Beggars

diusmr8a504cvk

What's your attitude towards beggars/homeless people on the streets? Has there ever been an instance where you've been upset by seeing them on the streets?

I went on a school trip to London last September, we were walking down the street to get to the tube late at night if I recall and on the other side of the street there was a man and a woman by the roller door of a shop and were both on their knees, hugging each other for warmth while one blanket was wrapped around them. It upset really upset me at the time but I put it out of mind as I didn't want it to affect my trip. It wasn't until I got home a few days later when I dwelled on it and realised how sad it was and that these two, who I assumed were a couple, were sticking with each other through thick and thin.

Links234

Go easy on them, they can't be choosers, or so I'm told...

zcorpian88

Not a big fan of the Romanian ones, I hear all sorts about them and a lot have more money than you and I.

Did witness something mad a few years ago, was sitting outside a pub having a coffee and there was a Romanian beggar on the pedestrianized street in town, a guy I guessed by the look of him was the same nationality gets out of a Mercedes jeep, big enough petrol guzzling yoke and was new enough looking and wearing what looked to be snake skin boots that looked quite flashy. Anyway he approaches the beggar, takes the cup of change off her and walks back to his jeep gets in and drives off quickly.

Wonder how much change you need to buy a Merc jeep??

Grandeeod

Caiden Beautiful Orangutan wrote: »

What's your attitude towards beggars/homeless people on the streets? Has there ever been an instance where you've been upset by seeing them on the streets?

I went on a school trip to London last September, we were walking down the street to get to the tube late at night if I recall and on the other side of the street there was a man and a woman by the roller door of a shop and were both on their knees, hugging each other for warmth while one blanket was wrapped around them. It upset really upset me at the time but I put it out of mind as I didn't want it to affect my trip. It wasn't until I got home a few days later when I dwelled on it and realised how sad it was and that these two, who I assumed were a couple, were sticking with each other through thick and thin.

The bold bit is where your problem really lies.

diusmr8a504cvk

Elaborate please? Would you want to have sadness and the thought of that hanging over you on a holiday?

MightyMandarin

Caiden Beautiful Orangutan wrote: »

Elaborate please? Would you want to have sadness and the thought of that hanging over you on a holiday?

I think they mean that if you really cared, you would've done something if even just a small gesture like offering them some food or something. Yet despite you being 'upset', you thought that your trip was more important than even just thinking about them.

Not sending you on a guilt trip or anything, but if you cared as much as you say you do, you would've done more than just ignore the thought of them until you were done enjoying your school trip.

Mint Aero

Beggars belief

rubadub

zcorpian88 wrote: »

Not a big fan of the Romanian ones, I hear all sorts about them and a lot have more money than you and I.

+1, I would be dubious about many. And not just foreign ones, there was an irish lad outside stephens green with no shoes around winter time, trying to appear really hard up. I heard someone offered to buy him runners and he either said no thanks, or a full on go fcuk off.

Just like you hear of them begging for money for food, but do not bother their hole to do this outside a shop -where they are likely to get people to actually buy them food -people who might be wary about where the money is going. I do not believe for a second they are unaware that many people would be wary.

Grandeeod

Caiden Beautiful Orangutan wrote: »

Elaborate please? Would you want to have sadness and the thought of that hanging over you on a holiday?

If I really cared...yes.

It upset you at the time but you put it out of your mind for the sake of your holiday. That says a lot about your attitude towards it. Once the holiday was over, you start thinking about it again. Those people could be dead by now. It was a long winter. They could be high as **** on heroine and guilty of many muggings. Who knows. But ultimately your initial sympathy for these people lead to nothing more than a random post on the internet 10 months later.

Did I elaborate enough?

I think what he meant was that obviously it hit home, but it wasn't until he was home from the trip! We all have moments of reflection and times we wish we did or said something? I think what he is asking is what you think of begets, not, what do you think of my question!? So calm down Sherlock, let's just give our own opinion on beggars!

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

Would never give cash but if someone asks me for money I'll offer to buy them tea or food if I have enough spare cash. I was genuinely surprised how many "homeless" people refused food.
Only last Saturday I was stopped at a train station by a well dressed/clean man (junkie) who asked for 2 euro for a hostel and food because hostels won't feed him, apparently. I said I haven't got change, but if you're hungry I'll get you food. "Please, I just need the money for a hostel, even a fiver" he figured if I was going to spend the money on food he'd rather the cash. Manipulative.

