Is it OK to leave a big dog outdoors in this weather?

AndrewJRenko

I don't know much about keeping dogs, so I'm interested in views from others. Our neighbour got what looks like an Andrex puppy dog over the summer. The puppy got lots of fuss and attention at the time, but doesn't seem to be getting too much attention these days. He's quite a big dog now, and has an outside kennel. It seems to be a good size for him, and has some kind of plastic flap door. He whines quite a bit whenever I go out into the garden, but I'm not sure if this is due to the cold or maybe the lack of attention. Is it OK to leave a dog like this in an outdoor kennel in this weather? I don't think I could do it myself, but I don't want to rush to judgement too quick.

The Raptor

No it's not. It's cold outside.

InTheTrees

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

He whines quite a bit whenever I go out into the garden, but I'm not sure if this is due to the cold or maybe the lack of attention. Is it OK to leave a dog like this in an outdoor kennel in this weather? I don't think I could do it myself, but I don't want to rush to judgement too quick.

No, it's certainly not okay.

forgodssake

The way I see it I always think would I be ok outside in this weather ???NO I wouldn't..... Neither is a poor dog no matter the size .

Stealthfins

I'm not a dog owner but it's not OK

Jen Pigs Fly

That poor Labrador ... breaks my heart to think of it!

My own rescue labrador was sentenced to a miserable life outside ... he now hates being outside especially when it rains luckily my lab managed to get off the chain so to speak .... he now sleeps with his family upstairs in any bed of his choosing!

It's not ok to leave any dog outside in that cold ... forgotten about, no family, no love, no comfort, no purpose

OU812

Absolutely not ok to be outdoors. I wouldn't be letting him upstairs to any bed he chooses, but indoors is a must.

My own dog has a very comfy bed in a quiet corner beside a radiator and knows he's not allowed upstairs (can't imagine having a dog in a bed, ick ick ick), but he had water and heat & comfort & free reign downstairs - sometimes we find he's pulled his bed away from the radiator if he's too warm & he's asleep in the middle of the floor.

Dogs are outdoor anaimals, they aren't humans and certainly aren't babies. Once he has shelter he will be fine, having dogs living in the house is a new thing that's emerged (in cities) over in the last 20 years or so.

Growing up in the country side where people deal with all sorts of animals everyday having a dog or cat inside the back door of the house was and for most still is unheard off.

Even kittens or puppies wouldn't be let in the house at home never mind grown dogs and they always lived happy and long lives.

Edit: just to add I wouldn't move a dog that's been used to inside outside but a dog should never be gotten used to inside in the first place.

Water John

Dogs are fine in a covered kennel or shed. Once they are dry and sheltered.
Don't treat animals the same as humans, there different, have fur etc.

This dog sounds lonely.

JayWalsh

My lad, an 11 year old JRT, and they love the fire, just demanded to be left outside to his kennel.
Sometimes they just get too hot indoors.
He sleeps outside and has done for 11 years, never done him any harm, never at the vets for anything other than check ups.

R.D. aka MR.D

If the dog is a labrador, then they are quite a hardy breed. They are used in many places, including colder climates for hunting which might involve swimming in very cold water.

If the dog is an outdoor dog and has an adequate kennel, then he should be fine unless the temperatures drop well below freezing.

I'm a keep dogs indoors kind of person but grew up on a farm so know that dogs will actually be totally fine outside if they have the right shelter and bedding.

heldel00

Away for the night.
Relying on my brother in law, who is most certainly not a doggie person, to put our little dog in to the shed tonight. Rang him earlier and it sounded like he was in a pub watching rugby. Worried!!!

DBB

Kaiden Orange Cowboy wrote: »

Dogs are outdoor anaimals, they aren't humans and certainly aren't babies. Once he has shelter he will be fine, having dogs living in the house is a new thing that's emerged (in cities) over in the last 20 years or so.

