Critérium du Dauphiné 2014 **use spoiler tags til midnight**

Lumen

Such arguments are pointless. Any of us can make up a story to fit the performances.

Anyone who wins repeatedly is accused of doping or non-dopey rule bending, and many of them have been proven to have been so subsequently, but there are many inconsistent winners and non-winners who turn out out to be dirty too.

The Clinic is that way >>>

pelevin

Lumen wrote: »

Such arguments are pointless. Any of us can make up a story to fit the performances.

Anyone who wins repeatedly is accused of doping or non-dopey rule bending, and many of them have been proven to have been so subsequently, but there are many inconsistent winners and non-winners who turn out out to be dirty too.

The Clinic is that way >>>

Yeah, it's better not I suppose to introduce the thought of a performance being credible in the first place, but since we're in that territory, I'd say such a ride is clearly of a very different ilk to other incredible ones we saw a lot of other times.

Inquitus

pelevin wrote: »

Yeah, it's better not I suppose to introduce the thought of a performance being credible in the first place, but since we're in that territory, I'd say such a ride is clearly of a very different ilk to other incredible ones we saw a lot of other times.

I'd say a leopard generally doesn't change it's spots, and as such I take anything he does with a pinch of salt.

pelevin

Inquitus wrote: »

I'd say a leopard generally doesn't change it's spots, and as such I take anything he does with a pinch of salt.

I'd say we're not talking about leopards but human beings so such generalisations aren't worth a whole lot.

tomdempsey200

Inquitus wrote: »

I'd say a leopard generally doesn't change it's spots, and as such I take anything he does with a pinch of salt.

maybe he's started washing his hands and changing his pillows

Inquitus

pelevin wrote: »

I'd say we're not talking about leopards but human beings so such generalisations aren't worth a whole lot.

Look at the track records of the DS, the rider, and the owner, and tell me Tinkoff is a team you can believe in :rolleyes:

gordongekko

Inquitus wrote: »

Look at the track records of the DS, the rider, and the owner, and tell me Tinkoff is a team you can believe in :rolleyes:

Name a team you can believe in?

Inquitus

gordongekko wrote: »

Name a team you can believe in?

Geswiss

pelevin

Inquitus wrote: »

Look at the track records of the DS, the rider, and the owner, and tell me Tinkoff is a team you can believe in :rolleyes:

Contador has been outstanding right through his career. Saying, as you did his form is right out of the blue, I would say is evidence of someone with no particular interest in objectivity but rather who wants to wallow in an opinion of certainty even when lacking the knowledge to justify anything like such certainty. If such leopards don't change their spots, the DS, the rider, the owner, etc . . . then presumably Contador wouldn't have had the quiet season he had last year but he did. Nibali was great last year, not this year. Doesn't mean his Giro last year is now no longer credible.

Inquitus

pelevin wrote: »

Contador has been outstanding right through his career. Saying, as you did his form is right out of the blue, I would say is evidence of someone with no particular interest in objectivity but rather who wants to wallow in an opinion of certainty even when lacking the knowledge to justify anything like such certainty. If such leopards don't change their spots, the DS, the rider, the owner, etc then presumably Contador wouldn't have had the quiet season he had last year but he did. Nibali was great last year, not this year. Doesn't mean his Giro last year is now no longer credible.

Veiled insults are no way to debate, I shall leave you to it.

pelevin

Inquitus wrote: »

Veiled insults are no way to debate, I shall leave you to it.

There was nothing veiled. I said you weren't interested in objectivity given your claim COntador's form is right out of the blue, by far the outstanding stage racer in the past good few years. I'm not all that bothered by your leaving me either. In fact I tend to find such declarations a bit sad, self-righteous and weak as a display of inner character.

Captain Havoc

Please don't speculate on whether a team can be believed in or not, cards will be handed out.

Inquitus

pelevin wrote: »

There was nothing veiled. I said you weren't interested in objectivity given your claim COntador's form is right out of the blue, by far the outstanding stage racer in the past good few years. I'm not all that bothered by your leaving me either. In fact I tend to find such declarations a bit sad, self-righteous and weak as a display of inner character.

Again you resort to insulting me instead of arguing the point.

