Feed a family nutritionally well for <€132 a week

ch750536

Hi. I'm doing this as I'm taking a nutrition course. Would be great if someone else would like to join me.

http://feedfamilyfour.blogspot.ie/

Basically trying to not eat low grade food, nutritionally empty but also not spending a fortune. Brownie points earnt for good organic food.

marizpan

These are all vegan meal plans, worth a mention :-)

LeinsterDub

ch750536 wrote: »

Nutritionally we did really well though.

Dinner
Hula Hoops 4 €2.95 12 €0.98
Roll 1 €3.50 12 €0.29 :eek:

ch750536

No, only mine are vegan. My wife eats fish, kids eat anything but what they are supposed to.

ch750536

LeinsterDub wrote: »

Dinner
Hula Hoops 4 €2.95 12 €0.98
Roll 1 €3.50 12 €0.29 :eek:

Was between us all & over the day, just makes it a bit easier. Nutrition is based over the whole week also and not just the individual days or even meals.

papu

ch750536 wrote: »

Was between us all & over the day, just makes it a bit easier. Nutrition is based over the whole week also and not just the individual days or even meals.

What are the Macro Breakdowns and calories ? Doesn't seem like an awful lot of nutritious food

what is "high in nutrition"
Seems high in sugar, the smoothies

I don't know how to do any of that on a vegan diet anyway. Feeding the family on a load of eggs, chicken fillets, rice, mixed veg etc would be fine

Stribach

Couple of nice meals low cost high taste
Omelette with chopped chorizo,diced mushrooms and cherry tomatoes sweated down in pan first then added to omelette mix finish under grill serve with a baked potato

Boil some pasta add a jar of chunky veg and tomatoe sauce quick and easy

Two favourites in our house of four!

ch750536

papu wrote: »

What are the Macro Breakdowns and calories ? Doesn't seem like an awful lot of nutritious food

Example

Doing this on a daily basis is nonsense. Your body handles and stores different elements in different ways. I'll be summarising calories. I'll handle the macros after a few days to see what is missing from the diet and replacing, so day 2 is not massively important. Day 5 is the key.

ch750536

bluewolf wrote: »

what is "high in nutrition"
Seems high in sugar, the smoothies

I don't know how to do any of that on a vegan diet anyway. Feeding the family on a load of eggs, chicken fillets, rice, mixed veg etc would be fine

Compared to the average diet. You have to remember 2 things.

• These are 2 kids, 7 & 9
• This is done on a budget.

So getting the kids to consume healthy nutritious food is always going to be relative for someone like yourself.

My own belief is that chicken & pork is not fit for human consumption. A conversation for another day maybe.

Berry smoothies not fruit, so lower in sugar 120 cal per glass (I may even start adding honey). There is a lot of rice already. Loads of mixed veg.

ch750536

bluewolf wrote: »

what is "high in nutrition"
Seems high in sugar, the smoothies

I don't know how to do any of that on a vegan diet anyway. Feeding the family on a load of eggs, chicken fillets, rice, mixed veg etc would be fine

We do give them meat, just not much. I believe 1 portion of meat a day is fine, perhaps even excessive. The kids also have a meal 3 times a week at their grans which always has meat so I have to take this into account. Sometimes it may appear that they are vegan but they really aren't.

Mellor

ch750536 wrote: »

Berry smoothies not fruit, so lower in sugar 120 cal per glass (I may even start adding honey). There is a lot of rice already. Loads of mixed veg.

Berrys are fruit.
That 120 cals, is essentially all sugar. Adding honey is more sugar.

Whats this;

http://veganate.blogspot.ie/2014/06/day-1-30-nutritional-summary.html

Over 30 days, the main source of calories was bread, the second hula hoops. Nearly 30% between them. Please tell me there's a mistake there.

It's also appears to still be a staple of the meal plan.
I take you point that nutrition should be looked at weekly, not just daily. But if you are eating hula-hoops and a roll everyday, it doesn't matter how you look at it.

ch750536

Mellor wrote: »

Berrys are fruit.
That 120 cals, is essentially all sugar. Adding honey is more sugar.

Whats this;

Over 30 days, the main source of calories was bread, the second hula hoops. Nearly 30% between them. Please tell me there's a mistake there.

It's also appears to still be a staple of the meal plan.
I take you point that nutrition should be looked at weekly, not just daily. But if you are eating hula-hoops and a roll everyday, it doesn't matter how you look at it.

