Undertaking in bus lanes.

robertxxx

I get the impression that people think this is ok!

It's illegal to drive in a bus lane, never mind speed in one.

Why not just overtake? That way Your going to be breaking the speed limit only and not driving in an restricted area?

:mad

evolving_doors

Not always illegal to undertake.. once a lane opens to cars at a certain time I'm in like flynn... Also if I'm turning left ....eventually..

Sobanek

robertxxx wrote: »

I get the impression that people think this is ok!

It's illegal to drive in a bus lane, never mind speed in one.

Why not just overtake? That way Your going to be breaking the speed limit only and not driving in an restricted area?

:mad

Some Bus Lanes in Dublin are 07:00 - 19:00, Monday to Saturday.

And I never get why people say undertaking is so dangerous. Are cars in Ireland not equipped with a left wing mirror or something?

ba_barabus

Sobanek wrote: »

Some Bus Lanes in Dublin are 07:00 - 19:00, Monday to Saturday.

And I never get why people say undertaking is so dangerous. Are cars in Ireland not equipped with a left wing mirror or something?

Irish drivers are much like Derek Zoolander in that they can only turn one way. They're not ambi-turners

CiniO

Generally bus lanes are no different to anything else, so undertaking on them is illegal - and that includes buses. (there is no exception in law for buses).

Obviously undertaking in slow moving traffic is legal.
But when cars on other lanes do 40km/h and bus is undertaking them on bus lane at 50km/h that's definitely illegal.

Chris_Heilong

after operational hours when bus lanes become open to the public everyone should be using them.

650Ginge

My understanding is that you can pass on the left if the traffic in the left lane is moving faster than the traffic in the right lane.

The grey is the drivers who come up in the left lane move right to overtake and then move left out of the empty right lane to continue.

whiskeyman

A common scenario I find is a car trying to turn right against a busy flow of traffic and there's a bus lane to their left.
Cars approaching from behind will use bus lane, as long as no bus coming, to undertake car and rejoin the driving lane.
Has anyone ever been pulled in for this?
I see it the whole time, and do it myself tbh.

CiniO

650Ginge wrote: »

My understanding is that you can pass on the left if the traffic in the left lane is moving faster than the traffic in the right lane.

You can, but only when traffic moves slowly.

The grey is the drivers who come up in the left lane move right to overtake and then move left out of the empty right lane to continue.

I think you meant opposite.
But anyway legality of undertaking is not affected by fact if someone changes lane before and after maneuver or not.

CiniO

650Ginge wrote: »

My understanding is that you can pass on the left if the traffic in the left lane is moving faster than the traffic in the right lane.

You can, but only when traffic moves slowly.

The grey is the drivers who come up in the left lane move right to overtake and then move left out of the empty right lane to continue.

I think you meant opposite.
But anyway legality of undertaking is not affected by fact if someone changes lane before and after maneuver or not.

roper1664

From the rules of the road:

You may overtake on the left when:
-You want to go straight ahead when the driver in front of you has moved out and signalled that they intend to turn right
-You have signalled that you intend to turn left
-Traffic in both lanes is moving slowly and traffic in the left-hand lane is moving more quickly than the traffic in the right-hand lane

I think these covers all scenarios mentioned in this thread. Sometimes it's best to just quote the rules of the road or the road traffic act next time a thread like this starts.

Regarding bus lanes, as posted already these are not all 24 hr and you should use these when they open (as best driving practice only).

Regarding speeding, this is controlled by the Gardai and private camera operators. This is not another driver's concern.

CiniO

roper1664 wrote: »

From the rules of the road:

You may overtake on the left when:
-You want to go straight ahead when the driver in front of you has moved out and signalled that you intend to turn left
-You have signalled that you intend to turn left
-Traffic in both lanes is moving slowly and traffic in the left-hand lane is moving more quickly than the traffic in the right-hand lane

I think these covers all scenarios mentioned in this thread. Sometimes it's best to just quote the rules of the road or the road traffic act next time a thread like this starts.

Regarding bus lanes, as posted already these are not all 24 hr and you should use these when they open (as best driving practice only).

Regarding speeding, this is controlled by the Gardai and private camera operators. This is not another driver's concern.

