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Help me understand the 24/7 Heart Attack care report

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  • Registered Users Posts: 28,941 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78



    not really that surprised to be honest, we re stuck in a spiraling situation not just nationally but internationally


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,999 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    Almost 350 patients in Waterford are to be sent to Cork for treatment under an initiative aimed at defusing controversy over cardiac services in the south-east.
    The plan, which is dependent on additional funds being made available to treat the cardiac patients at Cork University Hospital, is being advanced by the South/South West Hospital Group despite opposition from medical staff in Waterford.

    So what will it take to have the funding provided to UHW instead of Cork?

    It is getting to the time when Halligan will have to stop supporting the gov and preferably encourage his 'friends' to do likewise.

    Up to now there was a possibility that he could get what was needed while the gov saved face.
    If that is not to happen it is time to pull the plug.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,152 ✭✭✭reni10


    Yeah I think if additional funding is given to a Private Hospital in Cork to treat South East Patients from UHW then that is without a doubt a massive FU to UHW, the people of the South East and Halligan!

    Now is the time to get all the Independent Alliance to pull out of Government and we go again and try to elect better representation for Waterford!


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,510 ✭✭✭Max Powers


    Every poster on here should be at march Saturday.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,081 ✭✭✭fricatus


    Max Powers wrote: »
    Every poster on here should be at march Saturday.

    I'll be there anyway, with all the family!


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,941 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    Max Powers wrote: »
    Every poster on here should be at march Saturday.
    fricatus wrote: »
    I'll be there anyway, with all the family!

    yea enough is enough, would bolton street be madness on saturday?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 215 ✭✭JMT2016


    One recent story was featured by the Mirror - 3 patients, two from Kilkenny and Wexford.
    Pensioner's heart surgery stopped halfway through when emergency patient arrived at Waterford hospital

    Tom O’Dwyer - from Slieverue, Co Kilkenny- had one stent inserted when he was taken out of theatre to allow a critically-ill patient to receive life-saving cardiac treatment.

    Mr O’Dwyer said he understood the doctor was working “under very difficult circumstances” and was glad the other patient was treated – or else they may not have survived.

    He added: “If I were in the doctor’s position I don’t know how I would have felt having to stop in the middle of working on one patient and deal with an emergency.

    “It’s an impossible position to put someone in. Their work shouldn’t be interrupted.

    “While I was waiting in that cubicle for them to finish off my procedure there was a man beside me who had been sent there in an ambulance from Wexford and at about 5.30pm they had to send him home without having anything done.


  • Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 9,033 Mod ✭✭✭✭Aquos76


    fricatus wrote: »
    I'll be there anyway, with all the family!

    As will I and most of my family.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 309 ✭✭Tim the Enchanter


    http://www.rte.ie/news/2017/0113/844706-university-hospital-waterford-cath-lab/

    A small step in the right direction. Should reduce the numbers needing to go to cork, but also highlight the requirement of a 2nd permanent cath lab at UHW.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,999 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    What the heck is a 'mobile cath lab'?
    Sounds like something akin to a mobile brothel!

    Is it the intention that the personnel are 'mobile' or what does it mean?


  • Registered Users Posts: 727 ✭✭✭Dunmoreroader


    This cannot be allowed to become the permanent solution.
    We still need to march. I'll be there with as many family & friends as I can muster.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,874 ✭✭✭BBM77


    What the heck is a 'mobile cath lab'?
    Sounds like something akin to a mobile brothel!

    Is it the intention that the personnel are 'mobile' or what does it mean?

    A brothel would be less of a waste of money.

    I’d love to know how much flying people to Cork, mobile cath lab, reports, treating people in Whitfield Waterford, treating people in Bon Secours in Cork and treating people in UHC costs in total. I’d be nearly certain it is more expensive than just providing the feck’n second cath lab and 24 cardiac care in Waterford in the first place. But hey since when does logic come into government decisions.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,510 ✭✭✭Max Powers


    BBM77 wrote: »
    A brothel would be less of a waste of money.

    I’d love to know how much flying people to Cork, mobile cath lab, reports, treating people in Whitfield Waterford, treating people in Bon Secours in Cork and treating people in UHC costs in total. I’d be nearly certain it is more expensive than just providing the feck’n second cath lab and 24 cardiac care in Waterford in the first place. But hey since when does logic come into government decisions.

    Well, hopefully good crowd tomorrow and the message will be reinforced that we want proper services, like other regions.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,510 ✭✭✭Max Powers


    Fair play everyone especially organisers who turned out today, decent crowd of 5000 garda estimated on rte.I was thinking as I was walking, there should really be a 5 figure crowd here but a lot of apathy, ignorance and laziness in the world today.200 people protested in limerick today about their a&e situation (not as big a deal as our protest reason admittedly) which puts our figures in a great light, fair play all.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,152 ✭✭✭reni10


    Looks like John Deasy is still not acknowledging that we need the second Cath lab and 24 hour cover in Waterford even though he has been directly asked to support it from FF's Mary Butler!