Yep, that was a learning curve from the first month of becoming a vegan, 'cold turkey' style. Basically I decided to be vegan all of a sudden. The knowledge gap was huge so the void was filled with nonsense food. Things have settled well, read the blog to see this. The intent of that link was to show that I am keeping reasonable track of nutrients by way of example.

At the moment, moving in to this challenge, I have another curve to work through, cost vs nutrition. Balance & variation I know and understand but doing this for the right cost can be tricky. I think if you look at what happens in week 2 you will get a better picture of what I mean.

I believe that having a nutritious diet is easy for any adult with an open mind. I believe a reasonably nutritious diet for a family is possible. Kids throw all kinds of issues into the mix.

ch750536

Mellor wrote: »

Berrys are fruit.
That 120 cals, is essentially all sugar. Adding honey is more sugar.

Sugar is needed in any balanced diet. The benefit in berries in a smoothie vs fruit is that there are fewer calories and a different mix of nutrients. Kids eat bananas, apples, oranges etc at school but wouldn't eat berries as they don't like them as much & they are messy. Berry smoothie solves both of these issues.

ch750536

Mellor wrote: »

Berrys are fruit.
That 120 cals, is essentially all sugar. Adding honey is more sugar.

Whats this;

Over 30 days, the main source of calories was bread, the second hula hoops. Nearly 30% between them. Please tell me there's a mistake there.

It's also appears to still be a staple of the meal plan.
I take you point that nutrition should be looked at weekly, not just daily. But if you are eating hula-hoops and a roll everyday, it doesn't matter how you look at it.

The only bread we have now is bread I bake myself. Organic spelt, honey, water & yeast are the only ingredients. I make 12 average sized rolls every 2 - 3 days.

Wood

You should read "The Vegetarian Myth" by Lierre Keith. While your at it don't force your choices on your kids.

Ireland has some of the best meat products in the world. The chicken is second to none worldwide if bought from a reputable source. Saying one portion of meat per day is excessive is complete nonsense, we are omnivores.

But, you think hula hoops and sugar are okay? carry on. :rolleyes:

Mellor

ch750536 wrote: »

Sugar is needed in any balanced diet. The benefit in berries in a smoothie vs fruit is that there are fewer calories and a different mix of nutrients. Kids eat bananas, apples, oranges etc at school but wouldn't eat berries as they don't like them as much & they are messy. Berry smoothie solves both of these issues.

I never said zero sugar is the target. I'm just pointing out that a reliance on fruit can lead to high quantities of sugar. Do you have a macro breakdown for a week of this plan?

ch750536 wrote: »

The only bread we have now is bread I bake myself. Organic spelt, honey, water & yeast are the only ingredients. I make 12 average sized rolls every 2 - 3 days.

I only commented on the info provided.

ch750536

You're coming across as an angry Mellor. Nothing personal here, just info. I know you didn't have all the facts so I supplied them. I don't expect anyone to explain themselves other than the guy who opened himself to criticism, me. I'm also very open to the fact that while a lot is known about nutrition there is still a lot of opinion. What is right for Bob is not right for Bill.

Macro breakdown on day 2, no, not worth it. By day 7 yes, I will be looking in more detail as per the example I gave earlier. This will be me looking over the foods each of us have eaten and checking we are covering everything.

Aimeee

ch750536 wrote: »

The only bread we have now is bread I bake myself. Organic spelt, honey, water & yeast are the only ingredients. I make 12 average sized rolls every 2 - 3 days.

Slightly off topic, would you mind pming or posting recipe for the rolls please.
Usually do a loaf without yeast, would like to try something new.

ch750536

Aimeee wrote: »

Slightly off topic, would you mind pming or posting recipe for the rolls please.
Usually do a loaf without yeast, would like to try something new.

Dead simple:

Bowl of 300ml warm water
+squirt of honey (trial & error - taste)
+quick yeast (5g)
Stir until honey is mixed.
Add 500g organic spelt.

Mix & play for a few minutes till 1 consistent blob.
Cover with towel & leave in warm place for 1 hr.
Open & play with it.
Cover with towel & leave in warm place for 1 hr.
Open, add a little oil (makes it crusty)& play with it.
Place onto greased something & shape for what you want (rolls or loaf etc)
Cover with towel & leave in warm place for 1 hr.
Warm oven up (180 ish)
Put in oven till cooked.

Most important part seems to be how warm the warm spot is. Make sure it goes from covered warm spot straight into the hot oven.

Eventually I'll have my own starter but my fridge is a little small.

