More shots fired in Paris (Breaking)

_Brian

Patrick2010 wrote: »

Thanks, maybe you can suggest a couple of books I can read that will enlighten me on what wonderful leaders Ghaddafi and Sadaam Hussein were, beloved by their people?

Maybe you should read up about how western powers either brought these men to power or supported them in various wars against their neighbors because it suited western interests..
Western powers have long abused their positions by interfering in these regions politics, alliances and leadership. What we are seeing is partly as a result of this ongoing policy.

drumswan

_Brian wrote: »

What we are seeing is partly as a result of this ongoing policy.

What we are seeing is a result of perceived attacks on the Prophet Mohammed by satirical cartoonists using their liberal democratic right to freedom of speech, despite people like you wishing to blame the victim.

_Brian

drumswan wrote: »

What we are seeing is a result of perceived attacks on the Prophet Mohammed by satirical cartoonists using their liberal democratic right to freedom of speech, despite people like you wishing to blame the victim.

I said partly as a result !!
I'm not blaming anyone nor defending anyone, no sane person could defend or support these incidents..

Its just crazy for people to go about their lives believing that this was a totally unprovoked attack on the west. Being so narrow minded as to only see things from one perspective is partly how we've got to where we are.

Western countries interfere for gain in muslim majority countries, this is a fact. This has given extremists a fight with the west and something to build their ranks on. They see the shooting of innocent westerners as being no different to the killing of Muslim civilians by US drones.

These things are all intrinsically linked, we can't partition off the unscrupulous actions of western forces from the rise in hate held by extremist muslims towards westerners, its all part of the overall problem.

Egginacup

The Diabolical Monocle wrote: »

Did I say there was no Al-Qaeda or Taliban in Afghanistan or anywhere until the west created them.

no.

Did I say there was no ISIS in Iraq or Syria until the West created them.
Created them, funded them or created the conditions for the need for them.

no.

Did I say or even allude that the west is somehow blameless.

no.


If you move nato forces out of Muslim countries now the extremist networks such as the Taliban, al-quaeda, isil - will strengthen - as I said, and you will see more 9/11's, 7/11's and journalists murdered. Fact.
Read it for what its says. Not what your pathetic politically sensitive ego wants it to say.

I work in fact. You work in propaganda.

You won't find me constantly supporting America or the west on this forum.
Ill readily condemn the west.

Yet, when you say something on here its almost inevitably from a pro-Russian anti-west point of view.

You are the RT of boards.

Try arguing what I say, rather than what you'd like me to say (or represent) if you can.

But you won't, because you can't, because what I said is simply true.

But feel free to wriggle about and bring up the nazi's or the Algerian resistance.

What are you talking about? What facts do you claim to deal in? You say if NATO forces are pulled out then existing extremist elements there will strengthen. You say this as if you know it for a fact like you can read the future. The same rubbish was spewed out by narrow-minded, clueless, duckspeakers when the US was occupying Vietnam. "If we pull out, it'll be a bloodbath!" Like they knew this for fact. "If we pull out the Domino Theory will kick in and every country from Thailand to New Zealand will be a commie hellhole!". It was utter rubbish...similar to the rubbish you speak. When they were finally kicked out instead of pulling out none of those inane predictions came true. Why?.. because they were inane.

But the people who have a vested interest in keeping these countries destabilised and keeping these wars going can count on people like you to back them because you'll always fall for the bullshit. You'll always fall for the absurd predictions and pathetic rationalisations. You say that everything I say is from a pro-Russian, anti-west perspective. I knew I could count on you to pigeonhole. When someone points out an ugly truth, one that people like you would rather not hear then you have a meltdown and accuse them of bias or being a tinfoiler or some equally infantile jibe. Question western lies about Ukraine and all of a sudden you're a pro-Russian "putinbot", express outrage at Israeli bulldozers leveling some guy's house to make way for "settlers" (a term less offensive than "planters") and you're an anti-Semite.

You talk about the truth but you throw insults when you have to face a truth you don't like or that contradicts your skewed and clueless worldview. I guess it really is a lot easier to fool someone than to actually convince them they've been fooled.