    All the other elected Waterford TDs I believe have come on board except Deasy... What a joke!


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,514 ✭✭✭blue note


    Halligan is the only one flying the flag for it really though. He's the one in the media all the time for it and he's being treated like a punching bag. He's the only td actually fighting for it and outside of Waterford (including in the rest of the south east) he's being seen as a Healy rae type who is just trying to get local services for Waterford that the population doesn't merit. Inside Waterford he's seen as a out by so many people because he hasn't resigned because the government didn't give us the second Cath lab. Any time I see him past anything on Facebook he's meet with a barrage of criticism for nut resigning (which I think the government would be pretty happy about to be honest).


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 531 ✭✭✭Stopitwillya


    reni10 wrote: »
    Looks like John Deasy is still not acknowledging that we need the second Cath lab and 24 hour cover in Waterford even though he has been directly asked to support it from FF's Mary Butler!

    All the other elected Waterford TDs I believe have come on board except Deasy... What a joke!

    Two jokes.
    If Michael Martin told Mary Butler to jump in the river she would do it. We are severely lacking in the quality of public representatives we have.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,473 ✭✭✭robtri


    blue note wrote: »
    Halligan is the only one flying the flag for it really though. He's the one in the media all the time for it and he's being treated like a punching bag. He's the only td actually fighting for it and outside of Waterford (including in the rest of the south east) he's being seen as a Healy rae type who is just trying to get local services for Waterford that the population doesn't merit. Inside Waterford he's seen as a out by so many people because he hasn't resigned because the government didn't give us the second Cath lab. Any time I see him past anything on Facebook he's meet with a barrage of criticism for nut resigning (which I think the government would be pretty happy about to be honest).


    He gets a barrage of abuse because of election promises for second lab.. his speeches about "reigning down hell on the goverment", this is a red line issue
    ect ect ect
    and every-time he has back pedaled and shown that he doesnt back up any statements he has made..

    I for one was delighted when he got the post as it was a great way to work in the government and make changes... but to speak the way he does and then not to follow his own words/statements makes him look a laughing stock and hence in my opinion the reason for the abuse....


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,717 ✭✭✭Deiseen


    robtri wrote: »
    blue note wrote: »
    Halligan is the only one flying the flag for it really though. He's the one in the media all the time for it and he's being treated like a punching bag. He's the only td actually fighting for it and outside of Waterford (including in the rest of the south east) he's being seen as a Healy rae type who is just trying to get local services for Waterford that the population doesn't merit. Inside Waterford he's seen as a out by so many people because he hasn't resigned because the government didn't give us the second Cath lab. Any time I see him past anything on Facebook he's meet with a barrage of criticism for nut resigning (which I think the government would be pretty happy about to be honest).


    He gets a barrage of abuse because of election promises for second lab.. his speeches about "reigning down hell on the goverment", this is a red line issue
    ect ect ect
    and every-time he has back pedaled and shown that he doesnt back up any statements he has made..

    I for one was delighted when he got the post as it was a great way to work in the government and make changes... but to speak the way he does and then not to follow his own words/statements makes him look a laughing stock and hence in my opinion the reason for the abuse....

    I understand what you are saying but take Halligan out of the equation and where would we be? Absolutely no where is where.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,473 ✭✭✭robtri


    Deiseen wrote: »
    I understand what you are saying but take Halligan out of the equation and where would we be? Absolutely no where is where.

    and where are we now?? we have a caravan.... woo hoo great stuff


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,717 ✭✭✭Deiseen


    robtri wrote: »
    Deiseen wrote: »
    I understand what you are saying but take Halligan out of the equation and where would we be? Absolutely no where is where.

    and where are we now?? we have a caravan.... woo hoo great stuff
    That's a bit ridiculous to label it like that. At the very least it will reduce waiting lists and may save a few lives. On top of that it could lead to the justification for a second cath lab. It's not the perfect solution but it's 100% better than nothing. Do not forget that the consultants themselves suggested this, if it was a mickey mouse solution then they wouldn't have even put it on the table.


  • Registered Users Posts: 934 ✭✭✭azimuth17


    I originally thought the same as Deiseen, but this replay to a parliamentary question by David Cullinane (i am not a member of SF or any party) puts us in our box. Halligan is being made a show of. A mobile lab? A tissue of lies.

