How to kill depression

Mark Tapley

sup_dude wrote: »

It makes it sound very much like depression is something that's very difficult to overcome, and I think it's that kind of attitude that contributes to why there are so many long term sufferers of depression.

It's hard to see you as misunderstood.

Ave Sodalis

Mark Tapley wrote: »

It's hard to see you as misunderstood.

I don't follow?

Mark Tapley

sup_dude wrote: »

I don't follow?

Your experience and extensive research leads you to believe that depression is not difficult to overcome?

FullblownRose

Murray007 wrote: »

FullblownRose wrote: »

I am in those stats as someone who got over it as I have not sought treatment in some many years. I am not over it, I wake up every single morning and say to myself it's not going to get me today and hope to god it doesn't.

For the guys who say cheer up, you have no idea how chronic depression effects you. Apart from the mental numbness, the physical effects are incapacitating. I remember lying in bed one day and having to will each part of my body to move so I could get up and go to the toilet. I couldn't muster the energy to get my fingers to move, I had to ask a family member to help me up! I was on SSRIs at the time.

I don't understand why you are quoting me again. You mentioned complete recovery, and statistical probability of same, I didn't. I certainly haven't told anyone to cheer up.

Ave Sodalis

Mark Tapley wrote: »

Your experience and extensive research leads you to believe that depression is not difficult to overcome?

No, in fact if you read the rest of the post you quoted, I said it's not easy, you don't wake up in the morning suddenly feeling better. What I am saying is that it is not so difficult in that it's near impossible for anyone to overcome it. Depression can be overcome. It takes time and it takes finding a way that works because, as I also said in that post, everyone's experience is different. It also takes dedication (I am not saying that depression suffers suffer because they dont do enough) which is the hardest part of depression, to the belief it can be done. However, the belief it can be done gets diminished when people keep saying that it can't be done.

LETHAL LADY

I'm no expert and I can only discuss the people in my own and extended family who are or have in the past suffered from types of depression that I can recognize.

A bipolar family member exhibits what I would assume are textbook examples of mania.
When she is manic, she will show overly enthusiastic, out of character ways of behaving.
An example would be that she once, on a whim, signed a hire purchase agreement for a very expensive brand new car, without giving a second thought to how she would pay for it, given that the nature of her employment is not steady.
This to most people would hardly be shocking, but when you live with a person with bipolar I think you'll know what I mean.
She also has completely disastrous relationships with men.
The last one resulted in her being involved with a violent arsehole and this sent her on such a depressive episode that it nearly destroyed her both mentally and physically.

I've also had experience of a family member who suffered with postnatal depression.
When you have a baby you're meant to, according to tv and such, become the ultimate earth mother with a natural ability to bond with your child.
The reality is far from it imo!
A friend of mine, who is a maternity nurse, once told me they treat a lot of first time mums for postnatal depression, although she said it can also occur to the most experienced mums.
If you have a predisposition to anxiety or depression, well having a baby may just be your tipping point according to her.

Grief related depression can happen to us all.
The loss of a loved one, be it a parent, husband, child, or any family member, can spiral the most adept at coping into a pit of despair.
I've a sister who had a non-viable pregnancy.
She suffered from depression for a full two years after the birth.
I've spoken to a woman who lost a toddler to Leukemia many years ago. She told me that she coped through necessity at the time t(she had more children to look after) ,but her husband has suffered from mild to severe depression since this horrific experience every since.

In conclusion, I have to say that I do not fully understand the complexity of depression. The types of depression need to be discussed, rather than chastising peoples experiences maybe?

ardle1

mike_ie wrote: »

No offense, but if it were that easy to overcome depression, half of us here would be out jogging every morning. Part of dealing with depression is realising and accepting the fact that there isn't one easy solution, sad to say, and that it can't just be brushed away with exercise or similar

You can't 'kill' depression. The best one can do is to try to learn to deal with it, and to seek help with it if you can.




[edit]Hyperbole and a Half gives one of the best descriptions of depression that I have ever come across. Well worth the five minutes it takes to read it.

