Ryanair To The USA

JCX BXC

Growler!!! wrote: »

What kind of yields and load factors are you working with?

Are the crew within duty hours for a daily service, and how many crew are you looking at employing?

Are you taking CVs?

I didn't go too detailed.

What I did was hired 3 pilots, at €150,000 per year salary
20 cabin crew at 27,500 year salary.
3 co-pilots at 75,000 year salary
I pay myself 300,000
Rented a large office at 200,000 year.
I bought a boeing 757-200 1992 (http://www.controller.com/listingsdetail/detail.aspx?OHID=1305679)

billie1b

Carnacalla wrote: »

I didn't go too detailed.

What I did was hired 3 pilots, at €150,000 per year salary
20 cabin crew at 27,500 year salary.
3 co-pilots at 75,000 year salary
I pay myself 300,000
Rented a large office at 200,000 year.
I bought a boeing 757-200 1992 (http://www.controller.com/listingsdetail/detail.aspx?OHID=1305679)

What about SBY crew, overnight cost, high maintenance costs, catering, office electricity and heating, ground services, ground crew, landing fees, hangar rental and thats just naming a few. The list can go on and on. Your 4 million is declining rapidly.

irishgeo

billie1b wrote: »

What about SBY crew, overnight cost, high maintenance costs, catering, office electricity and heating, ground services, ground crew, landing fees, hangar rental and thats just naming a few. The list can go on and on. Your 4 million is declining rapidly.

travel insurance bonding,

JCX BXC

billie1b wrote: »

What about SBY crew, overnight cost, high maintenance costs, catering, office electricity and heating, ground services, ground crew, landing fees, hangar rental and thats just naming a few. The list can go on and on. Your 4 million is declining rapidly.

I factored in landing fees, 1.7million for newark.
Free at shannon for the first year.
Aircraft maintenance was 1million (excessive?)
15million fuel.
100,000 towards hotel stay and hub maintenance at newark.
I put 1mil towards advisors and legal+ other fees.
I put 100,000 towards furnishing the office,
30,000 towards power, water, broadband, telephone.
I have 3 web developers at 60,000 and 10,000 for web maintenance.
I also put 30,000 BIK for me and my fellow senior figures in the company.

A319er

Ok I searched online how do I book a seat ?

afatbollix

It wont work as you need Business passengers to pay for the £10 flights and they would rather fly with a legacy carrier with the champagne on tap as they don't pay for there flights.

He all ready ruined it by saying they would give out blow jobs to business class passengers. Would you really want to land in NYC and get to a board meeting to say you came in via ryanair and someone say 'Did you enjoy your free blowjob?' for you to have to reply 'No there was no blow jobs given out today.'

orionm_73

€100k for hotel costs in EWR ? You'd need to at least double that.

billie1b

Carnacalla wrote: »

I factored in landing fees, 1.7million for newark.
Free at shannon for the first year.
Aircraft maintenance was 1million (excessive?)
15million fuel.
100,000 towards hotel stay and hub maintenance at newark.
I put 1mil towards advisors and legal+ other fees.
I put 100,000 towards furnishing the office,
30,000 towards power, water, broadband, telephone.
I have 3 web developers at 60,000 and 10,000 for web maintenance.
I also put 30,000 BIK for me and my fellow senior figures in the company.

I destroyed the cowling on a 738 before, for the parts alone that needed replacing, it was €300,000, that doesnt include labour costs and what not, 1 million aint enough in my opinion. You also need public liability insurance, company insurance, use of simulators, medical officers, more crew than 6 pilots. Its a great idea but you'll need money behind you before you start. If it was as easy as 1 plane and you get 4 million profit after all expenses, any Tom, Dick and Harry could do it.

P.S : I'm not having a go at you, I find your idea great

JCX BXC

A319er wrote: »

Ok I searched online how do I book a seat ?

What?

L1011

Carnacalla wrote: »

I bought a boeing 757-200 1992 (http://www.controller.com/listingsdetail/detail.aspx?OHID=1305679)

No winglets, very old, won't make it westbound in winter.

Where do you have the costs of hiring in, say, a Titan 767 to cover when your single, elderly, high hours 757 goes tech or needs maintenance?

6 pilots gives you 2700 hours of block time which is not sufficient for a daily return at all. 20 cabin crew gives you, at the 5 required for that number of seats, 3600 hours, also insufficient.

Where's the employer PRSI?

ATC fees? CBP fees (not covered in the first year free generally)?

JCX BXC

MYOB wrote: »

No winglets, very old, won't make it westbound in winter.

Where do you have the costs of hiring in, say, a Titan 767 to cover when your single, elderly, high hours 757 goes tech or needs maintenance?

6 pilots gives you 2700 hours of block time which is not sufficient for a daily return at all. 20 cabin crew gives you, at the 5 required for that number of seats, 3600 hours, also insufficient.

Where's the employer PRSI?

ATC fees? CBP fees (not covered in the first year free generally)?

