Top Gear kicked out of Argentina - World gone mad?

I am pie

cdeb wrote: »

Thing is, this is all the detractors have to go on. "You honestly believe...?"

Not really enough grounds to suggest a person was deliberately antagonising a nation and deserved to be stoned.

Just looking for some proof of the statements being made is all. I'm sure you'll agree that "Do you honestly believe...?" isn't proof.

I am not suggesting he was trying to antagonise a nation. He was playing to the braying fools in the cheap seats.

I'll rephrase, as you seem to be struggling with the basic concepts of probability.

The chances of this number plate being coincidentally chosen are billions to 1. I chose to side with mathmatical probability rather than inanely clinging to the "what, no..err, I never noticed" angle.

I will enjoy returning to laugh at you when the filming and innuendo contained therein confirms.

BBDBB

Peist2007 wrote: »

Nope, people (coincidentally those on Top Gear's side in this issue) were starting to debate the merits of the Falklands War. A clear attempt to muddy the waters of the core issue and a clear indication of the bias involved. Just like you are doing now.

What do you think of Clarkson going to Argentina and antagonising them on purpose over the Falklands War? Hint: i am not asking you to give a summary of the rights and wrongs of the Falklands War.

Im sincerely not trying to muddy the waters, however I am pointing out your own bias to you as being less than helpful to your argument when you start to sling the biased accusation towards others. If you cant take that as an objective piece of information without slinging it back my way then I think you need to reconsider exactly what it is you find so objectionable about Clarkson & co.


My view is that the show has form for using number plates and strategic sign writing on doors that slide open on a few occasions in the past. Its certainly not a weekly occurrence from what Ive seen. If you are a weekly viewer then perhaps you've seen differently. So that suggests to me but doesn't prove an intent to antagonise.


Id also offer that I doubt whether the presenters actually chose the specific number plate, that's more likely to be someone junior in their production office to source vehicles for them. That person may or may not have attempted to mimic the previous "jokes" but I don't think anyone here can judge whether there was intent or not, its equally likely that some people are reading into the number plate something that isn't there.
In that case if you were one of the presenters would you necessarily look at the number plate? let alone spot the reference?


Id like some additional information, before being absolutely certain, specifically,
1) what were the number plates of the other two cars? If they also contained a feasible reference then I think they were deliberately attempting to antagonise and so got exactly the reaction and publicity they were seeking. If the other two cars don't show a possible reference to the Falklands war then its more likely that it was a coincidence that was misinterpreted
2) Is there any film of the presenters referring to the number plate? or any commentary that suggests its a deliberate act?
3) From what I have seen, they tend to buy cars for these ventures based on a criteria or smallish budget so they can bash them about and customise them, that seems more of a criteria to them than what plate it has


Someone earlier used the phrase plausible deniability, I think until any additional evidence comes to light then I think this has it. Regardless, to kick them out of the country seems an excessive reaction to me but then Im biased ;-)

Peist2007

bear1 wrote: »

Seriously what is your problem here? Are you pissed off because some of us don't believe in your opinion? Or "fact" as you think it is.
I find it hard to believe it was done on purpose (if it turns out it was then I'd correct myself immediately) but you also have to look at the other side of the coin, what if it was a coincidence?

I am not pissed off at all. There is a news story at the moment where this is alleged to have happened. Asking someone sitting in Ireland for proof who has read the story like everyone else is retarded. And, for a mod, i would expect a little more in terms of debating skills. I am perfectly entitled to read this story and comment on it.

You seem to think that the BBC denial means nothing took place? You do realise that Top Gear is a BBC show dont you?

bear1

I am pie wrote: »

I am not suggesting he was trying to antagonise a nation. He was playing to the braying fools in the cheap seats.

I'll rephrase, as you seem to be struggling with the basic concepts of probability.

The chances of this number plate being coincidentally chosen are billions to 1. I chose to side with mathmatical probability rather than inanely clinging to the "what, no..err, I never noticed" angle.

I will enjoy returning to laugh at you when the filming and innuendo contained therein confirms.

And how are you reaching this mathematical ratio?

FunLover18

Not bothered reading the whole thread but it seems like an overreaction. If Argentina were that sensitive why don't they ban registrations with '82' in them. God forbid anybody with an Irish car from that year pay a visit.