MPFG

I thought today that all the top finishers looked credible
I think top teams and riders are clean (bar the few cases now and again) because I think they understand the consequences to their sport if they are not.I put performances down to super training regimes at altitude, advanced science and training including racing less

It seems to me speculation is used every time to either beat Froome or Contador over the head by supporters of one or the other

If I didn't believe in the sport I wouldn't follow it .....
Fed up every-time someone wins we have to go through the whole doping speculation on here and Twitter

Darkglasses

Spoiler tags please, be fair. We are getting complaints about it, and I've to go back and edit them in.

Thanks to everyone who has been using them today

MPFG

Darkglasses wrote: »

Spoiler tags please, be fair. We are getting complaints about it, and I've to go back and edit them in.

Thanks to everyone who has been using them today

Sorry

pelevin

Inquitus wrote: »

Again you resort to insulting me instead of arguing the point.

Arguing what point? I responded by saying there was nothing veiled which there clearly wasn't. And such declarations as "I'll leave you, etc because " are always with the intention of placing oneself firmly & finally on the moral high ground, and the other shame-faced beneath. Which isn't very dignified in my view.

tomdempsey200

any predictions for today?

DDC1990

tomdempsey200 wrote: »

any predictions for today?

The winner will be accused of being a doper? :P

Breakaway rider to win, Froome to try and break Contador, but Alberto will hang onto his wheel and claim the overall victory.

Inquitus

tomdempsey200 wrote: »

any predictions for today?

Contador to hold Froome's wheel until the finish, and win by 4 or 8 seconds depending on whether they contest the stage win.

MPFG

Someone from Katusha (Spilak, Trofimov, or Dani Moreno) to fight it out

Contador to beat GC guys

Darkglasses

MPFG wrote: »

Is there a Tour of Suisse thread ?? Philip Deignan is in the break today in this race - Knew he had good form after yesterdays TT where he beat alot of GC guys given he is not a top TTer

You can make one! Or use the fantasy tour de suisse thread, whichever you like.

MPFG

Gosh its all kicking off at the Dauphine today ...bit like Tour de France stage that Dan Martin won ....seems Talansky, JVDB and Bardet over 2 mins up the road as Sky and T-S watch each other

gordongekko

Sounds like a good stage but no tv coverage so far.

tomdempsey200

230 again today

TheBlaaMan

Its already pretty exciting. From the cyclingnew tracker....

The 21 riders in a break are: David Lopez, Mikel Nieve, Tanel Kangert, Dani Navarro, Yoann Bagot (Cofidis), Adam Yates (Orica GreenEdge), Igor Anton, John Gadret (Movistar), Romain Bardet, Alexis Gougeard, Jean-Christoph Péraud (Ag2r-La Mondiale), Thomas Voeckler (Europcar), Jurgen Van den Broeck, Tony Gallopin, Pim Ligthart (Lotto Belisol), Kristjan Koren (Cannondale), Tejay van Garderen (BMC), Yuriy Trofimov (Katusha), Ryder Hesjedal, Andrew Talansky (Garmin-Sharp) and Bartosz Huzarski (NetApp-Endura).

Two Sky guys in this and surprisingly Talansky, 3rd on GC

Two others who were in the group Richie Porte (Sky) & Lieuwe Westra (Astana) have just sat up waiting for ...

A chase group of 17 consisiting of the (other) GC men at at 2:30. Alberto Contador (Tinkoff-Saxo), Chris Froome, Vassil Kiryienka, Danny Pate, Geraint Thomas (Sky), Vincenzo Nibali, Jakob Fuglsang (Astana), Luis Maté (Cofidis), Mikaël Chérel, Ben Gastauer (Ag2r-La Mondiale), Sébastien Reichenbach (IAM), Darwin Atapuma (BMC), Dani Moreno (Katusha), Jan Bakelants (Omega Pharma-QuickStep), Wilco Kelderman, Martijn Keizer (Belkin) and Leo König (NetApp-Endura).

Talansky is making a bid for glory on the first of the days Cat1 climbs.....meanwhile Contador is once again isloated with no teammates next nigh or near to him....wheelsucking time?

Darkglasses

Made a stage thread here, no need for spoilers there.