Are these breakdowns an average for the kids or everyone. For an adult 250g carbs a day seems high. The order is bread hula hoops potatoes nuts beer... that isn't something I'd really call nutritious

ch750536

bluewolf wrote: »

Are these breakdowns an average for the kids or everyone. For an adult 250g carbs a day seems high. The order is bread hula hoops potatoes nuts beer... that isn't something I'd really call nutritious

Look at the dates & read what I have already said about the EXAMPLE

I did see it was an example and I did check your blog which has waffles sausages bread rolls and hula hoops on a recent log

ellejay

ch750536 wrote: »

Dead simple:

Bowl of 300ml warm water
+squirt of honey (trial & error - taste)
+quick yeast (5g)
Stir until honey is mixed.
Add 500g organic spelt.

Mix & play for a few minutes till 1 consistent blob.
Cover with towel & leave in warm place for 1 hr.
Open & play with it.
Cover with towel & leave in warm place for 1 hr.
Open, add a little oil (makes it crusty)& play with it.
Place onto greased something & shape for what you want (rolls or loaf etc)
Cover with towel & leave in warm place for 1 hr.
Warm oven up (180 ish)
Put in oven till cooked.

Most important part seems to be how warm the warm spot is. Make sure it goes from covered warm spot straight into the hot oven.

Eventually I'll have my own starter but my fridge is a little small.

pm sent, didn't want to drag off topic.

ch750536

bluewolf wrote: »

I did see it was an example and I did check your blog which has waffles sausages bread rolls and hula hoops on a recent log

Vegan sausages, home baked spelt rolls.

Mellor

ch750536 wrote: »

You're coming across as an angry Mellor. Nothing personal here, just info. I know you didn't have all the facts so I supplied them. I don't expect anyone to explain themselves other than the guy who opened himself to criticism, me. I'm also very open to the fact that while a lot is known about nutrition there is still a lot of opinion. What is right for Bob is not right for Bill.

No anger behind any of my comments. Not sure what exactly gave that impression. Hard to convey tone in text sometimes.
I'm just giving my opinion on what you've posted so far. As you said, opinions differ. The macros so far would be far from what is call nutritious - I'm sure you wouldn't approve of elements of my diet.

Macro breakdown on day 2, no, not worth it. By day 7 yes, I will be looking in more detail as per the example I gave earlier. This will be me looking over the foods each of us have eaten and checking we are covering everything.

I didn't realise you were only two days into this plan, I thought it was a continuation of the last challange.

ch750536

Mellor wrote: »

No anger behind any of my comments. Not sure what exactly gave that impression. Hard to convey tone in text sometimes.
I'm just giving my opinion on what you've posted so far. As you said, opinions differ. The macros so far would be far from what is call nutritious - I'm sure you wouldn't approve of elements of my diet.


I didn't realise you were only two days into this plan, I thought it was a continuation of the last challange.

Link - That's where I should be linking to.

niamh.foley

bluewolf wrote: »

what is "high in nutrition"
Seems high in sugar, the smoothies

I don't know how to do any of that on a vegan diet anyway. Feeding the family on a load of eggs, chicken fillets, rice, mixed veg etc would be fine

it depends one what kind of Smoothies, you are talking about one you buy pre-done yes are loaded with Sugar, but if you make your own Smoothies with homemade Coconut or Almond Milk you can liimit the sugar.

ch750536

I've moved on to frozen berries for the smoothies as they are cheaper. There are much more tarty though. Anyone else found this?

Animord

FYI Frozen berries are still on a boil notice.

the groutch

still alot of crisps, or as it was today Dorito's involved.

ch750536

the groutch wrote: »

still alot of crisps, or as it was today Dorito's involved.

1 Pack, a lot?

Mellor

ch750536 wrote: »

1 Pack, a lot?

I think he's point is that a daily packet of crisps for everyone isn't exactly in line with eating nutritional well. Its exactly the type of "low grade, nutritionally empty food" you set out to avoid.

This is much more nutritional important, than whether or not your veg is organic.

ch750536

Ah, see the issue. I think you are misreading me. I'm aiming to ensure all vital nutrients are there, I never said I would exclude nonsense though obviously cash spent on nonsense is not spent on nutrients.

ch750536

Mellor wrote: »

I think he's point is that a daily packet of crisps for everyone isn't exactly in line with eating nutritional well. Its exactly the type of "low grade, nutritionally empty food" you set out to avoid.

This is much more nutritional important, than whether or not your veg is organic.

I think you underestimate the nutrition of fresh local organic vs supermarket cheap food.

Mellor

ch750536 wrote: »

I think you underestimate the nutrition of fresh local organic vs supermarket cheap food.

