is Aldo trying to get himself fired?

Foxtrol

darced wrote: »

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We're not talking about his fighting in the ring, it's a discussion about his conduct outside of it and whether he is going out of his way to try to get fired.

I’ll ask again, what has he done to follow through on his talk against the UFC or do you accept that so far he’s been all talk?

Davei141

Foxtrol wrote: »

We're not talking about his fighting in the ring, it's a discussion about his conduct outside of it and whether he is going out of his way to try to get fired.

I’ll ask again, what has he done to follow through on his talk against the UFC or do you accept that so far he’s been all talk?

So if he follows through with the IV talk then hes just a cheat who is looking forward to getting banned so he can avoid fighting Conor the GOAT. It is amazing how you and your like have set up the narrative that no matter what hes in the wrong.

What do you expect him to do other than speak out? Speaking out is far more than any other champion has done. If you saying he is trying to get himself fired then how is he all talk? Make up your mind.

darced

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Foxtrol

Davei141 wrote: »

People focusing on the IV thing because it is convenient to ignore the rest of the things he said. Just keep your mouth shut and be good little company men otherwise you are just a whinger. With fans like that is it any wonder the UFC treat its fighters with such contempt? Funny how these same fans are very quiet on the UFC flat out lying about Jose Aldo but have the neck to criticise him for saying what most fighters are thinking.

He is a whinger, he moans and blames everyone else and does nothing to improve his own position:

- Moans he doesn’t have a reebok deal – was in talks with them and chose venom
- Moans that UFC isn’t pushing him enough – refuses to learn English
- Moans he isn’t making enough money – 2 weeks out from a huge payday he idiotically has training partners throwing spinning kicks at him and gets injured

Where is the proof that the UFC have ‘flat out lied’ about Jose? There’s a lot of one side’s word against the other but the only independent party, the NAC, stated that it would have been ‘highly unlikely’ that Aldo would be denied cleared to fight.

Davei141

Foxtrol wrote: »

He is a whinger, he moans and blames everyone else and does nothing to improve his own position:

- Moans he doesn’t have a reebok deal – was in talks with them and chose venom
- Moans that UFC isn’t pushing him enough – refuses to learn English
- Moans he isn’t making enough money – 2 weeks out from a huge payday he idiotically has training partners throwing spinning kicks at him and gets injured

Where is the proof that the UFC have ‘flat out lied’ about Jose? There’s a lot of one side’s word against the other but the only independent party, the NAC, stated that it would have been ‘highly unlikely’ that Aldo would be denied cleared to fight.

Now you are just making stuff up. He has never moaned about not having a Reebok deal, he has moaned about the Reebok deal full stop. Like everyone else apart from the UFC drones.

He doesn't complain about not being pushed, he complains about not making enough money as the greatest featherweight of all time. So he doesn't learn English and doesn't turn himself into a sideshow that mean he shouldn't get paid?

He got injured before a fight, so did your boy Conor but the difference is the type of injury.

Eh the X-rays prove the UFC lied and also Dana White going on a mad one at the media for reporting exactly what he said lying about the injury. Then making up stuff about their being 2 sets of X-rays (which they are going quiet on as they got threatened with a defamation suit). They even sent out resident mouth piece Chael to reiterate that misinformation. They are scum.

Foxtrol

Davei141 wrote: »

So if he follows through with the IV talk then hes just a cheat who is looking forward to getting banned so he can avoid fighting Conor the GOAT. It is amazing how you and your like have set up the narrative that no matter what hes in the wrong.

What do you expect him to do other than speak out? Speaking out is far more than any other champion has done. If you saying he is trying to get himself fired then how is he all talk? Make up your mind.

If he uses IVs when they are banned then he’s a cheat, just like those who were on TRT when it was legal (remember how they had to be on it for their own health and safety??) but would now be cheating.

He’s not wrong no matter what he does, he just doesn’t cheat and actually fights this time and I have no issues with him win or lose. I think the bigger issue here is that he can do no wrong in some posters eyes.

I don’t expect him to do anything and I never said he was looking to get fired; I made the point that he is all talk and a poster called me out on it. I’m still waiting for an example of how he isn’t when it comes to moaning about the UFC or we can all happily agree that he’s all talk.

