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Priced out of the market :(

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    #32
    GavMan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,914 ✭✭✭GavMan


    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/order-for-eviction-of-couple-can-be-sent-to-sheriff-judge-says-1.1875739


    As good a reason as any to own your own home by the time you're retiring


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    #33
    Eldarion
    Registered Users Posts: 484 ✭✭Eldarion


    GavMan wrote: »
    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/order-for-eviction-of-couple-can-be-sent-to-sheriff-judge-says-1.1875739


    As good a reason as any to own your own home by the time you're retiring
    Article wrote:
    He also stated that he always attempted to pay the rent of €800 a month, but the rent cheques kept being returned.

    So you can live rent free like this couple?


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    #34
    GavMan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,914 ✭✭✭GavMan


    Eldarion wrote: »
    So you can live rent free like this couple?

    If thats all you took from that link, you've a strange view of the world...


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    #35
    lima
    Registered Users Posts: 1,239 ✭✭✭lima


    Shedite27 wrote: »
    No, but being able to redecorate, do a bit of landscaping,without the treat of being evicted in a month or two could.

    Also, not having to pay rent when I'm retired would make me happier than paying rent.

    I think not having to do decorating or landscaping would be better!

    True about having a house when you retire, but with renting you can keep savings as well, perhaps you could even purchase a property when you retire with these savings


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    #36
    MouseTail
    Registered Users Posts: 1,663 ✭✭✭MouseTail


    lima wrote: »
    True about having a house when you retire, but with renting you can keep savings as well, perhaps you could even purchase a property when you retire with these savings

    But you have much more spare income with a mortgage in order to be able to save.

    Take an example of someone who bought 17 years ago, in the new suburbs of Dublin 18. Houses sold at about £65k / €82.5k (I remember the conversations - thats mad money for a house, who will pay that etc).

    That person is paying around €350 a month mortgage, which at the start of the mortgage ate a large part of their income, much less so now, and due to inflation it will continue to decrease. Their neighbour, who has always rented is now paying €1,600 rent. Family A has over 1k a month more than family B to invest/save and the gap will widen.

    And that is leaving aside the fact that family A will have a paid for asset in 10 years or so.


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    #37
    Dredd_J
    Registered Users Posts: 202 ✭✭Dredd_J


    lima wrote: »
    If owning a home is ones happiness goal then it is a very peculiar goal

    While it may contribute to ones quality of life it has broken many others.

    Having a roof over your head, whether it's owned by you or a landlord, allows you to pursue happiness in other ways.

    For me, sitting in a room saying 'I own this' wouldn't really make me happy

    I know what you mean.
    I know far more people who have let the whole owning/not owning argument consume them to the point that they are driven mad and its really effecting their lives. I have friends who just cant get beyond the whole not owning for the rest of your life isnt as bad as it sounds (as long as you prepare for your retirement and put the rent away for that). One minute they are desperate to buy and are moaning to all around them about how its disgraceful that houses arent more affordable for them. then the next minute they are giving arguments for renting instead of buying.
    They dont know whether they are coming or going and i can see that they are letting it eat them up.

    i personally think people would be better off just not giving a sh1te whether renting or buying is the best way to go. Just go with what you can afford and forget about it after that.


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    #38
    lima
    Registered Users Posts: 1,239 ✭✭✭lima


    MouseTail wrote: »
    But you have much more spare income with a mortgage in order to be able to save.

    Take an example of someone who bought 17 years ago, in the new suburbs of Dublin 18. Houses sold at about £65k / €82.5k (I remember the conversations - thats mad money for a house, who will pay that etc).

    That person is paying around €350 a month mortgage, which at the start of the mortgage ate a large part of their income, much less so now, and due to inflation it will continue to decrease. Their neighbour, who has always rented is now paying €1,600 rent. Family A has over 1k a month more than family B to invest/save and the gap will widen.

    And that is leaving aside the fact that family A will have a paid for asset in 10 years or so.

    In fairness houses aren't going to go up 5 times the price over the next 17 years, they have gone down by half in the last 6 years!

    Plus rent wasn't e1600 17 years ago

    I get what you're saying but choosing to rent isn't at all that much 'dead money'
    as Irish society would have you believe. I've been paying an average of e600 a month for years now so have loads of spare cash

    Anyway I'm going to stop looking now for the foreseeable future and remain renting. I can still afford to buy but after two years of looking there is truly nothing worth it in Dublin.


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    #39
    No Pants
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,347 ✭✭✭No Pants


    GavMan wrote: »
    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/order-for-eviction-of-couple-can-be-sent-to-sheriff-judge-says-1.1875739

    As good a reason as any to own your own home by the time you're retiring
    Those two should be housed by the state...in Mountjoy. They can afford their own accommodation, just not in Dublin 15. They're costing everyone money and wasting court time.


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    #40
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    No Pants wrote: »
    Those two should be housed by the state...in Mountjoy. They can afford their own accommodation, just not in Dublin 15. They're costing everyone money and wasting court time.

    Did you read the bit about them being evicted because their landlord is in arrears, not them?


