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Punching a woman - Justified or not? - MOD WARNING FIRST POST

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    #632
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    bumper234 wrote: »
    You should never defend someone else?

    Fixed that


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    #633
    runawaybishop
    Registered Users Posts: 9,500 ✭✭✭runawaybishop


    efb wrote: »
    There are justifiable cases for striking a person when defending yourself or others, this however, is not one of those.

    Why not? Is getting punched in the face by surprise and unprovoked not enough to warrant defense?


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    #634
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    runawaybishop wrote: »
    Why not? Is getting punched in the face by surprise and unprovoked not enough to warrant defense?

    Once no. It's not a defence them it's retaliation


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    #635
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    efb wrote: »
    Once no. It's not a defence them it's retaliation

    And how would you know that the attack is only going to consist of one punch? Do you ask the attacker if they are finished or do they intend to continue the assault?


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    #636
    MrWard
    Registered Users Posts: 74 ✭✭MrWard


    efb wrote: »
    Once no. It's not a defence them it's retaliation

    The posters friend was struck unprovoked and knocked to the ground. What was he meant to do? Leave her there in the hope the attacker didnt strike her again and go look for security?


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    #637
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    MrWard wrote: »
    The posters friend was struck unprovoked and knocked to the ground. What was he meant to do? Leave her there in the hope the attacker didnt strike her again and go look for security?

    Restrain her?


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    #638
    Czarcasm
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,076 ✭✭✭✭Czarcasm


    MrWard wrote: »
    The posters friend was struck unprovoked and knocked to the ground. What was he meant to do? Leave her there in the hope the attacker didnt strike her again and go look for security?


    Firstly, you only have the OP's word that the attack was unprovoked, and secondly, the more immediate instinct would be to have gotten his friend out of there, not to retaliate with his fists, unless of course as he later admitted himself, he wanted to teach "the fat cnut" a lesson.


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    #639
    GenieOz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 892 ✭✭✭GenieOz


    efb wrote: »
    Restrain her?

    And this would be your choice of solution had it been a man?


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    #640
    tritium
    Registered Users Posts: 7,428 ✭✭✭tritium


    efb wrote: »
    Restrain her?

    How many people who use this line have actually tried to restrain a violent attacker? Its not really like in the movies, its actually pretty difficult, especially if you're physically weaker and have no specific training.


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    #641
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    efb wrote: »
    Restrain her?

    When was the last time you attempted to restrain someone? How did you go about it? What training had you?


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    #642
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    bumper234 wrote: »
    When was the last time you attempted to restrain someone? How did you go about it? What training had you?

    As a qualified boxing ref, I have a knowledge of stopping someone punching someone else. What qualification had the op in punching for self defence??,


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    #643
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    GenieOz wrote: »
    And this would be your choice of solution had it been a man?

    Yes. I diffuse the situation first, then attempt to restrain them if required. Punching them isn't v high on the list


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    #644
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    efb wrote: »
    As a qualified boxing ref, I have a knowledge of stopping someone punching someone else. What qualification had the op in punching for self defence??,

    Lmao

    Standing in between 2 boxers in a ring who observe the Marquis of Queensbury rules is a little different to a nightclub brawl. How would you have PHYSICALLY restrained the person?


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    #645
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    bumper234 wrote: »
    Lmao

    Standing in between 2 boxers in a ring who observe the Marquis of Queensbury rules is a little different to a nightclub brawl. How would you have PHYSICALLY restrained the person?

    They don't always play by the rules. Grabbing their arms is the most obvious method


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    #646
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    efb wrote: »
    They don't always play by the rules. Grabbing their arms is the most obvious method

    I would actually pay good money to watch you attempt that in the middle.of a nightclub.


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    #647
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    bumper234 wrote: »
    I would actually pay good money to watch you attempt that in the middle.of a nightclub.

    I'd rather not.


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    #648
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    efb wrote: »
    I'd rather not.

    Yeah best you don't. It wouldn't work out like it does in the ring :D


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    #649
    GenieOz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 892 ✭✭✭GenieOz


    efb wrote: »
    They don't always play by the rules. Grabbing their arms is the most obvious method

    And unless you're a man mountain and they're quite small it isn't gonna work.


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    #650
    cerastes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,601 ✭✭✭cerastes


    efb wrote: »
    They don't always play by the rules. Grabbing their arms is the most obvious method

    So , you could get headbutted easily that way it seems
    or move in close to prevent that and you could be bitten, lip, ear, face somewhere.
    plus you're not going to have someone else sneak up behind you and give you a dig in a ring, you're two hands are occupied, how you going to fend off another attacker while holding onto this one?
    just considering the possibilities, soon as you let go of the first person, nothing to stop them trying to hit you, Id consider putting space between them and me or the victim a better option.