Edit: The 'FKL' went over my head

I am pie

cdeb wrote: »

Just looking back over the last page or two and see I've consistently ignored your posts. Wasn't intentional; apologies! In fairness, it's interesting to see some local insight (assuming your location is genuine )

I don't think it can be argued that the veterans were "justifiable" offended though. I'm sure 982 isn't a number sequence skipped over in Argentinian reg plates, for example.

I also think it's far too easy for army people to be offended (or to be accused of offending army people). These are guys who, generally, are ordered into an area to go and kill people, and rarely is there ever discussion tolerated as to whether they were right to do so (I'm talking in general here; not just the Falklands)

The world would be a whole lot better if people could stand up and say "You know what? We're wrong in this war. We should hold our hands up, admit it and back out"

Instead, we get people "justifiably offended" by a car reg. Doesn't really facilitate rational thinking approaches to problems, does it?

I don't believe the British have any intention for apologising for attacking Argentina in the 19th century, any more than the Argentines have for attacking Las Malvinas in the 20th century.

I support the Argentine claim for possession of the islands, but this is not the place nor the time for that.

Stojkovic

Anyone who thinks that this wasnt another deliberate Clarkson stunt is seriously deluded.

Peist2007

Gatling wrote: »

Your posts go down quicker than an argentine cruiser

Top Gear stereotypical viewer alert :pac:

cdeb

I am pie wrote: »

The chances of this number plate being coincidentally chosen are billions to 1. I chose to side with mathmatical probability rather than inanely clinging to the "what, no..err, I never noticed" angle.

Mathematically unlikely doesn't equal impossible. It's quite dangerous to say the one course of events is mathematically unlikely, therefore must be wrong (as the case of Lucia de Berk shows)

I think people choosing to be offended by a car reg are as bad as those believing it's the most heinous thing ever. It doesn't bother whether it was deliberate or not. But I'm not going to go believing it was deliberate - because.

bear1

Peist2007 wrote: »

I am not pissed off at all. There is a news story at the moment where this is alleged to have happened. Asking someone sitting in Ireland for proof who has read the story like everyone else is retarded. And, for a mod, i would expect a little more in terms of debating skills. I am perfectly entitled to read this story and comment on it.

You seem to think that the BBC denial means nothing took place? You do realise that Top Gear is a BBC show dont you?

When have I said the BBC have denied everything?
You are entitled to your opinion just as I and others are entitled to theirs, no matter if they are stupid or not.
Your posts are antagonising and as the Mod already said your links provide no facts or anything for you to base your opinion that this was an intentional act.
Asking me stupid questions like "you do realise that Top Gear is a BBC show don't you?" further proves me point about you.

jimgoose

Stojkovic wrote: »

Anyone who thinks that this wasnt another deliberate Clarkson stunt is seriously deluded.

I'm waiting for him to trundle through Berlin standing up in the rear of a 1937 convertible Mercedes-Benz W150! :pac:

Gatling

Peist2007 wrote: »

Top Gear stereotypical viewer alert :pac:

Unlike the daily fail reader

I am pie

bear1 wrote: »

And how are you reaching this mathematical ratio?

Are you denying that the probability of a 3 letter, 3 digit combination being used by a british film crew in a particular region of Argentina with a concentration of veterans on a car used for filming (as opposed to any of the other 40 to 50 vehicles!), and used by the most polemical presenter DOESNT run into the millions, billions, what ever...the chances are miniscule.

Still, bias will do funny things to a man's potential to be logical.

Do you need some help with probability theory? I can probably dig out some websites for you.....

cdeb

bear1 wrote: »

And how are you reaching this mathematical ratio?

In fairness, the odds are 1 in 10*10*10*26*26*26 = 1 in 17,576,000

But that's just of something with 982FKL. People would have gotten offended at lots of combinations of letters* - FAL, for exampls. FDS. Let's say the F is required at the start, and the numbers are required. Let's say any of three letters could do the trick in the second and third slot. Then you've got odds of in in just under 2 million.

Proof of deliberateness? No.

Could it have been done deliberately? Of course.

Could it have been a case of seeing a reg first and then deciding to go to Argentina with the car? Quite possible.

Is it a big issue? No. Anyone offended by this needs a dose of reality, I think.


