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Religious Boyfriend

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    #152
    rozeboosje
    Closed Accounts Posts: 857 ✭✭✭rozeboosje


    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    I think I have been the only person to suggest talking to her boyfriend.

    I did, too! Take that back or I shall sit here, sulk, and hold my breath until my head explodes!


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    #153
    Buona Fortuna
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,507 ✭✭✭Buona Fortuna


    Can't help thinking that these last 3 or 4 pages of the linguistic olympics, featuring the pedants steeplechase and and the semantics hurdles have helped the OP not one jot.

    /it was fun but not much


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    #154
    Beano
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,357 ✭✭✭Beano


    Lingua Franca wrote: »
    Noted, Robindch.




    I never said you did. But you joined an advice thread merely to support a post calling her that.

    Anyway, this thread isn't about you or me and this conversation is way off topic.

    I joined the thread to give my point of view. Any advice required had already been given by Brown Bomber (rozeboosje might have mentioned it too)


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    #155
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    rozeboosje wrote: »
    I did, too! Take that back or I shall sit here, sulk, and hold my breath until my head explodes!
    Well for 16 hours I was the only person to suggest it. :phttp://www.boards.ie/search/submit/?thread=2057292567&query=talk Bob Hoskins probably would've too if he was here.


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    #156
    rozeboosje
    Closed Accounts Posts: 857 ✭✭✭rozeboosje


    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    Well for 16 hours I was the only person to suggest it.

    Well some of us are just a little slow *sob* don't hold it against us .... :P


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    #157
    Brian Shanahan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,232 ✭✭✭Brian Shanahan


    Beano wrote: »
    she has shown a specific prejudice. She has specifically said that she thinks he is judging her. That has nothing to do with original sin.

    No, she isn't showing prejudice, she is simply recognising that as a religious person of christian persuasion her boyfriend is under religious stricture to judge her in terms of her beliefs and find her wanting.

    Whether he does so or not is a different matter, but the fact is as a believer if he follows his commandments exactly he is compelled to do so. And as such she is simply recognising a potential problem in their relationship engineered by their differences in religious matters.


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    #158
    Beano
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,357 ✭✭✭Beano


    Brian Shanahan wrote: »
    No, she isn't showing prejudice, she is simply recognising that as a religious person of christian persuasion her boyfriend is under religious stricture to judge her in terms of her beliefs and find her wanting.

    Whether he does so or not is a different matter, but the fact is as a believer if he follows his commandments exactly he is compelled to do so. And as such she is simply recognising a potential problem in their relationship engineered by their differences in religious matters.

    we have already been over all this. you have added nothing new.


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    #159
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    Buona Fortuna wrote: »
    Can't help thinking that these last 3 or 4 pages of the linguistic olympics, featuring the pedants steeplechase and and the semantics hurdles have helped the OP not one jot.

    /it was fun but not much
    Helped with what? Based on what we know there is no "problem" outside of the OP's imagination. There is no indication that he has done anything but accept and respect her for who she is based on the fact that he has accepted her into his home and his life.

    It's like a black girl suspecting that her white boyfriend maybe secretly judging her because he is white and some white people are racist.


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    #160
    Buona Fortuna
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,507 ✭✭✭Buona Fortuna


    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    Helped with what? Based on what we know there is no "problem" outside of the OP's imagination. There is no indication that he has done anything but accept and respect her for who she is based on the fact that he has accepted her into his home and his life.

    It's like a black girl suspecting that her white boyfriend maybe secretly judging her because he is white and some white people are racist.

    Sorry times up



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    #161
    nozzferrahhtoo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,338 ✭✭✭nozzferrahhtoo


    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    OK, well apparently you missed her irrational and completely unsubstantiated thoughts on whether he was secretly judging her BECAUSE he was "religious" on some undefined level. This is by definition prejudice.

    I missed nothing thanks. She wondered something out loud and from the back of that one sentence you have attributed her with prejudice, paranoia, intolerance, and much much more! Come off it.

