Kilkenny GAA Thread Part 2 **MOD NOTE POST 1***

swengall

Senior:

First RD:

Shamrocks v Inistioge - RI usually go well in Thomastown, Shamrocks could be more vulnerable here than say in competition. A few RI County U21s with a point to prove, a few key men with injuries for Shamrocks. Verdict: Rower

Danesfort v Comer - Both teams probably happy with drawing one another. Will be close one would think. RH CF battle could be key. Verdict: Danesfort

First RD Relegation:

Bridge v Mullinavat - 2 strong enough teams to be in the relegation position. Mvat have a stronger panel and BB down one player due to suspension. Vegas recently won Football, good win over Clara in Byrne Cup- generally going well. Verdict: Mullinvat.

Village v Martins - Village being brought a long way for this one, and will be under more pressure than Martins. St M have improved of late and fitness levels have come on. Verdict St Martins

Hawkeye6

JJs Left Hand wrote: »

The idea that you're a better KILKENNY GAA fan because you went to a camogie game is laughable. I was at an U14 game on Monday evening - there was a full round of games on. Were you there? Eh? Eh?

The truth be known I was NOT at an under-14 match on Monday night. I was at the Camogie homecoming. However, I was at an Under-14 match the middle of last week, will be at another this Saturday as well as Minor and Under-16 Please God. Was at Under-16 one on Tuesday, Under-12 tonight. BTW, there wasn't a full round of U14 on Monday night. 2 matches one of which was abandoned.

Note to oneself, this guy has issues of a chauvinist nature. Not worth derailing proper discussion for.

brookville

swengall wrote: »

Senior:

First RD:

Shamrocks v Inistioge - RI usually go well in Thomastown, Shamrocks could be more vulnerable here than say in competition. A few RI County U21s with a point to prove, a few key men with injuries for Shamrocks. Verdict: Rower

Danesfort v Comer - Both teams probably happy with drawing one another. Will be close one would think. RH CF battle could be key. Verdict: Danesfort

First RD Relegation:

Bridge v Mullinavat - 2 strong enough teams to be in the relegation position. Mvat have a stronger panel and BB down one player due to suspension. Vegas recently won Football, good win over Clara in Byrne Cup- generally going well. Verdict: Mullinvat.

Village v Martins - Village being brought a long way for this one, and will be under more pressure than Martins. St M have improved of late and fitness levels have come on. Verdict St Martins

Some good matches this wknd with the rower v shamrocks probably the standout and should bring a big crowd if it's a nice morning
Shamrocks were missing a few during the league will mick fennelly and company be back or can darragh joyce play for the rower?
The rower will fancy their chances but hard to back against shamrocks.

Danesfort are going well but so are comer who are scoring more this year I expect comer to shade this.
Vegas and the bridge will be tight but I think the vat have learnt from last year and might shade this.
I didnt expect the village to be in this situation but they should have too much for muackalee who'll relish this challenge but they'll probably find the scores difficult to come by

Realt Dearg Sec

Edit: Ugh, not my battle

Can anyone tell me when were the village last relegated? Don't ever remember it in my lifetime.

dobbs2210

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

Edit: Ugh, not my battle

Can anyone tell me when were the village last relegated? Don't ever remember it in my lifetime.

Never were. The longest serving senior team in club history in Kilkenny. Won Junior in 1955 and came straight into senior as Intermediate didn't exist. Have held senior status since then.

They have freewheeled into the situation they find themselves in this season. Last season wasn't much better. St. Martins beat Village by 5 or 6 points last season as well.

tbiggertycome

JJs Left Hand wrote: »

I'm 31. Noone has ever dropped their hurl in my "era". And my mother couldn't give a **** about sport so I doubt she'll be overly judgemental on my no show at the camogie All Ireland.

The idea that you're a better KILKENNY GAA fan because you went to a camogie game is laughable. I was at an U14 game on Monday evening - there was a full round of games on. Were you there? Eh? Eh? These are the FUTURE! Because a true KILKENNY GAA man would have been there. And if you were there watching then why are you only watching and not coaching these kids? Because a true KILKENNY GAA man would be coaching.

Etc etc etc

I'm assuming or at least hoping that most of this is with tongue firmly in cheek.

Hawkeye6 wrote: »

The truth be known I was NOT at an under-14 match on Monday night. I was at the Camogie homecoming. However, I was at an Under-14 match the middle of last week, will be at another this Saturday as well as Minor and Under-16 Please God. Was at Under-16 one on Tuesday, Under-12 tonight. BTW, there wasn't a full round of U14 on Monday night. 2 matches one of which was abandoned.

