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Tyres not roadworthy bigger cause of accidents than prev thought

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    #152
    grogi
    Registered Users Posts: 8,615 ✭✭✭grogi


    Jesus. wrote: »
    So the Government should do nothing about rising premiums esp on older cars? The market always dictates?

    In fairness usually the more government is trying to control the prices, the more harm they cause in the long term. If they try to do it, more people will simply get quotes refusals if the calculated quote is above the government issued threshold.

    IMHO what should happen is a standardization of motor insurance policies, with a few things to fiddle BY THE CONSUMER - value of the car, excess, gap cover etc. Rest should be the same - Fire cover, 3rd party liaility cover etc. And the T&C should be standard too, defined in the law.

    That will allow the consumers to build the product they want and compare it between insurers. Now every insurer has different policy with different rules - so the customers can't really compare them and choose the cheapest - no competition drives the prices up.


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    #153
    Jesus.
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭Jesus.


    grogi wrote: »
    In fairness usually the more government is trying to control the prices, the more harm they cause in the long term. If they try to do it, more people will simply get quotes refusals if the calculated quote is above the government issued threshold.

    I don't mean they should try and regulate prices. I mean limiting compensation payouts would be a huge stride in the right direction. Lucretia would prefer the Govt did nothing in this regard. I don't know why he'd want that unless he's a Lawyer.


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    #154
    The Rape of Lucretia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭The Rape of Lucretia


    Jesus. wrote: »
    So the Government should do nothing about rising premiums esp on older cars? The market always dictates?

    Exactly.


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    #155
    visual
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,268 ✭✭✭visual


    Jesus. wrote: »
    So the Government should do nothing about rising premiums esp on older cars? The market always dictates?

    Captive market that is required to have insurance has encourage insurance industry to be dysfunctional.

    Sure claims have gone up but premiums have risen more.

    The compulsory part of insurance needs to be taken away from insurance companies to restore a free market.

    That would mean the government would have to provide the 3rd party cover at a reasonable cost.

    With IW been such a disaster doubt many would be confident a state body offering 3rd party insurance wouldn't end up being another costly quango. But options are running out as year on year massive price hikes can't be sustained.


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    #156
    visual
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,268 ✭✭✭visual


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Why - it isnt not anyones responsibilty to control it. It hasnt spiraled. It moves with market forces.

    Captive market where it's is Compulsory to insure your car it is not free market competing for business. It's has a business modle thats closer to a cartell.


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    #157
    polan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 397 ✭✭polan


    166man wrote: »
    Put two new Michelin Primacys on the 159 there last week. €270 all in in 215/55/16.

    Money well spent. Best tyres for that car.

    €140 fitted for two Uniroyal RainExpert 3 in 195/65/R15 and I've to say by far it's the best tyre for Ireland.
    Had goodyear efficientgrip performance before that and the cheaper Uniroyals are better.


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    #158
    CiniO
    Registered Users Posts: 16,089 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    Jesus. wrote: »
    To my mind its more unacceptable that the cost of motoring in Ireland has spiralled out of control in recent years

    Only the insurance and tax went out of control.
    Other aspects are very reasonable.
    And while there are garages overcharging for labour, and it's sometimes hard to get parts at reasonable price, but if someone tries hard, they'll always find reasonable price garage to fix the car, and parts cheap usually online from abroad.

    Motortax is just easy way government is screwing us.
    And insurance is absolute disaster.
    Not only insurance companies are ripping us off through price cartell they established, but also government is forcing prices up by awarding huge payouts for nothing through courts.

    We live in the EU.
    I can't understand the reason, why insurance for 19 year old young fella in Ireland must cost 30 times more than insurance on the same kind of car for the same kind of fella in Poland.
    Polish fella salary might be 3 times lower, but it still makes insurance there 10 times cheaper.


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    #159
    polan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 397 ✭✭polan


    CiniO wrote: »
    Polish fella salary might be 3 times lower, but it still makes insurance there 10 times cheaper.

    Because Polish insurance companies are smart and don't pay out €40k for a bruised arm.


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    #160
    CiniO
    Registered Users Posts: 16,089 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    polan wrote: »
    Because Polish insurance companies are smart and don't pay out €40k for a bruised arm.

    They don't.
    But not because they are smart.
    They don't pay that much, because courts in Poland don tell them to pay that much.
    Likewise, Irish companies are happy to pay €40k for bruised arm, not because they want to, but because Irish courts tell them to.


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    #161
    bear1
    Registered Users Posts: 12,812 ✭✭✭✭bear1


    The one thing about Polish insurance which is completely stupid is that no matter if the car is not in use it must have valid insurance.
    Also, the average salary in Warsaw lets say is about 3.5k PLN net. There are people I know (Poles) who have paid 1.6k for the year on insurance.
    That's a big chunk out of your salary and you cannot pay per month, either all at once or in two parts.
    So you get 3.5k, take 1.6k out of that for the insurance and you are left with 1.9k (roughly 450e) for the month.
    Regardless of the stupid pay out amounts here which should be capped, it's pointless to compare prices of either country.


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    #162
    Jesus.
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭Jesus.


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Exactly.

    Its not a free market situation though. We don't have a choice whether to be insured or not, its mandatory.


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    #163
    grogi
    Registered Users Posts: 8,615 ✭✭✭grogi


    Jesus. wrote: »
    Its not a free market situation though. We don't have a choice whether to be insured or not, its mandatory.

    Yes, there is choice. You drive or not. It is not mandatory...


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    #164
    Jesus.
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭Jesus.


    Funny guy!


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    #165
    endacl
    Registered Users Posts: 22,240 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    Jesus. wrote: »
    Funny guy!

    And accurate!


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    #166
    creedp
    Registered Users Posts: 5,644 ✭✭✭creedp


    grogi wrote: »
    Yes, there is choice. You drive or not. It is not mandatory...

    Fairly simplistic view though isn't?

    All markets have that option e.g. I don't have to buy a loaf of bread if I think it is too expensive but the important difference between the bread 'free' market and the insurance 'free' market is that the bread manufacturer has some control over his cost base. If its too expensive to source wheat in Ireland then look elsewhere to source it cheaper. The insurance 'free' market is somewhat different as, in the main, legislation and the courts determine the cost base which can vary dramatically from case to case and something the insurance companies have no choice but to accept. Its a matter for Govt, if it was in the least bit interested in its citizens and the cost of insurance, to legislate for maximum awards for specific claims and also the legislate for more severe sanctions for fraudulent insurance claims. This would remove the 'playing God' role courts currently have which massively distorts the free insurance market.


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    #167
    Jesus.
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭Jesus.


    endacl wrote: »
    And accurate!

    Its not accurate at all


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    #168
    gctest50
    Registered Users Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    creedp wrote: »
    .......................This would remove the 'playing God' role courts currently have which massively distorts the free insurance market.

    Judges seem to be starting to get on top of it though :


    Devices limiting the speed their cars can travel at to 100 km/h are to be installed for a period of two years.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/district-court/five-with-passion-for-cars-caught-doing-doughnuts-in-kerry-1.2616459

    Gary Healy (19), of Foiladown, Clonkeen, Killarney, who was seen doing about 20 doughnuts on the night, and was a week later observed entering and exiting a roundabout at speed with the rear of the car sliding was ordered to pay €4,500 to the court poor box.


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    #169
    Roger Mellie Man on the Telly
    Registered Users Posts: 1,097 ✭✭✭Roger Mellie Man on the Telly




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