Dairy Chit Chat- Please read Mod note in post #1

whelan2

frazzledhome wrote: »

Nothing served here yet. Will let in HE Bulls Xmas week till Jan 20th or so.

Did it last year and calves sold like hot buns, last thing I need is another 2 groups of animals on the farm

Aa bull in cleaning up now. Have another with heifers. Could be glad of money next back end

frazzledhome

whelan2 wrote: »

Aa bull in cleaning up now. Have another with heifers. Could be glad of money next back end

Very true, I couldn't believe what guys are paying for He calves.

3 wks ai here next spring and all He Bulls from there. I'd go all Bulls from the start only there would be chaos.

Plan is to go all cows on all ground with no young stock kept at all. They're costing way too much to rear. Lovely simple system

whelan2

Makes a big difference to calf rearing work

Dawggone

frazzledhome wrote: »

Plan is to go all cows on all ground with no young stock kept at all. They're costing way too much to rear. Lovely simple system

+1.

Brown Podzol

frazzledhome wrote: »

Very true, I couldn't believe what guys are paying for He calves.

3 wks ai here next spring and all He Bulls from there. I'd go all Bulls from the start only there would be chaos.

Plan is to go all cows on all ground with no young stock kept at all. They're costing way too much to rear. Lovely simple system

Replacements?

frazzledhome

whelan2 wrote: »

Makes a big difference to calf rearing work

Huge. We were faced with building a new calf unit and as you know when building from scratch would cost a fortune.

In 2017 the only animals getting dairy ai will be the heifers. We've a full time calf rearer and he's some man to work with the limited housing he has. He's still managed to wean more heifers than we ever could.

When all young stock 2014 & 2015 calves are totalled it comes to 70% of the milking cows o the farm.

frazzledhome

Brown Podzol wrote: »

Replacements?

Will get enough with 3 wks ai. I have no problem buying stock once they're calved and from a breeder I knew.

I'd buy from you

There are a few people on here who's opinions I'd regard so please discuss

Greengrass1

frazzledhome wrote: »

Very true, I couldn't believe what guys are paying for He calves.

3 wks ai here next spring and all He Bulls from there. I'd go all Bulls from the start only there would be chaos.

Plan is to go all cows on all ground with no young stock kept at all. They're costing way too much to rear. Lovely simple system

What happens if an opportunity arises? And you have no young stock or god forbid you got hit with a bout of anything?

frazzledhome

Greengrass1 wrote: »

What happens if an opportunity arises? And you have no young stock or god forbid you got hit with a bout of anything?

Hit the market and pay €1500, put clusters in them that evening. It's costing us that at the moment. I'm not tying that much cash up in young stock for 2 yrs while a cow geazing the same ground can be producing cash.

When every one else changes to this system I'll revert

Brown Podzol

frazzledhome wrote: »

Will get enough with 3 wks ai. I have no problem buying stock once they're calved and from a breeder I knew.

I'd buy from you

There are a few people on here who's opinions I'd regard so please discuss

Are you basing your figures on there being a very good price for He calves over the next no of years? Is it as easy to rear say 100 as 50? One of the reasons I have surplus is that I have a piece of ground rented and I think it is more profitable to rear heifers on it than use it for silage. I can buy the silage cheaper than make it myself and have a twist out of the surplus heifers. I can also make quicker genetic progress in the direction I want to go by being able to choose which cows to keep heifers from. Then you have the disease issues from bought in stock etc. I can see the attraction of keeping all cows if it fits in with your land parcels.

Injuryprone

frazzledhome wrote: »

3 wks ai here next spring and all He Bulls from there. I'd go all Bulls from the start only there would be chaos.

You could keep the bulls in the yard and bring the cows to them at milking time for a quarter hour. Did it that way this year, worked well

Dawggone

I've gone down that road.
Plan to treat it like buying any other input.
Now is definitely a buyers market.


The trick will be knowing and sourcing at the right time in the cycle.

frazzledhome

Brown Podzol wrote: »

Are you basing your figures on there being a very good price for He calves over the next no of years? Is it as easy to rear say 100 as 50? One of the reasons I have surplus is that I have a piece of ground rented and I think it is more profitable to rear heifers on it than use it for silage. I can buy the silage cheaper than make it myself and have a twist out of the surplus heifers. I can also make quicker genetic progress in the direction I want to go by being able to choose which cows to keep heifers from. Then you have the disease issues from bought in stock etc. I can see the attraction of keeping all cows if it fits in with your land parcels.

Not based on calf prices, I'm not a beef farmer

Like you can buy silage as cheap as the surpluses I can make

It's to do with land blocks and there sizes and my return on capital.

Buford T. Justice XIX

alps wrote: »

LWR has Hugo on both sides of his breeding. Last year on 2 occasions AI companies asked me to breed cows to a son as a granson of the cows sire.......

Is anyone else uncomfortable with this. ?

Or is it my strong Catholic upbringing creating such a sense of guilt?

If it works, it's linebreeding.

If it doesn't, it's inbreeding...:pac:

trixi2011

frazzledhome wrote: »

Very true, I couldn't believe what guys are paying for He calves.

3 wks ai here next spring and all He Bulls from there. I'd go all Bulls from the start only there would be chaos.

Plan is to go all cows on all ground with no young stock kept at all. They're costing way too much to rear. Lovely simple system

Will you aim to wean enough heifer to maintain your herds at current size or go fully blown flying herd and sell the dairy heifers as well as the beef calves. Do you envisage any problems with lame or lazy beef bulls ?

kowtow

frazzledhome wrote:

It's to do with land blocks and there sizes and my return on capital.