I have no Idea.
I'm really experienced in this area.

Can you add winglets?
If not, fly it eastwards:P

L1011

Carnacalla wrote: »

Can you add winglets?

Yes, but not cheaply. The winglets cost $1.1M from APB and that's them in a box in the factory, not on the wing of your plane.

Realistically there is zero chance a startup airline operating SNN-EWR would be profitable year one (if ever), let alone 4M.

JCX BXC

I have enquired about leasing an airbus a330.

JCX BXC

MYOB wrote: »

Yes, but not cheaply. The winglets cost $1.1M from APB and that's them in a box in the factory, not on the wing of your plane.

Realistically there is zero chance a startup airline operating SNN-EWR would be profitable year one (if ever), let alone 4M.

One of the biggest areas where startup airlines are let down is advertising.
Tell me my costs and I'll try and see if I can make any money.

Market research would be interesting.

JCX BXC

The Boeing 737-900 seems to be able for a transatlantic journey.
Ryanair anyone? They seem fond of their precious 737's

billie1b

Carnacalla wrote: »

The Boeing 737-900 seems to be able for a transatlantic journey.
Ryanair anyone? They seem fond of their precious 737's

The 737-800 is able for T/A with a smaller configuration, ask O'Leary to lease a few.

L1011

Carnacalla wrote: »

One of the biggest areas where startup airlines are let down is advertising.
Tell me my costs and I'll try and see if I can make any money.

Looking at failures, the biggest issue is assuming there's a market where there isn't one.

You need two aircraft realistically, newer and preferably already fitted out suitably (all economy seating with a basic AVOD system I'd imagine)

You need about 30 pilots and 75 FAs. You will need flight planning and operations staff. You're going to need more finance and HR people. You're going to need a much larger office...

You have to consider CBP charges, US security charges, US taxes as gone from the ticket price before you get a cent - if you attempt to transfer these directly to the consumer and think that they'll still fall for a headline rate without them you'll have no customers (and the EU on your back). These are on top of airport fees. Building a business plan on the airport fees being free in year 1 - which they often aren't for a second operator on a pre-existing route - leaves you dead in the water at 13 months.

You need significant room left in the budget for coping with delays, compensation for same, strikes, weather cancellations, Iceland blowing up cancellations, etc.

Carnacalla wrote: »

The Boeing 737-900 seems to be able for a transatlantic journey.
Ryanair anyone? They seem fond of their precious 737's

Not loaded to capacity its not. Try a 737-700 and you might be on to something, but you're not going to have the range to go any further than SNN-EWR realistically; nor are you going to make it in winter either.

b757

Carnacalla wrote: »

One of the biggest areas where startup airlines are let down is advertising.
Tell me my costs and I'll try and see if I can make any money.

Market research would be interesting.

Sorry to hijack the thread.

Lease a ATR, Waterford is need of a link to LTN. :P

JCX BXC

MYOB wrote: »

Looking at failures, the biggest issue is assuming there's a market where there isn't one.

You need two aircraft realistically, newer and preferably already fitted out suitably (all economy seating with a basic AVOD system I'd imagine)

You need about 30 pilots and 75 FAs. You will need flight planning and operations staff. You're going to need more finance and HR people. You're going to need a much larger office...

You have to consider CBP charges, US security charges, US taxes as gone from the ticket price before you get a cent - if you attempt to transfer these directly to the consumer and think that they'll still fall for a headline rate without them you'll have no customers (and the EU on your back). These are on top of airport fees. Building a business plan on the airport fees being free in year 1 - which they often aren't for a second operator on a pre-existing route - leaves you dead in the water at 13 months.



Not loaded to capacity its not. Try a 767-700 and you might be on to something, but you're not going to have the range to go any further than SNN-EWR realistically; nor are you going to make it in winter either.

Intresting.
My calculations were to fill 170 seats, a fill factor of 67%.
To sell seats, you could have 3 different classes.

Low Economy: Fares starting at €50. Includes a tightly packed seat and a piece of handluggage.

High Economy:
Includes a semi-spacious seat with a 20kg suitcase.
Complimentary water. Includes entertainment system. Extended features for €5.
2 pieces of hand luggage.

Business.
3 suitcases and spacious seats.
Seats partly recline. Full entertainment system with 3 meals.
Free soft drinks and up to 5 free alcoholic drinks. Priority boarding.

First Class.

Your own enclosed space with unlimited drinks and plentiful food. Free wifi. Seats turn into beds. Climate control.

JCX BXC

b757 wrote: »

Sorry to hijack the thread.

Lease a ATR, Waterford is need of a link to LTN. :P

Why not STN?
Call michael, he will set you up.

JCX BXC

Just noticed somthing.
When calculating, I realised that If I opt into preclearance in shannon for €10, I don't have to pay $15.75 in newark.
Also, when calculating the fees at newark, I accidentally put the dollars as euros.

About shannon.

