Season 6 Episode 5 "The Door" - "Non book readers"

stronglikebull

rwbug wrote: »

Must be in minority but didn't like that episode.

Seems that most people did really like it, and some are proclaiming it to be the best episode ever, but I honestly don't get it. Mostly, nothing happened, then we find out that Hodor means Hold the Door, then he dies. Also, the children people made the white walkers. Neither was really that important. Who created the walkers doesn't really advance the story, or give any insight as to what's going to come. The fact that GRRM had the idea for hold the door being Hodor for 20 years means nothing at all, and shouldn't be held up as some sort of shining example of how brilliant the writing is. I did not see anything in this episode that made it any way better than the last few episodes this year. As far as I could see, it was the worst of the season, and the worst for a lot of recent seasons.

Once again, it's building up to something that is to come in future episodes. Just when that will be seems a bit of a mystery. As Butters said in the South Park skit, "They keep promising us dragons, and all we get are more wieners!".

As for the claim that it's all about character development, it's been 6 years now and the characters of Sansa, Daneries, Theon, Jon, Arya and Bran have been in development since the very first episode. Sansa is finally maybe showing a bit of strength, but at the same time still trusting the biggest snake in the entire show and lying to her brother (which shows no development of her at all). A Girl may as well just go home. Bran has learned nothing from living with a tree for the last two years, and incredibly obviously fukked the whole thing up with his unguided dream sequence- idiot. Daneries rides a horse and gets an army, again. I'm pretty sure we've seen that episode about 3 times already. Theon might actually be turning into; not a snivelling toad. So that's something.

The whole Sacred City scene could have been deleted with not a single element of the show lost with it. We already know that the Dothraki are going to follow Daneries now. We also knew that the temple of Vaes Dothrak burned down, it was kind of the highlight of the last episode. We know that Jora loves Daneries, and that he has the pox, and that he's been banished umpteen times now, so they could have skipped all this and just had her turn up in Mareen with an army. 5 minutes of the limited time the show has wasted on nothing.

Really, the most interesting parts of this episode were in Mareen...

I don't like to criticise this show as I've really enjoyed it over the last six years, and I'm sure there's plenty of really good stuff to come. But this episode was really not good, at all. With only 10 episodes per season, you'd expect less of people standing around scratching their asses, and maybe a little more to-the-point progress.

intheclouds

stronglikebull wrote: »

Mostly, nothing happened.....

LOL.

If you dont understand the significance of the final 10 minutes of that episode then I doubt you will enjoy the rest of the series.

jebidiah

nhur wrote: »

have to say, I quite liked the Hodor loop... and the more rapid pace of the latest season .... however - it just seems like there is so much unnecessary stuff in the show overall... plenty of arcs/subplots which look like they're going to deliver spectacularly but just fizzle out (Aria & the hound, the countless hours of bran heading north etc. together with the continual building up of heroes and killing them off, simultaneously killing continuity only to bring one back from the dead...

I know i'm not supposed to mention the books here but I'm basically going through the same emotional rollercoaster with the series as with the books... starting off with being wowed by the intricate and far-reaching tapestry of characters and their motivations/backstories... then getting upset with the plodding of the (seemingly) main threads... especially daenerys chilling out in Not-Westeros (without doing anything with her dragons).

I know that a certain amount of filler is critical to understanding character motivations but there seem to have been a bizarrely large number of detailed stories from the early seasons which have absolutely no bearing on the current threads... It feels like we could have just been informed about them by exposition.

Am I the only one feeling this?

Wait, you think the hounds story fizzled out??!!

He kicked Brienne in the gee, got his ear bit off, smashed around with a rock, and got ****ed over a cliff for good measure.

Then Arya left him to die.

Id say he went out better than anyone on the show so far.

Right in the gee he kicked her. Class.

RoyalMarine

rwbug wrote: »

Must be in minority but didn't like that episode.

The Ironborn have a clapometer to decide who becomes king.
Elves with handgrenades.
White walker dies so easily.
Dead army won't take much beating if can be held back by a little bit of fire, or a door, or a character nothing more than a pack donkey.
At least the pack donkey died.

Hodor

Dial Hard

So, just so I'm clear:

Gratuitous boobs/vag = Best show eva!!!!11!!!

Gratuitous cock = down with this sort of thing, no call for that at all, pearl clutching, hand wringing, etc. etc.

Right, so.

ohnonotgmail

rwbug wrote: »

Must be in minority but didn't like that episode.