Should it not say instead:
-You want to go straight ahead when the driver in front of you has moved out and signalled that he intend to turn right

???

jameshayes

roper1664 wrote: »

From the rules of the road:

You may overtake on the left when:
-You want to go straight ahead when the driver in front of you has moved out and signalled that you intend to turn left
-You have signalled that you intend to turn left
-Traffic in both lanes is moving slowly and traffic in the left-hand lane is moving more quickly than the traffic in the right-hand lane

I think these covers all scenarios mentioned in this thread. Sometimes it's best to just quote the rules of the road or the road traffic act next time a thread like this starts.

Regarding bus lanes, as posted already these are not all 24 hr and you should use these when they open (as best driving practice only).

Regarding speeding, this is controlled by the Gardai and private camera operators. This is not another driver's concern.

The rules of the road are great, but they are not laws and are very much open to interpretation.

eg. Define the word slowly in point 3? 5kmph, 10kmph? In some opinions 50kmph could be considered slowly compared to 100kmph

CiniO

jameshayes wrote: »

The rules of the road are great, but they are not laws and are very much open to interpretation.

Thing is, that in that case laws say exactly the same.

eg. Define the word slowly in point 3? 5kmph, 10kmph? In some opinions 50kmph could be considered slowly compared to 100kmph

Surely on 50km/h speed limit road, 40km/h or 50km/h can not be considered slow. 5 or 10km/h can.

roper1664

CiniO wrote: »

Should it not say instead:
-You want to go straight ahead when the driver in front of you has moved out and signalled that he intend to turn right

???

Yes, typo

roper1664

JamesHayes, yes, it's not very clear in the ROTR but that's because if they gave exact figures/criteria it would be very difficult to control. It's to make the point that you shouldn't but your foot down and power up the lane to the left to get ahead of a car to the right.

evolving_doors

Aye basically if you want to undertake in the bus lane just shtick on the left indicator and put on the muck savage accent if stopped by guards..."im up from the country guard... no idea whats goingon with these rules in the big city.. I think I was meant to turn left... where are you from yourself guard.. hows yer father..etc.."

K.Flyer

CiniO wrote: »

Generally bus lanes are no different to anything else, so undertaking on them is illegal - and that includes buses. (there is no exception in law for buses).

Obviously undertaking in slow moving traffic is legal.
But when cars on other lanes do 40km/h and bus is undertaking them on bus lane at 50km/h that's definitely illegal.

That part makes no sense, The reason for Bus Lanes was so that Buses and Taxis could pass the slower moving traffic as long as they don't break the speed limit themselves, otherwise whats the point in them.

CiniO

K.Flyer wrote: »

That part makes no sense, The reason for Bus Lanes was so that Buses and Taxis could pass the slower moving traffic as long as they don't break the speed limit themselves, otherwise whats the point in them.

I just said what the law says.

K.Flyer

CiniO wrote: »

I just said what the law says.

I don't see anything in the RotR about buses having to maintain an equal or lesser speed to traffic in other lanes whilst using the bus lane.
They are not undertaking in the strictest terms of the law. They are using a lane for what it was designed for.

CiniO

K.Flyer wrote: »

I don't see anything in the RotR about buses having to maintain an equal or lesser speed to traffic in other lanes whilst using the bus lane.
They are not undertaking in the strictest terms of the law. They are using a lane for what it was designed for.

This:

(5) A driver may only overtake on the left—

( a ) where the driver of the vehicle about to be overtaken has signalled an intention to turn to the right and the driver of the overtaking vehicle intends, after overtaking, to go straight ahead or to turn to the left,
( b ) where the driver of the overtaking vehicle intends, after overtaking, to turn left at the next road junction and has signalled this intention,
( c ) in slow moving traffic, when vehicles in the traffic lane on the driver's right are moving more slowly than the overtaking vehicle.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1997/en/si/0182.html#zzsi182y1997a10

When bus is driving faster on bus lane (located on left side of the road) than other traffic, then it is overtaking on the left, which is prohibited except in cases listed above.

RandomAccess

Once 7pm rolls around its open season.
If the traffic in the right lane is backed up, then you can use the other lane without issue. Of course you need to use it with care as there is a chance of someone changing lane ahead of you.

However someone maybe aluded to using the bus lane during restricted hours when turning left, you won't get away with this though I've seen a lot of people getting caught.

K.Flyer

If this was being applied to bus drivers in the general Dublin Area the courts would be choc a block with bus drivers up on undertaking charges and it would be like shooting fish in a barrel for the Garda to catch them.
So there is obviously some type of exception applied to buses using bus lanes because they fly past the traffic.
Or is it a socially acceptable norm for buses to progress as long as they don't break the speed limit in the same way as its socially acceptable for emergency vehicles to get where they are going to as quick as possible by whatever means.