    Best thing is avoid the situation if possible
    if not, fend them off while drawing attention and hope someone else gets help or call for help, not worth getting glassed or sideswiped by some hero or worse, getting blamed for a situation you were not responsible for, security may have seen this before but bets are they will take the side of who seems to be the victim or as I have seen on occasion, not give a damn who is the victim, meaning the attacker will just be thrown out and no penalty, Gardai wont be interested either, especially if its a woman doiing the attacking unless its particularily vicious and clear someone has a serious injury, which might not be obvious if a person got knocked to the ground and banged their head.


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    #651
    beano345
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,105 ✭✭✭beano345


    Davei141 wrote: »
    http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/500x/48979520.jpg



    Considering sopretty was thanking all Stavros posts about attacking blokes she obviously has no issue with violence, so that only leaves sexism.

    Stavros can cash in his white knight points for sex off his two groupies who followed him around thanking his posts....while not realising what hypocrites they are


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    #652
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    I did say diffuse firstly


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    #653
    El Guapo!
    Registered Users Posts: 12,430 ✭✭✭✭El Guapo!


    beano345 wrote: »
    Stavros can cash in his white knight points for sex off his two groupies who followed him around thanking his posts....while not realising what hypocrites they are

    Mod: This type of post needs to stop now. Singling out a poster and making constant snide remarks like this is not on.
    You can argue the subject matter till the cows come home, but DO NOT turn this into a personal attack.


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    #654
    Artful_Badger
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,339 ✭✭✭Artful_Badger


    efb wrote: »
    I did say diffuse firstly

    Give up man, soon as there's nobody left to throw stones at the sooner this heap of shít thread dies.


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    #655
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    True. #imout


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    #656
    rubadub
    Registered Users Posts: 32,373 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    Duggy747 wrote: »
    Well, aren't you just a bundle of joy?

    Did you sucker punch her because she punched your friend?
    You have that mixed up, or just have a different idea of what sucker punch means than everybody else. The girl hit first got the unexpected sucker punch, I would not think the subsequent punch was a sucker punch, she hit someone so was starting a fight, he didn't hit her from behind. If you go around punching people you it should come as no shock that you might get hit back.

    Some people have this sexist rule of "you should never hit a woman", when questioned further it often turns out the rule they really mean is actually "you should never hit somebody weaker than you". So these people are being prejudiced/sexist in their presumption that women will be weaker than men. Why not have a rule "people should not hit people", by not saying that you imply that you condone male on male or female on male violence.

    If you think stronger people should not hit weaker ones why not say that, it gets rid of any exceptions to peoples presumptions, why bring a sexist prejudice into it. Sexism is less tolerated than when that phrase came into use, I'm surprised the phrase is not more frowned upon, by everybody. What other groups do you tell people not to hit? Asians would be typically smaller.

    The rule is usually stated after a weak person hits a stronger person. Why did they hit them? on the presumption the victim will also follow this ridiculous rule and will not retaliate? Do unto others and all that.

    How do you determine if the person is stronger that you, and therefore fair game for a beating, do they have an armwrestle or something? Do they take weapons into account, is it just a stronger person or one with the greater advantage at that time which you must not hit. If the hammer drops do you have to stop. If the weak woman/man hits you is it acceptable to put one hand behind your back to be on a level pegging, and then start a fair fight back? Can you hand the weaker person a big stick and then beat the crap out of them.


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    #657
    NordieSteve
    Closed Accounts Posts: 326 ✭✭NordieSteve


    rubadub wrote: »
    You have that mixed up, or just have a different idea of what sucker punch means than everybody else. The girl hit first got the unexpected sucker punch, I would not think the subsequent punch was a sucker punch, she hit someone so was starting a fight, he didn't hit her from behind. If you go around punching people you it should come as no shock that you might get hit back.

    Some people have this sexist rule of "you should never hit a woman", when questioned further it often turns out the rule they really mean is actually "you should never hit somebody weaker than you". So these people are being prejudiced/sexist in their presumption that women will be weaker than men. Why not have a rule "people should not hit people", by not saying that you imply that you condone male on male or female on male violence.

    If you think stronger people should not hit weaker ones why not say that, it gets rid of any exceptions to peoples presumptions, why bring a sexist prejudice into it. Sexism is less tolerated than when that phrase came into use, I'm surprised the phrase is not more frowned upon, by everybody. What other groups do you tell people not to hit? Asians would be typically smaller.

    The rule is usually stated after a weak person hits a stronger person. Why did they hit them? on the presumption the victim will also follow this ridiculous rule and will not retaliate? Do unto others and all that.

    How do you determine if the person is stronger that you, and therefore fair game for a beating, do they have an armwrestle or something? Do they take weapons into account, is it just a stronger person or one with the greater advantage at that time which you must not hit. If the hammer drops do you have to stop. If the weak woman/man hits you is it acceptable to put one hand behind your back to be on a level pegging, and then start a fair fight back? Can you hand the weaker person a big stick and then beat the crap out of them.


    I know a girl that benches 140kg in the gym, about 70 kg more than me, that is NOT someone I would punch anyway. :D


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