    Over react much?
    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    The fact that she believes that her boyfriend is judging her

    She did not indicate at any point that she believes this. She asked if there was any reason to think it was so.

    Her exact sentence was " I dunno does he....". Yeah because the words "I do not know if...." actually mean "I am certain that....".

    Edit peoples words much?
    Beano wrote: »
    she has shown a specific prejudice. She has specifically said that she thinks he is judging her.

    Where did she "specifically say" this then?
    Beano wrote: »
    she hasnt asked a question she has made an assumption. she did not say "do you think he might be judging me".

    She asked no such question. And she made no such assumption. Her EXACT words were:

    "I dunno does he judge a little deep inside though"

    Saying "I do not know X" is not saying "I assume X" or "Do you think X". There is no assumption inherent in saying there is something you do not know.

    Try again.
    Beano wrote: »
    why wouid she even think in that direction unless she thought there was some truth in it?

    Because she has acknowledged a difference between them, is aware of it, and simply does not know if this difference is relevant to him. She should ask him is my opinion.

    But that is why you would think in that direction, without any of this imaginary prejudice, assumption and so forth we are seeing the thread being injected with.
    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    I think I have been the only person to suggest talking to her boyfriend.

    False. Try reading my first post on the thread.


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    #162
    Beano
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,357 ✭✭✭Beano


    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    I missed nothing thanks. She wondered something out loud and from the back of that one sentence you have attributed her with prejudice, paranoia, intolerance, and much much more! Come off it.

    Over react much?



    She did not indicate at any point that she believes this. She asked if there was any reason to think it was so.

    Her exact sentence was " I dunno does he....". Yeah because the words "I do not know if...." actually mean "I am certain that....".

    Edit peoples words much?



    Where did she "specifically say" this then?



    She asked no such question. And she made no such assumption. Her EXACT words were:

    "I dunno does he judge a little deep inside though"

    Saying "I do not know X" is not saying "I assume X" or "Do you think X". There is no assumption inherent in saying there is something you do not know.

    Try again.



    Because she has acknowledged a difference between them, is aware of it, and simply does not know if this difference is relevant to him. She should ask him is my opinion.

    But that is why you would think in that direction, without any of this imaginary prejudice, assumption and so forth we are seeing the thread being injected with.



    False. Try reading my first post on the thread.

    I've been through this already with others. Look back on my previous replies.


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    #163
    nozzferrahhtoo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,338 ✭✭✭nozzferrahhtoo


    Beano wrote: »
    I've been through this already with others. Look back on my previous replies.

    And I have covered it again. Sue me. Or reply to me. Either works for me.


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    #164
    Beano
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,357 ✭✭✭Beano


    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    And I have covered it again. Sue me. Or reply to me. Either works for me.

    Bored now. bye bye.


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    #165
    nozzferrahhtoo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,338 ✭✭✭nozzferrahhtoo


    We will see how long THAT lasts I guess.

    But to summarize, I see nothing intolerant or prejudiced here. What I do see is two users taking innocuous and inquisitive sentences by a person entering a new sitution...... and running away with them and spinning them into everything from intolerance to prejudice to paranoia.

    And to repeat I can see none of that in her text. I simply see a person entering an unfamiliar situation and inquiring as to what the implications of that may or may NOT be...... from anyone who may have been in such a situation before.

    The religious really are keen to find intolerance and attacks in even the most innocent of queries.


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    #166
    rozeboosje
    Closed Accounts Posts: 857 ✭✭✭rozeboosje


    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    The religious

    Who would that be then?


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    #167
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    I missed nothing thanks. She wondered something out loud and from the back of that one sentence you have attributed her with prejudice, paranoia, intolerance, and much much more! Come off it.

    Over react much?
    We've been over this. I've provided the definitions. They apply. I cannot make the blind see.
    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    I She did not indicate at any point that she believes this. She asked if there was any reason to think it was so.