Foxtrol

darced wrote: »

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So then he is all talk… :rolleyes:

Thanks for agreeing, maybe through what someone has posted next time before you try to make a smart arsed comment.

Davei141

What makes him not all talk? Starting a one man union? Quitting the UFC? Going on strike? What exactly do you want him to do? I'm all ears.

zzfh

The only way he won't be 'all talk' is when he beats Mcgregor in Dec/Jan.Until then we will have to constantly listen to this stuff.

darced

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darced

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Foxtrol

Davei141 wrote: »

Now you are just making stuff up. He has never moaned about not having a Reebok deal, he has moaned about the Reebok deal full stop. Like everyone else apart from the UFC drones.

He doesn't complain about not being pushed, he complains about not making enough money as the greatest featherweight of all time. So he doesn't learn English and doesn't turn himself into a sideshow that mean he shouldn't get paid?

He got injured before a fight, so did your boy Conor but the difference is the type of injury.

Eh the X-rays prove the UFC lied and also Dana White going on a mad one at the media for reporting exactly what he said lying about the injury. Then making up stuff about their being 2 sets of X-rays (which they are going quiet on as they got threatened with a defamation suit). They even sent out resident mouth piece Chael to reiterate that misinformation. They are scum.

Your hate for the ‘scum’ UFC is clearly blinding you.

Apologies, he didn’t complain about not getting a deal (I got confused with another champ around the same time) but did complain about the deal in general, while being very happy to use the fact that Reebok were going after him in order to leverage money out of Venom. Reebok helped him get more money (on top of the money he will still get from Reebok) and he still moaned.

He hasn’t made more money because the greater public didn’t care about him and one of the key reasons is that he can’t speak the language understood by the biggest portion of the UFC fan base. If he doesn’t want to turn himself into a sideshow that’s fine but he can’t expect sideshow money for an act that few want to pay for.

The difference between ‘my boy’ :rolleyes: and Aldo is that one still showed up to fight and one didn’t (like 5 out his last 8 fights). Again, he whines about more money when he is more likely to drop out of a fight than show up. It’s laughable.

So you’ve got zero proof about UFC lying about anything, only that Dana was pissed off with the media about twisting a story and wouldn’t go into details. Again, the only independent party stated that it was ‘highly unlikely’ that Aldo would have been denied clearance to fight, yet Aldo’s camp repeatedly peddled that he was not cleared. To be as confident as you are that one side is telling the truth is quite deluded.

It all boils down to Jose wanting to look after Jose but going about it in a very stupid and childish way. There are plenty of things he could have done pro-actively done over the years but instead he just moans about it.

Foxtrol

darced wrote: »

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They’re delayed because it gives fighters time to prepare for cuts without it, very similar to how the TRT ban was phased in.

How are they trying to punish him?

I was initially skeptical about the interim belt but (even ignoring the implications for 189) when you combine the 5 withdrawals that he’s had in 8 fights during his UFC career I think it was totally justified.

If you look at how it turned out it’s possibly even better for the UFC than if the Aldo fight happened at 189 – McGregor vs Mendes I did huge numbers, it’s set up McGregor vs Aldo to be even bigger, they still get their TUF with McGregor being an even bigger star than if he’d lost, and they’ve set up McGregor vs Mendes II to be huge again. I’m sure Dana is real mad!

Davei141

Foxtrol wrote: »

Your hate for the ‘scum’ UFC is clearly blinding you.

Apologies, he didn’t complain about not getting a deal (I got confused with another champ around the same time) but did complain about the deal in general, while being very happy to use the fact that Reebok were going after him in order to leverage money out of Venom. Reebok helped him get more money (on top of the money he will still get from Reebok) and he still moaned.

He hasn’t made more money because the greater public didn’t care about him and one of the key reasons is that he can’t speak the language understood by the biggest portion of the UFC fan base. If he doesn’t want to turn himself into a sideshow that’s fine but he can’t expect sideshow money for an act that few want to pay for.

The difference between ‘my boy’ :rolleyes: and Aldo is that one still showed up to fight and one didn’t (like 5 out his last 8 fights). Again, he whines about more money when he is more likely to drop out of a fight than show up. It’s laughable.

So you’ve got zero proof about UFC lying about anything, only that Dana was pissed off with the media about twisting a story and wouldn’t go into details. Again, the only independent party stated that it was ‘highly unlikely’ that Aldo would have been denied clearance to fight, yet Aldo’s camp repeatedly peddled that he was not cleared. To be as confident as you are that one side is telling the truth is quite deluded.