Had an encounter with some other man nearby work who said he needed tea with 10 sugars because he was diabetic. I bought him a bar of chocolate incase he needed to bring his blood sugars up again and he was like aw no I can't eat that I need 4.50 for my insulin, I can't eat until I get that. I felt guilty for ages after walking off from him but looking back, obviously he was playing me.

kneemos

Caiden Beautiful Orangutan wrote: »

Elaborate please? Would you want to have sadness and the thought of that hanging over you on a holiday?

Ignore them.The important thing is that you were thinking about it.

johnnyskeleton

They cant all be lumped in together. Some people will beg in an aggressive manner such that people feel obliged to give them.money to get rid of them.

Another time a friend of mine was being threatened on the street by a drunk and a homeless man came up and got rid of the drunk for her!

Its sad that people have to beg, but my mams advice was to give money to the simon community rather than directly to beggars, and that seems to be the least worst option most of the time.

MightyMandarin

kneemos wrote: »

Ignore them.The important thing is that you were thinking about it.

Is it really? It's good that he felt sorry for them, but if he really felt upset, he would've made some sort of gesture or offer to them. At least then he could go on with his trip knowing that he at least tried to better the day of someone less fortunate than them.

syklops

There was a spate of posts on facebook, written by famous celebs speaking about the importance of "Just spending a little time with" or "sparing just a couple of euros or dollars" and "treating them like humans", etc. etc.

Thats all and well and good, but I regularly walk from St Stephens Green to Abbey Street. If I spent just a moment of my time with each homeless person I met, and parted with only a euro to each, I'd be down about 30 euros a day, and my journey home would be quite a bit longer.

That said, there was a guy who used to beg around Donnybrook a few years ago. I regularly bought him a sandwich or a cup of tea. He was always sober and friendly and was genuinely pleased with whatever I gave him.

ArtSmart

Mint Aero wrote: »

Beggars belief

damn it. That's both choosers and belief gone.

I'm outta ideas now.

zcorpian88

rubadub wrote: »

+1, I would be dubious about many. And not just foreign ones, there was an irish lad outside stephens green with no shoes around winter time, trying to appear really hard up. I heard someone offered to buy him runners and he either said no thanks, or a full on go fcuk off.

Just like you hear of them begging for money for food, but do not bother their hole to do this outside a shop -where they are likely to get people to actually buy them food -people who might be wary about where the money is going. I do not believe for a second they are unaware that many people would be wary.

Well in Dublin it's could be a given that they might use the money for no good for themselves, but then again with the housing crisis there are more people out on the street than there should be so you have to bear that in mind too. You have to use kind of your own judgement, I don't give anything to ones that bother you when you're in a hurry or the ones that hang around Busaras when you're catching a bus. One thing I do notice is they don't really do it outside shops, but I'd imagine they would be ushered away by the owner. I don't see too much begging in my area because it's not particularly urban like Dublin or Cork where you would see more of that. I'd only see the few Romanian ones with a cup mumbling jibberish at people passing by.

I was in Edinburgh last year on a holiday, and there was a homeless man outside a Tesco over there, looked like a genuine down on his luck local man, went in and I bought myself a bite to eat, and got him a sandwich, coke and a bag of crisps, he was delighted with it, had a small chat with him and all.

kneemos

MightyMandarin wrote: »

Is it really? It's good that he felt sorry for them, but if he really felt upset, he would've made some sort of gesture or offer to them. At least then he could go on with his trip knowing that he at least tried to better the day of someone less fortunate than them.

Not many people give them a second thought once they're out of sight.
Which is better,throwing a couple of quid and forgetting about it or having genuine concern?

Lau2976

kneemos wrote: »

Not many people give them a second thought once they're out of sight.
Which is better,throwing a couple of quid and forgetting about it or having genuine concern?

Genuine concern isn't going to feed them or keep them warm.

MightyMandarin

kneemos wrote: »

Not many people give them a second thought once they're out of sight.
Which is better,throwing a couple of quid and forgetting about it or having genuine concern?

