Undertaking in bus lanes.

whomitconcerns

greenflash wrote: »

Yep. You can't beat the feeling of hopping into the bus lane on the Malahide Road at 19.00.01 and cruising past untold amount of stop start stress heads.

What bugs the crap out of me though is when impatient, selfish little bastards pop into the bus lane 300 metres before it changes into a turn left lane and speed past other cars further up with their indicators on, just about to move left. This happens approx every 2.4 seconds at Clarehall.

And thats a 24/7 buslane at that point anyway(up to the left slip)....

greenflash

whomitconcerns wrote: »

And thats a 24/7 buslane at that point anyway(up to the left slip)....

I know!

First part of the post refers to homeward journeys coming from town, when I work there. Second part is just what seriously annoys me on the other side of the road when I go shopping.

Muahahaha

degsie wrote: »

I love bus lanes and always use then outside the posted hours. I find it gets me from A to B much faster

Tell me about it, bus lanes are 50% of the reason why I ride a motorbike into town rather than take the car. I know motorbikes aren't supposed to be in a bus lane but once you're not acting the maggot the Gardai don't bother you. I've done my commute in a car and apart from it taking almost twice as long it is the gear grinding and constant braking that wreck my head, also the drivers who take an age to hit the clutch, get into gear and move off, commuting in rush hour is not driving, it's torturing yourself. With the bus lanes on a bike you avoid all that at any time of day, it's well worth the odd soaking I might get

crc

greenflash wrote: »

What bugs the crap out of me though is when impatient, selfish little bastards pop into the bus lane 300 metres before it changes into a turn left lane and speed past other cars further up with their indicators on, just about to move left. This happens approx every 2.4 seconds at Clarehall.

Every day without fail, approaching Dennehy's Cross in Cork (northbound), drivers move left into the bus lane early rather than stay in the correct lane (i.e. the one just to the right of the bus lane).

See here on Google Maps

The right lane veers left at the end of the bus lane, so the correct procedure is to stay in this lane (if going straight on or turning left at the cross).

TheChizler

crc wrote: »

Every day without fail, approaching Dennehy's Cross in Cork (northbound), drivers move left into the bus lane early rather than stay in the correct lane (i.e. the one just to the right of the bus lane).

See here on Google Maps

The right lane veers left at the end of the bus lane, so the correct procedure is to stay in this lane (if going straight on or turning left at the cross).

This junction is frustrating! I was using the road correctly during bus lane hours the other day and had to slam on to avoid a taxi failing to yield and going into the side of me.

Was kind of annoyed that I did avoid the crash as I would have been in the right, and we weren't going too fast so there would have been no injuries, but a sense of righteousness wouldn't have been worth the hassle, and also going by the fact that I DID manage to avoid an accident means that if I left it happen it would really have been partially my fault.

On the slow traffic/undertaking thing, impossible to define a number, but I'd say slow is a speed at which it's unlikely there's be too much damage if someone f##ked up and did something stupid when you're overtaking on the left.

Completely disagree that 80 km/h could ever be objectively considered slow. The law says slow, which would imply an absolute figure, not relative. This absolute figure should be the same regardless of surrounding traffic and limits. If it did mean relative then, speed limits aside, overtaking on the left would be legal if you came up to someone doing 120 while doing 200 km/h for instance, how ridiculous would that be?

greenflash

crc wrote: »

Every day without fail, approaching Dennehy's Cross in Cork (northbound), drivers move left into the bus lane early rather than stay in the correct lane (i.e. the one just to the right of the bus lane).

See here on Google Maps

The right lane veers left at the end of the bus lane, so the correct procedure is to stay in this lane (if going straight on or turning left at the cross).

I know it well as my in-laws live just off Model Farm Road. Completely agree with you and what makes it worse is both my in-laws drive around the area and neither of them has ever had a driving lesson or taken a test.

Finally, as an aside, does anyone know if using indicators on roundabouts is illegal in Cork?

LFCFan

On Dorset street, turning left on to Whitworth Road there is a Bus Lane and it only turns in to a left turn lane at around 50 metres to the turn but there is frequently 100 metres of traffic turning left. You have no choice but to move in to the bus lane early or you end up trying to pull in to the left lane when the filter light is red and the regular light is green with the cars behind beeping and giving you the finger. Sometimes it's impossible to do the right thing on Irish roads because of they way they are laid out and the right things quickly becomes to wrong thing in the eyes of all the traffic around you. I'm sure there are hundreds if not thousands of examples of this type of thing around the country.

highdef

LFCFan wrote: »

On Dorset street, turning left on to Whitworth Road there is a Bus Lane and it only turns in to a left turn lane at around 50 metres to the turn but there is frequently 100 metres of traffic turning left. You have no choice but to move in to the bus lane early or you end up trying to pull in to the left lane when the filter light is red and the regular light is green with the cars behind beeping and giving you the finger. Sometimes it's impossible to do the right thing on Irish roads because of they way they are laid out and the right things quickly becomes to wrong thing in the eyes of all the traffic around you. I'm sure there are hundreds if not thousands of examples of this type of thing around the country.

