Abusing candidates/canvassers - where is the line?

Phoebas

cletus van damme wrote: »

So let me get this straight so I don't make a faux pas...

Too late

cletus van damme wrote: »

The rules of AH with regard to public abuse are that

Abusing John Waters is ok
But abusing a politician is not.


Ok so far??

You do realise that although the video was posted on the internet, it was an event that happened in real life?

whupdedo

Maudi wrote: »

Eleven austerity suicides a week..Eleven..people..irish people you dumwit..kill themselves..because of this gov austerity (its not really austerity its money shovelled out of the country to bondholders/imf.) Children are put out of their homes by the thousands because of repossessions..homeless figures are at an epidemic level..irish people are eating out of bins.for christs sake!!.emigration is rife..working people are the new poor..and you expect citizens to what? Have tables on the streets laden with tea and scones coronation style to welcome the parasitic van guards of the political dynasty that caused this corrupt cash grab to happen ..yes welcome ..come tell me more lies to my face and why I should vote corruption once again..I dont think so pal..people have woken up..

Wtf, their must be a fiction writing forum on boards somewhere, you can get advice on your writing style

Stheno

Maudi wrote: »

Im glad misery and suicide give you such a giggle..canvassing go well earlier?

Can you back up even one of the statements in your original post with factual evidence?

I suspect not.

tritium

Maudi wrote: »

Eleven austerity suicides a week..Eleven..people..irish people you dumwit..kill themselves..because of this gov austerity (its not really austerity its money shovelled out of the country to bondholders/imf.) Children are put out of their homes by the thousands because of repossessions..homeless figures are at an epidemic level..irish people are eating out of bins.for christs sake!!.emigration is rife..working people are the new poor..and you expect citizens to what? Have tables on the streets laden with tea and scones coronation style to welcome the parasitic van guards of the political dynasty that caused this corrupt cash grab to happen ..yes welcome ..come tell me more lies to my face and why I should vote corruption once again..I dont think so pal..people have woken up..

That would be 572 suicides a year. Suicide statistics for Ireland typically put the annual rate at under 500. Even assuming every suicide was austerity related (ckearly not the case) your numbers wouldn't add up.

Pretty sick statistic to just make up btw

Maudi

Stheno wrote: »

Can you back up even one of the statements in your original post with factual evidence?

I suspect not.

You ask/request a response and immediately respond with your own answer ..how rude..you..my friend are a bully ..

tempnam

Maudi wrote: »

You ask/request a response and immediately respond with your own answer ..how rude..you..my friend are a bully ..

So..... Nothing to back up your claims then?

Muise...

Maudi wrote: »

You ask/request a response and immediately respond with your own answer ..how rude..you..my friend are a bully ..

Stheno said she had a suspicion, not an answer, and how the fnuck can you call her a bully for that on a thread about actual bullying of a candidate?

4zn76tysfajdxp

jdooley28 wrote: »

How many?

Thousands.



Thousands.

the_syco

Maudi wrote: »

people have woken up..

Actually, no. They want to escape reality and go into some fairytale world where there are jobs and lots of money. Not going to happen, though.

Maudi wrote: »

You ask/request a response and immediately respond with your own answer ..how rude..you..my friend are a bully ..

And yet you do not give a link to where you get your figures from.

Shakespeare's Sister

Maudi wrote: »

You ask/request a response and immediately respond with your own answer ..how rude..you..my friend are a bully ..

A "bully"? For asking a question and then answering it? Oh dear.

errlloyd

I find many parts of this video frustrating, but mostly the idea that the entire problems of a government that her political party are her fault. Just because she's labour doesn't necessarily mean she buys everything into everything the Government are doing, and considering Labour will be back in opposition after the next general election, you may as well elect her now so she go back to being populist but ineffective in 2 years time.

Minority government parties all over the world get absolutely gutted after they're in government, I actually can't think of many examples where it has worked out. PDs dead, Greens dead and the Liberal Democrats in the UK are ****ed.

anncoates

To be honest, the left candidates these days need to toughen up. I remember (in the late 80a) a canvasser (very near the street in that video) for a now defunct left wing party trying to headbutt a dog that jumped up on a wall to bark at them.

