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Journalism and cycling

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    #7952
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 49,137 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    happens all the time - one example though was just off griffith avenue where there was widespread opposition to closing off some rat runs. after a trial period, the locals requested that the bollards be kept.


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    #7953
    silverharp
    Registered Users Posts: 17,873 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    Qrt wrote: »
    I’d prefer general restrictions. Congestion charges just mean “free for the rich” in the long run, look at London.

    that is kind of old tech , give it 10 years or so and it would be feasible to have a live meter built into cars. Dublin could be broken out into zones and times of day. Maybe the school run costs a euro. Its about pricing a scarce resource ie road space.
    You have to ration road space to improve the odds for busses or trams and pricing is fair especially if there is ring fencing involved for related capital projects

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



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    #7954
    Tenzor07
    Registered Users Posts: 8,651 ✭✭✭Tenzor07


    When the council tried to make changes in Drumcondra also:

    https://www.dublininquirer.com/2017/09/13/in-drumcondra-locals-are-divided-over-road-closures
    Some motorists will have to drive further, and for longer, to reach their destination – for example, someone who lived on Millmount Avenue and wanted to drive to Walsh Road, instead of making a short trip from one to the other, would have to drive a large horseshoe shape.

    Millmount to Walsh road is less than 1km


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    #7955
    Tenzor07
    Registered Users Posts: 8,651 ✭✭✭Tenzor07


    silverharp wrote: »
    that is kind of old tech , give it 10 years or so and it would be feasible to have a live meter built into cars. Dublin could be broken out into zones and times of day. Maybe the school run costs a euro. Its about pricing a scarce resource ie road space.

    I think we've had tolling, or barrier free tolling on the M50 for 10 years and yet some motorists who use it everyday don't pay a cent in tolls, and others could spend the best part of €60 a month to use the M50, with talk of pay by the distance traveled been mentioned for years, it hasn't even become close to actually happening...


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    #7956
    xckjoo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,379 ✭✭✭xckjoo


    silverharp wrote: »
    that is kind of old tech , give it 10 years or so and it would be feasible to have a live meter built into cars. Dublin could be broken out into zones and times of day. Maybe the school run costs a euro. Its about pricing a scarce resource ie road space.
    You have to ration road space to improve the odds for busses or trams and pricing is fair especially if there is ring fencing involved for related capital projects
    It would still end up being a rich/poor divide though. Rich people wouldn't care about the cost, poor people would be priced out of it and those in the middle would just see more of their wages go towards maintaining the status quo. I'd rather see time being the rationing criteria. "Sure you can drive but it's going to take you twice as long. Why not use this nice convenient, reliable and quick bus service instead?"


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    #7957
    Lumen
    Registered Users Posts: 31,059 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    xckjoo wrote: »
    It would still end up being a rich/poor divide though. Rich people wouldn't care about the cost, poor people would be priced out of it and those in the middle would just see more of their wages go towards maintaining the status quo. I'd rather see time being the rationing criteria. "Sure you can drive but it's going to take you twice as long. Why not use this nice convenient, reliable and quick bus service instead?"

    Traffic jams are extremely fair


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    #7958
    Tenzor07
    Registered Users Posts: 8,651 ✭✭✭Tenzor07


    xckjoo wrote: »
    It would still end up being a rich/poor divide though. Rich people wouldn't care about the cost, poor people would be priced out of it

    Not sure how many "Poor" people drive a motor car, when you consider even a cheap reliable car should cost a minimum of €5,000 add on fuel, tax, insurance, maintenance would amount to a lot of money to keep the vehicle legally on the road per year...


