Britian's poorest going hungry: Are we heading the same way?

smcgiff

garp wrote: »

A lot of the food poverty in this country is in relation to children. I was very horrified when a teacher friend informed me that his school had started a "breakfast club" because children were arriving into school hungry, Mondays being the worst.
Poverty is never a choice.

Food clubs are great, in most cases parents know they'll get fed in school and budget accordingly.

garp wrote: »

Poverty is never a choice.

That's a pretty meaningless comment.

Beaner1

garp wrote: »

That's not a link. At best it is an incomplete web site address which leads to a web site with LOTS of info on it.
Provide the link to your info.

Find it yourself.

I've posted a referenced fact. You've posted nothing.

SEPT 23 1989

breakfast clubs?

have these so called parents no fcuking shame?:mad:

garp

smcgiff wrote: »

Food clubs are great, in most cases parents know they'll get fed in school and budget accordingly.



That's a pretty meaningless comment.

So..... Are you saying that before the food club was set up that the parents of the children involved thought that if they let the little mites go into school hungry that they would be able to have a few more pints out with the gang next Friday night and that the school would pick up the slack in regard to the hungry wanes.

Its only a pretty meaningless comment if you can afford to ignore it.

SEPT 23 1989

garp wrote: »

So..... Are you saying that before the food club was set up that the parents of the children involved thought that if they let the little mites go into school hungry that they would be able to have a few more pints out with the gang next Friday night and that the school would pick up the slack in regard to the hungry wanes.

Its only a pretty meaningless comment if you can afford to ignore it.

A bag of porridge and a couple of litres of milk is less than a tenner

there is no excuse for a kid going without breakfast

steddyeddy

smcgiff wrote: »

Re foodbanks, it would be interesting for an unbiased survey for the reasons of why people found themselves in the situation.

I agree that a more educated populace would improve the food poverty levels. But a state can only intervene so much.

We're operating under different hypothesis. The rise in food poverty (whatever its reasons) correlates positively with recessions. It would be unlikely that you could simply correlate an increase in food poverty with bad budgeting.

Merrion

According to these stats Ireland has had a slightly higher per capita calories per day (3612) than the UK (3458) for every recent year except 2005. Both massively higher than Japan (2812) which we don't consider to be a nation of starvation risk.. In fact the much derided "fat Americans" only passed Ireland in 2002.

That said, these statistics don't break down calories into food vs drink...

steddyeddy

Beaner1 wrote: »

Find it yourself.

I've posted a referenced fact. You've posted nothing.

No you posted one variable to explain a multi variable phenomenon.

smcgiff

steddyeddy wrote: »

It would be unlikely that you could simply correlate an increase in food poverty with bad budgeting.

What has it increased from? Genuinely didn't see that bit.

Beaner1

steddyeddy wrote: »

No you posted one variable to explain a multi variable phenomenon.

What variables do you need?
Price of food.
Average income
Welfare rates.

Food has getting easier and easier to afford. It's all on the CSO.

garp

Beaner1 wrote: »

Food has never been cheaper.
Source: CSO

Beaner1 wrote: »

CSO.ie

Beaner1 wrote: »

Find it yourself.

I've posted a referenced fact. You've posted nothing.

You have posted nothing of the sort. You have not even supplied a valid website address to support your "FACT"
Source: Beaner!'s A**.

Link
http://www.barnardos.ie/what-we-do/our-services/specialist-services/breakfast-clubs.html

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/breakfast-club-boosting-school-attendances-in-city-26078306.html Published 2001

smcgiff

garp wrote: »

So..... Are you saying that before the food club was set up that the parents of the children involved thought that if they let the little mites go into school hungry that they would be able to have a few more pints out with the gang next Friday night and that the school would pick up the slack in regard to the hungry wanes.

I do think some parents regardless of class or wealth do not care for their children properly.

With poor families this will manifest in some children not being fed properly due to other priorities. Is this something you'd disagree with?

garp

smcgiff wrote: »

I do think some parents regardless of class or wealth do not care for their children properly.

With poor families this will manifest in some children not being fed properly due to other priorities. Is this something you'd disagree with?

NO.
In some cases.
And yes Porridge (yuck)and water can do the trick, but what if you did not/could not pay the esb bill last week.

qt3.14

I know there was a Tory recently attacked for saying much the same thing, but really, people need to be taught how to cook. On a tight budget, things can get an awful lot tighter when it largely goes on processed products especially "kids food" potato waffles, fish fingers, beans etc.

steddyeddy

Merrion wrote: »

According to these stats Ireland has had a slightly higher per capita calories per day (3612) than the UK (3458) for every recent year except 2005. Both massively higher than Japan (2812) which we don't consider to be a nation of starvation risk.. In fact the much derided "fat Americans" only passed Ireland in 2002.