It all boils down to Jose wanting to look after Jose but going about it in a very stupid and childish way. There are plenty of things he could have done pro-actively done over the years but instead he just moans about it.

You didn't get confused you purposely tried to spread false information and got called on it. A pretty standard Dana White tactic. Just lie lie lie and hope most people eat it up.

He is probably not expecting sideshow money but he deserves to get paid. This is a sport after all and he is one of the very best.

Zero proof they lied? So all those x-rays and MRI's that Aldo was forced to release that quite clearly showed his injury were just mis-interpreted by UFC paid for Dr's? Independent doctors were coming out and calling the UFC downright negligent for saying Aldo was good enough to fight, and your "independent party" was going off of the lies spread by the UFC. In any case if enough money is at stake the commission would clear anybody if they were willing to clear a broken rib for all that $$$$.

Foxtrol wrote: »

They’re delayed because it gives fighters time to prepare for cuts without it, very similar to how the TRT ban was phased in.

How are they trying to punish him?

I was initially skeptical about the interim belt but (even ignoring the implications for 189) when you combine the 5 withdrawals that he’s had in 8 fights during his UFC career I think it was totally justified.

If you look at how it turned out it’s possibly even better for the UFC than if the Aldo fight happened at 189 – McGregor vs Mendes I did huge numbers, it’s set up McGregor vs Aldo to be even bigger, they still get their TUF with McGregor being an even bigger star than if he’d lost, and they’ve set up McGregor vs Mendes II to be huge again. I’m sure Dana is real mad!

The interim belt was brought in purely to keep Conor in the main event, stop trying to pretend it is justified outside of that context. He defended it back in October! You think under any other circumstance it gets brought in? 5 pull outs and he still more active than most champs who haven't taken half the abuse.

Foxtrol

Davei141 wrote: »

You didn't get confused you purposely tried to spread false information and got called on it. A pretty standard Dana White tactic. Just lie lie lie and hope most people eat it up.

No I made a mistake but my point still stands. He leveraged the Reebok deal to make more money and then still complained about it. That to me is a whinger.

He is probably not expecting sideshow money but he deserves to get paid. This is a sport after all and he is one of the very best.

Are you saying he doesn’t get paid? He isn’t making top draw money for the reasons I stated, many of which he could change but chooses not to. Complaining about something when he could do something about it himself is the act of a whinger.

Zero proof they lied? So all those x-rays and MRI's that Aldo was forced to release that quite clearly showed his injury were just mis-interpreted by UFC paid for Dr's? Independent doctors were coming out and calling the UFC downright negligent for saying Aldo was good enough to fight, and your "independent party" was going off of the lies spread by the UFC. In any case if enough money is at stake the commission would clear anybody if they were willing to clear a broken rib for all that $$$$.

Independent doctors who were using the questionable x-rays released by Aldo’s team... seems to have the same consistency issue as you calling out the NAC for taking the UFC’s word.

I love how you’re claiming the NAC is shady while trusting Aldo’s team, when Brazilian MMA and Commission are rife with corruption and cheating. I’m sure you think there was nothing shady at all about the Aldo delayed drug test earlier this year.

I’m going to repeat myself, you have either inside information or are delusional to be so confident that one side is telling the full truth in this.

The interim belt was brought in purely to keep Conor in the main event, stop trying to pretend it is justified outside of that context. He defended it back in October! You think under any other circumstance it gets brought in? 5 pull outs and he still more active than most champs who haven't taken half the abuse.

According to his camp the earliest he is fit would be October so at minimum a year off, that’s if something else doesn’t come go wrong for him. Can you name a champ with more than a handful of defenses that has pulled out of more than half their fights (or even close to it)? If someone gets injured that often and doesn’t learn then their title deserves to be disputed. When you add in the situation of 189 it makes it the interim a no brainer, it’s not a punishment.

slicus ricus

Davei141 wrote: »

The interim belt was brought in purely to keep Conor in the main event, stop trying to pretend it is justified outside of that context. He defended it back in October! You think under any other circumstance it gets brought in? 5 pull outs and he still more active than most champs who haven't taken half the abuse.