Adventures in Depression
Depression Part Two

No offence, it's not a theory but scientific fact.....
Maybe it's just not as simple as it sounds, but I'm sure it takes into account all variables, such as, healthy lifestyle and minimal alcohol use!

ilovebiology

I had severe suicidal depression. I attempted suicide a number of times, and failed. I cannot begin to tell you how severely sick I was.

I think with this illness, there are a number of things involved that you have to face and acknowledge, and understand that there are things that you will have to do to maintain your emotional health, to try and stabilise yourself emotionally, and to try and keep going on being in a moderate to good emotional state.

It took me a long long time to get where I am today, and let me tell you it was supremely difficult. Having the illness is one thing, trying to get out of it is even worse in my opinion, as I know what its like and I was severely sick, like I was saying.

You have to first accept that you are sick, accept that if you are diagnosed with depression to accept you are depressed. Just being told that can make you feel even worse, and more depressed. Depression is in my opinion the worst illness anyone can have. I know two women, both had cancer, and then went onto having depression. They both said that cancer was somewhat easier in a way than depression, because with cancer you are not alone, and people have more understanding, but with depression, if no one can understand you, you feel completely alone and that is one of the most difficult parts of this illness, people not understanding you.

I became so absolutely locked in the illness that I couldn't get out of bed, and couldn't leave the house. I was really locked in the illness, and every day I was getting worse and worse. I attempted suicide, and ended up in hospital.

I was assessed by a fantastic psychiatrist, psychologist, CBT, social worker, and occupational therapist. They were brilliant. They told me about the daily routine, eating well, sleeping well, and for weeks I was so ill I remained extremely sick. Then one day, like one of the posters above, in my mind I thought, do you know what I am so sick of feeling this bad all the time, I am sick of it. (That is one of the reasons people commit suicide because they are in such excrutiating emotional pain, which never leaves them, and they would rather die than have to feel in such a horrendous way for another day.)

On that day, I changed my attitude to it. I thought, I can either stay feeling absolutely miserable, not being able to function, I can kill myself, or I can try and face this horrible illness and do something about it, to try and really help myself.

I had tried to kill myself a few times and failed, which I felt crap about, as at the time, I couldn't face another day, as I was in such constant excrutiating emotional pain. I was afraid then if I tried it again I could be left in limbo ie needing an organ transplant, being left paralysed or left in some other way. I decided to face the illness, challenge it, and really do everything I could to help myself so I could feel some way better.

I began to sleep better, and eat better, and take better care of myself. Just doing those things alone took me 5 to 6 weeks to work very hard on, and it was very very difficult. But with the kindness of the nurses (Their support, and positiveness really did help). You don't need to be in hospital for this, please ask your family, partner, friends that you will need their help with just this alone, as with going through this, a depressed person needs so much support, help, kindness, patience, understanding and an awful lot of love, and getting that every day whilst battling the simple things every day helps a depressed person an awful lot.

It took me weeks and weeks to get through this, and every day was like climbing Mount Everest for me. It was so difficult. That's what the illness is. It sucks the life out of you, and everything in life is negative, and just trying to face the illness is an overwhelming battle.

I had bad days, and good days, and on my bad days I said to myself Ok, I can have today for a day of recovering from the past few days, and I will try again tomorrow. That was where I went wrong in the past, if I failed on one or two days, I gave into the illness and was back into a severe depressed state again. Its also about not being so hard on yourself, and going easy on yourself, and acknowledge that you are trying, and to keep trying and trying and not to give up, but to try again the next day. That alone helped me.

I gradually worked myself into the daily routine, and then extended that to getting outside - even just to sit outside for a while. Fresh air is good for the mind. Talking to people who understand - thats where friends and family become your rock, and you need them alot with this illness.

I then took to the gym, and I gave it a good few chances, and kept going, and I have kept going to the gym to this day, and it does help me, and overall I am doing an awful lot better than where I was.

Anyone who has severe depression will know you would do ANYTHING to feel good even just for ONE day, and even just exercising that heavy dead negative emotional hell of depression lifts a little - exercise is like cleaning out those terrible emotional hell of depression, for me it is like that anyways.