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    #41
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,279 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    gaius c wrote: »
    Did you read the bit about them being evicted because their landlord is in arrears, not them?

    They were offering to pay half the going rent- but this was determined to be unsatisfactory- and their cheques were returned uncashed.

    They were not offering to pay the going rent for the area- they want to live somewhere they clearly can't afford to- and they have built up significant arrears in rent, which they have not made any proposals as to how they might intend to cover (aka they didn't save the rent in a separate bank account when it wasn't collected..........)

    While its hard not to have sympathy with them on one level- on another level- they signifiy much which is wrong with the rental system in Ireland.

    Their debt (and it is a debt) has now been handed over to the county sheriff, who has been ordered by the court to evict them.


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    #42
    No Pants
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,347 ✭✭✭No Pants


    gaius c wrote: »
    Did you read the bit about them being evicted because their landlord is in arrears, not them?
    It's the landlord's house and he's trying to deal with his situation. They're not. They have been ordered to leave, they're in contempt of court and they're currently spending nothing. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news folks, but you can't afford to live in Castleknock. Time to move on. Sad to see two grown adults behave like children and I don't believe that they've tried very hard to find themselves somewhere to live.


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    #43
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    Interesting the difference in attitude when it's tenants outstanding their welcome versus folk who haven't paid their mortgage in years. Not just you, quite a few are posting similar sentiments but if something similar was said about mortgage holders, there would be a slew of "you heartless monster" posts.


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    #44
    mariaalice
    Registered Users Posts: 12,390 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    Why is it such an all or noting situation, do what a lot of German do which is buy somewhere you might retire too, but rent in a city or where you work. I can see why if you are single you couldn't buy in somewhere like Gorey or Laytown , but rent Dublin or any where prices are reasonable.

    I don't think you could expect to cover the mortgage with the rent you couldn't approach it like that, until you retired that gives you the best of both worlds security when you retire and flexibility to live where you want now. Also don't buy until you are 35/40 if you are single that gives you plenty of time to save and get you self in a good position.


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    #45
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    The_Conductor wrote: »
    They were offering to pay half the going rent- but this was determined to be unsatisfactory- and their cheques were returned uncashed.

    Thats not referenced anywhere in that article.


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    #46
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,279 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    gaius c wrote: »
    Thats not referenced anywhere in that article.

    It was part of the discussion in the court notes- and one of the grounds on which the judge held them in contempt.


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    #47
    Shedite27
    Registered Users Posts: 9,374 ✭✭✭Shedite27


    mariaalice wrote: »
    Why is it such an all or noting situation, do what a lot of German do which is buy somewhere you might retire too, but rent in a city or where you work. I can see why if you are single you couldn't buy in somewhere like Gorey or Laytown , but rent Dublin or any where prices are reasonable.
    Because I want to live where my children/grandchildren/friends live when I'm retired


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    #48
    mariaalice
    Registered Users Posts: 12,390 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    Shedite27 wrote: »
    Because I want to live where my children/grandchildren/friends live when I'm retired

    That's a good point, it maybe a very Irish thing though look at the uk retiring to the countryside or the sea side is very popular thus things are more set up and availed of by retired people. If you are still renting when you retire look in to the Sue Ryeder foundation is a good idea, although I know the one in Dalkey has a long waiting list, you get the best of both worlds privacy and company. I think we are going to have to accecpt the model of the way we provide a home for ourselves in Ireland is going to have to change.


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    #49
    MouseTail
    Registered Users Posts: 1,663 ✭✭✭MouseTail


    mariaalice wrote: »
    That's a good point, it maybe a very Irish thing though look at the uk retiring to the countryside or the sea side is very popular thus things are more set up and availed of by retired people. If you are still renting when you retire look in to the Sue Ryeder foundation is a good idea, although I know the one in Dalkey has a long waiting list, you get the best of both worlds privacy and company. I think we are going to have to accecpt the model of the way we provide a home for ourselves in Ireland is going to have to change.

    Have you ever been to those English seaside towns, like Eastbourne? I find them very depressing, almost like old people have been ghettoised. A dystopian town where young people and children have vanished. i know thats not the case, and they retire there by choice, but I certainly prefer a society of intergenerational living, and believe that is the model we should strive for.


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    #50
    mariaalice
    Registered Users Posts: 12,390 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    MouseTail wrote: »
    Have you ever been to those English seaside towns, like Eastbourne? I find them very depressing, almost like old people have been ghettoised. A dystopian town where young people and children have vanished. i know thats not the case, and they retire there by choice, but I certainly prefer a society of intergenerational living, and believe that is the model we should strive for.

    I have been to Lythem st Anns which is a bit like that, of course we should have intergraded living, but the I was born in Crumlin and want to die in Crumlin mantra we have in Ireland is not working anymore so new ways of doing it will have to be found, maybe it means you can stay in Crumlin, but if you are single you will have a one bed apartment not a whole house.


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    #51
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    The_Conductor wrote: »
    It was part of the discussion in the court notes- and one of the grounds on which the judge held them in contempt.

    Sorry but you've lost me now. I don't see any discussion on them past the posting of the link on the last page.