Muise...

anncoates wrote: »

To be honest, the left candidates these days need to toughen up. I remember (in the late 80a) a canvasser (very near the street in that video) for a now defunct left wing party trying to headbutt a dog that jumped up on a wall to bark at them.

:pac:

Sadly, both the candidate and her aggressors would place themselves on the left. Nothing left now.

Shakespeare's Sister

anncoates wrote: »

I remember (in the late 80a) a canvasser (very near the street in that video) for a now defunct left wing party trying to headbutt a dog that jumped up on a wall to bark at them.

Lol

anncoates

It wasn't a small dog either.

P_1

Tactics right out of 30's Germany there. You mightn't want to hear what a politico has to say but that gives you no right whatsoever to prevent others from hearing it.

cletus van damme

Phoebas wrote: »

Too late


You do realise that although the video was posted on the internet, it was an event that happened in real life?

I do realise this.

But I am at a loss to understand your point.

Amirani

cletus van damme wrote: »

I do realise this.

But I am at a loss to understand your point.

There's a bit of a difference shouting verbal abuse in someone's face and posting a few negative comments on an internet messageboard. I wouldn't have thought it was too difficult to understand?

DazMarz

As someone who is going around canvassing at the moment, I can safely say there is a lot of anger out there. Thankfully, none directed towards me.

But I heard of a couple of incidents that chilled me to the bone the other day.

A former-colleague and friend of my mother has a brother who is a sitting Fine Gael councillor. He was out canvassing in his local area.

A man answered the door to him. Brandishing a shotgun. The Gardaí had to be called as the man was screaming and raving and waving the shotgun around.

Another man I know is running for Fine Gael in my own local area. He is a decent, well-respected, well-liked and honourable man with a young family. He is only running because he believes that he can bring something to the table and help his local area.

When he called to a house, the owner of the house let 2 dogs loose to go after him and the poor man was nearly attacked.

I respect people's right to be angry, but that sort of behaviour is absolutely deplorable. County councillors, regardless of their affiliation, did NOT land this country where it is. Most county councillors I know are decent, hard-working, civic minded people who are just trying to do their best for their local areas. Sure, some might represent and be members of political parties that people are angry at. But directing such vitriolic anger at the lower-rung members of the party is pointless.

The chef burns the food... but it is the poor waiter who gets it in the neck.

That kinda thing. The councillors and their canvassers are at the coalface of it and are at the frontline. Very few of them (if any of them) had an input into the financial affairs of this country or had any say in austerity measures or any of that. County councillors look after local issues in the immediate local areas.

Sure, be angry. But to shout abuse, to physically threaten or to get violent is deplorable, disgusting behaviour.

Uriel.

DazMarz wrote: »

As someone who is going around canvassing at the moment, I can safely say there is a lot of anger out there. Thankfully, none directed towards me.

But I heard of a couple of incidents that chilled me to the bone the other day.

A former-colleague and friend of my mother has a brother who is a sitting Fine Gael councillor. He was out canvassing in his local area.

A man answered the door to him. Brandishing a shotgun. The Gardaí had to be called as the man was screaming and raving and waving the shotgun around.

Another man I know is running for Fine Gael in my own local area. He is a decent, well-respected, well-liked and honourable man with a young family. He is only running because he believes that he can bring something to the table and help his local area.

When he called to a house, the owner of the house let 2 dogs loose to go after him and the poor man was nearly attacked.

I respect people's right to be angry, but that sort of behaviour is absolutely deplorable. County councillors, regardless of their affiliation, did NOT land this country where it is. Most county councillors I know are decent, hard-working, civic minded people who are just trying to do their best for their local areas. Sure, some might represent and be members of political parties that people are angry at. But directing such vitriolic anger at the lower-rung members of the party is pointless.

The chef burns the food... but it is the poor waiter who gets it in the neck.