CiniO

K.Flyer wrote: »

So there is obviously some type of exception applied to buses using bus lanes because they fly past the traffic.

I looked for one some time ago for a good while with no effect.
I don't believe there is any exception.

Or is it a socially acceptable norm for buses to progress as long as they don't break the speed limit

I suppose that's the only explanation.

in the same way as its socially acceptable for emergency vehicles to get where they are going to as quick as possible by whatever means.

Isn't there a law allowing emergency vehicles driving with sirens on, to not obey traffic laws?

corktina

I thought the bus lane was treated as a separate road and you join at the start and leave at the end, not crossing the solid white line in between. When the lane is not in use, the white line "disappears" and the lane becomes the driving lane and you may not undertake

CiniO

corktina wrote: »

I thought the bus lane was treated as a separate road and you join at the start and leave at the end, not crossing the solid white line in between. When the lane is not in use, the white line "disappears" and the lane becomes the driving lane and you may not undertake

While your proposal makes sense, it doesn't work like that.

djimi

corktina wrote: »

I thought the bus lane was treated as a separate road and you join at the start and leave at the end, not crossing the solid white line in between. When the lane is not in use, the white line "disappears" and the lane becomes the driving lane and you may not undertake

The problem is that there doesnt seem to be any clear definition of exactly what a bus lane is.

My understanding is that a bus lane is a seperate carraigeway; its not the left hand lane and doenst become the driving lane when its not in operation (ie you are not obliged to drive in the bus lane when it is out of hours). As such, normal undertaking laws do not apply. None of this however is written down to the best of my knowledge, so it becomes a free for all of opinion when this topic comes up, as nobody ever seems to know exactly what the legal situation of bus lanes actually is.

micraX

I do often be traveling into Dublin city in a tractor and trailer. I come up the r132/n1 by swords santeh etc. I go fairly hard mow, 43km/h top speed, I am still not a bus, yet some people don't notice this and blow me out of I and point ant the bus lane then fly up it themselves I usuall wave I they catch my eye. Why should I be subjected to this when it's clear I'm not a bus( bus lanes where closed I always look at signs)
The tractor is fully taxed, insured, lights working, reflectors, beacons, trailer has breakaway chain, brakes, lights, number plate so it's all legal. And I do be delivering vegetables into the Dublin market for those who think I shouldn't be delivering in a tractor.

corktina

ANy way, can we drop the subject now before too many people cop on that a bus lane is not always a bus lane :-)

K.Flyer

micraX wrote: »

I do often be traveling into Dublin city in a tractor and trailer. I come up the r132/n1 by swords santeh etc. I go fairly hard mow, 43km/h top speed, I am still not a bus, yet some people don't notice this and blow me out of I and point ant the bus lane then fly up it themselves I usuall wave I they catch my eye. Why should I be subjected to this when it's clear I'm not a bus( bus lanes where closed I always look at signs)
The tractor is fully taxed, insured, lights working, reflectors, beacons, trailer has breakaway chain, brakes, lights, number plate so it's all legal. And I do be delivering vegetables into the Dublin market for those who think I shouldn't be delivering in a tractor.

That section of road linking the Malahide Rd and the roundabout at Bewleys Hotel just off the M1 does not have a Bus Lane in either direction. They are old road markings, but it is not a Bus Lane.
I rang Coolock Garda Station a couple of years ago to clarify this as at the time I was using this road quite often.

micraX

K.Flyer wrote: »

That section of road linking the Malahide Rd and the roundabout at Bewleys Hotel just off the M1 does not have a Bus Lane in either direction. They are old road markings, but it is not a Bus Lane.
I rang Coolock Garda Station a couple of years ago to clarify this as at the time I was using this road quite often.

That's nice, but that's the n32 your talking about. I'm talking about the r132 formally know as the n1 which has a bus lane from the pavilions roundabout to santry.

K.Flyer

micraX wrote: »

That's nice, but that's the n32 your talking about. I'm talking about the r132 formally know as the n1 which has a bus lane from the pavilions roundabout to santry.