If you're the homeless couple which is better, being offered food or money by a stranger or unknowingly being the subject of 'genuine concern', yet not being helped in any way whatsoever?

I know 99% of people pass by without a thought for them, but this notion of feeling really upset and acting concerned for their welfare, yet doing f*ck all about it, is just laughable.

I'll admit I pass dozens of beggars and homeless people on the street every time I'm in town, but I'm not making some sob-story about feeling concerned for them.

frostyjacks

I'd like to see the Gardaí arrest them instead of just shooing them on to beg somewhere else.

diusmr8a504cvk

In hindsight I wish I'd done something but the fact that we were in a rush for the tube and it was late at night (It was 23:30) meant I probably couldn't if I wanted to. Thanks to all the posters who saw it fit to question my story and concern rather than answering the question and giving your opinion on beggars.

Bubbaclaus

Beats me how someone can reach the stage of genuine homeless beggar in Ireland, given the generous welfare available.

MightyMandarin

Caiden Beautiful Orangutan wrote: »

In hindsight I wish I'd done something but the fact that we were in a rush for the tube and it was late at night (It was 23:30) meant I probably couldn't if I wanted to. Thanks to all the posters who saw it fit to question my story and concern rather than answering the question and giving your opinion on beggars.

Then why bother telling this story in the OP? Couldn't just ask people for their opinions on beggars without a story, no?

MightyMandarin

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Beats me how someone can reach the stage of genuine homeless beggar in Ireland, given the generous welfare available.

Afaik in order to receive the dole, you need a permanent address, which a lot of people around Dublin can't afford due to the sky-high rents around the city. It's a toxic cycle people get put into and it can affect a lot of people very quickly without warning.

NachoBusiness

I don't mind them if 1) they don't hog landmarks (I despise this and the ones that do this, tend to not be homeless at all) and 2) don't give me a bs story and fake cry. Otherwise though I don't mind them and often give them a euro or so, or ask them if they want food bought.

In saying that though, food is not hard to come buy for the homeless as there are at least half a dozen places they can go from morning to evening, then the mobile soup kitchens come round and there is now free burger barbecue for them a few nights a week on Grafton St near the Phil Lynott statue.

diusmr8a504cvk

MightyMandarin wrote: »

Then why bother telling this story in the OP? Couldn't just ask people for their opinions on beggars without a story, no?

I was talking about an instance in which it upset me, answering my own question of:

Caiden Beautiful Orangutan wrote: »

Has there ever been an instance where you've been upset by seeing them on the streets?

Stheno

Beggars with pets make me feel upset, their used be one outside a shop I'd go to

Every day i'd ask him if he or the dog needed food, and was always told they were ok for food.

shane9689

After being abroad to third world Countries, you will never look at an Irish Beggar the same. Here theyre junkies who cant take care of themselves and need medical treatment, not money which fuels their habits.

In other countries you can see the genuine fear and hunger in their eyes, its scary and nothing compared to the relatively decent treatment they receive here

pablo128

MightyMandarin wrote: »

Then why bother telling this story in the OP? Couldn't just ask people for their opinions on beggars without a story, no?

The Op was on a school trip. This means he/she was a child. Do you expect children to approach homeless people in a foreign city, at 11.30 at night to enquire after their welfare?

hatrickpatrick

The Roma crew in Dun Laoghaire piss me off because they robbed me and my friends when we were kids. F*ck 'em.
I feel incredibly sorry for the rest of them. This government needs to cop the f*ck on about the housing crisis in particular - you'd be surprised how many of these people have enough money for food and day to day living, but just not enough for accomodation. And most of them don't want to stay in hostels because there seems to be an element of intimidating anti-social stuff around those?

rubadub

frostyjacks wrote: »

I'd like to see the Gardaí arrest them instead of just shooing them on to beg somewhere else.

I wish they were able to arrest the beggars who take advantage of both people's ignorance and the lax laws which alllow them to openly harass and beg from people. i.e. the street beggars known as chuggers & chunts

KungPao

There seems to be 3 distinct types of beggar in Ireland

1. Genuine person, who are down on their luck for some reason...pehaps their marriage broke down and then lost their jobs, and they have to beg and shift between temp accommodation. Good sorts, deserve some help.