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    #7959
    Duckjob
    Registered Users Posts: 2,859 ✭✭✭Duckjob


    silverharp wrote: »
    that is kind of old tech , give it 10 years or so and it would be feasible to have a live meter built into cars. Dublin could be broken out into zones and times of day. Maybe the school run costs a euro. Its about pricing a scarce resource ie road space.
    You have to ration road space to improve the odds for busses or trams and pricing is fair especially if there is ring fencing involved for related capital projects

    There's already an attitude issue among a subset of motorists who pay "road tax" etc and feel more entitled to the road than other user groups and feel bitterness and aggression towards them as a result. Making them pay more in monetary terms will only serve to exacerbate that problem IMO.


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    #7960
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,653 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    mr spuckler wrote: »
    Agreed, make it so challenging or time consuming to drive that it's clearly the worst choice. As you say congestion charging favours the wealthy.

    A congestion charge based on car value or engine size might help that. Free parking outside the M50 and then you can go by PT for 4 euro anywhere in the city for the day or you can pay a congestion charge based on the size/value/emissions of the vehicle you have. Starting at 5euro per day upto 20euro a day for the most environmentally damaging. Work vehicles can claim tax back on the price. ANPR at every route into the city, tracked against a database which marks out those who have paid or not, much like the toll bridge on the M50. Any cloned plates or noon payers, people being creatures of habit, can be brought to the attention of Gardai or revenue for seizure of the vehicle. Parking permits in the city centre could incorporate this cost for residents but price it enough that it discourages car ownership in the city centre


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    #7961
    droidus
    Registered Users Posts: 1,545 ✭✭✭droidus


    Its all going to be redundant soon enough. Most cars are going to be driven(!) out of our cities due to a variety of factors in the very near future. The arctic is melting 70 years early, the impacts are going to be rapid and devastating and the response is going to be radical and discontinuous with anything we have known in the past.


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    #7962
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 49,137 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    Tenzor07 wrote: »
    Not sure how many "Poor" people drive a motor car, when you consider even a cheap reliable car should cost a minimum of €5,000 add on fuel, tax, insurance, maintenance would amount to a lot of money to keep the vehicle legally on the road per year...
    €5k would be plenty to spend on a car. you'd get a ten year old micra for well under that; my mother recently got scrappage on a 05 micra, and the only thing that i can ever remember going wrong was the cabin heater stopped working.


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    #7963
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,572 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    More from the Irish Times and their 'non agenda'.

    https://twitter.com/dublincycling/status/1156120353309155328


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    #7964
    Grassey
    Registered Users Posts: 2,393 ✭✭✭Grassey


    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/bike-blog/2019/aug/05/carpe-noctem-joy-cycling-through-night-ride-coast


    The FNRttC, as it’s known to veterans, has been spreading the joy of night riding for almost 15 years,...

    The distance ranges from 55 to 75 miles, and popular routes can attract more than 100 participants....

    Rides begin at midnight with a chat about safety and etiquette, jokes optional. 




    That sounds class. Have often considered a long night cycle... Then said nah... Next week...


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    #7965
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,764 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    I love cycling at night. I used to do field work on Pollardstown Fen, and one aspect was trying to capture the moment at dawn when the reeds opened their stomata and exhaled, so I used to cycle out across the Curragh from my grandmother's house in Kildare with an infra-red gas analyser in the middle of the night to set up. It was really quite a magical place in the dead of night, especially when there was a full moon. And when the sun came up and the mist rose off the fen, spectacular.


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    #7966
    Pinch Flat
    Registered Users Posts: 7,761 ✭✭✭Pinch Flat


    Items on newstalk earlier regarding kids and their lack of exercise - walking / cycling to school cited as the elephant in the room to sort this out. numbers cycling to school have plummeted by 98% in the past 20 odd years, which is really shocking.

    Had your man Professor Moyhihan (?) from Operation transformation on, saying it's a no-brainer to get kids active and that a 1.5km walk / cycle is no big deal for a kid - even with their heavy school bags. Didn't take long for the texts to come in "cyclists need a licence before they're allowed on the road", "roads are too dangerous" etc. You've got to really laugh with our love affair for the car. It's slowly killing people in all sorts of way, yet people ill happily get in one and transfer their lazy behavior to their kids.


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    #7967
    The Enbalmer
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,001 ✭✭✭The Enbalmer


    Pinch Flat wrote: »
    It's slowly killing people in all sorts of way, .




    What are your credentials to be posting this sort of thing?


    Are you a medical professional or have you published peer-reviewed findings?


    What are the "all sorts of ways" you speak of? People can die in collisions with cars,yes..what are the others?


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    #7968
    Mickiemcfist
    Registered Users Posts: 1,585 ✭✭✭Mickiemcfist


    The Enbalmer wrote: »
    What are your credentials to be posting this sort of thing?


    Are you a medical professional or have you published peer-reviewed findings?


    What are the "all sorts of ways" you speak of? People can die in collisions with cars,yes..what are the others?

    Hi this is a message from 2019: Heart disease & Obesity to name the first 2 that come to mind


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    #7969
    The Enbalmer
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,001 ✭✭✭The Enbalmer


    Mickiemcfist wrote: »
    Hi this is a message from 2019: Heart disease & Obesity to name the first 2 that come to mind


    Heart disease and obesity relate to cars how?


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    #7970
    Mickiemcfist
    Registered Users Posts: 1,585 ✭✭✭Mickiemcfist


    The Enbalmer wrote: »
    Heart disease and obesity relate to cars how?

    Sitting in a car for 5+ hours a week vs walking or cycling for the same amount of time...


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    #7971
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,366 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    The Enbalmer wrote: »
    Heart disease and obesity relate to cars how?
    Where have you been?
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/almost-a-third-of-irish-children-are-now-overweight-study-1.3252123


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    #7972
    The Enbalmer
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,001 ✭✭✭The Enbalmer


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    Where have you been?
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/almost-a-third-of-irish-children-are-now-overweight-study-1.3252123




    I'll ask again..how does that relate to cars?

    Are children driving cars now? That article states the main causative factor in childhood obesity is related to diet..in particular sugar consumption.


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    #7973
    is_that_so
    Registered Users Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    Where have you been?
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/almost-a-third-of-irish-children-are-now-overweight-study-1.3252123
    He's been on the internet barracking car drivers!


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    #7974
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 49,137 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    The Enbalmer wrote: »
    What are your credentials to be posting this sort of thing?
    he's got a big brain. i mean, *really* big.


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    #7975
    average_runner
    Registered Users Posts: 12,851 ✭✭✭✭average_runner


    Pinch Flat wrote: »
    Items on newstalk earlier regarding kids and their lack of exercise - walking / cycling to school cited as the elephant in the room to sort this out. numbers cycling to school have plummeted by 98% in the past 20 odd years, which is really shocking.

    Had your man Professor Moyhihan (?) from Operation transformation on, saying it's a no-brainer to get kids active and that a 1.5km walk / cycle is no big deal for a kid - even with their heavy school bags. Didn't take long for the texts to come in "cyclists need a licence before they're allowed on the road", "roads are too dangerous" etc. You've got to really laugh with our love affair for the car. It's slowly killing people in all sorts of way, yet people ill happily get in one and transfer their lazy behavior to their kids.


    This brings back the memories, cycling to school with two bags on my back.
    Did me no harm.


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    #7976
    The Enbalmer
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,001 ✭✭✭The Enbalmer


    Mickiemcfist wrote: »
    Sitting in a car for 5+ hours a week vs walking or cycling for the same amount of time...




    Sitting in a car does not by itself cause obesity and heart disease..


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    #7977
    average_runner
    Registered Users Posts: 12,851 ✭✭✭✭average_runner


    Mickiemcfist wrote: »
    Sitting in a car for 5+ hours a week vs walking or cycling for the same amount of time...

    Sitting in a car 5+ hours a week is no harm if you do exercise after it and eat well.

    Cycling for 5 hours a week and then eating crap and sitting on the couch for hours is alot worst.


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    #7978
    The Enbalmer
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,001 ✭✭✭The Enbalmer


    magicbastarder wrote: »
    he's got a big brain. i mean, *really* big.


    Well if he's able to make such sweeping statements he must be at the forefront of research into morbidity,obesity and heart disease..making him able to afford a *very* big car indeed...although somehow i doubt that.


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    #7979
    Mickiemcfist
    Registered Users Posts: 1,585 ✭✭✭Mickiemcfist


    The Enbalmer wrote: »
    Sitting in a car does not by itself cause obesity and heart disease..

    No but it exposes you to more air pollution than you would get if you were cycling.

    If you're picking two methods of transport for the week, a car or a bike, one will make you fitter & healthier, one will not. So there is an opportunity cost of driving instead of cycling, and that cost is your health.

    Fine if you already get enough exercise through other means, however most children in urban Ireland do not.


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    #7980
    silverharp
    Registered Users Posts: 17,873 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    Mickiemcfist wrote: »
    No but it exposes you to more air pollution than you would get if you were cycling.

    If you're picking two methods of transport for the week, a car or a bike, one will make you fitter & healthier, one will not. So there is an opportunity cost of driving instead of cycling, and that cost is your health.

    Fine if you already get enough exercise through other means, however most children in urban Ireland do not.

    Are we talking about kids that joyride? :confused: :pac:

    I remember seeing a study that kids that were forced to do more formal exercise in school did less when they went home. Be it kids or adults diet is over 90% responsible for obesity just as the other expression gores you cant out train a bad diet.
    If people have been obese, when they tackle that then they might be motivated to take up cycling or other activities to aid maintenance

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



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    #7981
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,653 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    The Enbalmer wrote: »
    I'll ask again..how does that relate to cars?

    Are children driving cars now? That article states the main causative factor in childhood obesity is related to diet..in particular sugar consumption.
    They are in the cars, doing no exercise when there is ample opportunity in most cases. It is not indicating it will cure obesity but it will aid in its reduction and prevention of other issues related to a sedate lifestyle. Wonderful paper in BMJ about all risk morbidity in cyclist vs pedestrians vs cars a few months ago, results, were shocking not in how shocking they were but in how clear cut it was that Cycling vs Driving (or being a passenger) was a no brainer.
    The Enbalmer wrote: »
    Sitting in a car does not by itself cause obesity and heart disease..
    Sedentary lifestyles does though, and sitting in a car adds to a sedate lifestyle if there are alternatives available.
    average_runner wrote: »
    Sitting in a car 5+ hours a week is no harm if you do exercise after it and eat well.

    Cycling for 5 hours a week and then eating crap and sitting on the couch for hours is alot worst.
    Sitting in car and eating crap is the worse of the three options. The question must be, if the opportunity is there (and I accept at this time, it is not for everyone), which is better "Sitting in a car 5+ hours a week is no harm if you do exercise after it and eat well." or "Cycling 5+ hours a week instead of sitting in a car for 5+ hours, as well as doing exercise after it and eat well".
    The Enbalmer wrote: »
    Well if he's able to make such sweeping statements he must be at the forefront of research into morbidity,obesity and heart disease..making him able to afford a *very* big car indeed...although somehow i doubt that.
    I am a scientist, I have peer reviewed publications although most of my work is from Technical / Management perspective, so not named on many papers I have worked on. Is this important, not at all, far more reasoned and informed views appear on this site all the time from people who do not work in the field, happy to admit that. Many people I know personally are at the forefront of such research, working here and abroad but again, not really relevant. I don't ask you because, well, if the concept of sitting on your ass vs exercising needs clarification as to why it is a good thing, I am not sure I can explain as it is so obvious to me but maybe you can explain why it is not? (I don't need details on your qualifications, or your publications, standing in academic research or elsewhere, if you can explain robustly, that is good enough for me.


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