That said, these statistics don't break down calories into food vs drink...

Obesity isn't simply calories in VS calories out. There are many factors such as where you get your calories from. I realise the physical meaning of the calorie is constant in thermodynamic terms but that doesn't translate to complex biology and quantum biology.

Say you have one calorie or glucose and one calorie of oleic acid. Both are one calorie but they send out completely different signals upon digestion. One will produce a surge of insulin and the other won't to the same degree.

Beaner1

garp wrote: »

You have posted nothing of the sort. You have not even supplied a valid website address to support your "FACT"
Source: Beaner!'s A**.

Link
http://www.barnardos.ie/what-we-do/our-services/specialist-services/breakfast-clubs.html

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/breakfast-club-boosting-school-attendances-in-city-26078306.html Published 2001

CSO.ie is a valid address.
I've publish many academic papers and I know how to reference.

smcgiff

garp wrote: »

....but what if you did not/could not pay the esb bill last week.

What do you suggest be done for those that cannot budget properly, reward them with more social welfare?

steddyeddy

qt3.14 wrote: »

I know there was a Tory recently attacked for saying much the same thing, but really, people need to be taught how to cook. On a tight budget, things can get an awful lot tighter when it largely goes on processed products especially "kids food" potato waffles, fish fingers, beans etc.

She didn't say that. She said poor people need to learn how to cook.

Beaner1

garp wrote: »

NO.
In some cases.
And yes Porridge (yuck)and water can do the trick, but what if you did not/could not pay the esb bill last week.

Food is the first bill you pay.

Gyrocream

Food is more affordable than any time in history.

garp

smcgiff wrote: »

What do you suggest be done for those that cannot budget properly, reward them with more social welfare?

Who said they were not working.??

Streetwalker

FG have done everything in their power to protect societies well off from the destruction of our economy. That was no surprise, what is a surprise is how meekly the Irish people accepted it. Food poverty is here and now in Ireland and will get worse as the income gap grows.

smcgiff

garp wrote: »

Who said they were not working.??

Why are they not on FIS?

qt3.14

steddyeddy wrote: »

She didn't say that. She said poor people need to learn how to cook.

Only direct quotes I could find:

She said: “We have lost a lot of our cookery skills. Poor people do not know how to cook.”
She added: “I had a large bowl of porridge today, which cost 4p. A large bowl of sugary cereals will cost you 25p.”
She told BBC Radio 4’s World At One: “What I meant was as a society we have lost our ability to cook. That seems no longer to be handed down in the way that it was by previous generations.
“I am well aware that I made a mistake in saying it and apologise to anybody who’s been offended by it.
“The point is valid. If people today had the cooking skills that previous generations had, none of us would be eating so much pre-prepared food.”

I don't disagree, other than the blanket statement that all poor people don't know how to cook. Many don't though. And poor people by definition have less disposable income to waste on processed food that's more expensive per calorie.

smcgiff

Streetwalker wrote: »

FG have done everything in their power to protect societies well off from the destruction of our economy. That was no surprise, what is a surprise is how meekly the Irish people accepted it. Food poverty is here and now in Ireland and will get worse as the income gap grows.

The other way of looking at it, 90% of people are getting at least the basics right.

Do you think it is possible to micro manage 100% of the people to ensure they feed themselves properly?

Even back in the boom an unemployment rate of approx 5% was considered full employment, why was that do you think?

garp

Beaner1 wrote: »

CSO.ie is a valid address.
I've publish many academic papers and I know how to reference.

I hope that you supply better links in your many academic papers then you do here.

http://www.cso.ie/en/index.html

Is the front page of the site.
Where is your "Fact" on this page.

An analysis of consistent poverty rates by principal economic status shows that the consistent poverty rate is highest among
individuals who were unemployed (19.2%) and individuals who were not at work due to illness or disability (17.6%). Individuals who
were at work had the lowest consistent poverty rate at 1.9%. An analysis of the rates by household composition shows that individuals
living in households where there was one adult and one or more children under 18 continued to have the highest consistent poverty rate
in 2012 at 17.4%. The consistent poverty rate for individuals living in households where there was one adult aged under 65 and no
children under 18 was also high at just over 16%. See table 2.

Page 6

http://www.cso.ie/en/media/csoie/releasespublications/documents/silc/2012/silc_2012.pdf

garp

Beaner1 wrote: »

Food is the first bill you pay.

Not Rent..?

garp

smcgiff wrote: »

Why are they not on FIS?

I dont know.
Pride.
Arrogance.

smcgiff

garp wrote: »

I dont know.
Pride.
Arrogance.

If this is a real case they'll need to look into that.

steddyeddy

smcgiff wrote: »

What has it increased from? Genuinely didn't see that bit.

Less income more outgoings. Often less income due to inequality of opportunity.