Philip Cairns' Murder finally confirmed?

Keane2baMused

This notion that she must have been involved seems completely ludicrous to me.

Why would she open up a whole can of worms unnecessarily? If she was involved and this man was on the way out there was no reason for her to say a word. Unless she felt the gardai believed her a suspect which by the sounds of it doesn't seem to be the case.

anewme

people take secrets to their grave for all types of reasons. fear, abuse, family ties, post traumatic stress disorder.

What about all the Saville victims who only came forward when he died? Those hateful paedophiles frighten people so much into submission.

What about the Dalkey House of Horrors?

The hatred on this thread is understandable.

However, if this woman's story is true, the murderer is dead and now the lynch mob want to lynch the wrong person.

The Police and Gardai often re run case studies on crimes years after the event appealing for witnesses to come forward, no matter how long ago or what their reasons were at the time. They are assured their evidence will be treated with compassion and understanding. It has to be this way or the cold cases will remain unsolved.

Wibbs

philstar wrote: »

would Eamon Cooke have been a well known character/celebrity for 13 yr old schoolboy to know back then???

OK I had a few years on the lad involved at the time, but not that many, still a teenager and I would have certainly known and listened to Radio Dublin as many did, so would have had some attachment to the station and the guy who ran it. I'm not sure I would have been immediately aware of his name exactly, but if some "old dude" had said with conviction and backup "I run Radio Dublin" I'd have listened. As many would.

mewe

Nobody knows the full story here. I'm as disgusted as anyone that this information was withheld for so long and added to Philip's family's suffering but this woman could have learning difficulties for example. More than likely this scumbag surrounded himself with vulnerable people.

I'm not defending her but saying calm down until you have the full facts. People are angry about it though and that's understandable.

Atlantic Dawn

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

She's as guilty as him if she held it this long, utter scum.

And why did she hold this secret so long? Does this thing run deeper than the actual suspect himself? Can you honestly say that you know her motivating factor for keeping this secret?

I don't think that someone would wake up some morning and say to themselves "what needs to be done today...oh sure that's right I had to visit the cops about a boy that went missing 30 yrs ago "

Atlantic Dawn

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

The woman needs to be named and publically identified in the media so she can never enjoy one minute of what remains of her life in this country. The heartbreak of Philips family not knowing what happened to him and the amount of man hours that went in to the search when she knew all along where she last saw him.

No she doesn't.

She may not have known anything. She may be just a troubled young woman looking for attention. Let's not send the pitchforks around to her front door just yet.

arayess

andekwarhola wrote: »

Fear isn't rational.

That said, nobody actually knows the facts here so we're all hypothesising.

You are responsible for your own behaviour using excuses like fear etc...is weaseling out of it.
Her behaviour cost a family 30 years of pain and a man to die not knowing what happened his son.
no excuse supercedes that. none.

I could possibly at a stretch buy that pre-2007 ....but cooke was locked up then aged 70 for 10 years.

Dolbert wrote: »

Away with your logical and reasoned posts! Off with her head!

quite right

arayess

arayess wrote: »

Her behaviour cost a family 30 years of pain and a man to die not knowing what happened his son.
no excuse supercedes that. none.

Again...only if you accept without question the story she is now peddling.

I have serious doubts.

Atlantic Dawn

Deleted User wrote: »

And why did she hold this secret so long? Does this thing run deeper than the actual suspect himself? Can you honestly say that you know her motivating factor for keeping this secret?

I don't think that someone would wake up some morning and say to themselves "what needs to be done today...oh sure that's right I had to visit the cops about a boy that went missing 30 yrs ago "

He disappeared 20 years ago, in that time she would have been able to gain sense and a conscience if she was a normal human being. Strange time she goes to the Gardaí when Cooke was away with the fairies on medication and could have owned up to anything. We are at a stage now without a body or a stable accused to question, she could have made the whole thing up, complete and utter mess. She's an out and out disgrace to the human race, unless she knows now where he's buried she should have taken her shame to the grave, she has only opened up old wounds.