Standing here corrected
After posting I re-read your post, quickly checked the map and saw my mistake.
But you beat me to it before I could sheepishly delete my post.

vickers209

If your using the bus lane after hours and you come to a bus traffic light which allows a bus to move off before rest off traffic can a car go while in the bus lane

Theres one at stillorgan park hotel on n11 heading southbound

corktina

vickers209 wrote: »

If your using the bus lane after hours and you come to a bus traffic light which allows a bus to move off before rest off traffic can a car go while in the bus lane

Theres one at stillorgan park hotel on n11 heading southbound

well the answer is that this does not happen.....at least not in a well organised country that has a simple chip to control the lights so that the "bus" lights don't work outside bus lane hours. In this country? well, as we know, "sure it'll do".

whomitconcerns

Friday morning in traffic at artane. Long queue and I see a cop beside the buslane. Guy comes speeding up buslane from behind and spots the cop late and merges in front of me at about 60kph, we were only moving around 40 so I had to lock on. Beeped him out of it he gave me the finger.... Cop had seen him and pulled him out of the lane and to side. Karma

Sir Chops

CiniO wrote: »

Generally bus lanes are no different to anything else, so undertaking on them is illegal - and that includes buses. (there is no exception in law for buses).

Obviously undertaking in slow moving traffic is legal.
But when cars on other lanes do 40km/h and bus is undertaking them on bus lane at 50km/h that's definitely illegal.

That is a common perception but one that is completely incorrect

CiniO

Sir Chops wrote: »

That is a common perception but one that is completely incorrect

Why is that incorrect?

K.Flyer

If it is incorrect, then there are hundreds of traffic offences being made everyday by Dublin Bus drivers.
Somehow I cannot see if there was blatant disregard for the kaw by bus dtivers that it would continue unchecked.

markpb

CiniO wrote: »

Why is that incorrect?

Because what you're suggesting is contrary to the spirit of the law. The *only* intention of bus lanes is to give PSVs priority over low occupancy/ private vehicles. If undertaking in an in-operation bus lane was illegal, the law would be redundant. Since no-one would create a bus priority measure which traps buses at the lower speed of the normal lanes, ergo the law must mean that undertaking is legal.

No it's not spelled out in the law but that's because we don't (always) have to be prescriptive in the drafting of our laws, especially not laws that can only be enforced by an arm of the state. The Gardai understand the spirit and intention of the law, they understand that undertaking is not meant to be illegal and therefore don't prosecute bus drivers for it. No one else can prosecute for breach of the road traffic acts so it doesn't matter if you or anyone else disagree with their interpretation of it.

Chris_Heilong wrote: »

after operational hours when bus lanes become open to the public everyone should be using them.

I did this for a while and found it too awkward. How do you treat bus-only traffic lights or road markings that say left turn except buses? Most importantly, by being in the bus lane when no one else was, I didn't trust drivers on my right to expect me to continue straight at junctions that have the aforementioned left turn except buses signs.

corktina

you mean "turn left, except buses I guess"?

CiniO

markpb wrote: »

Because what you're suggesting is contrary to the spirit of the law. The *only* intention of bus lanes is to give PSVs priority over low occupancy/ private vehicles. If undertaking in an in-operation bus lane was illegal, the law would be redundant. Since no-one would create a bus priority measure which traps buses at the lower speed of the normal lanes, ergo the law must mean that undertaking is legal.

No it's not spelled out in the law but that's because we don't (always) have to be prescriptive in the drafting of our laws, especially not laws that can only be enforced by an arm of the state. The Gardai understand the spirit and intention of the law, they understand that undertaking is not meant to be illegal and therefore don't prosecute bus drivers for it. No one else can prosecute for breach of the road traffic acts so it doesn't matter if you or anyone else disagree with their interpretation of it.

Yeah, sure...
There is clear law prohibiting undertaking, but you say that it means nothing, because it doesn't make sense.

Sorry, but it doesn't make sense to me what you are saying.

markpb

CiniO wrote: »

Yeah, sure...
There is clear law prohibiting undertaking, but you say that it means nothing, because it doesn't make sense.

Sorry, but it doesn't make sense to me what you are saying.

Do you agree that a law that creates bus lanes to give vehicles legally in it priority but doesn't allow them to move faster than other vehicles would be nonsensical?

Do you agree that the Gardai do not prosecute bus or taxi drivers (or even cyclists) who move faster in the bus lane than other traffic?

No one is going to be able to give you the answer you're looking for. Perhaps the law is poorly drafted but the only people who it's relevant to understand it so no one else really matters. You could contact the DoT or RSA to get clarification if you'd like?