    Her exact sentence was " I dunno does he....". Yeah because the words "I do not know if...." actually mean "I am certain that....".

    Edit peoples words much?
    Have the annoying habit of adding much at the end of sentences much?

    Would it make you feel better if we just pretended that she didn't think that if someone has gone to Lourdes (for reasons unknown) and has some little religious artifacts in their dorm room (for reasons unknown) it created a "problem" were they were by default at least worthy of suspicion?
    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    False. Try reading my first post on the thread.
    I just did. http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=92263952&postcount=25

    That is awful advice to give to two teenagers who have just started dating. That is not talking, you are advising her to make some weird, robotic pros and cons list for their relationship when they have just met and turn it into some kind of maths equation. He'll think she is a psycho and dump her.

    And not only that you are feeding her prejudices by posting videos of lunatic preachers from the bible-belt and conflating him with her boyfriend who has done NO WRONG. Not helpful at all.


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    #168
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    rozeboosje wrote: »
    Who would that be then?
    I too would like to know this.


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    #169
    shruikan2553
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,113 ✭✭✭shruikan2553


    Shruikans guide to A&A, from the creator of How to Celebrate Atheist Christmas.

    Step 1. Person asks question
    Step 2. Person gets reasonable responses
    Step 3. Try to make it look like a non catholic is secretly Hitler in disguise.
    Step 4. ?????
    Step 5. Create a topic in feedback about how the mods are mean.


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    #170
    nozzferrahhtoo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,338 ✭✭✭nozzferrahhtoo


    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    We've been over this. I've provided the definitions. They apply. I cannot make the blind see.

    Work on your own blindness before imagining it in others. Your definitions do not apply, and you are simply, for reasons only known to you, twisting an innocent request for shared experience into everything from "intolerance" to "paranoia".
    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    Have the annoying habit of adding much at the end of sentences much?

    Your annoyances are not my concern. Your misrepresentations of the OP, are.
    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    Would it make you feel better if we just pretended

    There is nothing to pretend. She sees that the guy is religious. She sees aspects of his life (where he has visited and what he owns) as highlighting this. And she merely wants to know if anyone here has had similar experiences and how it worked out for them.

    No intolerance. No paranoia. Both of those are you projecting your own paranoia I fear.
    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    That is awful advice to give to two teenagers who have just started dating. That is not talking,

    Er yes, it is talking. The talking part is the whole point of it. The "list" part is the preperatory work before the talking, which they can do alone to be ready to talk usefully and maturely when they get together.
    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    you are advising her to make some weird, robotic pros and cons list

    I never suggested anything of the sort. I suggested they both evaluate what they want from a relationship. Nothing to do with pros and cons.

    The point is to find out if there is anything either of them want that is somehow precluded by these differences she perceives between them.
    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    And not only that you are feeding her prejudices

    Prejudices that exist in your head only, not hers.
    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    conflating him with her boyfriend

    Again I did no such thing. Your ongoing need to misrepresent words of others is suspicious at best. Be it the OP, or be it me. I guess it comes from the Conspiracy Theory forums where you need to simply make things up in order to make it look like people are engaged in all kinds of awful things that no one is actually doing.
    rozeboosje wrote: »
    Who would that be then?

    The religious as a whole display this characteristic all too often. I see it emerge from that set/group too often. As for who the religious are? Errm.... religious people who are.... religious..... duh?


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    #171
    rozeboosje
    Closed Accounts Posts: 857 ✭✭✭rozeboosje


    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    Errm.... religious people who are.... religious..... duh?

    Anybody in particular who was posting in this thread? Some of the people you've been arguing with, perhaps? Care to name any usernames?


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    #172
    rozeboosje
    Closed Accounts Posts: 857 ✭✭✭rozeboosje


    But yes, indeed ...
    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    The religious really are [...]

    Just like the blacks are ... or the gays are ... or the Jews are ... or the Atheists are ... When I hear someone talk about The [members of an out-group] I am never too impressed.