I simply ignore the finger pointing and beeping horns. Why should you or I break the law for the sake of others and be at risk of punishment just to please others? If you are in the right lane indicating left, where the bus lane ends, you are doing the correct thing. The fact that there is a queue of traffic sitting in the bus lane is irrelevant. Whether it is full of cars or completely empty, you should only begin to try to enter the left lane AFTER the bus lane ends.

I do this all the time (when the bus lane is not open to the public) without fail. I have been questioned by Gardai twice when performing this action whist awaiting to get into the left turn lane onto South Circular Road from the N4/R148/Con Colbert Road inbound. They said I could cause an accident by being stopped in the carriageway awaiting entry to the slip lane. In both instances, I was told that I should join the queue in the 24 hour bus lane. And in both instances, I asked for name, badge number and what he said in writing and signed by him. The first time I did this, the guard told me to pull in further up, at which point he performed a meticulous search of my car looking for some fault which he did not find. The second time, the guards just got back in their van and drove off.

Muahahaha

Muahahaha wrote: »

Tell me about it, bus lanes are 50% of the reason why I ride a motorbike into town rather than take the car. I know motorbikes aren't supposed to be in a bus lane but once you're not acting the maggot the Gardai don't bother you. I've done my commute in a car and apart from it taking almost twice as long it is the gear grinding and constant braking that wreck my head, also the drivers who take an age to hit the clutch, get into gear and move off, commuting in rush hour is not driving, it's torturing yourself. With the bus lanes on a bike you avoid all that at any time of day, it's well worth the odd soaking I might get

That's exactly the reason i have just gotten my bike leaner permit, i love my car but commuting from one side of Dublin to the other for 3 years has put me on the brink. Will use a bike to commute and my car for when i can actually enjoy it.

robz150

Also, why oh why do some drivers not use the Bus Lanes when their open. Really annoys me when I see a near crash as a driver indicates right and swerves at the last minute to switch back in to the right hand lane to avoid a bus lane that is open to everyone. In particular the Oscar Traynor road in Coolock which is not a bus lane between 10:00 and 12:00. Always get the evil eyes when I drive in this bus lane at this time. Even had a nice man in a landscape business 4x4 swerve towards me as I went past in the bus lane. He got out at the next lights to ask me 'Did I think I was great driving in the bus lane' I informed it was open to cars at the specific times but that only made his face more red and he wanted to fight Idiot

degsie

I think we should close this thread NOW! I really don't want everyone knowing bus lanes are ok to use outside the posted times, it saves my skin every time I collect the kids from school as I merrily skip along the open lane. The red faced, snarling, stress heads all bunched up in the other lane just makes me giggle a little...

robz150

I take your point its nice to drive down an open bus lane when permitted, why wouldn't you I shouldn't be surprised people are oblivious to a sign saying they can when a lot of drivers are oblivious to everything else around them. Sundays and after 7pm queuing in traffic with an empty bus lane beside them, whats going on in their heads??

LFCFan

robz150 wrote: »

whats going on in their heads??

Precious little most probably

visual

robz150 wrote: »

Also, why oh why do some drivers not use the Bus Lanes when their open. Really annoys me when I see a near crash as a driver indicates right and swerves at the last minute to switch back in to the right hand lane to avoid a bus lane that is open to everyone. In particular the Oscar Traynor road in Coolock which is not a bus lane between 10:00 and 12:00. Always get the evil eyes when I drive in this bus lane at this time. Even had a nice man in a landscape business 4x4 swerve towards me as I went past in the bus lane. He got out at the next lights to ask me 'Did I think I was great driving in the bus lane' I informed it was open to cars at the specific times but that only made his face more red and he wanted to fight Idiot

The landscaping guy should be put off the road
even if you where driving in buslane at wrong time(and you weren't) he shouldn't be openly aggressive and demonstrate road rage.

Muahahaha

cisk wrote: »

That's exactly the reason i have just gotten my bike leaner permit, i love my car but commuting from one side of Dublin to the other for 3 years has put me on the brink. Will use a bike to commute and my car for when i can actually enjoy it.

Once you discover the joys of a rush hour commute on a motorbike you'll find it hard to go back to the car. I only ever take the car if it's icy or absolutely lashing rain. You will get wet now and again but for me the inconvenience is well worth the time saved and not having to be grinding gears in slow moving traffic

degsie wrote: »

I think we should close this thread NOW! I really don't want everyone knowing bus lanes are ok to use outside the posted times, it saves my skin every time I collect the kids from school as I merrily skip along the open lane. The red faced, snarling, stress heads all bunched up in the other lane just makes me giggle a little...

