The New Ireland

astonaidan

Ive had a quick read and while I think the OP has a few good points, he clearly had a very off day in his town.
Not even sure ifs its really a new thing, more something Ive noticed, we are a country who hate to see people succeed, thats something that Ive noticed in younger generations, the aul lads I know arent like that, but this is just personal experience.

J Mysterio

astonaidan wrote: »

we are a country who hate to see people succeed, thats something that Ive noticed in younger generations, the aul lads I know arent like that, but this is just personal experience.

Completely disagree.

makingmecrazy

pone2012 wrote: »

I literally mean I dont attend anything that involves alcohol, I prefer travelling, seeing sites, movies, concerts , im a gym goer, a kickboxer, a martial artist...its just not my thing

While I wholeheartedly agree people should totally go out and enjoy themselves if thats their thing...my gripe is subjecting others to the behaviour aforementioned (Pissing, vomiting, fighting, sexual displays )

You'll get absolutley no argument from me that people are entitled to enjoy themselves...but not if people have to be subjected to that as a byproduct..

I dont subject others to this type of behavior when I engage in social activities, so, id be pleased to know why its acceptable for people to subject me, or others to it with no consequence?? Furthermore, why should they have to clean up, pay for and tolerate the effects and damage they cause...a few weeks ago i seen the side of a guys new Audi completly dented in..the car window was smashed and th...this warrants more than simply paying for damages imo

This was literally the question i asked to begin with....if everyone actually looked at that instead of zoning in on Words like Indian or Pissing, this thread would have been different I think

Sorry there OP, but when you start a thread, you don't get to choose what people post in response. Your posts have come across as INCREDIBLY patronising and hostile. Can't say that type of attitude IRL would be appealing to many. You mustn't have a single toy left in your pram at this stage.

And as a heads up.....YOU brought your GF and her nationality into this, not to mention her opinion on the situation "She was horrified" yada yada.
Don't lose your **** entirely when people raise a quizzical eyebrow in relation to that ;-)

makingmecrazy

pone2012 wrote: »

I literally mean I dont attend anything that involves alcohol, I prefer travelling, seeing sites, movies, concerts , im a gym goer, a kickboxer, a martial artist...its just not my thing

While I wholeheartedly agree people should totally go out and enjoy themselves if thats their thing...my gripe is subjecting others to the behaviour aforementioned (Pissing, vomiting, fighting, sexual displays )

You'll get absolutley no argument from me that people are entitled to enjoy themselves...but not if people have to be subjected to that as a byproduct..

I dont subject others to this type of behavior when I engage in social activities, so, id be pleased to know why its acceptable for people to subject me, or others to it with no consequence?? Furthermore, why should they have to clean up, pay for and tolerate the effects and damage they cause...a few weeks ago i seen the side of a guys new Audi completly dented in..the car window was smashed and th...this warrants more than simply paying for damages imo

This was literally the question i asked to begin with....if everyone actually looked at that instead of zoning in on Words like Indian or Pissing, this thread would have been different I think

Sorry there OP, but when you start a thread, you don't get to choose what people post in response. Your posts have come across as INCREDIBLY patronising and hostile. Can't say that type of attitude IRL would be appealing to many. You mustn't have a single toy left in your pram at this stage.

And as a heads up.....YOU brought your GF and her nationality into this, not to mention her opinion on the situation "She was horrified" yada yada.
Don't lose your **** entirely when people raise a quizzical eyebrow in relation to that ;-)

If yours and your GF's sensibilities are as fragile as they come across, I suggest you both wrap yourselves in a lot of bubblewrap and blindfolds for your next outside venture.

Arghus

pone2012 wrote: »

I literally mean I dont attend anything that involves alcohol, I prefer travelling, seeing sites, movies, concerts , im a gym goer, a kickboxer, a martial artist...its just not my thing

While I wholeheartedly agree people should totally go out and enjoy themselves if thats their thing...my gripe is subjecting others to the behaviour aforementioned (Pissing, vomiting, fighting, sexual displays )

You'll get absolutley no argument from me that people are entitled to enjoy themselves...but not if people have to be subjected to that as a byproduct..