The Ironborn have a clapometer to decide who becomes king.
Elves with handgrenades.
White walker dies so easily.
Dead army won't take much beating if can be held back by a little bit of fire, or a door, or a character nothing more than a pack donkey.
At least the pack donkey died.

it has already been well established that dragonglass kills whitewalkers. sam killed a white walker in an earlier episode using a piece of dragonglass. the children of the forest used dragonglass to create the white walkers.

Frynge

Exactly, come on, keep up.

Giggernaut

I'd like to know more about the Children of the Forests' beef with Man. Wonder what happened? #prequal series

Wasn't it mentioned to Jon that the original king Walker was a Stark tricked into the forest by a beautiful vision? Wonder will that play a significant part moving forward.

I expect more from the acting troupe, wasn't that Richard E Grant I spied? He's hardly around for single episode.

I'm very confused about the Brann story. So has he absorbed the 3eyed ravens power? And what about the walkers when they first arrived at the sacred den surely the King Walker knew. He seems to control all of the walkers telepathically?

If the last ten minutes of every episode for the past six seasons was edited together you've have one incoherent thrill ride!

Till next week, there better be dragons doing cool sh*t!

nicki11

Giggernaut wrote: »

I'd like to know more about the Children of the Forests' beef with Man. Wonder what happened? #prequal series

Wasn't it mentioned to Jon that the original king Walker was a Stark tricked into the forest by a beautiful vision? Wonder will that play a significant part moving forward.

I expect more from the acting troupe, wasn't that Richard E Grant I spied? He's hardly around for single episode.

I'm very confused about the Brann story. So has he absorbed the 3eyed ravens power? And what about the walkers when they first arrived at the sacred den surely the King Walker knew. He seems to control all of the walkers telepathically?

If the last ten minutes of every episode for the past six seasons was edited together you've have one incoherent thrill ride!

Till next week, there better be dragons doing cool sh*t!

This lore video should explain it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1DVoAtR3aI.

BoJack Horseman

Dial Hard wrote: »

So, just so I'm clear:

Gratuitous boobs/vag = Best show eva!!!!11!!!.

What has been an example of gratuitous boob?

Falthyron

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

What has been an example of gratuitous boob?

As far as I am concerned, there is no such thing as 'gratuitous boob'. That's like waking up every day and saying "Oh, for once, just once, I would appreciate a bit of darkness in the mornings.".

DeadHand

Dial Hard wrote: »

So, just so I'm clear:

Gratuitous boobs/vag = Best show eva!!!!11!!!

Gratuitous cock = down with this sort of thing, no call for that at all, pearl clutching, hand wringing, etc. etc.

Right, so.

You have a point. I reckon nudity, both male and female, is simply a defining characteristic of the series at this stage. Some just need to get over it and enjoy the show.

It's just a cock ffs nothing mysterious or disconcerting about it. We're not Victorians.

The infamous warty dick shot did serve a plot purpose in that it, along with the girl wandering around topless, set the troupe up as a merrily shameless bunch.

I was struck at how natural and realistic the backstage scene was- then it hit me that they were actors playing actors. They'd probably been engaging in backstage banter/flirting all their lives. Of course they nailed it.

dark crystal

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

What has been an example of gratuitous boob?

Do you need a list??

There was one in the very same scene, but no one here was lamenting that!

DeVore

DeVore wrote: »

Yeah it seems like the Dani's time line will need to move much quicker than the Ironborn can build even 100 boats. I guess thinking about it, its possible that Theon and sis might take those 50 ships to Dani and scupper their bonkers murderous uncles plans that way... (just a guess, I'm not a book read or anything).

For the people comparing the willy-shot with boobs... I don't think its quite the same thing. See if they had a scene which started with a close up of a vagjayjay and see what the response would be....

In fairness there has been quite a few vagjayjay shots. Plenty of full-body nudity. I mean, I was shocked to see a penis so close as it was unexpected, but it's tough to complain about it in a show that is filled with nudity.

EagererBeaver

dark crystal wrote: »

Do you need a list??

There was one in the very same scene, but no one here was lamenting that!

They were a cracking set though. We were all outraged when six million year Melisandre's were flapping about.

So to correct the original statement, gratuitous boob shots are fine, as long as they're good boobs.

polluxspiky

Sleepy wrote: »

This was planned since the start. The producers were told about it by GRRM. That reveal was 20 years in the making, we haven't seen it in the books yet!

The producers were told about it 2 years ago. The whole scene will appear in book 7 of what was originally supposed to be a 3 book series which was extended after great sales.
I'm not really buying it, and there's so much else in the show that's pretty random or blind alley I've never gotten any feeling there was much coherence to any of it.
Not that it isn't entertaining, it's just not very overarching plot driven IMO.

polluxspiky

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

it has already been well established that dragonglass kills whitewalkers. sam killed a white walker in an earlier episode using a piece of dragonglass. the children of the forest used dragonglass to create the white walkers.

