Just be honest with yourself. You're not a Catholic. That's ok.

beauf

Zamboni wrote: »

I'm sorry that is what you are getting from this thread.
It is really to raise awareness of the practical implications to future parents that their current self identification can affect how the children will access education. Outlined (non-angrily) here
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=95016362&postcount=152

In a thread with a title about being honest. You should have made that blatantly clear in the title and the original post.

There was no need for the merry go around about religion. Its not about religion. Its about school places. But you've gone from A to B via Z.

Macavity.

Eugene Norman wrote: »

Are you confusing debate with lack of free speech?.

No, I'm pointing out that a lot of posts are merely semantics and whataboutery, and that of which you call "debate", are at best, a pathetic attempt to silence others with valid and reasonable concerns regarding various religions.

SparkySpitfire

crockholm wrote: »

And you want to achieve this for you future Children how exactly?Have the thought police run tests? Lie -detector tests? A quiz on Canon-Law?:pac:

Don't worry about the kids,they'll be all right wherever they are.My siblings and I had Nuns teaching us in school and all bar one are good atheists/agnostics

It's called being honest. Something God would have you do rather than "bear false witness".

I also went to a Catholic school and was scarred for life. If things don't change here and fast, I'm out. And I'm certainly not the only one who will be.

SparkySpitfire

Eugene Norman wrote: »

Precisely because it annoys the new atheist I'll stick to calling myself Catholic although I haven't believed since I was 8.

Yeah go ahead and do that. Give the rest of the 5 year olds in the country a run for their money in the biggest tantrum competition.

You might even win a hat.

Zamboni

beauf wrote: »

In a thread with a title about being honest. You should have made that blatantly clear in the title and the original post.

There was no need for the merry go around about religion. Its not about religion. Its about school places. But you've gone from A to B via Z.

I do indeed mention this in the first paragraph of the OP.

Ghost Buster

catallus wrote: »

The pagan hordes, in their wilful blindness, revel in their sinfulness; but that is not enough to sate the demons of avarice and pride in their collective soul! They are dazzled at the bliss of the faithful as one is dazzled by the brilliance of the sun, and the arid despair which is their ultimate lot causes such baleful wailing and desperate gnashing of teeth, who knows in what circle of hell they languish! Knowing their fate is due to their own nescience, how can they bear to know their true God?!!

Oh look. You dont know what a pagan is.

beauf

Zamboni wrote: »

If I did that it would have been moved to the parenting forum.
This is purposely targeting future parents and the wider user base of AH. I do indeed mention this in the first paragraph of the OP.

You need to more than mention it. If you get school places where you want, religion becomes a non issue. If its school places that is the sole objective.

You need to influence the school board who dictate ethos and enrolment policy. They can change those without changes to anything else.

At least one school operates a positive discrimination/quota to encourage diversity.

orestes

The vast majority of the Irish catholic population today are protestants who don't understand the difference between catholicism and protestantism due to generations of secterian madness, and think that the only alternative to catholicism is athiesm.

crockholm

SparkySpitfire wrote: »

It's called being honest. Something God would have you do rather than "bear false witness".

I also went to a Catholic school and was scarred for life. If things don't change here and fast, I'm out. And I'm certainly not the only one who will be.

As a human being,I know when to,and when not to use honesty,it is an atavistic trait we have. As an agnostic teethering on the edge of atheism,I find that what "God" wants does not reflect my decisions or how I got there.

Now the next bit is contentious,but please bear with me,I do not wish to diminish any hurt that you experienced during your schooldays.
I get the feeling that you are younger than I am (36) and would therefore find it strange that you could have been subjected to such brutality,done by the religious orders that has henceforth scarred your Life.

This debate aside,I hope that you can be at Peace with yourself someday and don't suffer in silence.

Ghost Buster

catallus wrote: »

The pagan hordes, in their wilful blindness, revel in their sinfulness; but that is not enough to sate the demons of avarice and pride in their collective soul! They are dazzled at the bliss of the faithful as one is dazzled by the brilliance of the sun, and the arid despair which is their ultimate lot causes such baleful wailing and desperate gnashing of teeth, who knows in what circle of hell they languish! Knowing their fate is due to their own nescience, how can they bear to know their true God?!!

Oh look. You dont know what a pagan is.

mailforkev

orestes wrote: »

The vast majority of the Irish catholic population today are protestants who don't understand the difference between catholicism and protestantism due to generations of secterian madness, and think that the only alternative to catholicism is athiesm.

This, I've always thought this. Friends of my parents made the switch a few years ago.

Most Irish Christians would be much better served by the Church of Ireland for their spiritual needs. Same god but without some of the mad belief stuff and especially without the decades long criminal behaviour.

But it's associated with "the Brits" so gets no consideration from the "Catholics".

Edit: I use the quotation marks for the pretend "Catholics" rather than those who do actually practice what they preach and whom I respect their right to believe.

SpaceSasqwatch

I see myself as a lapsed zombie worshipper

elstingeo

What's the real purpose of this thread? Why does the OP feel the need to document the declining number of Irish Catholics?

I feel that this thread, especially in the after hours forum is going to cause arguments that are thinly veiled as debates. Does the OP study sociology and spiritual matters?

