Alton Towers rollercoaster crash

K4t

PM me nudes wrote: »

I'm all for equality. It's the attention seekers that never make up their own minds or formulate their own opinions that follow the crowd and then seek some form if recognition that get me. These are the same people that will have completely forgotten about the whole referendum in a matter of days and move onto something else.

I still think it's harsh to call someone vermin solely for supporting equality! It wasn't really a question that required much thought or deliberation either tbh, it was only made seem that way for many due to the false and misleading opinions of the religious groups driving the no side.

bradlente

RedemptionZ wrote: »

Why did you make the joke then? For recognition from all your internet pals so they can see how hilarious you are. If you can tell me another reason you posted it I'm all ears. You also ignored my question so I'll say it again, would you say the joke if you thought family members of the victims were reading?

Why do you care so much about this?If you had chosen to ignore the joke because you didn't find it funny it'd be forgotten about now,but taking so much offence to it actually gives it more exposure.
Why do you think you know exactly how a family member,someone you've never known or met would feel about reading something?

RedemptionZ

PM me nudes wrote: »

They may well be reading for all I know Would you talk behind a friends back if you knew they'd hear about it? No, but I bet you still do it anyway.

Would I make jokes about my friend's recently crippled relatives behind their back? I'm gonna go with a no there.

PM me nudes

RedemptionZ wrote: »

Would I make jokes about my friend's recently crippled relatives behind their back? I'm gonna go with a no there.

I meant talk about them in general

RedemptionZ

bradlente wrote: »

Why do you care so much about this?If you had chosen to ignore the joke because you didn't find it funny it'd be forgotten about now,but taking so much offence to it actually gives it more exposure.
Why do you think you know exactly how a family member,someone you've never known or met would feel about reading something?

Agh lads it's 3:43am and we're on boards, there's no winners in this scenario, we're all losers here. I'll bow out here, not much more to say on the topic other than I hope they have the best possible recovery possible.

Off topic I will say that PM me nudes is a great name

PM me nudes

The speech of a defeated man :pac:

I agree and goodnight.

The name has proved unsuccessful so far

PM me nudes

K4t wrote: »

I still think it's harsh to call someone vermin solely for supporting equality! It wasn't really a question that required much thought or deliberation either tbh, it was only made seem that way for many due to the false and misleading opinions of the religious groups driving the no side.

Maybe vermin was a bit ott. I haven't quite reached Mein Kampf levels yet.

aaronjumper

Article says their stock has dropped 3%. I know very little about stock other than down is bad and up is good. Interesting to see how this turns out.

PM me nudes

aaronjumper wrote: »

Article says their stock has dropped 3%. I know very little about stock other than down is bad and up is good. Interesting to see how this turns out.

I heard something about that being the equivalent of £160million. It's parent company are second only to Disney in terms of theme parks/ entertainment accommodation

aaronjumper

PM me nudes wrote: »

I heard something about that being the equivalent of £160million. It's parent company are second only to Disney in terms of theme parks/ entertainment accommodation

If Disney is their only proper competition they'll probably recover provided no ones injurys are permanent.

Samaris

Ok, people definitely need some coaching on the difference between satire and stupid jokes. What exactly were you satirising? You were making fairly dumb leg puns because four people suffered horrendous crush injuries. They were two couples, by the way. Their relationships, lives, and their own bodies will probably change irrevocably from what should have been a fun day out. No, it's not a bit of a laugh, it's a tragedy.

Satire's a delicate weapon. Yis failed pretty hard on satire.

As for the ride having issues. Eh. No more issues than any other bit of machinery. The park's been open since 1980, and this is by far the worst accident to occur. I reckon ALton Towers is a pretty safe place and put a lot of care into their rides. I feel sorry for whoever it was that gave the go-ahead to start the ride up again. They're really going to be regretting that decision.

ScumLord

It must have been a pretty catastrophic failure of the the braking system. As rollercoasters don't have any crash structures at the front of the cars you'd assume they would be considered redundant because that would be built into whatever braking system there is in the rail.

It seems like this wouldn't have been all that serious if there was some form of crash structure at the front.

razorblunt

ScumLord wrote: »

It must have been a pretty catastrophic failure of the the braking system. As rollercoasters don't have any crash structures at the front of the cars you'd assume they would be considered redundant because that would be built into whatever braking system there is in the rail.