There's more to it than just keeping Conor in the main event. The fact is that UFC spent an unprecedented amount of cash on the promotion of Aldo vs McGregor at 189. Given that Aldo then pulled out, UFC really had to bring the interim title into it to make sure the event kept its hype and made a strong return on the investment they had made in it.

The 5 withdrawals, while not the primary reason for bringing in the interim title, certainly adds more justification for doing it. Surely the UFC are getting sick of his constant withdrawals from fights, I can't think of any other fighter who has withdrawn from fights so frequently.

With regard to the was he cleared, wasn't he cleared stuff - my understanding at the time was that Aldo was cleared to fight but pulled out on the basis that he was still in pain/discomfort and did not want to risk defending his title when not at 100%. As far as I am aware that was what Dana White was saying about it (he has been filmed saying Aldo was cleared to fight) and the rest of the stuff he was quoted as saying is the part he denied (quite aggressively) at the post fight press conference.

Davei141

Foxtrol wrote: »

No I made a mistake but my point still stands. He leveraged the Reebok deal to make more money and then still complained about it. That to me is a whinger.



Are you saying he doesn’t get paid? He isn’t making top draw money for the reasons I stated, many of which he could change but chooses not to. Complaining about something when he could do something about it himself is the act of a whinger.

He is complaining about Reebok because it is an awful deal for everyone apart from the few golden children who are well taken care at the expense of everyone else. He is one of the very few fighters who actually didn't lose too much on Reebok because he had a company that was rabid about keeping him, how many others lost a ton of money? Because he didn't take a huge hit himself the fact he is speaking out for teammates and other less fortunate is commendable.

Independent doctors who were using the questionable x-rays released by Aldo’s team... seems to have the same consistency issue as you calling out the NAC for taking the UFC’s word.

I love how you’re claiming the NAC is shady while trusting Aldo’s team, when Brazilian MMA and Commission are rife with corruption and cheating. I’m sure you think there was nothing shady at all about the Aldo delayed drug test earlier this year.

I’m going to repeat myself, you have either inside information or are delusional to be so confident that one side is telling the full truth in this.

I'm not going to disagree that CABMMA aren't shady as hell and that all the goings on with regards the drug testing wasn't shady as hell (i brought it up on this forum) but Aldo's team had to go out of their way to prove he was injured as Dana White and his mouthpieces kept throwing him under the bus.

Every single pro fighter has said you can't fight with a messed up rib but because you can barely move yet these "Independent doctors" cleared him to fight? Where are these doctors btw? You won't see any self respecting doctor putting his name to that clearance.

NAC will clear anyone if there is enough money on the line. Dana White would get anyone to clear him to fight if there was enough money on the line. He wanted to send him out to slaughter, take his belt pay, him his few m$, call Conor the champ and build a rematch on the fact Aldo was crocked. Would you have been happy with that farce? I was seething when he got injured but it happened.

According to his camp the earliest he is fit would be October so at minimum a year off, that’s if something else doesn’t come go wrong for him. Can you name a champ with more than a handful of defenses that has pulled out of more than half their fights (or even close to it)? If someone gets injured that often and doesn’t learn then their title deserves to be disputed. When you add in the situation of 189 it makes it the interim a no brainer, it’s not a punishment.

Lets face it if Aldo made the UFC $$$$$ they wouldn't have treated him that way. Taking the headlining slot out of the equation they were pissed at him for spending so much on the build up (rightly so) and were definitely punishing him. Has an interim belt ever been created less than a year after it was defended due to injury?

Davei141

slicus ricus wrote: »

There's more to it than just keeping Conor in the main event. The fact is that UFC spent an unprecedented amount of cash on the promotion of Aldo vs McGregor at 189. Given that Aldo then pulled out, UFC really had to bring the interim title into it to make sure the event kept its hype and made a strong return on the investment they had made in it.

The 5 withdrawals, while not the primary reason for bringing in the interim title, certainly adds more justification for doing it. Surely the UFC are getting sick of his constant withdrawals from fights, I can't think of any other fighter who has withdrawn from fights so frequently.

I don't disagree with those points but do you think they do that any other champs if they are very popular? All of that played into it but the way they are acting is a joke.