Exercise really does help alot, but you have to face and accept you have the illness, and acknowledge and make a choice that you want to live or die. If you chose to live, it is very difficult to work through all of this, but it is really worth it. My psychiatrist told me -

To interact with people every day.
Do meditation, yoga, relaxation techniques (They didn't work for me, but do for some people)
To find something to look forward to as much as possible.
To remember times in your life you were happy and to do those things again - whether it was a hobby you once did, people you used to meet up with, or also to meet new people.
It's amazing how much laughter can help a person along - maybe to watch funny films again, meeting up with a positive funny person again.
Having someone there to listen to you about how you are feeling, a family member, or a friend you trust. Talking is like a release of those awful emotions and it does help too.
Getting a pet, or spending more time with a family pet. You always get unconditional love from an animal, and animals have been proven to help people with depression.
If something really upsets me and I feel desperate or at crisis point I take xanax or valium, and sleep it off. When I wake a few hours later, I don't feel as bad, and then to allow the problem to sink in, and then to find a way of solving the problem.
There have been times where I have been incredibly upset and very down, and I have drank to ease myself. I know it is not the best advice to give people, but I put it like this, is it better to have a few drinks and ease yourself or trying to commit suicide, or causing yourself irreversible self harm?
If someone or something makes you very angry to punch pillows.
If you are feeling very anxious, exercise is BRILLIANT for feelings of intense anxiety.
When you have intense emotions like these to try these remedies I have mentioned, and they do work. You must also remember that, these intense emotions do not last, and in a few hours you won't feel as intense as you did. These intense emotions come and go, and to try to remember that, when you are feeling that bad.
Problem solving your life. Write down all the issues/problems you have in your life that upset you, or maybe its a person, or a job. Write down all possibilities to try and sort the problem out. Maybe discuss your problems with someone you trust, because with this illness, it can be very hard to think clearly or see things clearly. Break down the problems in your life, bit by bit, as it is easier to solve problems that way rather than trying to take on a problem all at once. Again, I will say, perseverance, try again, and not be so hard on yourself if you have a bad day - bad days are a part of getting well, and to say ok, I will try again tomorrow.
If you are in a difficult relationship, or have difficult people in your life, maybe try to talk to them, or avoid them as much as you can, or break up with them if you have to.
Assess how you are feeling as you gradually progress. If you have a few bad days, and feel you are going back into the bad symptoms of depression to alert yourself, and say no, I don't want to get into that state again. I kept that in my mind, as I was getting myself well. Being aware of how you are doing, and if you are eating less, not getting out, things like that to adjust it, so that you don't become that way again.
The gym/exercise, now I mean vigorous exercise for over 40 minutes every 2 or 3 days, has really really helped me, and every time I go to the gym I feel like I am cleaning out my insides, and the horrible negative emotions are released from me, and it really does help an awful lot.

I hope this helps. Maybe in my title the word "Kill" depression wasn't my best choice of word, but with me doing and going through all of this, it helps an awful lot, and from where I was before with severe suicidal depression to where I am now, I would say I am 70% better. I have to keep up my exercise for the rest of my life, and I have no problem doing it, as anything that can keep the excrutiating hell of depression away I will do it, as most people with severe depression would know.

I am improving everyday, and am gradually getting back to being 100%, but it is taking time, and I have to adjust myself if I am having a few bad days, and get back to where I was before, and keeping up my exercise and getting out into the fresh air, being around people, and talking out your problems.

I composed my thread to help someone out there, I hope it does help someone, and slowly but surely you can get there.

Mark Tapley

sup_dude wrote: »

No, in fact if you read the rest of the post you quoted, I said it's not easy, you don't wake up in the morning suddenly feeling better. What I am saying is that it is not so difficult in that it's near impossible for anyone to overcome it. Depression can be overcome. It takes time and it takes finding a way that works because, as I also said in that post, everyone's experience is different. It also takes dedication (I am not saying that depression suffers suffer because they dont do enough) which is the hardest part of depression, to the belief it can be done. However, the belief it can be done gets diminished when people keep saying that it can't be done.

