brewery site plans

linny

http://kclr96fm.com/news/500-jobs-pipeline-brewery-site-kilkenny-city/

if this comes to pass it will be great for kilkenny

road_high

I heard this a few months back. Google were mentioned at the time but it's clearly a more Financial Servcies type set up. I couldn't see this coming to fruitition for years as the site is still being used by Diageo and will take massive redevelopment.
I'd have thought something like this would prefer to be outside the city, like State Street or VHI?

kikel

Sorry but when do the county council deliver jobs for the county. In my opinion this is just pr spin they have come up with to push through plan for the CAS.

If this was really possible or true we'd be hearing names and the IDA would be backing it. Shame on Mr. Crocket for such a poor attempt. He will try anything to get this through. First he lied about the archeological report and now this rubbish that their are jobs in the pipeline. He must be getting a big brown envelope from someone.

randylonghorn

In fairness to Crockett (and I don't have much time for the man, and I think the CAS is a dreadful idea), he does take more interest in attracting business to the area than many county managers seem to.

Imho, he has as big an ego as any politician, and sees the grandiose "Abbey Quarter" and the CAS and a couple of other projects as his potential "legacy" to the city, so it really wouldn't surprise me if he was actively involved in trying to attract anchor tenants, for want of a better term, for the AQ.

Whether he is as far along in that quest as he would like us to believe ... that might be a different matter!

And I couldn't but applaud him for trying to bring business and employment in, for whatever reason he's doing it; who could? I think he lacks a broader long-term vision though, or much respect for the historic fabric of the city which is potentially one of its greatest economic resources if safeguarded, and smugly dismisses and derides anything that doesn't suit his agenda; and the upshot may be that the city ends up with the CAS and another ugly bridge and ugly steel and glass towers on the brewery site which end up half empty and a white elephant in years to come.

Einhard

Why don't people wait and see what comes of these proposals before launching into the routine condemnations and ad honinem attacks?

Also, the whole brown envelope thing is a pretty nasty slur. I don't know the man from Adam, but to be alleging corruption and illegality against someone purely because you don't agree with his plans is pretty contemptible. It's libel pure and simple.

rayc

kikel wrote: »

If this was really possible or true we'd be hearing names and the IDA would be backing it.

Just to point out here that the article clearly mentions both the IDA and ConnectIreland as being involved in negotiations.

redtelephone

I think that following the elections the CAS is in real trouble, and Mr Crockett is starting to panic, so he starts scaremongering. The Council meeting today (3.00 pm) may tell a lot.

linny

does anyone know out of the 24 councillors that were elected who is for and against the CAS

redtelephone

linny wrote: »

does anyone know out of the 24 councillors that were elected who is for and against the CAS

According to the Irish Times of last Friday (30th May) there were 6 known to be against : Malone, Mckee, Funchion, Kennedy, Gardiner and Noonan. By this stage there may be more (or even less) :eek:

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/kilkenny-s-central-access-scheme-may-be-in-doubt-after-local-elections-1.1814387

road_high

redtelephone wrote: »

According to the Irish Times of last Friday (30th May) there were 6 known to be against : Malone, Mckee, Funchion, Kennedy, Gardiner and Noonan. By this stage there may be more (or even less) :eek:

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/kilkenny-s-central-access-scheme-may-be-in-doubt-after-local-elections-1.1814387

The only ones that are ideologically against it here are Gardner and Noonan. And I respect them for their believes and green credentials.
The rest are just populist FF/SF'ers that will blow what ever way they feel the wind is blowing and never have to actually make a hard decision.
Love to hear Kathleen Funchion's alternatives for example. How someone like this gets elected is truly mind-boggling. Was Kennedy elected too? That's the same guy that hasn't worked in years? He'll be such an addition too in driving Kilkenny forward if that is the case :rolleyes:

linny

thankfully then there's more for it than against,

road_high

Einhard wrote: »

Why don't people wait and see what comes of these proposals before launching into the routine condemnations and ad honinem attacks?

Also, the whole brown envelope thing is a pretty nasty slur. I don't know the man from Adam, but to be alleging corruption and illegality against someone purely because you don't agree with his plans is pretty contemptible. It's libel pure and simple.

