber to the front of the auto scraper blade and see if it makes any difference

pedigree 6

kowtow wrote: »

Did anyone ever have or use one of those walk behind Honda powered yard scraper thingies (you see them on done deal & at the ploughing, they look like a rotavator..)

Have my existing dairymaster hydraulic scraper working in the new feed passage but not massively pleased with the results.. we put quite a deep square pattern in the concrete so that doesn't seem to be helping although I'm sure it will improve with time as the surface wears a bit and the grooves fill up.

Still have to get a scraper for the cubicles, and the passage is wide (10 or 11 feet I think) so rather than another hydraulic one I was thinking either of a scraper tractor or one of those little powered things. I do have an old ride-on mower I could convert as well, but we have a lot of steps in the sheds and the yard and was also thinking one of those walk behind ones might be just as handy.

I know people have very mixed views on the wheeled ones, perhaps they are just as bad?

This would get in the grooves. But might be a bit big for you.
But you might get an idea from it.

GrasstoMilk

whelan2 wrote: »

Did you find out why they lost the calves? 3 is alot

Nope. All only got one serve in in first round in may
We're scanned incalf in September, came home in November and started bulling. Scanned them again this morning and not incalf

Real bummer as one was wanted by NCBC to geno test the calf

kowtow

pedigree 6 wrote: »

This would get in the grooves. But might be a bit big for you.
But you might get an idea from it.

hmm... I like that solution.

Is that an everyday job? - do you go straight at the slurry with it or some kind of scraper in advance? Does the brush wear out? Need washing every day?

I left 3.50m clearance into the sheds so should be able to get the 50b in with that on the front...

pedigree 6

kowtow wrote: »

hmm... I like that solution.

Is that an everyday job? - do you go straight at the slurry with it or some kind of scraper in advance? Does the brush wear out? Need washing every day?

I left 3.50m clearance into the sheds so should be able to get the 50b in with that on the front...

Well I just use it for the yards and either too dry or too wet is perfect for it.
I have the scraper for the tractor as well. I'd mostly use the scraper as the brush can be a bit hard on the yard and won't be long showing up cracks in the concrete. By that I mean it'll take the dirt out of the cracks, where the scraper hides them.

I sometimes have the brush on the loader with the scraper on the back of the tractor. But it would handle wet slurry easily. The more rows of bristles the better obviously and you can get replacement bristles when those ones wear out. They just slide out. On my one it is 3 sets of brushes wide. It was made by Prodig and I wanted it wider than the tractor.
You get some made for pallet forks but i'm not sure how they work when you want to reverse the tractor using it. Would they fall off??

The bristles are very hard wearing and I expect them to last me a long time. (But it's only something I might use once a week)

More info here........
http://prodigattachments.com/index.php/item/29-agri-prosweep/9-1700-prosweep.html