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    #52
    Dredd_J
    Registered Users Posts: 202 ✭✭Dredd_J


    mariaalice wrote: »
    Why is it such an all or noting situation, do what a lot of German do which is buy somewhere you might retire too, but rent in a city or where you work. I can see why if you are single you couldn't buy in somewhere like Gorey or Laytown , but rent Dublin or any where prices are reasonable.

    I don't think you could expect to cover the mortgage with the rent you couldn't approach it like that, until you retired that gives you the best of both worlds security when you retire and flexibility to live where you want now. Also don't buy until you are 35/40 if you are single that gives you plenty of time to save and get you self in a good position.


    Thats exactly what we did. We own the house outright now and will be retiring to it as soon as we are ready. Its rented at the moment, so making some money for us for now too. Its great for retirement, but not when you have to commute to a city job every morning.


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    #53
    Squatman
    Registered Users Posts: 1,581 ✭✭✭Squatman


    dodged a bullet there OP. That house does not represent good value for money. It looks like a 50+ year old house for near 200k. My advice to anyone looking at this or similar is to not get fooled into thinking this is a good way in spending money that will take a lifetime to accrue.


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    #54
    No Pants
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,347 ✭✭✭No Pants


    gaius c wrote: »
    Interesting the difference in attitude when it's tenants outstanding their welcome versus folk who haven't paid their mortgage in years. Not just you, quite a few are posting similar sentiments but if something similar was said about mortgage holders, there would be a slew of "you heartless monster" posts.
    I can't speak for others here, but I'm just commenting on this article at this time. I originally read something about it in the Indo yesterday and, true to form, it was not as well written and overly emotional.

    "Speaking to the Irish Independent last night from their semi-detached house in a quiet housing estate in Carpenterstown, west Dublin, Martin (71) and Violet (61) said they face prison and homelessness.

    ...the couple have remained, saying there is simply nowhere else for them to go."

    They have been searching since then for somewhere else to live but due to the massive shortage of rental accommodation in the capital and rents increasing by more than 25pc, the couple are stuck in limbo.

    He will be meeting with the housing department again today to see if they can get a rental allowance.

    But with rents in the area now exceeding €1,400 a month, the couple – whose combined pension income is just €363 a week – aren't holding their breath."

    But this next piece is my favourite (emphasis mine):

    "There was a house for rent two doors down and there were 50 people queuing up outside to view it. It was absolutely frightening," Mrs Coyne said." :rolleyes:


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    #55
    Grandpa Hassan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,945 ✭✭✭Grandpa Hassan


    gaius c wrote: »
    Interesting the difference in attitude when it's tenants outstanding their welcome versus folk who haven't paid their mortgage in years. Not just you, quite a few are posting similar sentiments but if something similar was said about mortgage holders, there would be a slew of "you heartless monster" posts.

    I completely disagree. I think the overwhelming majority on here want people who haven't paid their mortgage to get their home repossessed. This reluctance to repossess is doing nobody any favours except for those individual debtors


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    #56
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users Posts: 17,843 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    If that house is worth 350k in 10 years time it will look pretty good value for 200k! everything is relative. Yes it looks expensive compared to the trough of prices...


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    #57
    No Pants
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,347 ✭✭✭No Pants


    MouseTail wrote: »
    Have you ever been to those English seaside towns, like Eastbourne? I find them very depressing, almost like old people have been ghettoised. A dystopian town where young people and children have vanished. i know thats not the case, and they retire there by choice, but I certainly prefer a society of intergenerational living, and believe that is the model we should strive for.
    A lot of the English seaside towns are like that, Brighton being the exception. All along the south coast from Cornwall to Sussex. Eastbourne is still noted as being exceptional, known by the locals as "God's Waiting Room".

    Having said that, no one forces them to move there. They make that choice themselves and property down there isn't cheap.


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    #58
    MouseTail
    Registered Users Posts: 1,663 ✭✭✭MouseTail


    No Pants wrote: »
    A lot of the English seaside towns are like that, Brighton being the exception. All along the south coast from Cornwall to Sussex. Eastbourne is still noted as being exceptional, known by the locals as "God's Waiting Room".

    Having said that, no one forces them to move there. They make that choice themselves and property down there isn't cheap.
    Not a model we should be attempting to emulate here though. Besides the demands placed on social and health services in those areas must be huge.


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    #59
    Grandpa Hassan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,945 ✭✭✭Grandpa Hassan


    http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/gallery/2013/aug/06/uk-seaside-resorts-decline-in-pictures

    http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2013/aug/21/english-seaside-towns-deprivation

    Margate has deteriorated a bit since the Jolly Boys Outing


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    #60
    mariaalice
    Registered Users Posts: 12,390 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    I am not saying we should follow the uk model there are lots of model of providing housing and renting where you work and retiring to the country side or the seaside is not a bad ideal.


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    #61
    No Pants
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,347 ✭✭✭No Pants


    The helpless crybaby act, often employed in these situations, appears to have worked.

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/irish-benefactor-offers-old-family-home-to-evicted-pensioners-30460397.html

    Doesn't say where this house is located. I sincerely hope it's in an area that aesthetically pleasing.


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