It seems like this wouldn't have been all that serious if there was some form of crash structure at the front.

It looks like the pod in front was sent around the track first while empty and it got stuck, second pod was sent around after it and collided.
I know folk who were there on Sunday and said they were having issues then too which was causing delays, they still went on it and the only people leaving the queue were those not wanting to wait longer rather than walk away over safety concerns.

Horribly sad to be the statistic on the wrong side of the likelihood of an accident like this.

Magico Gonzalez

I imagine when the attention seekers have reached maturity and developed a sense of humour that extends beyond not understanding how satire works, they might feel a little silly looking back at their comments.

You know they type, all mouth. Full of their own inane glory.

Samaris

It -is- odd that the second carriage was sent around before the first test carriage had completed its run. Reports have been a bit confused so far.

ScumLord

Samaris wrote: »

It -is- odd that the second carriage was sent around before the first test carriage had completed its run. Reports have been a bit confused so far.

It may not be odd, it could just be a way of getting more people through. The fact the other cart was empty makes less sense.

From what I remember these things rely a lot on gravity doing most the work. Too much weight, or not enough, could have a big effect on how the rollercoaster performs.

With machines this big and complicated though it could be something as mundane or simple as using a different brand of bushings. The problem could have started by a supplier changing their product and not informing the customer that they have received a different part.

An extra level of safety redundancy in the form of a crash structure at the front would have avoided the injuries though.

ThinkProgress

Samaris wrote: »

Ok, people definitely need some coaching on the difference between satire and stupid jokes. What exactly were you satirising? You were making fairly dumb leg puns because four people suffered horrendous crush injuries. They were two couples, by the way. Their relationships, lives, and their own bodies will probably change irrevocably from what should have been a fun day out. No, it's not a bit of a laugh, it's a tragedy.

Satire's a delicate weapon. Yis failed pretty hard on satire.

As for the ride having issues. Eh. No more issues than any other bit of machinery. The park's been open since 1980, and this is by far the worst accident to occur. I reckon ALton Towers is a pretty safe place and put a lot of care into their rides. I feel sorry for whoever it was that gave the go-ahead to start the ride up again. They're really going to be regretting that decision.

^^WRONG!!

It may well be a tragedy for those directly involved, but it's unlikely to be for anyone on here!

Most are either displaying fake empathy to appear as being super compassionate creatures - some people actually turn this into a competition of sorts, trying to out do each other. (not unlike all the fake animal rights fruitjobs in the other thread)

Or they are projecting themselves into someone else's tragic situation along with all their bottled up fears and insecurities. Both examples of narcissistic behavior.

The jokes (crappy or otherwise), don't need to be direct examples of satirical jokes in order to satirize the situation.

The jokes are an attempt to satirize the fake empathy and cut through the waist deep bs in this thread, not a direct attempt to ridicule the actual people involved. (who we don't know - and probably never will).

Samaris

Ah, the empty carriage was sent as a test run, afaik. There was a bit of an issue, and it was closed for a bit to sort something out. Then an empty test carriage was sent through, but for some mad reason, they didn't wait for it to get back before releasing the full carriage. There are sensors on these things that are supposed to prevent two carriages being in the same sector of track at once, but it looks like a catastrophic combination of mechanical error and human error.

One of the four people was released from hospital yesterday, the other three look to be in a bad way.

Samaris

ThinkProgress wrote: »

^^WRONG!!

It may well be a tragedy for those directly involved, but it's unlikely to be for anyone on here!

Ah, I see you were waiting for that. Firstly, how do you know? Secondly, one does not have to be directly involved to feel empathy and to disapprove of dumb jokes about it.

ThinkProgress wrote: »

Most are either displaying fake empathy to appear as being super compassionate creatures - some people actually turn this into a competition of sorts, trying to out do each other. (not unlike all the fake animal rights fruitjobs in the other thread)

How on earth do you know that? You can proclaim others to be being fake all you want, but you can't possibly know that anyone on here is faking feeling empathy for others. I'm not, and you can deny that all you like, but it's true.

ThinkProgress wrote: »

Or they are projecting themselves into someone else's tragic situation along with all their bottled up fears and insecurities. Both examples of narcissistic behavior.

Possibly, I have heard this argument before. I have heard empathy argued as being a sense of projecting how one would feel in such a situation, and thus it is narcissistic. Perhaps, but it is still a far more human response to feel sympathy for others in a terrible situation than to mock them.

ThinkProgress wrote: »

The jokes (crappy or otherwise), don't need to be direct examples of satirical jokes in order to satirize the situation.

The jokes are an attempt to satirize the fake empathy and cut through the waste deep bs in this thread, not a direct attempt to ridicule the actual people involved. (who we don't know - and probably never will).

That'd be where, in my view, you failed. You should, in that case, have been mocking the other posters, not making LOL, LEGS! jokes, simply because others have suffered horrendous crush injuries to their legs. Consider it like rape jokes. Rape jokes can be funny, but the target of the humour should be the perpetrator, not the victim. Your jokes were making light of the victims in the situation, the injured people, not the people you feel are narcissistic for having sympathy. Do you get where I'm coming from? It wasn't satire of peoples reactions to the situation, it was having a laugh at the expense of the victims of the situation, which, to me, is rather worse than what you seem to consider making it all about the "viewer" (to pick a word to refer to people reading about it). You're not only, in this situation, ALSO making it all about you (by trying to distract the conversation into laughing at your jokes), but you're also being fairly rotten towards the people who are actually suffering, whether or not you know them, or they ever are likely to read this, or whether or not their families are here.

ThinkProgress

@samaris

I don't need to conclusively prove who is being fake and who isn't on this thread. It's just a microcosm of wider society.

Because the majority of people display fake empathy when things like this occur. It's human nature. (for most, but not all)

Their supposed empathy comes from a much darker, less understood place in their minds.

Just look at how many people rubberneck when they see a car crash. 99.9% of those people are really just thinking "poor b*stards, glad it wasn't me!" (of course most would never admit to thinking that)

Genuine empathy and heartfelt compassion is exceedingly rare. And it's not something you generally experience when you don't know the people involved.

Humor is also a very natural way of subconsciously acknowledging the tragic randomness of this life.

So, for some, the choice is clear. Fake empathy and propogating more useless irrational fear withing the delusional safety of the herd.

Or use humor to cut through that frustrating bs and see these situations and life for what they truly are! (I know which one I prefer)

Samaris

Eh, so far this still sounds like a lazy excuse to say whatever you like.

Again, you misfired. If you wanted to satirize other people then satirize the posters on the board. You'd still be incorrect (and the burden of proof is on you, as the accuser, to prove that other people are fitting your world-view, else it is just an assumption), but at least it's only moderately insulting. You were being a dick about people being seriously injured, and then excusing it with "you're all fake, so I can say what I like", pretty much.

Compassion isn't rare, but you can view compassion as being self-serving if you want. It seems a damn shame to, but I can't change anyone's mind on that. I'd honestly prefer to be compassionate and considered naive (or self-serving by a few) than to assume that everyone's a self-serving dick.

Edit: It's also quite true that neither compassion nor jokes will make a shred of difference to those people in hospital, or to their adjusting to life afterwards, but compassion is a just a bit more likely to help than pisstaking should any of them or their families find this thread when looking into the cause of their accident.

ThinkProgress

Samaris wrote: »

Eh, so far this still sounds like a lazy excuse to say whatever you like.

Again, you misfired. If you wanted to satirize other people then satirize the posters on the board. You'd still be incorrect (and the burden of proof is on you, as the accuser, to prove that other people are fitting your world-view, else it is just an assumption), but at least it's only moderately insulting. You were being a dick about people being seriously injured, and then excusing it with "you're all fake, so I can say what I like", pretty much.

Compassion isn't rare, but you can view compassion as being self-serving if you want. It seems a damn shame to, but I can't change anyone's mind on that. I'd honestly prefer to be compassionate and considered naive (or self-serving by a few) than to assume that everyone's a self-serving dick.

Edit: It's also quite true that neither compassion nor jokes will make a shred of difference to those people in hospital, or to their adjusting to life afterwards, but compassion is a just a bit more likely to help than pisstaking should any of them or their families find this thread when looking into the cause of their accident.

Life's a d*ck sometimes, it sure was to those guys on the rollercoaster! I'm just choosing to be honest about how I feel. Many others are being fake. Not my fault I can see the wood from the trees.

Everyone's not a self-serving d*ck. That's not my viewpoint at all.

But unless you're directly involved or know someone involved, the compassion is usually not real. (even if you want to believe it is)

You just feel obligated to feel and act that way. I feel obligated to be true to myself and how I REALLY feel. Society dictates how most people react to the world around them. Obviously if you're one of those people, it's not very easy to look in the mirror and recognize it.

Some might see it if you point it out to them - but most never will.

And humor is almost always of more use than morbidly dwelling on people's random misfortune in this life.

Samaris

ThinkProgress wrote: »

Life's a d*ck sometimes, it sure was to those guys on the rollercoaster! I'm just choosing to be honest about how I feel.

You don't actually have to speak when you feel something, you know. Sometimes it's best to snort and move on rather than start something from the view of "these people are all fake, and I'll prove it with my edge". In truth, I feel the same way about people who "say it like it is, call a spade a spade," and "are blunt and honest", as if manners are something repellent. It's lazy in my eyes, to not give a **** about causing offence or hurt.

ThinkProgress wrote: »

Many others are being fake. Not my fault I can see the wood from the trees.

In this case, or rather, in both, that's your opinion, not necessarily fact.

ThinkProgress wrote: »

Everyone's not a self-serving d*ck. That's not my viewpoint at all.

But unless you're directly involved or know someone involved, the compassion is usually not real. (even if you want to believe it is)

Good way to get people coming ANd going, that :P Either deliberate fakery, or ofc, accidental fakery. No chance of being genuine then?

ThinkProgress wrote: »

You just feel obligated to feel and act that way. I feel obligated to be true to myself and how I REALLY feel. Society dictates how most people react to the world around them. Obviously if you're one of those people, it's not very easy to look in the mirror and recognize it.

Some might see it if you point it out to them - but most never will.

Yis can be true to yourself without declaring it to the world and calling others fake in their viewpoints and reactions, much less believing implicitly that your viewpoint is the only honest one out there. It's not. What may be true for you is not necessarily true for others.

ThinkProgress wrote: »

And humor is almost always of more use than morbidly dwelling on people's random misfortune in this life.

I will agree with that, but it does depend on the humour. Laughing at someone taking an absurd tumble and landing in a ditch is one thing. Laughing at someone taking an absurd tumble and breaking their arm is rather another.

I'm gonna leave it at that, mostly because we have derailed this thread fairly thoroughly. It's not that I'm walking away in defeat, just to quote an earlier post regarding Redemptionz (and I don't reckon he was either!), but because we have two utterly opposing viewpoints, and I don't think either of us will convince the other of one being right :P So perhaps we can agree to disagree?

end of the road

ThinkProgress wrote: »

Life's a d*ck sometimes, it sure was to those guys on the rollercoaster! I'm just choosing to be honest about how I feel. Many others are being fake. Not my fault I can see the wood from the trees.

Everyone's not a self-serving d*ck. That's not my viewpoint at all.

But unless you're directly involved or know someone involved, the compassion is usually not real. (even if you want to believe it is)

You just feel obligated to feel and act that way. I feel obligated to be true to myself and how I REALLY feel. Society dictates how most people react to the world around them. Obviously if you're one of those people, it's not very easy to look in the mirror and recognize it.

Some might see it if you point it out to them - but most never will.

And humor is almost always of more use than morbidly dwelling on people's random misfortune in this life.

have you got a source for your claims? believe it or not some of us can actually think for ourselves without society "telling" us what to think

ThinkProgress

Samaris wrote: »

You don't actually have to speak when you feel something, you know. Sometimes it's best to snort and move on rather than start something from the view of "these people are all fake, and I'll prove it with my edge". In truth, I feel the same way about people who "say it like it is, call a spade a spade," and "are blunt and honest", as if manners are something repellent. It's lazy in my eyes, to not give a **** about causing offence or hurt.


In this case, or rather, in both, that's your opinion, not necessarily fact.


Good way to get people coming ANd going, that :P Either deliberate fakery, or ofc, accidental fakery. No chance of being genuine then?



Yis can be true to yourself without declaring it to the world and calling others fake in their viewpoints and reactions, much less believing implicitly that your viewpoint is the only honest one out there. It's not. What may be true for you is not necessarily true for others.


I will agree with that, but it does depend on the humour. Laughing at someone taking an absurd tumble and landing in a ditch is one thing. Laughing at someone taking an absurd tumble and breaking their arm is rather another.

I'm gonna leave it at that, mostly because we have derailed this thread fairly thoroughly. It's not that I'm walking away in defeat, just to quote an earlier post regarding Redemptionz (and I don't reckon he was either!), but because we have two utterly opposing viewpoints, and I don't think either of us will convince the other of one being right :P So perhaps we can agree to disagree?

I can speak whenever I feel like it. If you don't enjoy reading what I have to say that's your problem. Maybe the light I'm shining feels uncomfortable for you - again YOUR problem!

Very little chance of it NOT being fakery. Of course there is the rare exception of someone who is genuinely affected. Exceedingly rare. The rubberneckers are quite predictable in their behaviors.

I'm not the only person who posted jokes on this thread. There were others, so I'm hardly isolated in my reaction.

You can't tell people when to find humor in something. It happens organically, it's instinctive. You just admitted to finding someone else's misfortune funny. I never did that with this incident. I admitted to finding the fraudulent reactions of others amusing!

I don't think you're admitting defeat - no. You put your points across well. I disagree with the majority of them, but that happens quite a bit on here!

end of the road

ThinkProgress wrote: »

I can speak whenever I feel like it. If you don't enjoy reading what I have to say that's your problem. Maybe the light I'm shining feels uncomfortable for you - again YOUR problem!

Very little chance of it NOT being fakery. Of course there is the rare exception of someone who is genuinely affected. Exceedingly rare. The rubberneckers are quite predictable in their behaviors.

I'm not the only person who posted jokes on this thread. There were others, so I'm hardly isolated in my reaction.

You can't tell people when to find humor in something. It happens organically, it's instinctive. You just admitted to finding someone else's misfortune funny. I never did that with this incident. I admitted to finding the fraudulent reactions of others amusing!

I don't think you're admitting defeat - no. You put your points across well. I disagree with the majority of them, but that happens quite a bit on here!

what "light" are you "shining" . all your doing is accusing people of being fake without anything to back it up. some very well might be but many others aren't

K4t

end of the road wrote: »

what "light" are you "shining" . all your doing is accusing people of being fake without anything to back it up. some very well might be but many others aren't

His accusations are directed mostly towards those who scorned him and others for making jokes, not specifically at those showing sympathy for the victims of the crash. And he's right. Irrespective of whether the jokes are in good or bad taste, there is something more sinister about attempting to dictate to others how they should respond to such events, and chastising those who attempt to add some humour rather than conform to normal customs. You'd swear this thread was a condolences book that will be given to the victim's families judging by some replies.

marklazarcovic

guess who booked flights and car rental on sunday evening for manchester to go alton towers

JustAThought

marklazarcovic wrote: »

guess who booked flights and car rental on sunday evening for manchester to go alton towers

Feck. But there's be no joy in it knowing what had happened - and let's face it, with that kind of track record of repeated & unresolved failures would you feel fully comfortable riding the rides ? (!!!)

I gave up on irish rides (!) after crawling under one to get my wallet that had fallen out as I was whipped around & saw about 20 poorly balanced wedges of wood holding one of the legs of it up ~ I'd always assumed they were built & installed by engineers but I somehow doubt very much there are any qualifications needed or had for that job other than availability & ability to differentiate a red from a green button & take coins & give good change :0

I hear one guy lost both his legs. He was 19. Was no one bothered even looking before they plummeted them at 60mph into a steel cage > horror story

silverfeather

JustAThought wrote: »

Feck. But there's be no joy in it knowing what had happened - and let's face it, with that kind of track record of repeated & unresolved failures would you feel fully comfortable riding the rides ? (!!!)

No I know I wouldn't at all!