I think fresh is hugely important. My shopping consists mostly of meat and veg. Ideally as fresh as possible. I usually buy my veg from a proper fruit and veg shop, but I'll often have to skip something and get in in the supermarket as it's clearly been there a while.

I think the organic benefit is overstated at times. Food doesn't need to be organic to be fresh, in fact organic cold easily be sitting around longer due to not selling as well. I guess I'm just yet to see convincing evidence for organic.

ch750536

Mellor wrote: »

I think the organic benefit is overstated at times. Food doesn't need to be organic to be fresh, in fact organic cold easily be sitting around longer due to not selling as well. I guess I'm just yet to see convincing evidence for organic.

The food gets the nutrients from the soil. These days you get a 'cucumber farm' or a 'pepper farm' where the same crop is planted year after year after year. Peppers take zinc from the soil, after 3 years there is no zinc left. As a lay field is no profit the other option is to chemically add zinc to the field which allows no break in production.

Although zinc allows the peppers to grow the field is also devoid of nutrients. The producer does not care as it doesn't impact the ability to grow. We end up with a pepper that is big, shiny & empty.
The farmer around the corner from me is certified organic. I turn up and we walk around picking from the plants & placing into bags. He grows maybe 20 / 30 varieties, including grapes & peach trees in poly tunnels, lots of flowers (also edible) and understands how to use the land & rotate. He gives me oddly coloured, oddly shaped things that taste fantastic.
Source

Davei141

No doubt that all that food pictured above looks delicious and is very healthy, but imagine how unbelievably healthy it would be nutrient wise with some good quality fish/liver/organ meats/meat. I just think if your idea is to be super healthy by being vegan instead of being vegan on ethical grounds you are cutting the nose off in spite of the face, especially in a country known world over for its quality of meat.

ch750536

Davei141 wrote: »

No doubt that all that food pictured above looks delicious and is very healthy, but imagine how unbelievably healthy it would be nutrient wise with some good quality fish/liver/organ meats/meat. I just think if your idea is to be super healthy by being vegan instead of being vegan on ethical grounds you are cutting the nose off in spite of the face, especially in a country known world over for its quality of meat.

It's really not a vegan issue. I cover all the macro's really well so no problem, plenty of protein in the diet.
Although the beef & lamb is great, the pork and chicken are not so. Many irish pork products are <80% pork. The curing of pork is done by adding lots of chemicals and I just don't see it as being fit for human consumption.
Happy to debate this on the vegan forum or by PM. I am vegan and I do live a healthy life.

A_Sober_Paddy

ch750536 wrote: »

It's really not a vegan issue. I cover all the macro's really well so no problem, plenty of protein in the diet.
Although the beef & lamb is great, the pork and chicken are not so. Many irish pork products are <80% pork. The curing of pork is done by adding lots of chemicals and I just don't see it as being fit for human consumption.
Happy to debate this on the vegan forum or by PM. I am vegan and I do live a healthy life.

When you say you cover all macros really well, what do you weight and how many grams of protein do you take in a day(on averaged out)

ch750536

A_Sober_Paddy wrote: »

When you say you cover all macros really well, what do you weight and how many grams of protein do you take in a day(on averaged out)

I honestly don't know what I weigh nor do I want to know. If my protein is low for 2-3 days I'll take a supplement or I'll specifically target high protein foods.

Roughly if protein for the last 3 days <150g then I'll take 200g today.

I'll adjust this based on what is going on in my life also, am I moving about a lot or sitting still etc.

As with everything I consume, I won't look at day to day detail (other than water) but I do look at what I may be missing 'lately'.

Penny Tration

Lots of bread, crisps and weetabix, some waffles, doughnuts and tonnes of pasta and rice.

Doesn't sound very nutritious. Lots of fruit and carbs.

A_Sober_Paddy

ch750536 wrote: »

I honestly don't know what I weigh nor do I want to know. If my protein is low for 2-3 days I'll take a supplement or I'll specifically target high protein foods.

Roughly if protein for the last 3 days <150g then I'll take 200g today.

I'll adjust this based on what is going on in my life also, am I moving about a lot or sitting still etc.

As with everything I consume, I won't look at day to day detail (other than water) but I do look at what I may be missing 'lately'.

Well your weight generally determines what type of macro's you need, if your not active somewhere in the ballpark of you bodyweight in Kg (in grams 80kg=80g of protein) is the amount of grams of protein you eat...So if you 80kg, over a 4 day period you should be taking in 320g thats pretty minimum and if your active it needs to be higher...

Also make sure you are taking a lot of FLax or Chia seeds for Omega 3, if you want to take in 300mg of usable omega 3 your'd nearly want to be taking about 30g of those seeds...