That kinda thing. The councillors and their canvassers are at the coalface of it and are at the frontline. Very few of them (if any of them) had an input into the financial affairs of this country or had any say in austerity measures or any of that. County councillors look after local issues in the immediate local areas.

Sure, be angry. But to shout abuse, to physically threaten or to get violent is deplorable, disgusting behaviour.

well said.

Foxhound38

DazMarz wrote: »

As someone who is going around canvassing at the moment, I can safely say there is a lot of anger out there. Thankfully, none directed towards me.

But I heard of a couple of incidents that chilled me to the bone the other day.

A former-colleague and friend of my mother has a brother who is a sitting Fine Gael councillor. He was out canvassing in his local area.

A man answered the door to him. Brandishing a shotgun. The Gardaí had to be called as the man was screaming and raving and waving the shotgun around.

Another man I know is running for Fine Gael in my own local area. He is a decent, well-respected, well-liked and honourable man with a young family. He is only running because he believes that he can bring something to the table and help his local area.

When he called to a house, the owner of the house let 2 dogs loose to go after him and the poor man was nearly attacked.

I respect people's right to be angry, but that sort of behaviour is absolutely deplorable. County councillors, regardless of their affiliation, did NOT land this country where it is. Most county councillors I know are decent, hard-working, civic minded people who are just trying to do their best for their local areas. Sure, some might represent and be members of political parties that people are angry at. But directing such vitriolic anger at the lower-rung members of the party is pointless.

The chef burns the food... but it is the poor waiter who gets it in the neck.

That kinda thing. The councillors and their canvassers are at the coalface of it and are at the frontline. Very few of them (if any of them) had an input into the financial affairs of this country or had any say in austerity measures or any of that. County councillors look after local issues in the immediate local areas.

Sure, be angry. But to shout abuse, to physically threaten or to get violent is deplorable, disgusting behaviour.

Exactly right

cletus van damme

Diego Simeone wrote: »

There's a bit of a difference shouting verbal abuse in someone's face and posting a few negative comments on an internet messageboard. I wouldn't have thought it was too difficult to understand?

What you say is true but not relevant.
Both were abused verbally on the street.
But the opinions of AH is markedly different on both situations of verbal abuse.

Amirani

cletus van damme wrote: »

What you say is true but not relevant.
Both were abused verbally on the street.
But the opinions of AH is markedly different on both situations of verbal abuse.

I hadn't realised that John Waters had been abused in person, my apologies.

steddyeddy

Lapin wrote: »

No one deserves abuse no matter who they represent.

But people should be questioned on what they represent.

P_1

steddyeddy wrote: »

But people should be questioned on what they represent.

Yes but people have the right to do that themselves. Not to have somebody do it for them and chase people away.

Foxhound38

steddyeddy wrote: »

But people should be questioned on what they represent.

Indeed, but there's a difference between asking questions and engaging in harassment. The people in this video were not interested in hearing answers from this woman, they were simply interested in bullying her to the point of tears and getting it caught on tape.

They are the lowest of the low, and they make the anti-government side look like ignorant bullies. They should be embarassed by their behaviour but instead they seem to be boasting about it on social media.

Galwayguy35

The 2 filming and shouting at her were nothing but bullies all right, but yer man with the phone wasn't much better.

Muise...

cletus van damme wrote: »

What you say is true but not relevant.
Both were abused verbally on the street.
But the opinions of AH is markedly different on both situations of verbal abuse.

AH is not Borg, so your hypocrisy argument fails. It is perfectly possible to disapprove of both situations (though I don't think there is any credible evidence for the John Waters one). I don't like to hear about either of them; both destroy a perfectly good point.

tritium

cletus van damme wrote: »

What you say is true but not relevant.
Both were abused verbally on the street.
But the opinions of AH is markedly different on both situations of verbal abuse.

Abusing someone in the street is just gutter behaviour regardless of who that person is. There's a way to make your point and a way to protest , that covers neither.

SeanLEFT

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

The 2 filming and shouting at her were nothing but bullies all right, but yer man with the phone wasn't much better.

You mean her brother trying to protect her from the scum