Note to oneself, this guy has issues of a chauvinist nature. Not worth derailing proper discussion for.

This one-up-manship is tiresome. Would you not agree that you don't have to go to every match in the county to be interested in the GAA? I'd love to go to tonnes of games, I can't go to lots because of work, family or just general life getting in the way. This doesn't mean I'm not interested. Because someone didn't go to an under 14 match or the Camogie or whatever game doesn't mean you aren't a supporter. Its actually this kind of attitude that puts many people off attending club games as they feel they'll be looked down on for their lack of involvement.

To be honest if someone just wants to follow the Kilkenny Senior hurling team then that should be encouraged. If they just follow the Camogie that's fine too, if they only go to club games or underage games, who cares as long as they go and are interested in the sport we love. Why do you have to attend every game going to be a great GAA person?:(

A mother or father, who brings their kid to underage games and never goes to a senior game, are more important than self important hurlers on the ditch in my view. The more people watch of the sport the more they will get involved and by and large it will grow their interest in other levels of the sport. I think it's the kind of narrow minded carry on that puts people off our or any sport. If your not FANatical your not any kind of a FAN which is BS :mad:

Rant over :cool:

JJs Left Hand

Yea I wasn't being serious. Whether or not someone goes to a game is absolutely irrelevant to me.

tbiggertycome

I'm fairly sure I've said this on here since last years AI but I just want to pop a version of it up here now the intercounty season is totally done. I looked at us last winter and suggested that we're entering a 2 year rebuilding process for a few reasons.
1. There is a gap of a few years where there was not a huge amount of talent coming through
2. We still had big leaders up to last years AI and it will take a while for lads to realise they now need to be the leaders
3. With Codys style of management it will take a few years for lads to get the message of how much work is involved in reaching the top level as he will never spell it out for lads.

So after year 1 where are we?
1. I personally don't think the young lads were given enough exposure to Senior level and so we're probably not where I would hope we would be this winter in terms of players development.
2. I didn't really see anyone new step up as a leader on the field maybe Buckley but that would be about it, If anything I think lads who had been doing a bit of leading fell back last year
3. This will take time to take effect for those who will make it.

Personally I think any young lad wanting to make it with Kilkenny should read Jackies book and I would say they should treat it like a bible and read it at least once a year. I think it's the perfect handbook to teach lads what needs to be done to make it physically and also and probably more importantly mentally.

The two things that pop out of the book for me and the thing that made our great team great were two fundamentals.
1. Players who were totally driven.
2. Total belief in their team mates and the confidence that if they were picked Cody/management believed in them too.

So what did we see this year from our teams at all levels?
I think they were honest and hard working by and large they have skill so what was missing?
Well I think our U21's and minors showed some drive but not enough. Our seniors were almost completely lacking in drive bar a few exceptions Buckley, TJ, Fogarty, M Fennelly, P Murphy, Lester, E Murphy. The issue with some of these in terms of getting a performance was the secound element and thats belief.

I think the management showed no belief or very little at best in the players. Their team selection day to day was totally in consistent and also they individually messed with lads heads and I think that lead to a team were lads had very little self belief and very little belief in their team mates and they felt they had no belief from the management. This lead to the disjointed displays we saw from proven players. The only good thing that might come out of it is that players eyes may have been opened to what needs to be done to get to the level (for the newer lads) and from a leadership point of view (for the established lads).

I think If the management settle on 11 to 12 players and play them consistently in their best positions and plug in players around them we'll actually do well next year.

There are 3 things I would like to see happen next year
1. Players finding/rediscovering their drive to be the best
2. Belief in each other from management down
3. a game plane (no matter how basic)

I can tell you that all of this can be achieved in a very short space of time. I've seen it develop in my own club over the last 9 months. We were embarrassed in the championship last year and yet this year we're a different proposition for anyone we will face in the next few months. All of this was brought about by a management team which demanded the players to challenge themselves to get better, They all have. The management have belief in all the players that stuck around and work with them all to improve their weaknesses individually and team weaknesses. They've developed a very simple but highly effective gameplan, actually more a set of basic actions to be carried out when possible. The gameplan for the players is simple a few things they need to do when the opportunities occur but also to how to make them occur. The gameplan is not complicated or so prescriptive that lads are straight jacketed into playing in limited way. If a club can do this much this well in 9 months the county with boundless more time and skilfull players can definitely achieve better things next year if done right. I think we have the hurlers but have they the drive and belief to challenge is the only thing holding us back. I don't expect us to win the AI next year (it would be nice) but I think we should be challenging and really pushing on to be in an AI by 2019.

The future is bright and it will definitely have Black and Amber in it.

brookville

tbiggertycome wrote: »

I'm fairly sure I've said this on here since last years AI but I just want to pop a version of it up here now the intercounty season is totally done. I looked at us last winter and suggested that we're entering a 2 year rebuilding process for a few reasons.
1. There is a gap of a few years where there was not a huge amount of talent coming through
2. We still had big leaders up to last years AI and it will take a while for lads to realise they now need to be the leaders
3. With Codys style of management it will take a few years for lads to get the message of how much work is involved in reaching the top level as he will never spell it out for lads.

So after year 1 where are we?
1. I personally don't think the young lads were given enough exposure to Senior level and so we're probably not where I would hope we would be this winter in terms of players development.
2. I didn't really see anyone new step up as a leader on the field maybe Buckley but that would be about it, If anything I think lads who had been doing a bit of leading fell back last year
3. This will take time to take effect for those who will make it.

Personally I think any young lad wanting to make it with Kilkenny should read Jackies book and I would say they should treat it like a bible and read it at least once a year. I think it's the perfect handbook to teach lads what needs to be done to make it physically and also and probably more importantly mentally.

The two things that pop out of the book for me and the thing that made our great team great were two fundamentals.
1. Players who were totally driven.
2. Total belief in their team mates and the confidence that if they were picked Cody/management believed in them too.

So what did we see this year from our teams at all levels?
I think they were honest and hard working by and large they have skill so what was missing?
Well I think our U21's and minors showed some drive but not enough. Our seniors were almost completely lacking in drive bar a few exceptions Buckley, TJ, Fogarty, M Fennelly, P Murphy, Lester, E Murphy. The issue with some of these in terms of getting a performance was the secound element and thats belief.

I think the management showed no belief or very little at best in the players. Their team selection day to day was totally in consistent and also they individually messed with lads heads and I think that lead to a team were lads had very little self belief and very little belief in their team mates and they felt they had no belief from the management. This lead to the disjointed displays we saw from proven players. The only good thing that might come out of it is that players eyes may have been opened to what needs to be done to get to the level (for the newer lads) and from a leadership point of view (for the established lads).

I think If the management settle on 11 to 12 players and play them consistently in their best positions and plug in players around them we'll actually do well next year.

There are 3 things I would like to see happen next year
1. Players finding/rediscovering their drive to be the best
2. Belief in each other from management down
3. a game plane (no matter how basic)

I can tell you that all of this can be achieved in a very short space of time. I've seen it develop in my own club over the last 9 months. We were embarrassed in the championship last year and yet this year we're a different proposition for anyone we will face in the next few months. All of this was brought about by a management team which demanded the players to challenge themselves to get better, They all have. The management have belief in all the players that stuck around and work with them all to improve their weaknesses individually and team weaknesses. They've developed a very simple but highly effective gameplan, actually more a set of basic actions to be carried out when possible. The gameplan for the players is simple a few things they need to do when the opportunities occur but also to how to make them occur. The gameplan is not complicated or so prescriptive that lads are straight jacketed into playing in limited way. If a club can do this much this well in 9 months the county with boundless more time and skilfull players can definitely achieve better things next year if done right. I think we have the hurlers but have they the drive and belief to challenge is the only thing holding us back. I don't expect us to win the AI next year (it would be nice) but I think we should be challenging and really pushing on to be in an AI by 2019.

The future is bright and it will definitely have Black and Amber in it.

Good post hopefully we have a good league that can give us confidence going into the summer and some stability in the team we need to settle on few central positions if we can find a number 3 and move padraig out to his best position at 5.fogarty back to mf and a few forwards to add competion there's still a good core of players to compete

Motivator

dastardly00 wrote: »

I actually feel sorry for the chap at this stage... he clearly seems to have some issues...

Can I not ask a serious question about your fearless leader? Are you not allowed speak ill of the main man?

Surely the most ardent Kilkenny fan must be mystified by his decision to stay on? He's gotten all he can out of the players - there doesn't seem to be anyone coming through that wojld strike fear in to opponents such as a Shefflin, R. Hogan or Reid.

Was taking the piss with the last line of the original post but I was being serious with my summary of things. I think he's done, finished. But it has more to do with the players, current and potential than he himself. In my mind, 6 or 7 of the players that played against Waterford aren't on the same planet as those who filled those positions at the back end of the last decade.

Realt Dearg Sec

I think what mystifies us is your ongoing preoccupation with Kilkenny. Don't worry it's not just you, it's quite common among Waterford fans. I mean, that kind of Stockholm syndrome is understandable when you've had so little success compared with your neighbours, so I get why it would be tempting to go putting the boot in, but it just seems like ye haven't gotten over the inferiority complex, as demonstrated by your attempts to troll this thread in the last couple of months, before ye shat the course again in September.

Motivator

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

I think what mystifies us is your ongoing preoccupation with Kilkenny. Don't worry it's not just you, it's quite common among Waterford fans. I mean, that kind of Stockholm syndrome is understandable when you've had so little success compared with your neighbours, so I get why it would be tempting to go putting the boot in, but it just seems like ye haven't gotten over the inferiority complex, as demonstrated by your attempts to troll this thread in the last couple of months, before ye shat the course again in September.

You're obviously still bitter after Waterford embarrassed Kilkenny down in Thurles.

Another reason I'm surprised Cody stayed on is that he might have to hide behind the linesman again the next time they meet Waterford. Hiding, mouthing and then cowardly pushing a poor linesman when McGrath stood up to him on the line. Cody was terrified of Derek and Dan.

Hope you boys weren't too bored for the summer after we made a show of ye in early July 😆

Realt Dearg Sec

Motivator wrote: »

You're obviously still bitter after Waterford embarrassed Kilkenny down in Thurles.

Another reason I'm surprised Cody stayed on is that he might have to hide behind the linesman again the next time they meet Waterford. Hiding, mouthing and then cowardly pushing a poor linesman when McGrath stood up to him on the line. Cody was terrified of Derek and Dan.

Hope you boys weren't too bored for the summer after we made a show of ye in early July ��

Not bitter at all, actually, I was supporting Waterford. Most KK people I know were supporting ye, because we're not obsessed with ye. But you're right, we probably are bitter at all the success ye nearly had this year. We'll never know the feeling of almost winning that is so deeply ingrained in the hurling culture of Waterford. And we are, of course, massively bitter about all the silverware that ye got quite close to winning. I'm sure Cody is very intimidated by all the All Ireland medals Derek and Dan dream of one day possessing.

Gentleman Off The Pitch

Motivator wrote: »

You're obviously still bitter after Waterford embarrassed Kilkenny down in Thurles.

Another reason I'm surprised Cody stayed on is that he might have to hide behind the linesman again the next time they meet Waterford. Hiding, mouthing and then cowardly pushing a poor linesman when McGrath stood up to him on the line. Cody was terrified of Derek and Dan.

Hope you boys weren't too bored for the summer after we made a show of ye in early July ��

You're going to be very embarrassed looking back on a lot of your posts when you grow up

bruschi

Christ, a Waterford lad talking about a team being embarrassed in a Kilkenny v Waterford game, but the 08 final is not the game he's talking about!

Being from wexford, we've been embarrassed enough times over the last few years, so being selfish, I'm delighted to see Kilkenny in this 'drought'. But it still wouldn't lead me to gloat over beating them this year. Twice in fact.

Motivator

bruschi wrote: »

Christ, a Waterford lad talking about a team being embarrassed in a Kilkenny v Waterford game, but the 08 final is not the game he's talking about!

Being from wexford, we've been embarrassed enough times over the last few years, so being selfish, I'm delighted to see Kilkenny in this 'drought'. But it still wouldn't lead me to gloat over beating them this year. Twice in fact.

Ssssssoak it in maaaaaan

buzzinfly83

Waterford man here. Huge respect for Kilkenny hurling and all the achievements. Whilst I would be happy for Waterford to win just one, I can't understand the silly comments or the gloating over winning one game. If anything would look to the success ye have had as something to be admired.

Realt Dearg Sec

buzzinfly83 wrote: »

Waterford man here. Huge respect for Kilkenny hurling and all the achievements. Whilst I would be happy for Waterford to win just one, I can't understand the silly comments or the gloating over winning one game. If anything would look to the success ye have had as something to be admired.

Sorry lad I don't mean to be sounding too high and mighty, motivators posts really invited the easy response. Like I said I supported Waterford in the final (actually kind of wanted a draw to get another big match out of the season), would be delighted if ye won one to reflect the great players that have been and in some cases still are on the team. Be interesting to see if ye can push on next year or the year after.

Amprodude

Motivator wrote: »

Can I not ask a serious question about your fearless leader? Are you not allowed speak ill of the main man?

Surely the most ardent Kilkenny fan must be mystified by his decision to stay on? He's gotten all he can out of the players - there doesn't seem to be anyone coming through that wojld strike fear in to opponents such as a Shefflin, R. Hogan or Reid.