It's the usual Kilkenny "syndrome". We had it with the Parade revamp, the new pedestrian bridge and new Courthouse for example. There seems to be an ingrained cynical attidude in Kilkenny to all public development concerning anything they may change the status quo or heaven forbid, move the city forward a bit.
It's incredible that potential of a development which may bring an element of 500 IDA backed jobs to Kilkenny is greeted with the same cyniscm. The brewery site will have to be redeveloped regardless of the CAS, I think it's so positive there is such interest in Kilkenny. I sincerely doubt the Council and Joe Crockett are making it up so they can push through their nasty road. That's taking conspiracy theories to a whole new level quitefrankly.

kikel

Yeah I missed the IDA part of the article. Still think their is something not right about why Mr Crockett wants to push this through so badly. It is very suspicious that the report his council commission was found to be grossly wrong. Now his PR team are talking jobs. In my opinion Mr Crocket cannot and should not be trusted to care for our beautiful city.

kikel

road_high wrote: »

It's the usual Kilkenny "syndrome". We had it with the Parade revamp, the new pedestrian bridge and new Courthouse for example. There seems to be an ingrained cynical attidude in Kilkenny to all public development concerning anything they may change the status quo or heaven forbid, move the city forward a bit.
It's incredible that potential of a development which may bring an element of 500 IDA backed jobs to Kilkenny is greeted with the same cyniscm. The brewery site will have to be redeveloped regardless of the CAS, I think it's so positive there is such interest in Kilkenny. I sincerely doubt the Council and Joe Crockett are making it up so they can push through their nasty road. That's taking conspiracy theories to a whole new level quitefrankly.

I think everyone would welcome new jobs to the city. It's the timing of this announcement that makes me smell a rat. I know how the PR industry works from previous experience and this is article is just that. It is to sway public opinion.

Rarely would the IDA announce job opportunities in this way. This is the council and their PR machine at work.

MR Crockett and his team were responsible for the archeological report on the vicar street houses. So yeah I wouldn't be surprised if this PR article is totally fabricated.

Put yourself in the eyes of a company considering to set up in Ireland. Would they really care if it is on the brewery site or the ring road. They would be more concerned about getting the right staff, paying the right rent, paying the staff the rate they see at competitive. The company shouldn't care if it is the brewery site or outside of town.

In saying all that, I really hope their are 500 jobs coming to Kilkenny. I do hope they are on the brewery site. I think it will help our city centre develop. I just want to see the city developed without the CAS.

Edit: with regard to your comment

road_high wrote: »

It's the usual Kilkenny "syndrome". We had it with the Parade revamp, the new pedestrian bridge and new Courthouse for example. There seems to be an ingrained cynical attidude in Kilkenny to all public development concerning anything they may change the status quo or heaven forbid, move the city forward a bit.

Yeah these people are out there that don't want the city to move forward. I think the issue is not about moving forward but HOW we move forward. We can move forward by protecting our heritage, our beautiful city landscape. Maybe even move forward with a more pedestrian and cyclist friendly city.

mick kk

road_high wrote: »

It's the usual Kilkenny "syndrome". We had it with the Parade revamp, the new pedestrian bridge and new Courthouse for example. There seems to be an ingrained cynical attidude in Kilkenny to all public development concerning anything they may change the status quo or heaven forbid, move the city forward a bit.

In fairness...the new bridge is pretty ugly and I'm not a big fan of the courthouse either. The chipper on the parade is handy though.

JTMan

Does anyone have any insight into the type of company that is trying to locate here? Is a another funds company?

road_high

Fungus wrote: »

Does anyone have any insight into the type of company that is trying to locate here? Is a another funds company?

Apparently an international financial services company. Think the aim is to grow kilkenny further into a financial services hub with State Street and the others operating here. So something like in the IFSC I'd reckon.

Kirk Van Houten

As far as I know State Street had some deal with the IDA that no other financial services company could set up within a certain radius for a certain period (10 or 15 years i think).

I believe BNY looked at Carlow some years ago but couldn't set up there due to this.

road_high

Kirk Van Houten wrote: »

As far as I know State Street had some deal with the IDA that no other financial services company could set up within a certain radius for a certain period (10 or 15 years i think).

I believe BNY looked at Carlow some years ago but couldn't set up there due to this.