If we could make the flights cheap enough from shannon and had connecting routes from Europe, it would make shannon a hell of an airport and would do alot for Ireland.

JCX BXC

How did Aer Lingus sustain them 747's?

L1011

Carnacalla wrote: »

Intresting.
My calculations were to fill 170 seats, a fill factor of 67%.
To sell seats, you could have 3 different classes.

Low Economy: Fares starting at €50. Includes a tightly packed seat and a piece of handluggage.

High Economy:
Includes a semi-spacious seat with a 20kg suitcase.
Complimentary water. Includes entertainment system. Extended features for €5.
2 pieces of hand luggage.

Business.
3 suitcases and spacious seats.
Seats partly recline. Full entertainment system with 3 meals.
Free soft drinks and up to 5 free alcoholic drinks. Priority boarding.

First Class.

Your own enclosed space with unlimited drinks and plentiful food. Free wifi. Seats turn into beds. Climate control.

None of those classes would sell.

First is a product for airlines with established frequent flyer bases, hubs, connecting flights, etc. There is NO demand for First from Shannon.

Business needs lie-flats, not "partly recline" - you are describing economy on other carriers here. All you will get for that is standard economy pricing on other carriers - which, ex-Ireland, is nothing to write home about. €500 return if booked in advance, maybe.

The economy options both sound like something that Biman Bangladesh would be embarrassed by and would be completely incompatible with an airline that's trying to offer First. €50 will have you losing significant sums on every ticket.

You aren't going to fit 170 seats in a four class layout into a 752 either, realistically

Carnacalla wrote: »

How did Aer Lingus sustain them 747's?

They didn't.

Flew them irregularly, leased them out to cover costs, half-filled them in DUB first, lost masses of money. There is a reason they replaced them with 330s (and in the case of Shannon, now only operate 757s).

JCX BXC

MYOB wrote: »

None of those classes would sell.

First is a product for airlines with established frequent flyer bases, hubs, connecting flights, etc. There is NO demand for First from Shannon.

Business needs lie-flats, not "partly recline" - you are describing economy on other carriers here. All you will get for that is standard economy pricing on other carriers - which, ex-Ireland, is nothing to write home about. €500 return if booked in advance, maybe.

The economy options both sound like something that Biman Bangladesh would be embarrassed by and would be completely incompatible with an airline that's trying to offer First. €50 will have you losing significant sums on every ticket.

You aren't going to fit 170 seats in a four class layout into a 752 either, realistically



They didn't.

Flew them irregularly, leased them out to cover costs, half-filled them in DUB first, lost masses of money. There is a reason they replaced them with 330s (and in the case of Shannon, now only operate 757s).

Take out first class.

JCX BXC

What you haven't got Myob, is that only the first few tickets will be €50, and only the ones on a tuesday and thursday.

L1011

Carnacalla wrote: »

Take out first class.

Leaving you with Economy, Penury and Purgatory? Not one of them is a coherent offering. You need to equal what's on offer on US transcons (New York - LA) realistically, if you're not going to match what other TATL carriers do.

Carnacalla wrote: »

What you haven't got Myob, is that only the first few tickets will be €50, and only the ones on a tuesday and thursday.

To be honest, I suspect they're the only ones you'll sell...

afatbollix

Your first class sounds like business.

For business class you are going to need a lounge in each airport serving complementary alcohol and food.

But you can charge for it €1000 each way. Your Business class passengers pay for your flights not economy.

JCX BXC

MYOB wrote: »

Leaving you with Economy, Penury and Purgatory? Not one of them is a coherent offering. You need to equal what's on offer on US transcons (New York - LA) realistically, if you're not going to match what other TATL carriers do.



To be honest, I suspect they're the only ones you'll sell...

Why would you say that?
If their is 3 airline offering new york during the summer season, then why would I work?

Okay say I had 10 business seats with 200 economy.
Economy includes carry on with paid for entertainment.
20kg bags cost €50.

Zonda999

The idea of a transatlantic "RyanAtlantic" always strikes up a good thread here.

At this stage, I find it pretty difficult to see it happen

For a start, it would have to make money at a totally separate entity to Ryanair.Okay, this is an assumption but I don;t think MO'L would have it any other way and I doubt anyone else here would either. That means no connecting Ryanair flights or anything like that.

If we assume, he;d start something like this with 787's or A350's, he won;t get them for many years and would have absolutely no leverage when negotiating with Boeing or Airbus

As well, in the last couple of years, we've seen winter transatlantic fares drop to as low €340 with the likes of US Airways from Dublin. There is immense competition already, I think it would be very hard for RyanAtlantic to compete and actually make enough money to make the whole thing worthwhile

JCX BXC

afatbollix wrote: »

Your first class sounds like business.

For business class you are going to need a lounge in each airport serving complementary alcohol and food.

But you can charge for it €1000 each way. Your Business class passengers pay for your flights not economy.

I'd use the rhianna lounge in shannon.