With regard to the was he cleared, wasn't he cleared stuff - my understanding at the time was that Aldo was cleared to fight but pulled out on the basis that he was still in pain/discomfort and did not want to risk defending his title when not at 100%. As far as I am aware that was what Dana White was saying about it (he has been filmed saying Aldo was cleared to fight) and the rest of the stuff he was quoted as saying is the part he denied (quite aggressively) at the post fight press conference.

Come on he was being sent out to take his money and lose the belt. He had zero chance of competing with that injury and everyone knows it but because the money was spent he was being backed into a corner. Who wanted to see Aldo actually fight after news broke of how injured he was? I certainly didn't want to see it over a healthy Mendes.

slicus ricus

Davei141 wrote: »

Come on he was being sent out to take his money and lose the belt. He had zero chance of competing with that injury and everyone knows it but because the money was spent he was being backed into a corner. Who wanted to see Aldo actually fight after news broke of how injured he was? I certainly didn't want to see it over a healthy Mendes.

I agree to an extent, obviously we all wanted to see Aldo at 100% vs McGregor at 100% and for sure, nobody should be forced to fight when injured.

A lot of fighters do go into fights injured though, without releasing news of the injury to the media. I listened an interview Ronda Rousey did within the last week where she said she would have fought with that injury and that she has gone into fights injured before. She said something along the lines of: 'Do you really think I've never been injured going into a fight, like I'm the luckiest person in the world'. That to me suggests that a lot of fighters are prepared to fight while injured. I'm not saying that's necessarily right but it does seem to be the culture in fighting (not just in the UFC). To say that Aldo was being "sent in to take his money and lose the belt" seems a tad naive when you consider this culture.

raze_them_all_

slicus ricus wrote: »

I agree to an extent, obviously we all wanted to see Aldo at 100% vs McGregor at 100% and for sure, nobody should be forced to fight when injured.

A lot of fighters do go into fights injured though, without releasing news of the injury to the media. I listened an interview Ronda Rousey did within the last week where she said she would have fought with that injury and that she has gone into fights injured before. She said something along the lines of: 'Do you really think I've never been injured going into a fight, like I'm the luckiest person in the world'. That to me suggests that a lot of fighters are prepared to fight while injured. I'm not saying that's necessarily right but it does seem to be the culture in fighting (not just in the UFC). To say that Aldo was being "sent in to take his money and lose the belt" seems a tad naive when you consider this culture.

Do you really think aldo hasn't fought injured before? There are injuries that can be fought through, having one that ****s your breathing up doesn't seem like it'd smart to fight a 5 round title fight with

.ak

Ofcourse, it's a contact sport. Nobody plays contact sport 100%... and I imagine with MMA you have to spar consistently so you'll always have knocks and lumps.

slicus ricus

raze_them_all_ wrote: »

Do you really think aldo hasn't fought injured before? There are injuries that can be fought through, having one that ****s your breathing up doesn't seem like it'd smart to fight a 5 round title fight with

Fair enough on the current one, doesn't seem smart to me either but then again I'm not a fighter so I don't have that mentality.

The fact that he has pulled out of 5 fights now suggests that he hasn't fought injured before. There is an element of the boy who cried wolf in this one I'm afraid!

darced

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Mellor

Doug Cartel wrote: »

They can test their blood for phthlate plasticizers. This test is actually used to detect some forms of doping, and I think one of the reasons they want to remove IV rehydration is that it cuts out one more excuse someone can have for having phthlate plasticizers in their system.

I've heard that mentioned before I can't see how it would work. They can't detect aspire without a reference level.
2000ml would probably cause higher levels than 50ml, but unless they have a limit within the rules in black and white I can't see how it'd be enforceable.

I read the main reason for the 50ml limit was to prevent athleyes delaying testers with large IV's - apparently cyclists were doing this to give last nights micro dose of EPO extra time to clear.

GiftofGab

Aldo would be made sign a contract for the McGregor fight.

I’m sure the UFC will put in the contract that IV re-hydration is banned and as a consequence this can affect his payment / salary. So if he uses the IV he won’t get his big payday. Up to him if he wants to take that chance.

Mellor

GiftofGab wrote: »

Aldo would be made sign a contract for the McGregor fight.

I’m sure the UFC will put in the contract that IV re-hydration is banned and as a consequence this can affect his payment / salary. So if he uses the IV he won’t get his big payday. Up to him if he wants to take that chance.