SEPT 23 1989

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

It's like when those bastards let Winnie Johnson go to her grave without telling her where her son Keith was buried

Putting a woman through a living nightmare of torment for her whole life

As twisted as the original crime they committed

With the moors murders though, the child was buried on bog land. Land profile changes regularly on soft land so its possible the body could have shifted over time. The cops did dig but could not locate the child

arayess

Deleted User wrote: »

Again...only if you accept without question the story she is now peddling.

I have serious doubts.

I can't disagree with you...I'm sure there is much more.
my comments are based on the story as narrated.

Arghus

Dolbert wrote: »

Away with your logical and reasoned posts! Off with her head!

It's typical really. The pitchforks and "burn in hell" comments are out quicker than a half-baked opinion around here whenever something like this comes out in the media. We don't know the circumstances, but it doesn't stop people rushing to judgement. It's one of the most depressing feature of Boards.

Atlantic Dawn

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

He disappeared 20 years ago, in that time she would have been able to gain sense and a conscience if she was a normal human being. Strange time she goes to the Gardaí when Cooke was away with the fairies on medication and could have owned up to anything. We are at a stage now without a body or a stable accused to question, she could have made the whole thing up, complete and utter mess. She's an out and out disgrace to the human race, unless she knows know where he's buried she should have taken her shame to the grave, she has only opened up old wounds.

Nonsense. Your disregarding the fear factor completely.

And as for 'opening up old wounds' I disagree. This info could give his family some form of closure.

And how are we to know whether the suspect was lucid when questioned?

Fleawuss

Dolbert wrote: »

she felt unable to come forward until he was dying. I can't claim to know that kind of fear (thankfully!) Trauma is not always rational. Why assume she has acted out of malice?

You have assumed that she was a child in 1986, that she felt unable to contact the police, that she was in the grip of some sort of fear, that she was traumatized, that others assume she acted out of malice; that's just a list of your assumptions. I don't care what she was in 1986. She had ten years later. She had twenty years later. There are no excuses for thirty years of agony. None.

Allyall

arayess wrote: »

I don't buy this, cooke was old , infirm and lets not remember locked up for fcuking ages before this , he was jailed in 2007 that is almost 10 years ago....she had 10 years of freedom from whatever hold you suggest to give this info....

because you are afraid or a victim you don't get a carte blanche on responsibilities.

She apparently made a statemtent to the Garda in 2011. Maybe another before.

Keane2baMused wrote: »

This notion that she must have been involved seems completely ludicrous to me.

Why would she open up a whole can of worms unnecessarily? If she was involved and this man was on the way out there was no reason for her to say a word. Unless she felt the gardai believed her a suspect which by the sounds of it doesn't seem to be the case.

There are tons of reasons that she may have come forward if she was involved. When she heard he was dying, she may have thought if new evidence did come to light, that she would get blamed, yet Cooke would be dead and unable to take the majority of the responsibility.
She may have wanted him to say something.

Cooke may have convinced her that somehow she was to blame/part of it by being in that room. She may have believed that for years, and was afraid to come forward.

Atlantic Dawn

Deleted User wrote: »

Nonsense. Your disregarding the fear factor completely.

And as for 'opening up old wounds' I disagree. This info could give him some closure.

And how are we to know whether the suspect was lucid when questioned?

Her information is about as useful as someone coming forward now to say they know who actually shot Michael Collins.

Atlantic Dawn

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Her information is about as useful as someone coming forward now to say they know who actually shot Michael Collins.

Er no there is a big difference between 30 years ago and 94 years ago.

Hence that's why a line of information was kept open

Fleawuss

Fleawuss wrote: »

You have assumed that she was a child in 1986, that she felt unable to contact the police, that she was in the grip of some sort of fear, that she was traumatized, that others assume she acted out of malice; that's just a list of your assumptions. I don't care what she was in 1986. She had ten years later. She had twenty years later. There are no excuses for thirty years of agony. None.