Gatling

Some people are plain and simple incapable of seeing the truth

Egginacup

Patrick2010 wrote: »

Thanks, maybe you can suggest a couple of books I can read that will enlighten me on what wonderful leaders Ghaddafi and Sadaam Hussein were, beloved by their people?

You see that's the kind of mentality we're dealing with. Immature, petty and flippant little quips that carry no discernible value just vapidity.

Roger Hassenforder

Egginacup wrote: »

You see that's the kind of mentality we're dealing with. Immature, petty and flippant little quips that carry no discernible value just vapidity.

I'm waiting patiently for a few of your recommendations too

Egginacup

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

Nato didn't attack Libya, they intervened at the request of the NTC.
Out of curiosity what books would you recommend?

The willingness to fall for these tricks is depressing. Saying that the NTC asked NATO to ruthlessly bomb civilian areas of Libya is akin to NATO staging a brutal invasion and occupation of Ukraine and then claiming they were "asked" to help by the bought-and-paid-for neo-nazi thugs that they installed in the first place.
If you're really interested in books then PM me.

Egginacup

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

I'm waiting patiently for a few of your recommendations too

Are you aware that Ghadaffi was not a brutal, authoritarian dictator like he was portrayed in the bullshit western press? Within Libya he had very little executive power at all.

Patrick2010

Egginacup wrote: »

The willingness to fall for these tricks is depressing. Saying that the NTC asked NATO to ruthlessly bomb civilian areas of Libya is akin to NATO staging a brutal invasion and occupation of Ukraine and then claiming they were "asked" to help by the bought-and-paid-for neo-nazi thugs that they installed in the first place.
If you're really interested in books then PM me.

Its an open forum, just put your recommendations up here. I'd even settle for a few website suggestions so I can enlighten myself on what shapes your world view.

Roger Hassenforder

Egginacup wrote: »

Are you aware that Ghadaffi was not a brutal, authoritarian dictator like he was portrayed in the bullshit western press? Within Libya he had very little executive power at all.

Suggested reading material please.

And references to these claims.
Did he not base his judicial system on sharia law. Among other benevolent acts.

Patrick2010

Egginacup wrote: »

Are you aware that Ghadaffi was not a brutal, authoritarian dictator like he was portrayed in the bullshit western press? Within Libya he had very little executive power at all.

Not a brutal rapist for a start?, did all those Libyan women and school girls make it up at the behest of the western media?

supersean1999

The egg is being kept in his shell here.

Roger Hassenforder

supersean1999 wrote: »

The egg is being kept in his shell here.

Egg?
You there?


Maybe an Israeli drone got him

Gatling

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

Egg?
You there?


Maybe an Israeli drone got him

Holiday in Moscow

humanji

MOD: Folks, if you've a problem with a user, report them or ignore them. If you continue to bitch about people, you'll get a smack with the banhammer.

bear1

How do people think this will end? Final shootout with the police or will they simply vanish?
Reports are that two men were seen running into a sizeable forest outside of Paris. Hope they get the punishment they deserve...

sjb25

bear1 wrote: »

How do people think this will end? Final shootout with the police or will they simply vanish?
Reports are that two men were seen running into a sizeable forest outside of Paris. Hope they get the punishment they deserve...

They'll get a few bullets I'd say and that's what the deserve

bear1

I'd be more happy with them spending their sorry excuse of a life in solitary confinement.

sjb25

bear1 wrote: »

I'd be more happy with them spending their sorry excuse of a life in solitary confinement.

Maybe so but they will want to martyr themselves I'd say......

bear1

sjb25 wrote: »

Maybe so but they will want to martyr themselves I'd say......

Taser should stop that idea

sjb25

bear1 wrote: »

Taser should stop that idea

Meh if they are pointing an AK47 at police u can be sure that the police won't be drawing a taser

bear1

sjb25 wrote: »

Meh if they are pointing an AK47 at police u can be sure that the police won't be drawing a taser

Ah yeah, I'd forgotten about the AKs.