I feel the same, the less people that know they can use bus lanes the better

Funnily enough I think the lack of people using them is a direct reflection of the average Irish drivers observational skills when driving. Because if their observation was any good then they'd clearly see the signs outlining when the public can use them.

porsche959

Can't we have one giant mega-merge thread for all the "I saw someone doing something bold that secretly I'd like to do myself but I don't have the balls" rants?

degsie

porsche959 wrote: »

Can't we have one giant mega-merge thread for all the "I saw someone doing something bold that secretly I'd like to do myself but I don't have the balls" rants?

No.

Sean Kinvarra

On many occasions driving down Malahide Road towards Fairview just after 7am I used the bus lane as it was open to all traffic after 7. At times there were buses and taxis in front and behind so I kept up to their speed which at times was up to a maximum of 60 kmh. Even though traffic in other lane was doing 30- 40 kmh shouldn't all those busses and taxied including myself have been pulled in and drivers received penalty points and a fine if it's so dangerous? This happens every day on Irish roads yet never heard anybody complain about this.

degsie

Sean Kinvarra wrote: »

On many occasions driving down Malahide Road towards Fairview just after 7am I used the bus lane as it was open to all traffic after 7. At times there were buses and taxis in front and behind so I kept up to their speed which at times was up to a maximum of 60 kmh. Even though traffic in other lane was doing 30- 40 kmh shouldn't all those busses and taxied including myself have been pulled in and drivers received penalty points and a fine if it's so dangerous? This happens every day on Irish roads yet never heard anybody complain about this.

Only if you were exceeding the posted speed limit.

Sean Kinvarra

Dessie. That's what I was thinking myself. But doesn't that contradict the rule on undertaking? Doubt a Garda ever pulled a bus or taxi driver for this type of undertaking, yet if a private motorist did this without any busses or taxis around it would be a different story. The rule on undertaking in a grey area, and should be sorted out once and for all as in UK and N Ireland.

degsie

Nothing grey about it. If a bus lane has posted times then that lane becomes a normal driving lane outside of the posted times. In this country we are required to drive on the leftmost lane, so those driving on the second lane are in the wrong as this in effect is now an overtaking lane. Most drivers are clueless on this.

corktina

Sean Kinvarra wrote: »

On many occasions driving down Malahide Road towards Fairview just after 7am I used the bus lane as it was open to all traffic after 7. At times there were buses and taxis in front and behind so I kept up to their speed which at times was up to a maximum of 60 kmh. Even though traffic in other lane was doing 30- 40 kmh shouldn't all those busses and taxied including myself have been pulled in and drivers received penalty points and a fine if it's so dangerous? This happens every day on Irish roads yet never heard anybody complain about this.

Have you got that right? would it not be open to all traffic until 7am?

old_aussie

Overtake, undertake, whats the problem?

In Oz, you can overtake in any lane, we have a simple rule(we are Aussies I know)

LOOK BEFORE CHANGING LANES!

So simples.

We're not crashing by the thousands.

corktina

you probably have had an effective driver training program for years to go with it though

enda1

Australia has a higher rate of road deaths than Ireland. Not saying it's attributed to that rule, but I wouldn't hold it up as a glowing example of driving excellence either.

djimi

degsie wrote: »

Nothing grey about it. If a bus lane has posted times then that lane becomes a normal driving lane outside of the posted times. In this country we are required to drive on the leftmost lane, so those driving on the second lane are in the wrong as this in effect is now an overtaking lane. Most drivers are clueless on this.

This has been said several times and nobody has ever once posted anything to back it up. I have never seen anything written anywhere to suggest that it is manditory to drive in a bus lane outside of hours.

enda1

djimi wrote: »

This has been said several times and nobody has ever once posted anything to back it up. I have never seen anything written anywhere to suggest that it is manditory to drive in a bus lane outside of hours.

Unless there is a rule which says not to, I think it falls user the drive in the leftmost lane rule.

djimi

enda1 wrote: »

Unless there is a rule hick days not to, I think it falls user the drive in the leftmost lane rule.

A bus lane is not part of the main carraigeway though. Is there anything written anywhere to suggest that it becomes part of the main carraigeway outside of hours?

corktina

but out of hours it ceases to be a bus lane and the thick white boundary can be disregarded, thus it is the left hand lane and should be the driving lane by default.

corktina

enda1 wrote: »

Unless there is a rule which says not to, I think it falls user the drive in the leftmost lane rule.

...and also the rules on undertaking then apply too...