CiniO

markpb wrote: »

Do you agree that a law that creates bus lanes to give vehicles legally in it priority but doesn't allow them to move faster than other vehicles would be nonsensical?

Generally yes.
But current law allows them to move faster if traffic is moving slowly.
So when cars are stock in traffic jam moving at 5km/h, bus can go faster undertaking them legally.
What he can't do legally, is doing 50km/h when cars do 40km/h.

Do you agree that the Gardai do not prosecute bus or taxi drivers (or even cyclists) who move faster in the bus lane than other traffic?

Yes, I agree - they don't.

No one is going to be able to give you the answer you're looking for. Perhaps the law is poorly drafted but the only people who it's relevant to understand it so no one else really matters.

It doesn't matter until there is going to be accident, where someone will pursue the case, that cause or part of cause for accident was bus undertaking illegally.

You could contact the DoT or RSA to get clarification if you'd like?

I contacted RSA in the past to clarify few things, and they seem to be useless.
They don't even bother to look at the law.
According to them(RSA), buses can't use most-right lanes of motorways. Funny, as there is no law prohibiting it.

highdef

A lot of the time if I am heading into work in Dublin, I will leave the N4/R148 just after the Palmerstown traffic lights and enter the Lucan Road towards Chapelizod. If you know this road, there is a bus lane that is open to the public after 10am. What regularly happens (when it is after 10am of course) is that I will drive in the left lane (previously a bus lane) at 50 kmh, the speed limit. There are also ramps on this road.
Now, in my car I can travel over these ramps at the 50kmh limit no problem as the ramps are not too rough. What invariably happens is that a car slightly ahead of me in the right lane doing the same speed will hit the brakes as he/she arrives at one of the ramps and slow right down, sometimes right down to around 20kmh or so.
The reason why I can keep going at 50kmh is because everyone drives exclusively in the right lane for 3 main reasons:

1) They are making the right turn onto Kylemore Road a few hundred metres ahead
2) They are not paying attention and reading the signs.
3) They are the same as the vast majority of Irish drivers and have a fear and aversion of bus lanes that are open to the public.

Am I expected to follow the other drivers speed and hit the brakes so that I do not pass him on the left? I don't see why I should delay my journey because a fellow motorist wants to slow to a crawl over these pleasant ramps. Can I classify the drivers passing over the ramps as driving at a slow speed and therefore make my driving legal?

I do not use this lane as an excuse to skip traffic. I ALWAYS read the bus lane signs and will use it if the sign dictates to do so. I also NEVER use a bus lane when it not permitted, I won't even slip into one a few metres ahead if I am turning left. I treat that white line as wall.

CiniO

highdef wrote: »

A lot of the time if I am heading into work in Dublin, I will leave the N4/R148 just after the Palmerstown traffic lights and enter the Lucan Road towards Chapelizod. If you know this road, there is a bus lane that is open to the public after 10am. What regularly happens (when it is after 10am of course) is that I will drive in the left lane (previously a bus lane) at 50 kmh, the speed limit. There are also ramps on this road.
Now, in my car I can travel over these ramps at the 50kmh limit no problem as the ramps are not too rough. What invariably happens is that a car slightly ahead of me in the right lane doing the same speed will hit the brakes as he/she arrives at one of the ramps and slow right down, sometimes right down to around 20kmh or so.
The reason why I can keep going at 50kmh is because everyone drives exclusively in the right lane for 3 main reasons:

1) They are making the right turn onto Kylemore Road a few hundred metres ahead
2) They are not paying attention and reading the signs.
3) They are the same as the vast majority of Irish drivers and have a fear and aversion of bus lanes that are open to the public.

Am I expected to follow the other drivers speed and hit the brakes so that I do not pass him on the left? I don't see why I should delay my journey because a fellow motorist wants to slow to a crawl over these pleasant ramps. Can I classify the drivers passing over the ramps as driving at a slow speed and therefore make my driving legal?

I do not use this lane as an excuse to skip traffic. I ALWAYS read the bus lane signs and will use it if the sign dictates to do so. I also NEVER use a bus lane when it not permitted, I won't even slip into one a few metres ahead if I am turning left. I treat that white line as wall.

Assuming someone slows down to low speed on the ramp, I'd say you are probably OK to undertake in such circumstances, as this could be classified as traffic moving slowly. But I'm only guessing.