I think that religion is an extremely touchy subject in Ireland for obvious reasons that we can all identify with.

Common sense dictates that why wouldn't anyone do the following things you outlined for the benefit of their family in the future, for example, school places, keeping family happy etc.

I respect peoples beliefs but if Ireland would like to take a move in the modern direction and begin to understand why so many people have lost or given up their faith and even a possibly of separation of church and state

Macy0161

wench wrote: »

The CSO worship at the altar of the Almighty Time Series.

Changing the question would break the link to previous answers, and that is something they are loath to do.

I get that. I meant a follow up question. They follow up do you work?, with what sector, with how you get there, how long it takes etc.

Moved to Atheism and Agnosticism forum following discussion with OP and A&A forum mod. Please read A&A charter before posting. Thank you.

looksee

But we already know we are not Catholics in here? What do we have to be honest about?

magicbastarder

Shenshen wrote: »

However, I'm given to understand that if you were baptised in Ireland, you no longer have the option to opt-out. The church decided to not accept your letter of defection any more a few years back.

it's not an opt out; the previous process (no longer being used) was that a note would be placed in the baptismal roll stating you no longer consider yourself catholic.
not being able to do this anymore does absolutely nothing to prevent you from not considering yourself a catholic - the baptismal roll is a historical document proving you were baptised. it does not mean you are a catholic against your will.

Zamboni

looksee wrote: »

But we already know we are not Catholics in here? What do we have to be honest about?

I think it is a bit redundant here too tbh. Preaching to the deconverted so to speak.
Perhaps SW would like it in Christianity...

Staph

To be honest, the a la cartes are hardly going to be looking up the Christianity forum either!

kylith

Staph wrote: »

To be honest, the a la cartes are hardly going to be looking up the Christianity forum either!

Just what I was thinking.

Best to stick it back in AH in the run up to the next census I reckon.

beauf

Considering the thread is to get people who can't be bothered to "de-register" themselves, or practise their religion, to be proactive about something else. The phrase know your audience comes to mind. I think you'd be better to appeal to like minded people in your local area about your local school.

robindch

looksee wrote: »

But we already know we are not Catholics in here?

Catholics do drop by from time to time and are as welcome as everybody else. Not quite so sure about some hardline catholic opinions though.

fisgon

ChunkyLover54 wrote: »

I'm happy to identify myself as Catholic even though I don't practice and I have no supernatural beliefs. I was baptised and raised Catholic so I don't see any contradiction in this.

The problem with the OP is that he comes across as snotty and, ironically, preachy.

Is this a joke? You have no supernatural beliefs, and you're Catholic? Are you serious? This kind of nonsense is exactly what the OP is talking about.

You can call yourself what you want, but by definition, if you have no supernatural beliefs you are not a catholic. As mentioned in another post, it's like saying that you are a vegetarian while scoffing down a big steak every night.

looksee

fisgon wrote: »

Is this a joke? You have no supernatural beliefs, and you're Catholic? Are you serious? This kind of nonsense is exactly what the OP is talking about.

You can call yourself what you want, but by definition, if you have no supernatural beliefs you are not a catholic. As mentioned in another post, it's like saying that you are a vegetarian while scoffing down a big steak every night.

You are asking someone who claims to be religious to be rational as well? :pac:

techdiver

_Whimsical_ wrote: »

The census thing is befuddling, as is the reaction to it. 84% of people identify themselves as Catholic yet there's widespread disbelief and complete non acceptance that this could be true.

Are we to believe that the vast majority of those people are stupid,incapable of understanding what being catholic means, have their staunchly catholic manipulative mother fill in their census form for them?

Yes!

coffee_cake

Having it in here only fuels the 'this could only be said by those evil atheists' idea when there really was at least one priest saying the same
I must go dig out who it was

Could belong in the christianity forum either so they can discuss if they're catholics or really protestants

kylith

looksee wrote: »

You are asking someone who claims to be religious to be rational as well? :pac:

And more than one person said that they intended to continue to put it on the census just to stick it to [us].

Zamboni

bluewolf wrote: »

Having it in here only fuels the 'this could only be said by those evil atheists' idea when there really was at least one priest saying the same
I must go dig out who it was

Could belong in the christianity forum either so they can discuss if they're catholics or really protestants

I agree. This is a national issue were people need to realise the impacts of their choices.
There is a national facade being continued and peope only spot the difficulty when they realise they have to pretend to be Catholic to get a state funded school place. These people don't frequent A&A, Education, Religion or Parenting because they may not have children yet or religion may not even be a feature in their day to day life.
That's why I posted in AH :-)

shruikan2553

bluewolf wrote: »

Having it in here only fuels the 'this could only be said by those evil atheists' idea when there really was at least one priest saying the same
I must go dig out who it was

Could belong in the christianity forum either so they can discuss if they're catholics or really protestants

It will become giving out about the atheists who think they know so much and how protestants arent real Christians without realizing their hypocrisy.

lukesmom

I'm Catholic, a practising Catholic and I respect atheists for their non beliefs and I also very much respect them for telling the truth about where they stand with their non beliefs. It's the pretend Catholics I take issue with.