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    #173
    Brian Shanahan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,232 ✭✭✭Brian Shanahan


    shruikan2553 wrote: »
    Step 3. Try to make it look like a non catholic is secretly Hitler in disguise.


    I'm Hitler in DISGUISE!







    Oh, wait I'm Lorenzo St. DuBois. Sorry.


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    #174
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users Posts: 34,252 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Beano wrote: »
    we have already been over all this. you have added nothing new.

    Irony meter just exploded.

    Fingal County Council are certainly not competent to be making decisions about the most important piece of infrastructure on the island. They need to stick to badly designed cycle lanes and deciding on whether Mrs Murphy can have her kitchen extension.



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    #175
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    Er yes, it is talking. The talking part is the whole point of it. The "list" part is the preperatory work before the talking, which they can do alone to be ready to talk usefully and maturely when they get together.

    I never suggested anything of the sort. I suggested they both evaluate what they want from a relationship. Nothing to do with pros and cons.
    I am actually shuddering here at the thought of two 18 year olds who have just met doing this. Can you really not understand how creepy this is?

    "So Dave...I know we only met each other a couple of weeks ago but here is a notepad and pen. I need to quell my irrational suspicions I have of you so I must insist you write down what you expect in our relationship. I will do the same and we'll meet up at 2200 hours and process the results through this program I downloaded from bunnyboilers.com and then we will see if we are compatible."

    She will get the notepad back and all it will say is "Don't call me again, psycho!".


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    #176
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    rozeboosje wrote: »
    Anybody in particular who was posting in this thread? Some of the people you've been arguing with, perhaps? Care to name any usernames?
    Ain't gonna happen. It's just another baseless assumption.


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    #177
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    Work on your own blindness before imagining it in others. Your definitions do not apply, and you are simply, for reasons only known to you, twisting an innocent request for shared experience into everything from "intolerance" to "paranoia".
    1) They are not "my definitions" but dictionary definitions, and once again they apply, albeit mildly as I've said.
    2) No twisting of anything, though on reflection I regret the use of paranoia; too many negative connotations that don't apply. Though I can't think of a better term for when an individual (such as the OP) who is imagining another is thinking negatively of them in secret without any actual reason to do so.


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    #178
    nozzferrahhtoo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,338 ✭✭✭nozzferrahhtoo


    rozeboosje wrote: »
    Anybody in particular who was posting in this thread? Some of the people you've been arguing with, perhaps? Care to name any usernames?

    It was a general point about the set "religious" as a whole. Not everything is about you, or people here. But we can observe that trait here on the thread. The OP has made an innocent set of queries, and those queries have been wantonly exploded into everything from "intolerance" to "paranoia" by a crass and fetid need to find something offensive where nothing actually is.
    rozeboosje wrote: »
    When I hear someone talk about The [members of an out-group] I am never too impressed.

    Then it is fortunate that impressing you is about as far down my list of priorities as it gets. I was merely commenting on what I have personally experienced which is that as a group, the religious have a disproportionate display of this particular attribute than any other group I can name.
    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    I am actually shuddering here at the thought of two 18 year olds who have just met doing this. Can you really not understand how creepy this is?

    Perhaps you simply have a low threshold for being creeped out. There are children in their early teens getting pregnant. There are many couples of age 18 getting married and committing to each other for life. It happens. Build a bridge.... get over it.... and deal.

    And I see nothing creepy about the suggestion that if someone is going to get into a long term relationship and take it seriously.... that they be clear from the outset what they themselves want from a relationship. It is not creepy to do this. In fact it is simply foolish and naive NOT to do it.

    I think she is being really mature on this thread. Despite being 18 she is not trawling in head first and blindly entering into a relationship. Instead she is stopping and saying "Hang on, lets me clever about this, lets find other people in similar relationships and draw on their experiences and wisdom".