I dont subject others to this type of behavior when I engage in social activities, so, id be pleased to know why its acceptable for people to subject me, or others to it with no consequence?? Furthermore, why should they have to clean up, pay for and tolerate the effects and damage they cause...a few weeks ago i seen the side of a guys new Audi completly dented in..the car window was smashed and th...this warrants more than simply paying for damages imo

This was literally the question i asked to begin with....if everyone actually looked at that instead of zoning in on Words like Indian or Pissing, this thread would have been different I think

I've read the thread OP and I agree with the main thrust of your argument: Ireland has a problematic relationship to drink and alcohols unsavory repercussions are tolerated and even accepted more here than they rightly should be. Although, I don't think that is a particularly "new" facet of Irish life, if anything it's ages old. Maybe increased affluence amongst people has made over indulgence more prevalent, but I think that is only symptomatic of a heightened version of problems that we've had culturally for a long time.

I also think most of the discussion on the thread has consisted of ultra defensive and stupidly obtuse comparisons between India and Ireland. Get over it people. It’s embarrassing.

However the part of your earlier post, that I've placed in bold, raises a few questions for me. Now, I could be wrong - and I'm sure you'll correct me if I am - but I would take from what you've said about avoiding alcohol, that you go out of your way to avoid it? That you will not place yourself anywhere near potentially imbibed alcohol? That to me seems like a very puritanical attitude towards drink - and it implies that you really can not stand it. It makes me question how unbiased you are - maybe the carry on you initally described wasn’t wholly as bad as you thought it was?. It would seem that you have an issue with booze generally - not just over consumption. I think if you’re going to start a thread primarily about Ireland’s relationship with drink, you should lay your own cards down on the table from the beginning. A rational discussion about alcohol is great, but if one side of the debate thinks partying til you puke is the way to go, and the opposing side is ultra austere - then the middle ground is going to be hard to find, the further we go on.


You also say in the another post -

For there to be discussion, acceptance is key...now if you'll re-read the thread, I'm sure you'll observe many things, but acceptance in terms of consesus , for the most part...is far from evident

Now when you say acceptance, what do you mean? Acceptance of a national drink problem? Acceptance of the severity of that problem? Or acceptance that we might all have wildly different views of what a problem actually is? Are you trying to imply there that the only way the discussion can move forward is that everyone accepts to agree with you?

Esel

Thread needs more periods, at the end of sentences. From the OP...

Helicopters, crash-landing. Piss off, man. Pick nose, flick, sick. Righteous indignation, savage Swift. Sleep, sleep, sleep. River deep. Bridge. Over. Droll does not always mean funny. Trawling (for fish) is harder than thish. Pish.

J Mysterio

Esel wrote: »

Thread needs more periods, at the end of sentences. From the OP...

Helicopters, crash-landing. Piss off, man. Pick nose, flick, sick. Righteous indignation, savage Swift. Sleep, sleep, sleep. River deep. Bridge. Over. Droll does not always mean funny. Trawling (for fish) is harder than thish. Pish.

Do you take acid at night or whats the craic? Your posts become more unintelligible as the day becomes long. Bong.

Esel

J Mysterio wrote: »

Do you take acid at night or whats the craic? Your posts become more unintelligible as the day becomes long. Bong.

It's okay. The message is not for you.

Have you been keeping up in this thread?

vixdname

pone2012 wrote: »

Ok ,

So i was driving home Sunday Night from Watching a movie in the cinema (Captain America Civil War : Great movie btw, advise to check it out)

But something struck me

I am from a smallish town, approx 5000 people...and in driving through the main street i noticed a guy getting arrested for fighting , two men pissing openly facing the road (yes i caught an eyeful of both), one girl pissing on the street, and a a guy who was sexually stimulating a girl with his hands..this was all within about 500m of each other. Almost everyone on the street was polluted drunk, nobody seemed to care, and everyone seemed it normal

My girlfriend ( from India) was absolutely horrified , she'd never seen such behaviour. I have many foreign friends and they all say the same thing, Ireland is a good country, but a lot (not all) of the people here behave like children.

I suppose my question is, whats gone wrong with this country?? How can people behave in such a way, why dont the police become stricter? why dont people face consequences as such? why is this type of behaviour considered ok

Weird, considering the gang rape of females on public transport seems to be a national pass time in India along with familys living in actual dumps .

nobby grande

pone2012 wrote: »

Two people disagreeing in public, which is effectively disturbing the peace....unacceptable

India has nothing to do with this discussion

Its a worthwhile discussion no doubt. It seems to me that at weekends the place turns into something out of Geordie Shore or Boozed up Britain. Its really depressing.
The hive mind indeed.
I love beer gardens in the sun but you would be turned off by some of the **** that goes on when the sun starts to go down.
Not really sure what the answer is but probably more guards on the streets at these times unfortunately.
That and ban English TV.

astonaidan

J Mysterio wrote: »

Completely disagree.