Bollocks

If you genuinely believe that you have lived a simple sheltered life

Fleawuss

Deleted User wrote: »

Bollocks

If you genuinely believe that you have lived a simple sheltered life

Laughable ****e. Making excuses for the inexcusable and rationalizing the misery inflicted. The old Irish failing of no accountability because because because.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Bollocks

If you genuinely believe that you have lived a simple sheltered life

Or alternatively, if you think "they did it, they did it" on the basis of the first "confession", you have lived a simple sheltered life.

Fleawuss

Fleawuss wrote: »

Laughable ****e. Making excuses for the inexcusable and rationalizing the misery inflicted. The old Irish failing of no accountability because because because.

How?

Do you know the woman in question?
If the police went about your recommendations, no one would come forward

anewme

The guy was convicted in 2003 of attempted rape and sexual assault and this conviction was overturned on a legal technicality in 2006. He then proceeded to carry out an arson attack( and subsequently received a 4 years suspended sentence) on the home of one of the complainants.

He also boasted of being a high level republican (and whether this was true or not) he used it to threaten ppl.

And you wonder why it just could not be possible someone could live in fear of this man????

12Phase

While I'm a bit young to remember 1986, I was absolutely aware of the Philip Cairns case and it always left me wondering what happened and why nobody had been put away for it.

I know I grew up in South Dublin and I was warned and re-warned as a kid about it and I probably never really felt particularly safe around adults who I didn't have a full sense of background information on.

This just leaves me even more disturbed.

It doesn't really bring closure, it just leaves even more questions and concerns about what the hell was going on in that era.

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Or alternatively, if you think "they did it, they did it" on the basis of the first "confession", you have lived a simple sheltered life.

He was a known paedophile. We can only assume by his confession that he may have contributed. There doesn't have to necessarily be a body for a crime anymore.

Do we know the full extent of what he disclosed to the cops?

All in suggesting is for people to keep their knickers on and wait and see how this pans out. More may be revealed in the future. Not enough facts to determine a case

kitkatman

reading through the replies on this thread, is it any wonder why people with secrets from the past generally remain quiet and don't reveal.

no one knows the circumstances of this lady informant, she may have been related to the monster, she might not have been the full shilling, pure guesswork.

consider all the recent garda programs on historic unsolved cases, from missing persons(assumed dead) to murders like dessie fox. in reality the garda are hoping to rattle the conscience of someone with key knowledge of the incidents.
instead of thanking this lady for resolving this mystery(albeit very late in the day), most of the contributers on this thread are of the lynch mob variety and want her punished for her silence. what message is this sending out to others with the information that would solve other crimes?...best stay dumb and retain a dirty conscience than open up and get vitriol.

in essence what I am asking, which of these options would you prefer?

1- a potential informant to fail to reveal information and a case remain unsolved
or
2- an informant reveals critical case facts and is immune from public criticism(assuming they were only 3rd/4th parties to an incident).

Dolbert

Fleawuss wrote: »

You have assumed that she was a child in 1986, that she felt unable to contact the police, that she was in the grip of some sort of fear, that she was traumatized, that others assume she acted out of malice; that's just a list of your assumptions. I don't care what she was in 1986. She had ten years later. She had twenty years later. There are no excuses for thirty years of agony. None.

Actually I haven't assumed anything, I'm saying "what if", in response to the vitriol displayed here (the original thread title was Stupid Bitch - I'd be more outraged at the killer myself). I'm suggesting that we wait and see what the facts are before calling for this woman to be named, shamed and imprisoned herself, as has been suggested.

Derrigra

Words fail me, Philips dad has passed away without knowing his sons whereabouts, their family has been destroyed and this 'lady' takes 30 years to come forward with this 'fainting' story, I hope she is proud if herself! Cairns family member

Atlantic Dawn

She could have sent an anonomous letter or made a phonecall 15-20 years ago linking him to it but didn't, would have got the ball rolling.

LadyLucinda

One thing I can never understand about missing peoples cases in Ireland is why people don't just take the law into their own hands. I would imagine, as is the case with lots of missing persons cases, they knew that it was most likely him that done it.

Animals like this Cooke man don't deserve the law. If that young boy was related to me, Cooke would have no choice but to tell the truth.

Atlantic Dawn

Did Cooke have any higher up connections so to speak?