2. Chancers who live nearby in flats and just go walking around looking for money for cigs, drink, or drugs.

3. Professional beggars who are part of a large pan-european scam. Never give these people a cent or even a "sorry, no change".

NachoBusiness

rubadub wrote: »

I wish they were able to arrest the beggars who take advantage of both people's ignorance and the lax laws which alllow them to openly harass and beg from people. i.e. the street beggars known as chuggers & chunts

They could for a while but then the law was quashed.

ComfortKid

MightyMandarin wrote:

Afaik in order to receive the dole, you need a permanent address, which a lot of people around Dublin can't afford due to the sky-high rents around the city. It's a toxic cycle people get put into and it can affect a lot of people very quickly without warning.

Live somewhere outside of Dublin then? If they are living on the streets they obviously no ties to the city apart from maybe there dealer! I honestly can not understand how anyone can become homeless in this country.

Lau2976

Lau2976 wrote: »

Genuine concern isn't going to feed them or keep them warm.

MightyMandarin wrote: »

If you're the homeless couple which is better, being offered food or money by a stranger or unknowingly being the subject of 'genuine concern', yet not being helped in any way whatsoever?

I guess this depends on how that "genuine concern" manifests itself later, no?

zcorpian88

ComfortKid wrote: »

Live somewhere outside of Dublin then? If they are living on the streets they obviously no ties to the city apart from maybe there dealer! I honestly can not understand how anyone can become homeless in this country.

Housing crisis is everywhere though and less and less landlords take rent allowance so it's usually between hostels and budget hotels for a lot of people. Surprised there aren't many homeless people where I live.

Can't understand why rents have skyrocketed, I'm nowhere near the big smoke and rents have gone up to 600-700 for a half decent apartment. A year ago you'd have got a great one for 450-500 a month

rubadub

NachoBusiness wrote: »

They could for a while but then the law was quashed.

I was talking about chuggers, the beggars who exploit what I consider a loophole so they cannot be arrested if they give just a tiny % to charity

former Minister for Justice Alan Shatter said that close to €4 million worth of Rehab lottery scratch cards sales earned just €9,452 profit in 2010.

that works out as 0.24%

Cheers for the link, it spoke of the barefoot beggar I mentioned before.

During one raid in July, the bus was stopped in Dublin Port and a “barefoot beggar” who operates on Grafton Street in Dublin city centre and who is known to gardaí was found to be carrying €1,800 in €50 notes.
“While he may look pretty sad on Grafton Street, I can assure you that he is manipulating people who are giving him the money.”
People who were genuinely moved by the man’s plight had been known to buy footwear for him in sports shops on Grafton Street, Insp McMenamin said.
“It’s known to ourselves that people will go in and buy him runners.
“He has more runners I think than the Foot Locker at this stage.”

SMJSF

One night around January I had gotten off the bus and there was a elderly man in dirty clothes, shivering sitting on the wall, soaked from the rain.
I felt sick seeing him like that, and the local shop was closed, so ran back home, made him a sandwich, grabbed an umbrella for him, and a blanket that was in a bag waiting to be brought to the charity shop, and ran back out to give to him, and he was gone I felt horrible. And I haven't seen him since.

But about 40 metres from there outside a Spar, there's a girl and a man who sit outside everyday, strung out of their minds begging! Now that pi$$es me off!

MightyMandarin

Deleted User wrote: »

I guess this depends on how that "genuine concern" manifests itself later, no?

Yes and in this case it turned out to mean f*ck all.

MightyMandarin

MightyMandarin wrote: »

Yes and in this case it turned out to mean f*ck all.

You have access to more of the back story than I do I guess

MightyMandarin

Deleted User wrote: »

You have access to more of the back story than I do I guess

Did you read the OP?

MightyMandarin

MightyMandarin wrote: »

Did you read the OP?

I did. Did you read my post?

I was talking about Knees post - not the op. I think we have just had a mutual context fail (otherwise known as talking past each other)

fancy pigeon

KungPao wrote: »

There seems to be 3 distinct types of beggar in Ireland

1. Genuine person, who are down on their luck for some reason...pehaps their marriage broke down and then lost their jobs, and they have to beg and shift between temp accommodation. Good sorts, deserve some help.