Duggy747

Still got that RPG too

bear1

Duggy747 wrote: »

Still got that RPG too

Shootout it is then.

sjb25

bear1 wrote: »

Ah yeah, I'd forgotten about the AKs.

Yeah be nice to bring then to justice and all that but I've a feeling if they are in that wood they may be coming out in a bag hopefully they hit no more officers or member of the public

phildin

@Roger Hassendorfer, regarding books, I recommend anything by Dillip Hiro. "Iraq" is a good one to start with, it predates the 2001 invasion so it gives a very insightful account of life under the sactions. I really don't think he's pro-Saddam but he conveys the sentiment expressed most frequently to him by Iraqis which is that Saddam put them in harms way but the US carried out the harm. After that, Secrets and Lies is also very good.

The Diabolical Monocle

Egginacup wrote: »

What are you talking about? What facts do you claim to deal in? You say if NATO forces are pulled out then existing extremist elements there will strengthen. You say this as if you know it for a fact like you can read the future. The same rubbish was spewed out by narrow-minded, clueless, duckspeakers when the US was occupying Vietnam. "If we pull out, it'll be a bloodbath!" Like they knew this for fact. "If we pull out the Domino Theory will kick in and every country from Thailand to New Zealand will be a commie hellhole!". It was utter rubbish...similar to the rubbish you speak. When they were finally kicked out instead of pulling out none of those inane predictions came true. Why?.. because they were inane.

But the people who have a vested interest in keeping these countries destabilised and keeping these wars going can count on people like you to back them because you'll always fall for the bullshit. You'll always fall for the absurd predictions and pathetic rationalisations. You say that everything I say is from a pro-Russian, anti-west perspective. I knew I could count on you to pigeonhole. When someone points out an ugly truth, one that people like you would rather not hear then you have a meltdown and accuse them of bias or being a tinfoiler or some equally infantile jibe. Question western lies about Ukraine and all of a sudden you're a pro-Russian "putinbot", express outrage at Israeli bulldozers leveling some guy's house to make way for "settlers" (a term less offensive than "planters") and you're an anti-Semite.

You talk about the truth but you throw insults when you have to face a truth you don't like or that contradicts your skewed and clueless worldview. I guess it really is a lot easier to fool someone than to actually convince them they've been fooled.

First off - as with certain genuine halfwits on this site, who shall go un-named, you have tended towards referencing cherry picked conflicts from the past and presenting them as evidence of how the future will span out.

Well now thats a patently flawed concept as the past will quite obviously be taken into account by people in charge of .... oh I dunno, entire fvcking nations and armies, rather than just people sitting around browsing furry pron and forums while stupidly believing that yesterdays fight IS both todays and tomorrows.

(just a brief moment to point out that associating my entirely grounded prediction to an invented scenario of a communist domino theory from the 80's is simply nonsensical)

I dont care about vested interests or how much of a bad guy nato or the US is. Im sure theres a list as long as my arm of charges for them to answer - nothing to do with what I said, so call Joe.

Radical Islam is like a fire, theres no point in extinguishing a good portion of it and walking away. Not when all thats required for 72 virgins is a simple assault rifle. It relies on an ignorant impoverished population that will do as its told by regional warlords and self elected spokesmen for god, that is its fuel source.

Nato has kindly murdered or bought off many of these warlords, built up the Afghan military as best it could to over 200,000 and won over locals, and removed ignorance and poverty to an extent where it could. Kindly preventing some uneducated manipulated individuals with zero previous opportunities or freedom in life from inconveniencing my air travel.

In the given circumstances, and I don't really give a fvck how they occurred right now, there is no better approach to preventing and reversing the growth of that contagious culture.

Theres a problem, theres a best available solution. That is all.

Then again.... maybe if left alone it will all magically go away.

And its not an issue of me pigeonholing you. I call it like I see it. And I dont see it through blue or red tinted shades. Unlike yourself - a simple glance at your profile will reveal your level of objectivity Commrade - not that Ive previously called you a putinbot, but whoever did got it right. Try reading whats on your screen objectively for a change - not everything is intended as an affront to your overly sensitive politics.