I didn't know I had to read the whole post. I thought I would cherry pick some random words and object to them.
As to the rest of your post I appreciate your condescension.

Call Me Jimmy

sup_dude wrote: »

However, the belief it can be done gets diminished when people keep saying that it can't be done.

A very good point and not very popular.

Someone goes into a GP, (or even a psychologist/psychiatrist) after a bad year or two and says they feel down. The doctor from this one chat says 'you have depression' (without any definitive test) and from then on all that person hears is 'there is no cure for depression'. So basically a life sentence (at least psychologically). Is that not a bit pardon the pun mad?

There is science behind the symptoms of depression (what the ssri's are based on) but how many patients are tested for low serotonin before being told they have a chronic illness?

Ave Sodalis

Mark Tapley wrote: »

I didn't know I had to read the whole post. I thought I would cherry pick some random words and object to them.
As to the rest of your post I appreciate your condescension.

Generally, "random words" are related to other "random words" and altogether they form a post.
I'm confused as to where my post was condescending, could you please point it out?

Ave Sodalis

Call Me Jimmy wrote: »

A very good point and not very popular.

Someone goes into a GP, (or even a psychologist/psychiatrist) after a bad year or two and says they feel down. The doctor from this one chat says 'you have depression' (without any definitive test) and from then on all that person hears is 'there is no cure for depression'. So basically a life sentence (at least psychologically). Is that not a bit pardon the pun mad?

There is science behind the symptoms of depression (what the ssri's are based on) but how many patients are tested for low serotonin before being told they have a chronic illness?

That actually reminds me of a time I went to the doctor. I had been sleeping to crazy hours of the day, even entire days without waking for alarms or anything. Now, I knew it wasn't depression because I had depression before. However, the doc was like "are you sure you don't have depression? I'll write you a prescription for antidepressants. What do you mean you don't want them? Are you positive you haven't been feeling a bit down lately?". This went on for the full 15minutes I was in there for. Needless to say, I didn't go back there.

This isn't taking away from depression diagnoses, by the way. Twas just an eyebrow raising, kinda funny story that that post reminded me of

Mark Tapley

sup_dude wrote: »

Generally, "random words" are related to other "random words" and altogether they form a post.
I'm confused as to where my post was condescending, could you please point it out?

You need your sarcometer checked . Condescending ? The bit where you put yourself forward as an authority and then state the bleedin obvious eg all peoples experiences are different. No **** Sherlock. You have either expressed yourself poorly or don't know what you are talking about.

Ave Sodalis

Mark Tapley wrote: »

You need your sarcometer checked . Condescending ? The bit where you put yourself forward as an authority and then state the bleedin obvious eg all peoples experiences are different. No **** Sherlock. You have either expressed yourself poorly or don't know what you are talking about.

I never put myself forward as an authority. I stated all people's experiences are different because it was relevant to what I said after that. It was an acknowledgement that just because I was a depression sufferer, doesn't mean I think everyone is the same as me or that the way I overcame it will work for everyone.

Glenn Coco

An article on The Journal recently http://www.thejournal.ie/readme/living-with-mental-illness-1577505-Jul2014/
One of the best articles I've read. Many people do overcome depression, many learn how to manage it, many don't. All need our help regardless.

ilovebiology

Glenn Coco wrote: »

An article on The Journal recently http://www.thejournal.ie/readme/living-with-mental-illness-1577505-Jul2014/
One of the best articles I've read. Many people do overcome depression, many learn how to manage it, many don't. All need our help regardless.

One of the most difficult things for me in trying to overcome this illness was a change in my attitude. That was a HUGE struggle for me, as with this illness everything is black, dark and extremely negative, and you feel you are stuck in the dark hole of depression forever, and nothing and no doctor can help just how extremely terrible you are feeling.

As I was saying, that one day, I decided I had had enough and I wanted to face this illness, and fight it, and to really try hard to help myself.

Just doing that alone, to change my attitude was a huge part of getting out of severe suicidal depression for me. Then doing the work of recovery, liek I have described, and to take it easy on yourself, and take it a day at a time, and if you can't do much for one or two days to let yourself have those one or two days, and to try again. Keep trying, and not giving up, taking it easy on yourself, and to try the next day.