2. Chancers who live nearby in flats and just go walking around looking for money for cigs, drink, or drugs.

3. Professional beggars who are part of a large pan-european scam. Never give these people a cent or even a "sorry, no change".

Back in the day as a naive 17 year old, on my first day to college (yeah, country boy!) I encountered a Keith Duffy/George Michael lovechild lookalike whom was relatively smartly dressed. He approached me and started his speech "Sorry to bother you bud but I have just been put out of my house and I have no where to go. Can you spare me some spare change for a cup of tea?" to which I obliged and handed him some change. Walking off and thought no more, thinking I'd done a good deed.

2 weeks later.... Same chap approaches me. And spouts the exact same dialogue. It suddenly dawned on me I had been duped! I think the conversation that followed was mostly colourful from me. He went away

I saw him a few times after, but he never approached me again. Never seen him again since, that was about 8 years ago.

I think he falls into category 2....?

TheLastMohican

I may be wrong ........ but I was under the impression that there is a welfare net that stops people falling into dire straits like begging for food etc. Many years ago I worked a soup run in London and over there there was a pattern to homelessness ......... you were either young and naive, or were suddenly up against insurmountable problems or were feeble minded/suffering from some kind of mental disorder or just plain lazy. However, there was temporary housing for everyone ...... if you knew how to go about it. Most of the street people knew that but some would rather take their chance than cop on for a few months and get registered.

The Nuns in Ladbroke Grove did a 3 course lunch for £0.15 back in 1986. OK take inflation into account ........ it must be £1.50 now. A few soup & sandwich runs and you had three square meals a day. If you lived in a squat, you had no bills and few worries. If you lived in a B&B, the government paid your bill.
Most of the attendees at the midnight soup run knew the score but would fuck up one way or another ....... generally due to lack of self control. The raucous laughter heard around the fire in bomb sites would warm the heart of any cynic.

JupiterKid

I prefer to give money to a charity than directly to beggars as there's a 98% chance it'll go towards their next drug fix or drink.

That said, Dublin has a housing crisis and homelessness is a real problem many people face.

SHOVELLER

Ban them ideally but its unconstitutional apparently.

kneemos

MightyMandarin wrote: »

If you're the homeless couple which is better, being offered food or money by a stranger or unknowingly being the subject of 'genuine concern', yet not being helped in any way whatsoever?

I know 99% of people pass by without a thought for them, but this notion of feeling really upset and acting concerned for their welfare, yet doing f*ck all about it, is just laughable.

I'll admit I pass dozens of beggars and homeless people on the street every time I'm in town, but I'm not making some sob-story about feeling concerned for them.

If everybody cared as much as the OP they wouldn't be there.

When I lived on Baggot Street, a few years back, I used see chat to this elderly man (about 70, but difficult to say) who was always in a complete state, and he was often totally incomphrehensible if you spoke to him. He was obviously an alcoholic, and perhaps incontinent. I never saw him begging, and he didn't accept help or advice, but he was clearly homeless. Does anybody know what's happened to him?

There was another man who used to beg outside Spar on Upper Leeson Street. He had unfortunately lost one of his legs. Seemed to have a lot of problems. Is he still around?

When I moved away I never saw these two men again, just wondering if anyone knows whether they're still around or what?

edward2222

Whenever I see some beggars,
pending coffee is thing that will usually pooped in my mind.

Timberrrrrrrr

zcorpian88 wrote: »

Not a big fan of the Romanian ones, I hear all sorts about them and a lot have more money than you and I.

Did witness something mad a few years ago, was sitting outside a pub having a coffee and there was a Romanian beggar on the pedestrianized street in town, a guy I guessed by the look of him was the same nationality gets out of a Mercedes jeep, big enough petrol guzzling yoke and was new enough looking and wearing what looked to be snake skin boots that looked quite flashy. Anyway he approaches the beggar, takes the cup of change off her and walks back to his jeep gets in and drives off quickly.

Wonder how much change you need to buy a Merc jeep??

Amazing how many people have witnessed this phenomenon, you would think they would be careful after being spotted the first 20 or 30,000 times :rolleyes: