Ulster Bank League 2015-2016 Talk/Gossip/Rumours

lukey967

Tarf1234 wrote: »

Looking forward to a few games. Lansdowne v Nure standout game for me.

1A
Lansdowne v Nure - should tell us a lot about both teams. Looking forward to seeing Lansdowne really challenged at home.

Tarf v Ballynahinch - Tarf should take this. Ballynahinch seem to be struggling word is they've lost a lot of players. Hopefully Conor O'Brien back for tarf after inter pros

Garryowen v Con - will be interesting too. Judging by results so far you'd have to go with Con. Who I believe were unlucky not to win last week.

OB v Wegians - OB struggling for depth already but still think they'll be too good for wegians. Did well to get a BP last week with a player sent off after 20/30 mins. Slattery and Riordan hugely important to their season.

UCD v YM - UCD should have loads of academy lads again and will probably win. They won't enjoy player munsters though.

1B
Ballymena v Trinity - would have to back Ballymena. Interesting to see what trinners are like this week after the universities. Strong possibility of a literal hangover.

Buccs v Rock - Home advantage to take it for Buccs. Both look like they're going well so far.

Marys v Shannon - Hard to know where Marys are having only played Dolphin who look like the whipping boys this year. However, if they have fanj and their 20s players involved they should win fairly comfortably.

UL v Dolphin - Dolphin look like they are seriously struggling. UL win

Old Wes v B'Quins - One thing is for sure Wesley will score lots of points!! Must already be odds on to be the highest scoring team in all 5 div's. Apparently they love their astro and just know how to play on it better than anyone else can

Not going to do lower divisions as I'm have little or no knowledge on them!

Heard Con were very good in the 1st half last week against Lansdowne, then very poor in 2nd half. Same with lansdowne, poor in 1st half and improved in the 2nd half.
I think Young Quinlan, unfortunately, let Lansdowne off the hook!
This weekend will be interesting

madlad88

Im a 2A man so ill have a go:

Malone v Corinthians - Malone as Corinthians seem to be struggling to adapt to life in the 2nd division

Naas v UCC - Naas will have learned a lot from blowing a massive lead last week, would fancy their bigger pack to overpower UCC

Nenagh v Queens - Nenagh dont tend to loose at home but seeing as they will be very rusty, I would fancy Queens to win by a very slim margin.

Skerries v Cashel - Very hard to call, Skerries dont like losing at home but are struggling with injuries so i will say Cashel by a score.

Thomond v Ban - Thomond very strong at home but Ban were very impressive in 1st 2 games so Banbridge by a score.

Tarf1234

Exactly what I had heard. I think they'll really miss Gerry Hurley this year. Best 9 in the league for years and one of those Danny Riordan/Barry O'Mahony type players who could almost single handily win a match. Hopefully Quinlan learns and improves from it but I'd rather Daragh Lyons at 10 if I was a con man.

Really interested to see how Willie Staunton goes for the season for OB. Could prove to be a great signing but could easily backfire not work out and piss Crosbie off by pushing him to 12 consistently.

The Lost Sheep

Tarf1234 wrote: »

Looking forward to a few games. Lansdowne v Nure standout game for me.

1A
Lansdowne v Nure - should tell us a lot about both teams. Looking forward to seeing Lansdowne really challenged at home.

Tarf v Ballynahinch - Tarf should take this. Ballynahinch seem to be struggling word is they've lost a lot of players. Hopefully Conor O'Brien back for tarf after inter pros

Garryowen v Con - will be interesting too. Judging by results so far you'd have to go with Con. Who I believe were unlucky not to win last week.

OB v Wegians - OB struggling for depth already but still think they'll be too good for wegians. Did well to get a BP last week with a player sent off after 20/30 mins. Slattery and Riordan hugely important to their season.

UCD v YM - UCD should have loads of academy lads again and will probably win. They won't enjoy player munsters though.

1B
Ballymena v Trinity - would have to back Ballymena. Interesting to see what trinners are like this week after the universities. Strong possibility of a literal hangover.

Buccs v Rock - Home advantage to take it for Buccs. Both look like they're going well so far.

Marys v Shannon - Hard to know where Marys are having only played Dolphin who look like the whipping boys this year. However, if they have fanj and their 20s players involved they should win fairly comfortably.

UL v Dolphin - Dolphin look like they are seriously struggling. UL win

Old Wes v B'Quins - One thing is for sure Wesley will score lots of points!! Must already be odds on to be the highest scoring team in all 5 div's. Apparently they love their astro and just know how to play on it better than anyone else can

Not going to do lower divisions as I'm have little or no knowledge on them!

Hard to say on UCD/Munsters. As you say UCD wont enjoy things too much versus the cookies
Agree with you on Tarf, Con. Think Wegians will beat Belvo and Lansdowne to win.
In IB I think Trinity in spite of being away will do enough if they don't have too many injuries from the oxford trip. That final was Monday and they got some very good tests in 40 minute games over the 3 game days and they'll do ok bar above..
Buccs, Bohs, Shannon and Wesley to win others

madlad88 wrote: »

Im a 2A man so ill have a go:

Malone v Corinthians - Malone as Corinthians seem to be struggling to adapt to life in the 2nd division

Naas v UCC - Naas will have learned a lot from blowing a massive lead last week, would fancy their bigger pack to overpower UCC

Nenagh v Queens - Nenagh dont tend to lose at home but seeing as they will be very rusty, I would fancy Queens to win by a very slim margin.

Skerries v Cashel - Very hard to call, Skerries dont like losing at home but are struggling with injuries so i will say Cashel by a score.

Thomond v Ban - Thomond very strong at home but Ban were very impressive in 1st 2 games so Banbridge by a score.

Don't think Corinthians are struggling to adapt back in division 2 and may edge a win. Naas should beat UCC
I think Nenagh will still beat Queens. Very few sides as you say win there and they have had strong seconds sides out by looks of it and had a good friendly or two and they wont be very rusty and if they can survive first 30 minutes they'll win.
Cashel have been hit by injuries as well so hard to say how this goes. Thomond to win in Liam Fitz

lukey967

Tarf1234 wrote: »

Exactly what I had heard. I think they'll really miss Gerry Hurley this year. Best 9 in the league for years and one of those Danny Riordan/Barry O'Mahony type players who could almost single handily win a match. Hopefully Quinlan learns and improves from it but I'd rather Daragh Lyons at 10 if I was a con man.

Really interested to see how Willie Staunton goes for the season for OB. Could prove to be a great signing but could easily backfire not work out and piss Crosbie off by pushing him to 12 consistently.

Where has Gerry Hurley gone to? Still playing?

Tarf1234

Somewhere in France apparently. Not sure of club or league but assume pro2

The Lost Sheep

lukey967 wrote: »

Where has Gerry Hurley gone to? Still playing?

Playing federale 1 in France

Stainalert

Was at the Terenure Lansdowne game. Lansdowne were well on top. Terenure were missing their two first choice out halves and it showed. Peter Dooley for Lansdowne was outstanding. Terenure also got hit with a spate of injuries during the game. Finished up 24 10 to Lansdowne.

Leinster5

Good win for Lansdowne and from what I was told, Peter Dooley was the stand out player. I see that Rael was on the bench for Lansdowne last night, last I heard he was at Old Belvedere but interesting signing if that's true. I'd worry about Terenure to be honest, haven't convinced in those first 3 games from what I hear, Young Munster putting it up to UCD currently here at the Bowl and from what I hear, 'Tarf and 'Belvo are struggling in their games.

Squidgy Black

Can hardly say Clontarf are struggling, only team unbeaten so far in the league.

Stainalert

Garryowen and Lansdowne both unbeaten also 😀

The Lost Sheep

Didnt get a chance to go to a game but some surprising/interesting results. Munsters losing by that much is a surprise. Trinity holding Ballymena to that score considering the hangover from the World Universities competition...
Dolphin getting 3 penalty tries... i assume scrum dominance????

Division 1A:
Clontarf 38 Ballynahinch 17
Garryowen 23 Cork Constitution 19
Old Belvedere 24 Galwegians 12
UCD 56 Young Munster 22
Lansdowne 24 Terenure College 10

Division 1B:
Ballymena 35 Dublin University 24
Buccaneers 30 Blackrock College 28
St Mary's 45 Shannon 12
UL Bohemians 13 Dolphin 28(awarded 3 penalty tries!!!)
Old Wesley 33 Belfast Harlequins 8

Division 2A:
Malone 20 Corinthians 14
Naas 34 UCC 27
Nenagh Ormond 36 Queen's University 13
Skerries 40 Cashel 43
Thomond 22 Banbridge 21

Division 2B:
Bective Rangers 27 Rainey Old Boys 22
Armagh 15 Highfield 29
Dungannon 23 Greystones 17
Seapoint 28 MU Barnhall 30
Sunday's Well 18 City of Derry 23

Division 2C
Boyne 32 Sligo 13
Dundalk 7 Tullamore 39
Kanturk 11 Old Crescent 18
Midleton 21 Wanderers 15
Navan 15 Bruff 17

Tarf1234

Tarf were awful in the first half on Saturday. Ballynahinch looked very impressive then the complete opposite in second half. The McGrath brothers now have 8 tries in 3 games. Not a bad return for 1 family. Joey Carberry is looking like a fantastic signing. Scrum was a real worry.

I wonder if it will be a case of second season syndrome for the nure. Good side and plenty coming through from 20s but apparently Lansdowne were much the better side on Friday.

Stainalert

Tarf1234 wrote: »

Tarf were awful in the first half on Saturday. Ballynahinch looked very impressive then the complete opposite in second half. The McGrath brothers now have 8 tries in 3 games. Not a bad return for 1 family. Joey Carberry is looking like a fantastic signing. Scrum was a real worry.

I wonder if it will be a case of second season syndrome for the nure. Good side and plenty coming through from 20s but apparently Lansdowne were much the better side on Friday.

Terenure will be a lot better when they have a proper 10 at the helm. I think Young Munsters and Ballynahinch have good reason to be worried

unce09f

UCD really cleaning up in terms of getting the best school leavers to join them. Wouldn't be surprised to see James Ryan play some 1A this season for them if his injury problems don't flare up again.

Tarf1234

Always been the way. The kids just see the scholarship and jump. Really is not beneficial to the club game. They brag about all the 'stars' they 'create' but in reality it is a nonsense. The stars they 'produce' are clearly already well on their way before they have any contact with them.

Players who still need the extra coaching and development never seem to go any further while at UCD. Which is why a lot of them seem to quit or go elsewhere, where they will get the additional coaching and exposure they need.

This issue for me is potentially the biggest issue in Leinster rugby.

The Lost Sheep

unce09f wrote: »

UCD really cleaning up in terms of getting the best school leavers to join them. Wouldn't be surprised to see James Ryan play some 1A this season for them if his injury problems don't flare up again.

Themselves, Lansdowne always do. If Ryan is as good as people make him out to be he should be looking at playing AIL....

Tarf1234 wrote: »

Always been the way. The kids just see the scholarship and jump. Really is not beneficial to the club game. They brag about all the 'stars' they 'create' but in reality it is a nonsense. The stars they 'produce' are clearly already well on their way before they have any contact with them.

Players who still need the extra coaching and development never seem to go any further while at UCD. Which is why a lot of them seem to quit or go elsewhere, where they will get the additional coaching and exposure they need.

This issue for me is potentially the biggest issue in Leinster rugby.

Would say the drop out in playing numbers at 13-14 and 18-20 is the biggest issues alright.
The scholarships as such aren't the issue considering so few overall qualify for them and then less actually get one. Its the lack of a link through teenage years with a club for so many and the OTT obsession with a few competitions

Anyway full set of fixtures this weekend. Interestingly in 1A the 5 sides currently in 1st-5th place are all away this weekend....
Havent looked much more at the fixtures for a stand out game yet.....

Tarf1234

Always, makes me wonder about these young lads forgoing the opportunity to play AIL straight out of school, the UCD no freshers rule has always been a bit of an oddity to me.

Agreed on your point I more meant in relation to the high end of things.

Certainly the lack of link between young lads in schools playing and clubs is the biggest issue over all.

Tarf1234

Rock Marys should be interesting. Marys probably won't have Fanj not sure if they lose anyone else with the A game coming up.

I reckon Con UCD should be a great game and interested in seeing how Wegains v Lansdowne goes, Lansdowne could be down some fairly important players.

Unfortunately can't make it down to YM v Tarf. Always enjoy going down there, great club.

unce09f

The top leinster u20 players aren't worries about playing 1A this season, they are focused on getting into the irish u20 squad, working with the sub-academy and getting bulked up. Oh and avoiding injury.

Quite a few are getting scholarships and the benefits that come with that. If you get into UCD it's going to be pretty hard not to play for them and take up that scholarship if you're offered it.

unce09f

Tarf1234 wrote: »

Rock Marys should be interesting. Marys probably won't have Fanj not sure if they lose anyone else with the A game coming up.

I reckon Con UCD should be a great game and interested in seeing how Wegains v Lansdowne goes, Lansdowne could be down some fairly important players.

Unfortunately can't make it down to YM v Tarf. Always enjoy going down there, great club.

the 1st scheduled A game is in November?

unless there is a friendly that hasn't been announced.

The Lost Sheep

Tarf1234 wrote: »

Always, makes me wonder about these young lads forgoing the opportunity to play AIL straight out of school, the UCD no freshers rule has always been a bit of an oddity to me.

Agreed on your point I more meant in relation to the high end of things.

Certainly the lack of link between young lads in schools playing and clubs is the biggest issue over all.

The links should be there especially at under 15/18 grades and schools should work with clubs for "open" club competitions to allow kids go back and play club rugby to keep links.
I say UCD don't play freshers as they want them playing 20s and possibly feel its too much for most....
Like considering the numbers going to UCD each year how do UCD not have more sides fielding at 20s and the metro competitions....

unce09f wrote: »

The top leinster u20 players aren't worries about playing 1A this season, they are focused on getting into the irish u20 squad, working with the sub-academy and getting bulked up. Oh and avoiding injury.

Quite a few are getting scholarships too and the benefits that come with that. If you get into UCD it's going to be pretty hard not to play for them and take up that scholarship if you're offered it.

They should as its the natural progression for them. They are focused on irish 20s but that's just one part of the season. No Irish 20s games for at least 3 months. Yes there is training camps but they should be looking at AIL if they want to do well with 20s.

unce09f

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

They should as its the natural progression for them. They are focused on irish 20s but that's just one part of the season. No Irish 20s games for at least 3 months. Yes there is training camps but they should be looking at AIL if they want to do well with 20s.

it's largely irrelevant, Ross Byrne was the starting outhalf for Ireland u20 and he had never played 1A, same with Carberry. The list goes on and on. Going to UCD does a player no harm when it comes to playing irish u20.

i'm sure they all would have liked to play 1A but it's not a priority, they will play it eventually anyway.

The priority is doing what needs to be done to make the academy and that's usually playing irish u20 rugby, avoiding injury and working your ass off in the sub-academy.

Tarf1234

unce09f wrote: »

the 1st scheduled A game is in November?

unless there is a friendly that hasn't been announced.

There is a game on next Wednesday from what I have been told. not sure who is playing who but presume it is inter pro's

Tarf1234

unce09f wrote: »

it's largely irrelevant, Ross Byrne was the starting outhalf for Ireland u20 and he had never played 1A, same with Carberry. The list goes on and on. Going to UCD does a player no harm when it comes to playing irish u20.

i'm sure they all would have liked to play 1A but it's not a priority, they will play it eventually anyway.

The priority is doing what needs to be done to make the academy and that's usually playing irish u20 rugby, avoiding injury and working your ass off in the sub-academy.

It annoys me to agree with that but it is true to a certain extent. Conor O'Brien played in an AIL final last year and in plenty of AIL games for a top team (and excelled) and didn't make the squad. Then fairly average guys made the cut having not done much at under 20s even.

Being in Lansdowne and UCD is a huge boost it seems. Particularly Lansdowne while Ruddock was 20s coach of the national side. He told numerous guys that he 'hadn't seen enough of them' and used it as a bargaining chip during recruitment as well.

Stainalert

Tarf1234 wrote: »

It annoys me to agree with that but it is true to a certain extent. Conor O'Brien played in an AIL final last year and in plenty of AIL games for a top team (and excelled) and didn't make the squad. Then fairly average guys made the cut having not done much at under 20s even.

Being in Lansdowne and UCD is a huge boost it seems. Particularly Lansdowne while Ruddock was 20s coach of the national side. He told numerous guys that he 'hadn't seen enough of them' and used it as a bargaining chip during recruitment as well.

Do you seriously think the IRFU would have allowed Ruddock to be involved with 20's recruitment for Lansdowne? Do you think a professional coach would jeopardise his career and reputation by engaging in such activity?

Re Conor O'Brien it was Nigel Carolan who didn't select O'Brien and not Ruddock.

Is it not the case that a lot of the good players were recruited by UCD and Lansdowne and then made their way onto the U20s by what they did in their Inter Pro's and their clubs rather than vice versa?

ArmchairQB

Plenty of other so called scholarships being offered by UCD such as accommodation, points, Registration Fees, and living allowance as well as the full scholarship so not as limited as people may think and as has been said hard to turn down. Most of the premier squad and a good portion of pennant squad will have been offered some enticement from UCD. Only supposed to be allowed offer Ad Astra but in reality offer large amounts of other enticements I know plenty of lads getting some or all of above. The main worry is that Leinster and the IRFU like their sub academy players in colleges and clubs will be coming more irrelevant. Players get duped or star struck but realise quickly they need to move on to get noticed or improve. Such as Byrne and Carberry to Clontarf which has been a very positive move for both

Senior Transfer window closes at midnight tonight, will probably be a few late arrivals at one or two clubs. This weekend will be interesting great to see old battles such as Rock & Marys taking place in 1b with the good weather they will hopefully attract a big crowd. Both sets of supporters will be looking at Marys Coach Peter Smith:) League table will be interesting come Saturday evening.

SA09

unce09f wrote: »

it's largely irrelevant, Ross Byrne was the starting outhalf for Ireland u20 and he had never played 1A, same with Carberry. The list goes on and on. Going to UCD does a player no harm when it comes to playing irish u20.

i'm sure they all would have liked to play 1A but it's not a priority, they will play it eventually anyway.

The priority is doing what needs to be done to make the academy and that's usually playing irish u20 rugby, avoiding injury and working your ass off in the sub-academy.

Fairly certain both Ross Byrne and Carberry played 1A with UCD and no doubt it would have made them better players by playing at this level each week

Tarf1234

Stainalert wrote: »

Do you seriously think the IRFU would have allowed Ruddock to be involved with 20's recruitment for Lansdowne? Do you think a professional coach would jeopardise his career and reputation by engaging in such activity?

Re Conor O'Brien it was Nigel Carolan who didn't select O'Brien and not Ruddock.

Is it not the case that a lot of the good players were recruited by UCD and Lansdowne and then made their way onto the U20s by what they did in their Inter Pro's and their clubs rather than vice versa?

From what I've been told, from very senior and reliable sources, it was one of the the primary points behind Nucifera sacking Ruddock. I personally know people who were recruited following lengthy conversations with Mike Ruddock, as is the norm with most AIL coaches.

On Conor O'Brien I am aware of that. It was more of a general point.

Don't 100% agree on your last point obviously players like Ross Byrne, Gary Ringrose are always going to go to World Cups. Selection bankers like them are not the norm though. Other players selected tend to be from a select few clubs as they are the only clubs they are seen in i.e. the only sides the 20s coaches go to.

Inter pro's is a very short window and is a long time before 6Nations and JWC and at that age time is a huge deal. Don't really think inter pro's is ideal for using as a reference point.

Tarf1234

SA09 wrote: »

Fairly certain both Ross Byrne and Carberry played 1A with UCD and no doubt it would have made them better players by playing at this level each week

I don't think Carberry did last year. Not sure on Ross Byrne. Byrne certainly didn't play much if he did play at all.

Carberry is definitely benefiting from playing seniors this year already in a club environment. Looks excellent to date, and I think will learn a lot more playing consistently in a an experienced team rather than a youthful UCD side.