The IV ban has nothing to do with the UFC. They haven't brought in the rule. That's down to USADA, NSAC, etc.
If it's treated no different to other banned items, then as it stands he'd he illegible for F/PotN bonuses, and the NSAC would fine him. But he's still get PPV points - but that's an easy change in the contract.

Davei141

slicus ricus wrote: »

I agree to an extent, obviously we all wanted to see Aldo at 100% vs McGregor at 100% and for sure, nobody should be forced to fight when injured.

A lot of fighters do go into fights injured though, without releasing news of the injury to the media. I listened an interview Ronda Rousey did within the last week where she said she would have fought with that injury and that she has gone into fights injured before. She said something along the lines of: 'Do you really think I've never been injured going into a fight, like I'm the luckiest person in the world'. That to me suggests that a lot of fighters are prepared to fight while injured. I'm not saying that's necessarily right but it does seem to be the culture in fighting (not just in the UFC). To say that Aldo was being "sent in to take his money and lose the belt" seems a tad naive when you consider this culture.

Rousey is the UFC golden child you really think she is ever going to come out and say you know what I wouldn't fight through a severe rib injury? Its the UFC position that Aldo pussied out so you can be damn sure it is her position. Rousey gets that same injury right before a Cyborg fight you can be sure as night follows day that she ain't fighting.

Most fighters that had a rib injury previously have said it is impossible, the ones who haven't had it have said sure i would fight through.

If he wasn't being sent in to take the money and lose the belt did you give the best featherweight of all time a hope in that fight if it went ahead? Because i certainly didn't.

slicus ricus

Davei141 wrote: »

Rousey is the UFC golden child you really think she is ever going to come out and say you know what I wouldn't fight through a severe rib injury? Its the UFC position that Aldo pussied out so you can be damn sure it is her position. Rousey gets that same injury right before a Cyborg fight you can be sure as night follows day that she ain't fighting.

What I don't understand is why the UFC would take this position that Aldo pussied out if they didn't believe it to be the case. What's the point in that as in what's to be gained by doing so?

Davei141 wrote: »

Most fighters that had a rib injury previously have said it is impossible, the ones who haven't had it have said sure i would fight through.

If he wasn't being sent in to take the money and lose the belt did you give the best featherweight of all time a hope in that fight if it went ahead? Because i certainly didn't.

Being honest with you, I have never had a bruised rib and have no idea whether or not one could fight with it. Seems pretty clear from what you are saying that a lot of pros are suggesting you can't

Davei141

slicus ricus wrote: »

What I don't understand is why the UFC would take this position that Aldo pussied out if they didn't believe it to be the case. What's the point in that as in what's to be gained by doing so?

Because they are pissed off at him. If it was a broken leg or something they would be equally pissed off but they would just hammer the sparring too hard angle. The fact he didn't make the walk makes him enemy of the UFC. Turning him into the villain just suits their narrative.

Being honest with you, I have never had a bruised rib and have no idea whether or not one could fight with it. Seems pretty clear from what you are saying that a lot of pros are suggesting you can't

Kinda my point though they just wanted him out there no matter what as they spent too much money.

Foxtrol

Mellor wrote: »

I've heard that mentioned before I can't see how it would work. They can't detect aspire without a reference level.
2000ml would probably cause higher levels than 50ml, but unless they have a limit within the rules in black and white I can't see how it'd be enforceable.

I read the main reason for the 50ml limit was to prevent athleyes delaying testers with large IV's - apparently cyclists were doing this to give last nights micro dose of EPO extra time to clear.

They have the same rules for several other sports so they clearly have a way of testing it. I’m sure a lot of stuff they test for has a natural level in the human system and you get done for being over it, as it’s a sign that you’re using a PED, but they don’t release that information to the public.

Mellor wrote: »

The IV ban has nothing to do with the UFC. They haven't brought in the rule. That's down to USADA, NSAC, etc.
If it's treated no different to other banned items, then as it stands he'd he illegible for F/PotN bonuses, and the NSAC would fine him. But he's still get PPV points - but that's an easy change in the contract.

I’ve posted it earlier in the thread but the new UFC policy is much stricter than what you’ve posted, if you’re caught for a PED it results in a 2 year ban, disqualification of the fight in question, forfeiture of title, ranking, and purse or other compensation. It’s not to be messed with.