    QUESTION NO: 1021
    DÁIL QUESTION addressed to the Minister for Health (Simon Harris T.D.)
    by Deputy David Cullinane
    for WRITTEN ANSWER on 17/01/2017

    * To ask the Minister for Health his plans to put in place a mobile cath laboratory for University Hospital Waterford as confirmed by the Minister for State in an interview (details supplied); the cost of such a measure; the staffing arrangements; the report, internal or external or both, which led to this plan; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
    David Cullinane T.D.
    Details Supplied: with the Irish Examiner on 6 January 2016

    REPLY.
    In recent weeks, the South/South West Hospital Group (SSWHG) has made very significant progress to address cardiology waiting lists at University Hospital Waterford (UHW). Waiting list data, compiled and published by the National Treatment Purchase Fund (NTPF) earlier this week, provide evidence that the cardiology waiting list at the hospital has reduced by almost 20% since the end of November, and the number of persons waiting longer than a year has reduced by some 66%. By year end, a total of 489 patients remained on the NTPF list, with no patient waiting longer than 18 months.
    The focus on the cardiology waiting list will continue in 2017. The SSWHG has a robust plan in place to address the remaining backlog which involves access to cath lab capacity across the region. In addition, as recommended in the Herity Report, an additional €.5m funding has been provided to UHW in 2017 which will enable the hospital to provide 2 additional cath lab sessions (8 hours) per week. I am advised that patients waiting over 12 months will have their procedures completed in the first 8 weeks of 2017; patients waiting 3 – 12 months will have their procedures completed by June 2017.
    Budget 2017 makes specific provision for those patients waiting longest for treatment within the health service. In this context, I am considering a national cardiology waiting list initiative which will address waiting times for cardiology treatments in a number of hospitals, including UHW. A range of measures are envisaged including sharing of facilities and resources amongst public hospitals, use of private facilities and the deployment of a mobile cath lab for specific periods in specific locations. Further detail will be available in the coming weeks


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,999 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    It is a 'stop-gap' measure, no doubt.
    It has the potential to show more accurate figures of the numbers in need of the service.

    Unfortunately I believe there are a couple of pitfalls.

    The lab will only be available for short periods, so it is not designed for emergency use.
    What hours will it be in operation?
    For how many days per week?

    Will it too close at 5:30 pm?

    While it sits there I expect there will be a concerted effort to divert patients to Cork to keep the UHW numbers down.

    Cork still gets its extra funding to take those referred patients.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,874 ✭✭✭BBM77


    Deiseen wrote: »
    That's a bit ridiculous to label it like that. At the very least it will reduce waiting lists and may save a few lives. On top of that it could lead to the justification for a second cath lab. It's not the perfect solution but it's 100% better than nothing. Do not forget that the consultants themselves suggested this, if it was a mickey mouse solution then they wouldn't have even put it on the table.

    So why exactly should we have to take this solution, when like for like other areas don’t?


  • Registered Users Posts: 934 ✭✭✭azimuth17


    Consultants asked as far as I know, for a mobile to be based at UHW, pending the completion of the second full time lab, not to come an odd day or so as now seems to be the situation.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,473 ✭✭✭robtri


    have a question...

    When they say a second Cath Lab.... what do they actually mean we need??

    we have one that is open till 5... how come we cant just staff it up and have it remain open 24 (i.e. 3 shifts) surely be a cheaper option then building a new lab... or using a mobile caravan?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,510 ✭✭✭Max Powers


    robtri wrote: »
    have a question...

    When they say a second Cath Lab.... what do they actually mean we need??

    we have one that is open till 5... how come we cant just staff it up and have it remain open 24 (i.e. 3 shifts) surely be a cheaper option then building a new lab... or using a mobile caravan?

    It is odd isn't it, something to do with lab capacity.it's not v clear


  • Registered Users Posts: 934 ✭✭✭azimuth17


    To be a 24/7 PPCI centre, that is one where heart attack emergency cases are dealt with, it is essential to have two cath labs. A man from Co Kilkenny spoke at the protest march recently and explained that he was on the operating table in the UHW cath lab getting two stents put in when a heart attack case arrived. he had to be removed from the table with only one stent in while the emergency was dealt with. When they put him back on the table the surgeon was unable for medical reasons to insert the second stent!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,392 ✭✭✭JohnC.


    It is a 'stop-gap' measure, no doubt.
    It has the potential to show more accurate figures of the numbers in need of the service.

    Unfortunately I believe there are a couple of pitfalls.

    The lab will only be available for short periods, so it is not designed for emergency use.
    What hours will it be in operation?
    For how many days per week?

    Will it too close at 5:30 pm?

    While it sits there I expect there will be a concerted effort to divert patients to Cork to keep the UHW numbers down.

    Cork still gets its extra funding to take those referred patients.
    I also can't help but think about how easy it'll be to take a mobile lab away again.


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