    And then in YOU march with this wanton and fetid need to take offence at everything and fuel your "conspiracy theory" hobby by attributing all kind of underhand motives and failures and nonsense to the OP based on.... well.... almost nothing at all but an over reaction to ONE single sentence the OP used and did not happen to phrase carefully and delicately enough for your hyper-sensitive disposition.

    And the result of that has been a string of unhelpful accusations that the OP is intolerant. Paranoid. Judgemental. And more.

    Get. Over. Yourself.
    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    2) No twisting of anything
    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    an individual (such as the OP) who is imagining another is thinking negatively of them in secret

    You declare and assert there is no twisting and then in the same breath you continue to do so.

    She said "I do not know if.....". That is not what you are making it out to be. Never has. Never will. Try again.


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    #179
    rozeboosje
    Closed Accounts Posts: 857 ✭✭✭rozeboosje


    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    It was a general point about the set "religious" as a whole.

    Tell me more about The Religious. Are they a Hive Mind of some kind? The Borg, perhaps? I am intrigued.

    Then you start with:
    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    Not everything is about you
    Of course not. It couldn't possibly be.

    Continue with:
    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    or people here.

    And then you contradict yourself with
    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    But we can observe that trait here on the thread. The OP has made an innocent set of queries, and those queries have been wantonly exploded into everything from "intolerance" to "paranoia" by a crass and fetid need to find something offensive where nothing actually is.

    Indeed? A "crass and fetid need" of.... The Religious in this thread, perchance? And The Religious in this thread are .... ?
    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    impressing you is about as far down my list of priorities as it gets

    Oh, I'm sure that whether I'm impressed with you is utterly irrelevant in your life. You're too busy with your Hasty Generalisations to take any notice of me.


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    #180
    nozzferrahhtoo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,338 ✭✭✭nozzferrahhtoo


    rozeboosje wrote: »
    Tell me more about The Religious. Are they a Hive Mind of some kind? The Borg, perhaps? I am intrigued.

    I suggested no such thing at all. I am talking about all people who are religious, as a demographic. Is that definition really not clear to you?
    rozeboosje wrote: »
    And then you contradict yourself with

    Not a contradiction at all, just your failure to understand it.

    On the one hand I was making a comment about the religious demographic.

    On the other hand I was pointing out the same attribute here on this thread.

    Not a contradiction. I was merely observing the same attribute in two groups. The religious demographic. And the posters on this thread.

    Hope this is clearer to you now.
    rozeboosje wrote: »
    You're too busy with your Hasty Generalisations to take any notice of me.

    I engaged in no such thing. The generalizations are coming from those that are exploding the OPs innocent and mature request to draw on shared experience.... into everything from "intolerance" to "paranoia".


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    #181
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    xLisaBx wrote: »
    I've been with a fella for just over a month now so it's nothing too serious yet. I really like him and hope this relationship works out, except there's a problem. He's pretty religious.
    We're both 18 and I'm agnostic. He's been to Lourdes and has a few little catholic church merchandise things in his college bedroom. However he doesn't blab on about God or try to convert me.
    My question is: do ye think this can work?

    Hi OP. Firstly I am sorry to see your genuine requests have been met with attempts to infer insidious motives or attributes to you. I hope it has not scared you off our forum - which is a great place to be the best of times when the vultures are not desperately circling looking for meat.

    As others have suggested - it is hard if not impossible to answer your question. The simply answer is of course it _can_ work but it really comes down to your specific case which we know nothing about.

    Is he judging you? Of course he is. We are human - We all judge - All the time. Is he judging you because of his religion? Well sure - what makes us us - is the basis from which we judge others. So his religion will be at least part of it.

    To what _degree_ this is so however we can not answer without knowing him.

    At the end of the day the most useful and powerful tool in a relationship is - in my opinion at least - communication. It is great you are on here seeking the experiences of others - and you should draw on that - but at the end of the day if this relationship starts to get serious - you simply have to communicate with him on this and see if he feels his religion will ever get in the way of progress and health of the relationship.

    All the best of luck with it either way!


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