As I said its my personal experience, may not be the same for everyone, their is plenty more annoying things I noticed, but I wouldnt class them as a Irish thing more generational thing

thattequilagirl

I had a drinking problem and gave up two years ago. I'm reluctant to judge because I'm not proud of some of my own behaviour when I drank, but going on a night out sober you see how widespread and accepted really anti-social behaviour is.

I've travelled loads and I've never seen it as bad anywhere else.

I went out with a group of my school friends lately. We went to the races so they started drinking early. By 1am, no one wanted to dance, no one wanted to talk, there was zero craic being had, they were like zombies just wandering around the pub.

I went back to the hotel to my leaba. No fighting or pissing in the streets, but it just seemed to me an awful way to spend a night. And don't get me wrong, I did it loads of times myself.

astonaidan

thattequilagirl wrote: »

I had a drinking problem and gave up two years ago. I'm reluctant to judge because I'm not proud of some of my own behaviour when I drank, but going on a night out sober you see how widespread and accepted really anti-social behaviour is.

I've travelled loads and I've never seen it as bad anywhere else.

I went out with a group of my school friends lately. We went to the races so they started drinking early. By 1am, no one wanted to dance, no one wanted to talk, there was zero craic being had, they were like zombies just wandering around the pub.

I went back to the hotel to my leaba. No fighting or pissing in the streets, but it just seemed to me an awful way to spend a night. And don't get me wrong, I did it loads of times myself.

Ah I feel for you, Im not really a drinker myself, I used to be able to have good craic till like around the 12 mark but then people get sloppy and its just not my scene. Thankfully my wife doesnt drink at all, was just laughing that we have had the same 6 corona in the fridge since christmas

Lyaiera

"Ireland's a bit awful, people fighting and pissing on streets. My Indian girlfriend was shocked."
"They rape people in Indian. Drag them about the place and violate them."
"Yeah, that's awful. I really feel for them. Still, I've been groped far too often by creepy dudes here. Not comparing it to rape but it's pretty bad to get grabbed and molested."
"Molested is a bit much. He's harmless, just a bit clueless. We shouldn't ruin his life because he was just having a bit of craic. Calling someone a creep can really stick."

MadDog76

thattequilagirl wrote: »

I had a drinking problem and gave up two years ago. I'm reluctant to judge because I'm not proud of some of my own behaviour when I drank, but going on a night out sober you see how widespread and accepted really anti-social behaviour is.

I've travelled loads and I've never seen it as bad anywhere else.

I went out with a group of my school friends lately. We went to the races so they started drinking early. By 1am, no one wanted to dance, no one wanted to talk, there was zero craic being had, they were like zombies just wandering around the pub.

I went back to the hotel to my leaba. No fighting or pissing in the streets, but it just seemed to me an awful way to spend a night. And don't get me wrong, I did it loads of times myself.

The thing is, your friends were all having a great night because they were all on the same level ......... you were on the outside as you didn't partake (by your own choice) which is why you felt like the outsider ......... you were the outsider just as you would have been if you decided to sit in the foyer of a cinema whilst all your friends went in to see a movie.

I'm curious as to where you travelled to without seeing drunken antics "worse" than those witnessed here in Ireland?

pajor

Bit off topic, but this is the most recent thread on drink that I can find.

This question is a bit of a long shot; but did anyone encounter a Dutch tv crew on Paddy's Day in Dublin this year? Watching a Dutch programme about sex and drugs etc. Every once in a while they do an 'on tour' series of the programme. One of the presenters was in Dublin around Paddy's Day to see if the stereotype of the drunken Paddy is true. Talking with students, alcoholics, the Rise Foundation, dealers on the Quays, randomers on the street.

It's an.. interesting window to look back into Ireland through. :pac:

K-9

The first stage of alcoholism is denial, it's just Ireland has never moved onto acceptance.

J Mysterio

K-9 wrote: »

The first stage of alcoholism is denial, it's just Ireland has never moved onto acceptance.

I think it has?

They say the first step to 'recovery' is acceptance. I think we accept we drink too much but dont give a shìte.

Legal Action

pajor wrote: »

Bit off topic, but this is the most recent thread on drink that I can find.