I was an extremely ill patient with severe suicidal depression, and I am now about 70% better, and I keep working at overcoming this illness everyday. The most difficult part is changing your attitude, listening to what your doctor or psychiatrist tells you to do, or what I wrote in my previous post, and to face the illness.

Lia_lia

It really does depend on the person I guess. I know if I'm ever in an "anxious depressive state" or whatever you call it I have to exercise. It's like an urge to get anger out of myself or something. I can go on really long runs no bother, it feels great!

I go through periods of depression every few years. Like I can be fine for a few years and then just be really, really down for a few months. Usually brought on by stress of some sort. Appetite completely goes and I cry all the time. It's really stupid. There's more but I won't go into it. Was in counselling for years when I was in secondary school.

Got CBT last year which I would recommend to anyone who suffers from depression or anxiety. Helped me so much!

woodoo

For anyone who came off antidepressants did it leave you feeling numb and emotionless for months afterwards?

thebaz

i excersise most days - I swim in the sea , most days , even in winter and I still get bouts of crippling depression - as others have said, if it was easy as a jog in the park , depression would be gone - sadly depression is a part of Western civilisation , perhaps linked to our material world - societies more compassionate and Spiritual and less materialistic , such as Asia and Africa , in fact the Western world up to quite recently were not as bedelived with the curse of Depression - its a horrible curse of modern life in the Western world.

Macavity.

woodoo wrote: »

For anyone who came off antidepressants did it leave you feeling numb and emotionless for months afterwards?

I'm 5/6 weeks off now and am feeling much better, I was completely emotionless on those drugs. I feel like a much more compassionate person over the last week or so. Anxiety has increased though.

Ruu

Just a note a general with these sorts of threads, goes without saying.

Do not give/request medical or professional advice.

If you want to tell someone about the amazing results YOU have had with a certain medical treatment, then go ahead. What you can’t do is tell them that THEY should have that treatment. You aren’t a doctor. Even if you were, you haven’t examined that person physically, nor do you have a full medical history. This applies to Alternative/Complimentary medicine too. Suggesting to someone that has a serious problem that <insert alternative therapy here> might cure it is very irresponsible.

Don't diagnose anyone on the site either. You simply can’t and we don’t want you doing it. Don't do it.

FanadMan

Macavity. wrote: »

I'm 5/6 weeks off now and am feeling much better, I was completely emotionless on those drugs. I feel like a much more compassionate person over the last week or so. Anxiety has increased though.

Know what you mean - everything is numb. Could be watching the funniest comedy or the saddest film ever and everything was just meh. Sounds stupid saying it but to experience it is strange.

Nowadays, I try to find small to smile at.......could be my neighbours dog coming in to say hello or something equally silly. To me it's the small things that can make the difference. In therapy I was always told to take baby steps and that's what I'm trying

Frito

ilovebiology wrote: »

I know two women, both had cancer, and then went onto having depression. They both said that cancer was somewhat easier in a way than depression, because with cancer you are not alone, and people have more understanding, but with depression, if no one can understand you, you feel completely alone and that is one of the most difficult parts of this illness, people not understanding you.

I actually think they're similar issues, depending on your perspective. I forget where to find the link but I remember reading an article about a woman who had cancer who was very angry and frightened by her illness and prognosis. This was compounded by people's expectation that she should be optimistic and "fight the fight" - her argument was this was the only legitimate attitude she was expected to have; that even the words such as 'battling cancer' made her out to be a heroic soldier fighting for some just cause, when in reality she was having gruelling chemotherapy. IIRC her support group waned considerably because she just couldn't reassure them she was 'coping' with her diagnosis and treatment - it was the end of the world to her.

I think this is similar to depression; people can be superficially sympathetic to distress provided the distress doesn't last too long and is replaced with hope and optimism and a sense of the person plodding on bravely. People like loose ends tied up neatly and understandably so. I agree it is very isolating for the person involved.