Sounds very sensible.

Would sexed semen make the system even more refined, or not worth the expense / bother?

kevthegaff

frazzledhome wrote: »

Hit the market and pay €1500, put clusters in them that evening. It's costing us that at the moment. I'm not tying that much cash up in young stock for 2 yrs while a cow geazing the same ground can be producing cash.

When every one else changes to this system I'll revert

I always thinking of no heifers just milking, less work. Most important two years before clusters rather than the non conventional straight into the tank

Deepsouthwest

frazzledhome wrote: »

Huge. We were faced with building a new calf unit and as you know when building from scratch would cost a fortune.

In 2017 the only animals getting dairy ai will be the heifers. We've a full time calf rearer and he's some man to work with the limited housing he has. He's still managed to wean more heifers than we ever could.

When all young stock 2014 & 2015 calves are totalled it comes to 70% of the milking cows o the farm.

While it wouldn't be for me, I can't think of any concrete reasons why it shouldn't work, the more I think of it, the more attractive it becomes.
What's ur replacement rate at the moment? Could u get it down to 12/13%? Will u have to let ur calf rearer go, or will u rear the minimum no of heifers?
Generally a person who's good with young stock will be good with any stock. Could u move him into milking, and fill the position u said u have opening up

browned

frazzledhome wrote: »

Will get enough with 3 wks ai. I have no problem buying stock once they're calved and from a breeder I knew.

I'd buy from you

There are a few people on here who's opinions I'd regard so please discuss

Been Ai breeding for 3 weeks the last couple of years. You'll get plenty of replacements and more importantly you'll be breeding off cows that hold first time.
Next year I'm going all beef and will purchase replacements from autumn 2017 onwards similar reason to you. Purchase as cheap as one can rear and you can purchase the numbers you require

whelan2

Jeeny lads don't be telling everyone. The market will be flooded with beef calves

stretch film

browned wrote: »

Been Ai breeding for 3 weeks the last couple of years. You'll get plenty of replacements and more importantly you'll be breeding off cows that hold first time.
Next year I'm going all beef and will purchase replacements from autumn 2017 onwards similar reason to you. Purchase as cheap as one can rear and you can purchase the numbers you require

Where are ye going to get the consistent quality to match your own in such numbers that your not going to be purchasing from many different sources and compromising herd health.

Dawggone

whelan2 wrote: »

Jeeny lads don't be telling everyone. The market will be flooded with beef calves

Too late! Calf market resembles the lower stretches of the Shannon...

Dawggone

stretch film wrote: »

Where are ye going to get the consistent quality to match your own.

Stanflt!!

mahoney_j

Dawggone wrote: »

Stanflt!!

He's looking for 1800 to 2 k though so that may price ye out of market!!!!!

stretch film

Dawggone wrote: »

Stanflt!!

Of course ,my mistake.

whelan2

Everyone is in a different situation. I will AI what I need to get replacements and then beef on the rest. Buying in is not an option here. Have even been stung too many times.

Milked out

Would using rented ground for silage ground and heifers reduce the cost as opposed to buying in both?. Stock it up tightly to get 2 cuts in the summer and use that silage ground to keep heifers and weanlings out as long as possible. Maidens should graze ground off relatively well for early cuts of silage off dry ground. If the ground and lease could be found of course. Ground too far away is a balls of a job in terms of time wasted travelling. Having had a poor second cut here totally under my own control has me doubtful good quality grass silage could be bought year on year and I put that down to weather more than any man's abilities. But up East may be a different kettle of fish.
On buying in heifers, if a supplier could be found who is regularly selling heifers could indicate he has a long lasting herd as wouldn't need the replacements himself and I guess at a minimum the vaccination programme would want to be the same. Johne's would be a fear given the lack of reliability in the testing for it.

Dawggone

mahoney_j wrote: »

He's looking for 1800 to 2 k though so that may price ye out of market!!!!!

We'll buy from you then!

Any special offers? Or will we wait until your January sales?

frazzledhome

Dawggone wrote: »

We'll buy from you then!

Any special offers? Or will we wait until your January sales?

Dawg you're on the ball. What's wrong with going to Stan or Mj, discussing my requirements they supplying heifers calved and maintaining their heifer numbers.

It's all about building relationships in time and sticking to your deal. I know of 10-12 herds I'd have no issues dealing with fr stock.

I recon I could buy genetic gain as easily and as cheaply by buying as by breeding.

frazzledhome

Milked out wrote: »

Would using rented ground for silage ground and heifers reduce the cost as opposed to buying in both?. Stock it up tightly to get 2 cuts in the summer and use that silage ground to keep heifers and weanlings out as long as possible. Maidens should graze ground off relatively well for early cuts of silage off dry ground. If the ground and lease could be found of course. Ground too far away is a balls of a job in terms of time wasted travelling. Having had a poor second cut here totally under my own control has me doubtful good quality grass silage could be bought year on year and I put that down to weather more than any man's abilities. But up East may be a different kettle of fish.
On buying in heifers, if a supplier could be found who is regularly selling heifers could indicate he has a long lasting herd as wouldn't need the replacements himself and I guess at a minimum the vaccination programme would want to be the same. Johne's would be a fear given the lack of reliability in the testing for it.

We're cutting silage and grazing young stock on rented ground already. About half the silage taken there goes to young stock. I'd be thinking out a milking parlour there and just milk