General secretary of the IFA on a possible €400,000 salary-Read mod note in post 2734

keep going

alps wrote: »

I just get upset when I see the word bonus...

Does this "bonus" form the make up of most employees nowadays, or just the CS, management, financial services type jobs....?

I just can't make out if I hire a guy to milk the cows....he gets €50 for the milking plus another €20 if he actually finishes the milking.....

Ffs....if you get paid to do a job..do it

If you're on a salary off 200k to run an organisation. ..run it...
If it takes 40hrs or 80hrs or 120 hrs per week to do...that's your baby...do it.....

Just a bonus rant..forgive me

its funny but im a huge fan of bonuses but the issue is setting the right criteria and mechanism for acheiving the bonus. people have to have an aim and something to drive to.

limo_100

keep going wrote: »

its funny but im a huge fan of bonuses but the issue is setting the right criteria and mechanism for acheiving the bonus. people have to have an aim and something to drive to.

I would assume that the the IFA never paid out any bonuses in fairness as they never achieved anything

Panch18

limo_100 wrote: »

Thats noting to do with the IFA they didn't want us young farmers to gain. Just because I happened to fall into the right age bracket this doesn't mean I cant have an opinion?? I want them go do something instead of a hole lot of noting picking up salaries

Ah here, have a word with yourself

You were eligible for entitlements, you got entitlements, what exactly is your problem

This **** about big farmer talk is only **** talk, and you getting entitlements on 150 acres. You do know that falls into the big farmer category don't you

red bull

Never a fan of Pat Smyth. As director of organisation he was a money grabber for the association with increased levies and membership fees. Unfortunately delivery of services to farmers did not coincide. Michael Berkery had the well being of farmers at heart, something Pat Smyth did not understand it was allways association funds

limo_100

Panch18 wrote: »

Ah here, have a word with yourself

You were eligible for entitlements, you got entitlements, what exactly is your problem

This **** about big farmer talk is only **** talk, and you getting entitlements on 150 acres. You do know that falls into the big farmer category don't you

I worked hard to get it to were it is we started out wit 0acres in 1990 little by little with hard graft and time and off farm enterprises yes we have a fairly big place now, Yes I got entitlements but no thanks to the IFA they lobbied for the big man to keep his entitlements as he was the best and more efficient farmer they didn't care about me or any of the young farmers, I also depend on beef as a beef farmer do you no that?? last year the €350 price gap with the UK has scandalous they were gona do this and do that and the gap would never happen again and low and behold its at €340 now but I dont here them saying to much about that now there too busy trying to safe there own jobs,

whelan2

adam14 wrote: »

Derek Deane is some man. It takes guts to do what he did. Downey has to go too.

Was it not con lucey who mentioned this on his retirement and derek Deane was just following through?

whelan2

red bull wrote: »

Never a fan of Pat Smyth. As director of organisation he was a money grabber for the association with increased levies and membership fees. Unfortunately delivery of services to farmers did not coincide. Michael Berkery had the well being of farmers at heart, something Pat Smyth did not understand it was allways association funds

I asked this before was pat Smyth put straight in on the same salary as Berkery was on?

EarlyHead

I've had meetings and run ins with both Berkery and Smith over the last 20 years and from my experience the one thing about Smith is that he would at least be blatant and forthright in a meeting or discussion, to the point of confrontation. I always felt Berkery would be smiling at you while stabbing you in the back. I don't know if it's a factor but is Smith also the Chief Exec of the telcom company they have? Should be an interesting couple of days and I still don't understand why he resigned without confirmation or denial of the salary. Whoever is advising them on PR and media might need to look at their renumeration to.

kowtow

A salary of 450k is appropriate for a risk position, with a body of shareholders ready to fire a failed incumbent at a moments notice.

It is not justified for a quango funded by levy whose executives think chewing cocktail sausages in Brussels and keeping in with 'the politicians' qualifies as actual work. It doesn't.

If the rest of the board shares that culture they should resign immediately.

rangler1

EarlyHead wrote: »

I've had meetings and run ins with both Berkery and Smith over the last 20 years and from my experience the one thing about Smith is that he would at least be blatant and forthright in a meeting or discussion, to the point of confrontation. I always felt Berkery would be smiling at you while stabbing you in the back. I don't know if it's a factor but is Smith also the Chief Exec of the telcom company they have? Should be an interesting couple of days and I still don't understand why he resigned without confirmation or denial of the salary. Whoever is advising them on PR and media might need to look at their renumeration to.

I told Pat one day he was more like Micheal o Leary than Micheal Berkery, he was always business minded and would drive on regardless as Director of Organisation, the electricity and phone deals were his idea and bring in a lot of money to the association.

frazzledhome

kowtow wrote: »

A salary of 450k is appropriate for a risk position, with a body of shareholders ready to fire a failed incumbent at a moments notice.

It is not justified for a quango funded by levy whose executives think chewing cocktail sausages in Brussels and keeping in with 'the politicians' qualifies as actual work. It doesn't.

If the rest of the board shares that culture they should resign immediately.

Nailed it

frazzledhome

kowtow wrote: »

A salary of 450k is appropriate for a risk position, with a body of shareholders ready to fire a failed incumbent at a moments notice.

It is not justified for a quango funded by levy whose executives think chewing cocktail sausages in Brussels and keeping in with 'the politicians' qualifies as actual work. It doesn't.

If the rest of the board shares that culture they should resign immediately.

Nailed it

rangler1

kowtow wrote: »

A salary of 450k is appropriate for a risk position, with a body of shareholders ready to fire a failed incumbent at a moments notice.

It is not justified for a quango funded by levy whose executives think chewing cocktail sausages in Brussels and keeping in with 'the politicians' qualifies as actual work. It doesn't.

If the rest of the board shares that culture they should resign immediately.

What else does a lobby organisation do, it was the tactic of teaming up with other politicians/organisations in Brussels that got Ciolos idea of the new CAP thrown out. IFA was a lone voice at that but bit by bit they got others on board and then had to get coveney on side as well.
It's alright heckling from the side but calling for resignations when you're prepared to do feck all yourself is a bit of a joke

Sam Kade

I was just thinking of this man as I read my milk statement and saw where ifa took a slice of my payment, I must put a stop to that. The icmsa also took a piece of the action even though I haven't heard from them in years :mad:

whelan2

rangler1 wrote: »

I told Pat one day he was more like Micheal o Leary than Micheal Berkery, he was always business minded and would drive on regardless as Director of Organisation, the electricity and phone deals were his idea and bring in a lot of money to the association.

Pat smyth was a great man , not worth a salary twicwe that of the taoiseach though. On the ifa deals , Billy up the road can go to bord gais and get 10% off their electricity. So no real saving there-airtricity are giving a 20% discount which is much better. With the buying power ifa members would have a better deal could be gotten elsewhere. On vodafone , half the country cant get coverage with them and the phone /broadband package can be gotten cheaper elsewhere.

Username John

alps wrote: »

I just get upset when I see the word bonus...

Does this "bonus" form the make up of most employees nowadays, or just the CS, management, financial services type jobs....?

I just can't make out if I hire a guy to milk the cows....he gets €50 for the milking plus another €20 if he actually finishes the milking.....

Ffs....if you get paid to do a job..do it

If you're on a salary off 200k to run an organisation. ..run it...
If it takes 40hrs or 80hrs or 120 hrs per week to do...that's your baby...do it.....

Just a bonus rant..forgive me

A bonus would figure into a lot of jobs nowdays I think...

If you're hired to do a job, and after 12 months of doing it, you have made improvements so now it takes less time / resources / money to do the same job - then should you not be rewarded?

But, as was said - its the critieria for when the bonus gets paid, thats key...

whelan2

rangler1 wrote: »

What else does a lobby organisation do, it was the tactic of teaming up with other politicians/organisations in Brussels that got Ciolos idea of the new CAP thrown out. IFA was a lone voice at that but bit by bit they got others on board and then had to get coveney on side as well.
It's alright heckling from the side but calling for resignations when you're prepared to do feck all yourself is a bit of a joke

We have had this discussion a million times before, farming has changed. We all forget it was the farm family that kept the home farms going when daddy or who ever was off lobbying for the ifa, the whole home farm scene has changed . Most wives/ kids wouldnt know were to go to to check something in the yard- and thats their own business- People do not have the time and can not afford to pay for outside help to cover them when they are away

kowtow

rangler1 wrote: »

What else does a lobby organisation do, it was the tactic of teaming up with other politicians/organisations in Brussels that got Ciolos idea of the new CAP thrown out. IFA was a lone voice at that but bit by bit they got others on board and then had to get coveney on side as well.
It's alright heckling from the side but calling for resignations when you're prepared to do feck all yourself is a bit of a joke

Who says I'm prepared to do feck all?

Irish Farmers have been sold a line that their future depends on inheritance, entitlement, and politics and that they are no more than passengers without any control of their own businesses. To add insult to injury, while cutting their own operations to the bone, they are expected to fund a layer of politicians each of whom claims to be the "only man" to get them the "deal they need".

This is snake oil and politicking of the worst kind, a distraction from the actual business of farming which does none of us (nor the next generation) a service.

Fire the lot of them and start again with people who realise that farming is, and always has been, about growing great food and getting it to market.

boggerman1

thank god i cancelled my membership and the taking of the levies by the ifa a few yrs ago.it was always the big guys organisation and a stepping stone to getting to the dail.anyone serious about farming nowadays hasn't time to be on the road the whole time at meetings or organising photo ops.its fine for them older lads as they probably had some fool at home to keep things ticking over

rangler1

whelan2 wrote: »

We have had this discussion a million times before, farming has changed. We all forget it was the farm family that kept the home farms going when daddy or who ever was off lobbying for the ifa, the whole home farm scene has changed . Most wives/ kids wouldnt know were to go to to check something in the yard- and thats their own business- People do not have the time and can not afford to pay for outside help to cover them when they are away

I never said phone/electricity deals were good or bad....I said it brings a lot of money into the association, which is what it was set up for,
IFA is based on voluntary input, if I don't bother, then someone else has to.
If everyone that works for the organisation around the country was paid properly the whole organisation would have to be reorganised and I know that farmers wouldn't pay for it. Micheal Berkery always claimed that voluntary officers were compensated for about third of their input, if they claimed it.
I didn't claim all my expenses because 1. I don't need it and 2 I've got back many many times what've put into it.
Smith was stupid to resign if he only got the package he was offered, deans probably happy but he hasn't got the people responsible, all he had it in for was pat Smith. O Cuiv got it right last night, it wasn't smiths problem
Maybe it is time to close the doors, politicians won't be sorry, they have lots of other calls for funding and tax concessions

whelan2

The ifa 60th do was on a week or 2 ago in Louth , Mr Downey got up and spoke and never mentioned milk price once in his speech. This is the main topic on every dairy farmers mind. To answer your last post , I am all too aware of the unpaid hours put in by ifa officers, what needs to change though to make the ifa work , as at the moment it is sinking fast

rangler1

whelan2 wrote: »

The ifa 60th do was on a week or 2 ago in Louth , Mr Downey got up and spoke and never mentioned milk price once in his speech. This is the main topic on every dairy farmers mind. To answer your last post , I am all too aware of the unpaid hours put in by ifa officers, what needs to change though to make the ifa work , as at the moment it is sinking fast

As is farming and farm incomes.
The people that are in positions seemingly aren't good enough for you and no one else will get off their backsides so it's catch 22.....let her sink

whelan2

rangler1 wrote: »

As is farming and farm incomes.
The people that are in positions seemingly aren't good enough for you and no one else will get off their backsides so it's catch 22.....let her sink

????????? I am asking you what you would do to improve things?

Farmer Ed

Whats the difference between IFA and FIFA? One letter as far as I can see.
This year a farmer friend of mine ended up in hospital with what he described as a big muscle in his back that was pressing on a nerve. Now he said the ironic thing was that this big muscle was meant to be protecting him but was in fact causing him a lot of pain. He could not remember the latin name of the of this muscle but for ease of memory we gave it the new medical name. The IFA muscle.

rangler1

whelan2 wrote: »

????????? I am asking you what you would do to improve things?

Milk price, beef price, it's the market, don't waste peoples time chasing it.
If farmers want an organisation they have to get involved instead of hurling abuse. If you're in any voluntary organisation and start to criticise the committee, you don't be long being told to get the finger out and work on the committee,
When important issues come up, if you're not involved how do people expect to be represented, hence the hill committee....what possible interest would I have in it if the HC aren't prepared to drive on the issues, yet you see the way we're being blamed. I sat beside the chairman of the HC in meetings for a year and he never opened his mouth, yet you see the sh...that goes on here.
It's not going to be easy and I'm glad to be away from it

rangler1

Farmer Ed wrote: »

Whats the difference between IFA and FIFA? One letter as far as I can see.
This year a farmer friend of mine ended up in hospital with what he described as a big muscle in his back that was pressing on a nerve. Now he said the ironic thing was that this big muscle was meant to be protecting him but was in fact causing him a lot of pain. He could not remember the latin name of the of this muscle but for ease of memory we gave it the new medical name. The IFA muscle.

and you expect other farmers to work for you when you're spewing that rubbish for rubbish expenses.....get a life.
Sad little farmers needn't think they're going to get off on using other farmers as cannon fodder just cos those sad little farmers can't make it in the real world.
when I was breeding pedigree rams, if I kept too many and had to take bad prices to get rid.......wasn't I slow that I didn't blame IFA for my bad management like you're doing. Only difference was that I'd always be producing what the customer wanted

Nettleman

Rangler, youve been on here last night and again this morning after having a full inspection this week. Take a break man, as IFA needs to defend itself today, one man cant do it by himself.
This organisation is in a bad way imo, & they lack the courage to do what needs to be done, maybe they will prove me wrong. Is there any chatter on who the successor will be. btw, CAN WE CHANGE THE THREAD TITLE TO €450,000+ ?

kowtow

rangler1 wrote: »

Only difference was that I'd always be producing what the customer wanted

If we were producing what the customer wanted then we would hardly need the IFA.

So why pay them?

Farmer Ed

rangler1 wrote: »

and you expect other farmers to work for you when you're spewing that rubbish for rubbish expenses.....get a life.
Sad little farmers needn't think they're going to get off on using other farmers as cannon fodder just cos those sad little farmers can't make it in the real world.
when I was breeding pedigree rams, if I kept too many and had to take bad prices to get rid.......wasn't I slow that I didn't blame IFA for my bad management like you're doing. Only difference was that I'd always be producing what the customer wanted

Ranger I was very much involved in putting forward a motion over two years ago to a CoOp SGM. If passed it would have forced the Co Op to implement something that has been a fictional IFA policy for decades, Namely independent milk testing. I personally had gone to a lot of trouble getting a quote from a lab and I was put forward a motion that would see independent milk testing introduced in the Co Op in a matter of weeks.Can you guess who were the first two people to stand up to oppose the motion? You'll never guess. The then IFA national chairman of the liquid milk committee and was quickly followed by a county chairman. Now forgive me but how in that particular situation did IFA not cause farmers pain? The only thing I can think of is they were more concerned with the money the Co Op was collecting for them and their own political careers than representing farmers. But please don't accuse me of not trying to do anything to better farmers incomes. I have tried and found the IFA to be one of the main obstacles.

Farmer Ed

kowtow wrote: »

If we were producing what the customer wanted then we would hardly need the IFA.

So why pay them?

I thought I stopped paying them a good while back when the type of thing that has become public knowledge this week started to become clear to me.
However I was shocked to find out just a few weeks ago that the EIF levy that the marts collect goes to IFA ICMSA and Macra. Needless to say I'll be stopping that also.