Also You need to take a Vit b12 supp as you can't get that from a vegan diet

ch750536

green_screen wrote: »

Lots of bread, crisps and weetabix, some waffles, doughnuts and tonnes of pasta and rice.

Doesn't sound very nutritious. Lots of fruit and carbs.

You understand this is 4 of us?
I has 2 slices of bread yesterday. No crisps. No weetabix. No waffles. No Doughnuts. 100g of pasta. No rice.

Hmmmmm.

ch750536

A_Sober_Paddy wrote: »

Well your weight generally determines what type of macro's you need, if your not active somewhere in the ballpark of you bodyweight in Kg (in grams 80kg=80g of protein) is the amount of grams of protein you eat...So if you 80kg, over a 4 day period you should be taking in 320g thats pretty minimum and if your active it needs to be higher...

Also make sure you are taking a lot of FLax or Chia seeds for Omega 3, if you want to take in 300mg of usable omega 3 your'd nearly want to be taking about 30g of those seeds...

Also You need to take a Vit b12 supp as you can't get that from a vegan diet

Yep, I know all this but thanks for the notice.
We do have a lot of seeds in the diet, is a difficult one to add in though. I bought a 1kg bag of organic mixed seeds which gets sprinkled on most things, but I don't tell you about that.

Omega 3 I take from algae (it's where fish get it from). Hard to source and have run out but am hoping to get back in pretty soon.

B12 - I have organic veg, not washed so am fine for that.

Animord

ch750536 wrote: »

B12 - I have organic veg, not washed so am fine for that.

Pretty sure this is a vegan myth - it is all over the internet - the theory is that there is enough animal and human excrement in the soil to supply the B12 needs of humans if they don't wash their food.

bluewolf

bluewolf wrote: »

Are these breakdowns an average for the kids or everyone.

ch750536 wrote: »

Look at the dates & read what I have already said about the EXAMPLE

green_screen wrote: »

Lots of bread, crisps and weetabix, some waffles, doughnuts and tonnes of pasta and rice.

Doesn't sound very nutritious. Lots of fruit and carbs.

ch750536 wrote: »

You understand this is 4 of us?
I has 2 slices of bread yesterday. No crisps. No weetabix. No waffles. No Doughnuts. 100g of pasta. No rice.

Hmmmmm.

We've asked for breakdowns before and you won't give them.
If the kids are the ones eating donuts and waffles and crisps it's still not ideal and not a prime example of "nutritious", no matter where the veg comes from

A_Sober_Paddy

ch750536 wrote: »

Yep, I know all this but thanks for the notice.
We do have a lot of seeds in the diet, is a difficult one to add in though. I bought a 1kg bag of organic mixed seeds which gets sprinkled on most things, but I don't tell you about that.

Omega 3 I take from algae (it's where fish get it from). Hard to source and have run out but am hoping to get back in pretty soon.

B12 - I have organic veg, not washed so am fine for that.

The only source of Vit b12 for vegans is Spirulina but its a poorly absorbed form, other than that there is no other

http://examine.com/supplements/Vitamin+B12/

http://examine.com/supplements/Spirulina/

ch750536

bluewolf wrote: »

We've asked for breakdowns before and you won't give them.

& I keep saying that breakdown now is pointless, after day 5 makes more sense.

bluewolf wrote: »

If the kids are the ones eating donuts and waffles and crisps it's still not ideal and not a prime example of "nutritious", no matter where the veg comes from

1 doughnut a week is fine. In fact, 1 doughnut a week and 1 pack of crisps \ popcorn in the school lunch each day is really good compared to most kids.

2 waffles eaten by the entire family, THIS WEEK does not seem excessive.

I don't expect them to get their nutrition from this. The doughnut does not delete nutrition. If they had 100% of their nutritional needs and then had a doughnut it does not mean that their nutrition vanishes. Sure, they have some bad stuff too but the good stuff is still there.

tldr;
Read & don't be a hater. There is loads of nutrition in our food, why focus on the 1 doughnut & 2 waffles we have consumed in total between 4 people in the last 5 days....

ch750536

A_Sober_Paddy wrote: »

The only source of Vit b12 for vegans is Spirulina but its a poorly absorbed form, other than that there is no other

http://examine.com/supplements/Vitamin+B12/

http://examine.com/supplements/Spirulina/

B12 is found naturally in manure fertilized soil.

A_Sober_Paddy

ch750536 wrote: »

B12 is found naturally in manure fertilized soil.

ok, but can you post a peer reviewed journal to confirm this please