No, it's not. There are ancient manuscripts dating back thousands of years written by middle-eastern hound owners (hunting hounds, greyhounds) describing the importance of keeping your dog close by you, including in your dwelling, to maximise the dog's welfare, bond with his master, and willingness to work for his master.
People are very quick to ignore the fact that it's not just about the dog feeling the cold... Being kept alone outside is disastrous for the dog's mental welfare and emotional wellbeing. Dogs kept outside alone suffer from more behavioural problems and training issues than indoor dogs. It's that simple.
This business of keeping dogs outside, particularly pet dogs, whilst not unique to Ireland, is a topic of great shock to people from the many other countries where it is considered abnormal to keep a dog outside the home.
So, maybe keeping dogs alone outside is new to Ireland (actually, I'm not sure it is... I don't remember any dogs within my frame of reference as a child being kept outside... And that's a tad longer than 20 years... And I knew a lot if dogs ), but Ireland is actually rather unusual in this"dogs belong outside" attitude.

I don't understand why anyone would get a PET dog, and leave them outside!
If they are a pet, part of the family, why leave them outside.
A lot of country people have outside dogs, I have no problem with that, they are outside dogs. My grandparents had outside dogs, in the countryside, they had a kind of job, barking etc if anyone came near.
But a pet is different, my granny got a little pet dog when she got older, a little jack Russell, that slept inside beside her bed, by the fire in the day. But she still had outside dogs, that barked whenever someone was near. Their outside dogs still had barns and sheds to sleep in though!
And guaranteed if a big freeze hit, all those outside dogs would be allowed into the kitchen at night.
What's the point in having a pet and leaving it outside?

jimf

if you want a dog that's totally ignored and left outside day and night without interaction why not just go and buy a stuffed one

they are a lot easier to wash no food or vet bills and no doggy footprints around the house or furniture

the problem is the cute little puppy stage is very short lived in the doggy lifetime

jimf

jimf wrote: »

if you want a dog that's totally ignored and left outside day and night without interaction why not just go and buy a stuffed one

they are a lot easier to wash no food or vet bills and no doggy footprints around the house or furniture

the problem is the cute little puppy stage is very short lived in the doggy lifetime

Not allowing a dog in the house is a perfectly legitimate way to keep a dog and does not mean it's ignored, doesn't have interaction and walks or does not live a long and happy life. As a person from a rural area I would know more people with dogs than most and the vast majority are exclusively outdoor (with shelter of course be it a kennel or shed). I think city folk baby animals too much as they arent used to dealing with them.

AndrewJRenko

Thanks for all the varying views. Would you have any idea if the DSPCA would consider keeping such a dog outside as 'neglect' that would be worthy of intervention? I'm not too sure that I want to go down that road at all, but I'm just wondering if it is an option at the end of the day.

VonVix

Dogs are social animals, they need company and interaction, the idea of a dog spending day and night outside just seems unnecessary. Sure, the dog may be walked and fed, but that's what, one hour out of 24?

I have three dogs, one of them being a German Shepherd, he was raised as an inside dog from the moment we brought him home, if I leave him outside by himself he does his business, then scratches the door to come back inside. If I ignored him, he would start barking and whining to be back inside, not because he doesn't want to be outside, but because he wants to be where I am. The idea of a dog like him being left outside 24/7 breaks my heart knowing my boy's nature.

SteM

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Thanks for all the varying views. Would you have any idea if the DSPCA would consider keeping such a dog outside as 'neglect' that would be worthy of intervention? I'm not too sure that I want to go down that road at all, but I'm just wondering if it is an option at the end of the day.

No, as long as it has adequate shelter, food and water then the dspca won't get involved.

DBB

If the dog has a kennel, it's unlikely they'll intervene.
Under the new animal welfare legislation, one could argue that a dog kept alone in a garden, particularly if displaying stressed behaviours, is in contravention of the law, as it goes against the Five Freedoms that the new law is *meant* to encapsulate.
However, whilst I've heard of one or two cases in which the ISPCA successfully argued that chaining a dog in a yard contradicted his Five Freedoms, there seems to be a general hesitancy to bring test cases to court. Pity... Our neighbours in the UK are far better at this kind of thing!

http://www.dspca.ie/FiveFreedoms

strandroad

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Thanks for all the varying views. Would you have any idea if the DSPCA would consider keeping such a dog outside as 'neglect' that would be worthy of intervention? I'm not too sure that I want to go down that road at all, but I'm just wondering if it is an option at the end of the day.