This question is a bit of a long shot; but did anyone encounter a Dutch tv crew on Paddy's Day in Dublin this year? Watching a Dutch programme about sex and drugs etc. Every once in a while they do an 'on tour' series of the programme. One of the presenters was in Dublin around Paddy's Day to see if the stereotype of the drunken Paddy is true. Talking with students, alcoholics, the Rise Foundation, dealers on the Quays, randomers on the street.

It's an.. interesting window to look back into Ireland through. :pac:

I was in Dublin for Paddy's Day and expected a pure knackerfest. Actually had a good night and was pleasantly surprised.

Dr Crayfish

astonaidan wrote: »

we are a country who hate to see people succeed, thats something that Ive noticed in younger generations, the aul lads I know arent like that, but this is just personal experience.

Why do Irish people always say that we don't like to see people succeed here? I think it's the reverse. In fact we big up any success by Irish people. We give mediocre rock stars like Phil Lynott a statue. We claim people like Che Guevara as being Irish. Vogue Williams seems to get the Sunday Independent magazine devoted to her every er... well every Sunday!
We get to the 2nd round of the world cup and have a huge concert in the Phoenix Park. The only place where a UFC star will make front page headlines, because we're not much good at anything really.
So can we put this myth to bed?

J Mysterio

I agree we're proud of our own and their achievements but Phil Lynott mediocre? FFS! Also, we're good at a lot of things. In fact, for a small island nation we've had a massive impact on the world. I'm proud of that.

Dr Crayfish

J Mysterio wrote: »

I agree but Phil Lynott mediocre? FFS!

Yeah. A handful of very mediocre songs, my opinion of course but if they weren't Irish I doubt anyone could name a song of theirs, maybe one at most. Maybe comparable to someone like 10cc. Some good songs, pretty forgettable, and most people wouldn't know who they are.

J Mysterio

My god.

Yes, 10cc were bang average with maybe two good songs. Thin Lizzy were brilliant and Phil Lynott was an icon. Live and Dangerous is widely recognised as one of the best live albums of all time.

Thin Lizzy had a great range from catchy pop tunes, hard rock, soulful laments, bluesy numbers and out there electro.

The boys are back in town, Dont beleive a word, Dancing in the moonlight, Rosalie, Sarah, etc. were hugely popular. Some of my favourites would be Yellow Pearl, Emerald and Dedication.

Dr Crayfish

J Mysterio wrote: »

My god.

Yes, 10cc were bang average with maybe two good songs. Thin Lizzy were brilliant and Phil Lynott was an icon. Live and Dangerous is widely recognised as one of the best live albums of all time.

Thin Lizzy had a great range from catchy pop tunes, hard rock, soulful laments, bluesy numbers and out there electro.

The boys are back in town, Dont beleive a word, Dancing in the moonlight, Rosalie, Sarah, etc. were hugely popular. Some of my favourites would be Yellow Pearl, Emerald and Dedication.

OK, I just always thought they were sh*te. I do love 10cc though

J Mysterio

Wall Street Shuffle! Also, Dreadlock Holiday. Two great tunes!

Dr Crayfish

J Mysterio wrote: »

Wall Street Shuffle! Also, Dreadlock Holiday. Two great tunes!

Rubber Bullets is my fave. I think we're off topic here. The New Ireland is no better or worse than any other Anglo Western country these days. At least we don't have American gun ownership laws and all that entails

Shint0

J Mysterio wrote: »

In fact, for a small island nation we've had a massive impact on the world. I'm proud of that.

Exactly! What other small country gets to have its national colours light up at least fifty global cities on its national day.

Arghus

Shint0 wrote: »

Exactly! What other small country gets to have its national colours light up at least fifty global cities on its national day.

I'd put some, if not all, of that down to historically Ireland being really quite crap indeed, giving people little or no choice but to emigrate, which leads to us having a bigger presence globally than we really should.

Shint0

Arghus wrote: »

I'd put some, if not all, of that down to historically Ireland being really quite crap indeed, giving people little or no choice but to emigrate, which leads to us having a bigger presence globally than we really should.

Lots of nationalities have emigrated throughout the world. Canada is full of Chinese and Punjabis, US has a huge American-Italian population, Jewish etc. but we do pack a bigger punch for such a small nation. Sure doesn't everyone want to be Irish on St. Patrick's Day.

lawlolawl

The whole international aspect of Paddys day is just an excuse for a day of drinking. It has become similar to the 5th of May in the USA at least.

We are seen as a drinking/party country so our national day is a drinking/party day.