Antarcticseal

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0lagC4l7SO0

Depression can be overcome by surrendering to the present moment. Accept the moment as it is, don't fight it, don't resist it, don't complain about it. Pay attention to your breathing, allow your thoughts to slowly fade away, when a thought does pop up, observe it and let it be and let it go.

gozunda

Antarcticseal wrote: »

...
Depression can be overcome by surrendering to the present moment. Accept the moment as it is, don't fight it, don't resist it, don't complain about it. Pay attention to your breathing, allow your thoughts to slowly fade away, when a thought does pop up, observe it and let it be and let it go.

This is one of the best descriptions of depression I have ever read on Boards

Devore wrote:

Depression is not sadness.
One of the biggest misunderstandings about depression is that its like being really sad. It's not. It's like being *nothing*. Not sad, not happy, nothing. No joy, no sorrow. Flat line. Sure it can be triggered, exacerbated or deepened by bad, sad news... But the feeling is not one of sadness, it's more a flat feeling of inertia.
To give you an idea, there was a day, not years ago, I got up and made myself a coffee and discovered I had no milk and thought: Why do I even bother, the world is ****ed and I can't fix it and went back to bed for the rest of the day. Two days later I couldn't figure out why someone had left a cup of black coffee go cold in my kitchen...

http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2056481009

Antarcticseal

gozunda wrote: »

This is one of the best descriptions of depression I have ever read on Boards




ie/thread/2056481009[/url]

Excessive thought and identification with form can block your connection to the life or consciousness inside yourself. This can cause you to feel flat or to feel nothing

gozunda

Antarcticseal wrote: »

Excessive thought and identification with form can block your connection to the life or consciousness inside yourself. This can cause you to feel flat or to feel nothing

Otherwise known as depression

Source??

Antarcticseal

gozunda wrote: »

Otherwise known as depression :rolleyes:

Source??

Source, Eckharte Tolle, Buddha, Dali Lama. There are many people over the millenia who discovered how the ego causes us suffering, including depression.

You must lose the idea of "me and my life". You are an expression of life, the same life is in all people. It is not "your life".

gozunda

Antarcticseal wrote: »

Source, Eckharte Tolle, Buddha, Dali Lama. There are many people over the millenia who discovered how the ego causes us suffering, including depression.

You must lose the idea of "me and my life". You are an expression of life, the same life is in all people. It is not "your life".

Hmmm yes ok - I don't believe this is a discussion about Existentialism or middle eastern philosophy ...

In the meantime Devores personal description of his experience of depression stands. Thanks all the same. :rolleyes:

Tony EH

fryup wrote: »

depression is so isolating, cause no one wants to be around someone who's sad and down in the mouth

its just not socially acceptable to be sad, you're just sneered at

There's a difference between depression (small d) and Depression (capital D).

The first, depression (small d), is a malaise usually "suffered" by pampered western people, who one day realise that their life hasn't turned out exactly how the wish. It's a malady that's been hyped by pharmaceutical interests and peddled by unscrupulous bastards out to make a quick buck on people looking for a reason for their particular sad mood that month.

Most people who say they are "depressed" are simply a bit down. A condition that everybody experiences from time to time and one that can be overcome with relative ease, especially by the people who say their "depressed" because they couldn't afford that holiday they wanted.

It's this "depression" that's bandied about, usually by people who need a good dose of cop on and better world education. Pampered fools with way too much time on their hands and a lack of real knowledge on true hardship.

The second, Depression (capital D), is clinical mental problem that is a genuine condition and can be very difficult to overcome. Unfortunately, that condition has been over-medicalised in the western world too, by the nouveau Psychiatric approach of shoving a pill down everyone's throat, who wishes to discuss a psychological issue. People who are "Depressed", can also quite often refrain from exhibiting the expected outward expressions of their condition and can often appear happy or bubbly in a public situation, while in private they are torn up and often are at a loss as to know exactly why, which leads to a further strengthening of their condition. People who experience Clinical Depression can often hide their problem until they decide to take a drastic action. They'll often self medicate, with alcohol or other drugs.

Depression (capital D) is not something to be scoffed at, but depression (small d) is, often, quite rightly scorned.