* - source - that minister guy did get offended at different combinations of numbers, clearly by making up conspiracy theories to suit his own views.

Peist2007

bear1 wrote: »

Your posts are antagonising .

You have tried your best too in fairness. I am not sure pity was your desired reaction though

Fratton Fred

This was juvenile from top gear, as you'd expect. No where near as juvenile as the way the Argentines have conducted their "claim" over the past few years.

Respect to the Argentine veterans who fought in the war and those that lost loved ones, but meh, the nation deserves to have the fact that the Falklands aren't theirs rubbed in their faces.

Peist2007

Gatling wrote: »

Unlike the daily fail reader

Have never read the Daily Mail. Your reality is skewed.

bear1

I am pie wrote: »

Are you denying that the probability of a 3 letter, 3 digit combination being used by a british film crew in a particular region of Argentina with a concentration of veterans on a car used for filming (as opposed to any of the other 40 to 50 vehicles!), and used by the most polemical presenter DOESNT run into the millions, billions, what ever...the chances are miniscule.

Still, bias will do funny things to a man's potential to be logical.

Do you need some help with probability theory? I can probably dig out some websites for you.....

Dig them out, I already asked you for links to the story in Spanish and I'm still waiting. You can then explain to me all you want about the random theories and stochastic processes all you want.
You seem to have knowledge that the other 40/50 cars there had "normal" number plates. Can you send me a link that shows all the other number plates?
As another poster said, if the other 2 cars (as these are the only cars that matter in the show) have plates referring to the war as well then I'd say it was a deliberate thing done by the show.
If normal plates then I would say it is merely a coincidence.

JONJO THE MISER

Delighted, hate that show and them guys.
Acting jack the lads at there age, idiots.

I am pie

cdeb wrote: »

Mathematically unlikely doesn't equal impossible. It's quite dangerous to say the one course of events is mathematically unlikely, therefore must be wrong (as the case of Lucia de Berk shows)

I think people choosing to be offended by a car reg are as bad as those believing it's the most heinous thing ever. It doesn't bother whether it was deliberate or not. But I'm not going to go believing it was deliberate - because.

Lets agree on statistically extremely unlikely ?

You are being deliberately disengenuous.

"People" = War veterans. Slightly understandable they were upset, I would argue.

They could have driven around in Buenos Aires all day long and got nothing more than a few funny looks, but that wouldnt make good TV.

SIlly stunt which backfired, Argentina on the whole shrugs it's shoulders and scratches it's head.

No one was kicked out, they packed up I now understand after some stones were thrown at the cars, which is also a bit daft.

Again, mostly the impression here is that they were childish and it's a shame they couldnt have made more emphasis on the shared history of the 2 countries rather than annoying some tired old veterans.

bear1

Peist2007 wrote: »

You have tried your best too in fairness. I am not sure pity was your desired reaction though

Damn I was hoping it would work

cdeb

I am pie wrote: »

Lets agree on statistically extremely unlikely ?

We already have agreed on that.

I am pie wrote: »

"People" = War veterans. Slightly understandable they were upset, I would argue.

Don't agree. The had no right to be "justifiably offended", as you say. They chose to be offended. It's a car reg, for God's sake. Get a grip.

fedor.2.

Top Gear, and in particular Jeremy Clarkson, are a breath of fresh air in this pussified world of political correctness. Long may they continue.

Peist2007

cdeb wrote: »

It's a car reg, for God's sake. Get a grip.

So you agree that it did happen?

bear1

Peist2007 wrote: »

So you agree that it did happen?

Again, going around in circles.
It has happened, the question is if it was intentional or not.

jimgoose

Peist2007 wrote: »

So you agree that it did happen?

That what happened? That a registration plate "H982 FKL" was issued in the UK? Yes, it would appear thus! :pac:

cdeb

Peist2007 wrote: »

So you agree that it did happen?

That what happened?

bear1

cdeb wrote: »

That what happened?

You know.... err the thing.

nelly17

fedor.2. wrote: »

Top Gear, and in particular Jeremy Clarkson, are a breath of fresh air in this pussified world of political correctness. Long may they continue.

I used to think that but I couldnt give a flying **** anymore its the same crap trotted season after season these days

Smiles35

bear1 wrote: »

You know.... err the thing.

Don't mention the thing!