Probably less of an issue now though I'd imagine with the motorway has widened the potential commuter belt widely. Hopefully still not the case and mustn't be as the IDA are mentioned already. Would be an enormous boost to kilkenny.

JTMan

Thanks. I'm surprised that the name of the firm had not leaked yet.

godtabh

If the CAS doesnt go ahead all that site will be fit for will be a park

road_high

Fungus wrote: »

Thanks. I'm surprised that the name of the firm had not leaked yet.

I heard "Google" months ago though I couldn't see them looking past Dublin really

JTMan

road_high wrote: »

I heard "Google" months ago though I couldn't see them looking past Dublin really

All reports indicate that it is a financial services company. That would appear to outrule Google.

Someone must know the company name.

Kirk Van Houten

Fungus wrote: »

All reports indicate that it is a financial services company. That would appear to outrule Google.

Someone must know the company name.

Have heard BNY are looking to downsize or possibly even close their Cork office. They had looked at opening an office in Carlow previously. I might be adding 2 and 2 and coming up 7 but....

JTMan

Kirk Van Houten wrote: »

Have heard BNY are looking to downsize or possibly even close their Cork office. They had looked at opening an office in Carlow previously. I might be adding 2 and 2 and coming up 7 but....

I don't see why BNY would downsize Cork to relocate to Kilkenny. Does not make sense to me.

I suspect it is a different funds firm.

kikel

godtabh wrote: »

If the CAS doesnt go ahead all that site will be fit for will be a park

Thats what out council want us to believe. There are plenty of ways for the site to be developed that don't need a new road directly to the door. We really need to get over this reliance of cars. Citys are much better places without motor cars for both its inhabitants.


Here is an idea. Turn the mart site into park and ride facility. Pay the road trains that ferry tourists around to provide a year round park and ride in around Kilkenny for local workers and tourists.

And also complete the ring road.

road_high

kikel wrote: »

Thats what out council want us to believe. There are plenty of ways for the site to be developed that don't need a new road directly to the door. We really need to get over this reliance of cars. Citys are much better places without motor cars for both its inhabitants.


Here is an idea. Turn the mart site into park and ride facility. Pay the road trains that ferry tourists around to provide a year round park and ride in around Kilkenny for local workers and tourists.

And also complete the ring road.

Terrible idea. An awful waste of potential development site near
the city centre, park and rides (if there is a demand even) make sense when located outside cities/towns.
Kilkenny is much too small and parking is not that expensive even in the centre of town.

Agree with the ring road completion, that's a no-brainer.

kikel

road_high wrote: »

Terrible idea. An awful waste of potential development site near
the city centre, park and rides (if there is a demand even) make sense when located outside cities/towns.
Kilkenny is much too small and parking is not that expensive even in the centre of town.

Agree with the ring road completion, that's a no-brainer.

Yeah, bit far fetched alright. I'm full of far fetched ideas today.

Here is another idea that I actually did suggest to one particular councillor who called to my door before the local elections.

Turn market cross car park into a shopping centre. Far fetched?

catbear

Park and ride only makes sense when you've already got a sustainable transport system. I believe some sort of college with public grounds would be attractive and useful. I don't think anyone could argue for more retail.

godtabh

kikel wrote: »

Thats what out council want us to believe. There are plenty of ways for the site to be developed that don't need a new road directly to the door. We really need to get over this reliance of cars. Citys are much better places without motor cars for both its inhabitants.


Here is an idea. Turn the mart site into park and ride facility. Pay the road trains that ferry tourists around to provide a year round park and ride in around Kilkenny for local workers and tourists.

And also complete the ring road.

Read the EIS with an unbiased viewpoint. I have. My professional view point is that Johns Bridge and Greens Bridge can not accommodate any new car journeys. Car journeys can be reduced but never eliminated. Therefore any development of the site can not be accommodated without alternative river crossings. Its simple really

catbear

godtabh wrote: »

Read the EIS with an unbiased viewpoint. I have. My professional view point is that Johns Bridge and Greens Bridge can not accommodate any new car journeys. Car journeys can be reduced but never eliminated. Therefore any development of the site can not be accommodated without alternative river crossings. Its simple really

My professional view concurs with yours, completion of the ringroad will provide a new bridge further up the Nore from Greensbridge. It really is that simple.