They would consider the dog to have adequate provisions (shelter and presumably food and water) so no.
You might want to have a chat with your neighbours instead, assuming that they are otherwise decent but clueless, to tell them that their dog is whining and unhappy alone in the cold (dogs are sturdy but for a pet puppy it's a huge change). They may not know, or they may know and push it out of their minds but will be willing to take action once a neighbour tells them the same. Or there's no shame in rehoming the dog responsibly if they are so inclined.

DBB

Taking up on mhge's point, depending upon the individual investigating SPCA officer, although they may not feel they have a case against an owner whose dog is living in such circumstances, they may nevertheless call to the house and have a wee chat with the owners. In many cases, this semi-official intervention is all it takes for the owner to do *something* to improve the dog's lot, even if that means surrendering it to the SPCA for rehoming.

Mr Arrior

I've a collie and he won't stay indoors overnight. Hes scraping at hthe door to get outside. We have a pen made up and a kennel with a basket and massive soft bed to lie on. He's more than happy.

DBB

I think it needs to be recognised now, before this thread descends into the mess that these threads tend to descend into, that some dogs prefer to be outside, and also that there are many working dogs not living in the house who live very happy, healthy, fulfilled lives... By working dogs, I mean those that spend a lot of their day doing stuff with and/or nearby their owner, doing what they were bred for.
But that's not what this thread is about.
This thread, as I understand it, is about a pet dog being kept alone in a back garden, with practically nothing to do all day... Not much interaction with humans or other dogs, and the bare minimum supplied to keep him existing.
That is a very, very different scenario for a dog than the one I described above.

colly10

I think it's more to do with interactaion than the cold. Our dog sleeps in the shed at night but is in the house whenever we're home. It's not bothered by the cold, it just wants to be wherever you are.
Alowing the dog to be around you for only half an hour a day is cruel in my mind, with that said, if i'm not working from home I know it'll be ok when im away.
It just needs a reasonable amount of company

Stoner

Mr Arrior wrote:

I've a collie and he won't stay indoors overnight. Hes scraping at hthe door to get outside. We have a pen made up and a kennel with a basket and massive soft bed to lie on. He's more than happy.

I've two collies. They are in during the day and out into their kennels at night. They are very hairy and their coats are in great condition. When it's very cold I leave them in. But they prefer being outside, often they head to the coldest part of the house for a sleep, up against the external doors etc.

I don't even have bedding for them they drag it out . Their houses are in different corners and very well raised up off the ground. They are wooden with an insulated roof. The entrances face walls and I have a deck on each one for the summer so they can be cool and dry and off the ground. The flooring is wooden and there is a foam mat 20mm on the floors

With the right dry shelter and out of a draft a two coated collie I think my dogs are healthier out side at night.

I mind a westie sometimes he gets on fine with my dogs has his own house, but at night I leave him indoors as he is not built for it. He'll often share with one if the collies but they seldom share a kennel.

AndrewJRenko

colly10 wrote: »

I think it's more to do with interactaion than the cold. Our dog sleeps in the shed at night but is in the house whenever we're home. It's not bothered by the cold, it just wants to be wherever you are.

You could well be right on the cause of the dog's complaining. I guess we're just not close enough to really understand what's going on.

InTheTrees

Kaiden Orange Cowboy wrote: »

As a person from a rural area I would know more people with dogs than most and the vast majority are exclusively outdoor (with shelter of course be it a kennel or shed).

As a person from a rural area I remember when you'd find animals dying by the side of the road from neglect. I remember when neutering a dog would have been a joke, you just put the littler in a bag and throw them in a lake.

Treatment of animals in rural areas isnt necessarily a standard to aspire to.

gflood

I have a 1.5 years old cocker spaniel. He is in and out most of the day, in during the evenings but absolutely he goes out at night no matter how cold. I have an thermal insulated kennel for him and a heat retaining cushion. He is warm as toast in the mornings and sometimes I have to get him out of the kennel again.

John_Rambo

You'll get a better behaved, better socialised, happier and friendlier dog if it's kept with the family.

They're pack animals it's a no brainer, anyone telling you dogs do well excluded from family life in a back garden doesn't know what they're talking about and have most likely never owned a dog.

Water John

AFAIK all the experts on here are saying the dog is not a pack animal.