Was taking the piss with the last line of the original post but I was being serious with my summary of things. I think he's done, finished. But it has more to do with the players, current and potential than he himself. In my mind, 6 or 7 of the players that played against Waterford aren't on the same planet as those who filled those positions at the back end of the last decade.

Amazing how Cody has stayed on but I think also he is finished and will probably turn out like Micky Harte in his future years of management and nothing to deliver with the current crop of players . Cody has been blessed with great players in the past but this present kilkenny team are nowhere as good as those of the last decade. No team will fear playing them. It's not looking good either that the minors and u21s are not winning and even struggling in Leinster. Hurling could be bleak in Kilkenny for a short while.

greenspurs

Amprodude wrote: »

Amazing how Cody has stayed on but I think also he is finished and will probably turn out like Micky Harte in his future years of management and nothing to deliver with the current crop of players . Cody has been blessed with great players in the past but this present kilkenny team are nowhere as good as those of the last decade. No team will fear playing them. It's not looking good either that the minors and u21s are not winning and even struggling in Leinster. Hurling could be bleak in Kilkenny for a short while.

I would look on Brian Cody staying on as his biggest challenge . Maybe the man sees the challenge is something he relishes?
He took over Kilkenny at a time in 98 , when Kilkenny had won 2 AllIrelands (only?) in 15 years (92+93) , and it took him until 2000 to win it.
So maybe he looks at it as a greater challenge to guide a team in transition back to the top , than to guide a team of brilliant hurlers to All Irelands.
Whatever people say , hes a fighter , and wouldnt shirk a challenge!

greenspurs

Motivator wrote: »

Ssssssoak it in maaaaaan

Would you ever go away yaa eejit.... You are embarrassing your county with your childish crap.....
Stop displaying your inferiority complex on the internet
60 years, tick tock...... 2008 etc, if you want us to start on you ??

brookville

greenspurs wrote: »

I would look on Brian Cody staying on as his biggest challenge . Maybe the man sees the challenge is something he relishes?
He took over Kilkenny at a time in 98 , when Kilkenny had won 2 AllIrelands (only?) in 15 years (92+93) , and it took him until 2000 to win it.
So maybe he looks at it as a greater challenge to guide a team in transition back to the top , than to guide a team of brilliant hurlers to All Irelands.
Whatever people say , hes a fighter , and wouldnt shirk a challenge!

His first year was 99 beaten by cork by a point won then in 00.
No doubt this is a big challenge to fill a few holes left by unbelievable hurlers we'll probably not see for a long time
jj,tommy,larkin,henry,power,eddie to name but a few.they don't exactly grow on trees they were exceptional individuals.
The easiest thing to do was leave after the tipp all Ireland in 14 when 5 lads retired knowing the replacements weren't there but he got another all Ireland in 15 with a much weaker panel than the previous year.
We were beaten by a much better team in the 16 final while we huffed and puffed all this year and showed very little form all year the writing was on the wall this spring that we could have a short summer
The county board have rubber stamped the management team earlier so id expect work to start very soon trying to plug the holes and cull any dead wood on the panel and unearth a few new lads

dubcat51

Lost in xtra time and you call that embarassed.go back and hide under your blanket.

dubcat51

A record never to be broken.waterford in 08 took 45 minutes to score from play.now thats what I call embarassed.

gobo99

Motivator wrote: »

Kilkenny are finished lads, deal with it.

Beaten by a piss poor Wexford team and then humiliated by Waterford.

You know things are bad for Kilkenny when all of Waterford are laughing at you!

Go to bed, you're drunk.

Realt Dearg Sec

Motivator wrote: »

Kilkenny are finished lads, deal with it.

Beaten by a piss poor Wexford team and then humiliated by Waterford.

You know things are bad for Kilkenny when all of Waterford are laughing at you!

You know things are bad for Motivator when all of Waterford are apologising for you!

suirway

Predictions;
Senior champions O'Loughlins
Intermediate - Ballyragget
Junior - Emeralds

kksaints

Motivator wrote: »

Kilkenny are finished lads, deal with it.

Beaten by a piss poor Wexford team and then humiliated by Waterford.

You know things are bad for Kilkenny when all of Waterford are laughing at you!

Then we look at the All-Ireland winners list and laugh at Waterford's "mighty" total of two wins and the length of time since their last one.

blackcard

suirway wrote: »

Predictions;
Senior champions O'Loughlins
Intermediate - Ballyragget
Junior - Emeralds

Dicksboro, Tullaroan, Emeralds

WhatsGoingOn2

If everyone stops replying, he'll go away eventually.
Comer beat Danesfort by 9 points