Shouldn't there be a bit of an APB put out for dragonglass at this stage? Once you've got it, killing white walkers doesn't seem all that difficult. One dragonglass spear each and the crows could probably do the job on their own.

pickarooney

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

The HBO casting ad must have went:

She was recast AFAIK. The original actress was even nicer.

There was a real stunner in it last week, in Mereen I think. Not sure what the deal with he was or if she's coming back.

pickarooney

Dial Hard wrote: »

So, just so I'm clear:

Gratuitous boobs/vag = Best show eva!!!!11!!!

Gratuitous cock = down with this sort of thing, no call for that at all, pearl clutching, hand wringing, etc. etc.

Right, so.

Were you not here for Melisandre's bedtime ritual? Or Jon Snow in the nip@

Pretty things = good
Ugly things= bad

AlmightyCushion

kunst nugget wrote: »

Honestly, I think this was a joke on behalf of the makers who are always getting hassle for the amount of boobs the show - especially after the finale of the previous show.

Are people really that horrified by seeing a willy on screen for a few seconds? I see one everyday and it's way more wrinkly and dishevelled than that one.

More warts too.

LionelNashe

jebidiah wrote: »

Wait, you think the hounds story fizzled out??!!

He kicked Brienne in the gee, got his ear bit off, smashed around with a rock, and got ****ed over a cliff for good measure.

Then Arya left him to die.

Id say he went out better than anyone on the show so far.

Right in the gee he kicked her. Class.

+1
The meeting between Brienne and the Hound came out of the blue; the fight was brutal, the mountaintop setting was perfect, and him begging Arya not to leave him to a slow death was absolutely heart-braking and really well written and acted. The reason it was so powerful was all the time spent developing the relationship between Arya and the Hound. For me, it was the most powerful death scene, along with Shireen's, followed in order by Ned Stark, the Red Wedding, Jon's death, the Purple Wedding, and Hodor's death pales in comparison to all of the above. Willis's struggling was a bit sad though.

ohnonotgmail

polluxspiky wrote: »

Shouldn't there be a bit of an APB put out for dragonglass at this stage? Once you've got it, killing white walkers doesn't seem all that difficult. One dragonglass spear each and the crows could probably do the job on their own.

There is a bag of it somewhere that Sam found. i cant remember what happened to it

intheclouds

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

There is a bag of it somewhere that Sam found. i cant remember what happened to it

It's gone. Left behind in Hardhome in the dash away from the army of the dead.

Remember Jon and the bald Thenn went in to get it and then got in a fight with a white walker who Jon then bested with Longclaw and we all realised Valaryian steel could shatter the white walkers.

Nermal

polluxspiky wrote: »

Shouldn't there be a bit of an APB put out for dragonglass at this stage? Once you've got it, killing white walkers doesn't seem all that difficult. One dragonglass spear each and the crows could probably do the job on their own.

You can't defeat the wights first without the dragons though. The larger the army you send against the wights, the more wights you end up with.

Alanhooly

I understand this may have been asked already and/or it may sound incredibly stupid. Here goes..

If Wyllis dies as a child, how was Hodor still alive in the future?

GerB40

Alanhooly wrote: »

I understand this may have been asked already and/or it may sound incredibly stupid. Here goes..

If Wyllis dies as a child, how was Hodor still alive in the future?

He didn't die, he just went mental.

Duckworth_Luas

Alanhooly wrote: »

If Wyllis dies as a child, how was Hodor still alive in the future?

Wyillis didn't die.

What is hor may never dor!

deco nate

LionelNashe wrote: »

+1
The meeting between Brienne and the Hound came out of the blue; the fight was brutal, the mountaintop setting was perfect, and him begging Arya not to leave him to a slow death was absolutely heart-braking and really well written and acted. The reason it was so powerful was all the time spent developing the relationship between Arya and the Hound. For me, it was the most powerful death scene, along with Shireen's, followed in order by Ned Stark, the Red Wedding, Jon's death, the Purple Wedding, and Hodor's death pales in comparison to all of the above. Willis's struggling was a bit sad though.

Really? The red wedding was the most... Ahh, wtf of all. But Yea I did get a bit of dust in my eye over this episode.

Alanhooly

Ha, fair enough so, that explains it. Silly me.

Thanks lads/ladies.

PTH2009

That witch in meeran was a stunner BTW

Beautiful looks must come as a package for these witches (when there in there younger apperence lol)

Could hodor be brought back as a zombie (a big guy like him could come in handy for the whitewalkers)