Anyway - what I wonder - if most Irish motorists don't even know it's illegal to undertake.
From those who do know, majority think that undertaking takes place only when you follow someone and change lane to left, to undertake and then return right; and once you follow left lane just travelling faster than someone on right lane, this is not undertaking.
And even that tiny leftover of drivers who actually really understand the law in relation to undertaking, don't bother obeying it, then what's the point in having it at all?

Why Ireland can not change a law and allow for undertaking in all cases if everyone wants it?

K.Flyer

CiniO wrote: »

....
Anyway - what I wonder - if most Irish motorists don't even know it's illegal to undertake.
From those who do know, majority think that undertaking takes place only when you follow someone and change lane to left, to undertake and then return right; and once you follow left lane just travelling faster than someone on right lane, this is not undertaking.
And even that tiny leftover of drivers who actually really understand the law in relation to undertaking, don't bother obeying it, then what's the point in having it at all?

What you have to remember is where this Law against undertaking originated from in Ireland.
It came about long before we had dual carriageways, nevermind motorways or even bus lanes. Couple this with poor driving standards, drink driving was almost a norm and the fact that back then most cars did Not even have left side mirrors!!
Impatient drivers would Often cut up the tight inside gap, sometimes mounting footpaths or use the hard shoulder to get past a slower driver if there was no room to overtake in the normal manner.
If you extrapolate this scenario to modern day driving, (IMO), it translates into the deliberate change to a left lane to pass a slower vehicle and then rejoin your original lane (at any speed).
Whereas to continue in your lane, (even if its lane 1), regardless of speed but within the legal limit, whilst passing slower moving cars in outer lanes does not construe undertaking in the strictest sense of the law if you look at where the law originated from.
Also it is the driver of the car who wishes to change lanes, be it on a motorway or to move into a bus lane, to have a duty of care to the users of that lane and to excercise caution when carrying out such a manoeuvre as the vehicles in the lane which the driver intends to join (irrespective of their speed) have right of way.

CiniO

K.Flyer wrote: »

What you have to remember is where this Law against undertaking originated from in Ireland.
It came about long before we had dual carriageways, nevermind motorways or even bus lanes. Couple this with poor driving standards, drink driving was almost a norm and the fact that back then most cars did Not even have left side mirrors!!
Impatient drivers would Often cut up the tight inside gap, sometimes mounting footpaths or use the hard shoulder to get past a slower driver if there was no room to overtake in the normal manner.
If you extrapolate this scenario to modern day driving, (IMO), it translates into the deliberate change to a left lane to pass a slower vehicle and then rejoin your original lane (at any speed).
Whereas to continue in your lane, (even if its lane 1), regardless of speed but within the legal limit, whilst passing slower moving cars in outer lanes does not construe undertaking in the strictest sense of the law if you look at where the law originated from.

Yes, you are the best example of driver I described above.
Nothing unusual, as most drivers here have no clue about this "no undertaking" law.

Muahahaha

I spend most of my commute undertaking by some of the definitions above. Though that's because I'm on a motorbike and use the bus lanes at any time of day. On my 6 mile commute I'd probably pass about 100-150 cars stuck in traffic and moving fairly slow so it's a lot safer for me to do that in the bus lane than around the outside of them. I wouldn't be pelting it up the bus lane as undertaking stopped traffic is when you're most likely to get a jay walker walk across the bus lane with barely looking.

I think the answer to the question is quite vague. I've often had taxis up my hole in the bus lane when we are undertaking stopped or slow moving traffic. If me taking it handy wasn't slowing them down then they would be doing the limit of 60kph while undertaking largely stationery traffic. I've seen plenty of taxis belt it down a bus lane doing 60kph when the lane beside them is doing 40kph but I don't think a Garda would classify that as undertaking as the bus lane is where they're allowed to be. However if they were caught driving at the limit of 60kph up a bus lane while the traffic next to them is stopped then a Garda wouldn't need to try to do them for undertaking, he could instead just charge them with 'not driving with due care' which is a kind of all encompassing term that can be applied to lots of situations. And in fairness doing even 50kph next to stopped traffic can be asking for trouble, pedestrians often pop out from between cars or worse again vans and SUVs so you really can't be going any quicker than what it would take you to slam the brakes and come to a complete halt within 15-20 meters away. If a taxi were using the bus lane at excessive speeds for the traffic conditions around them (even within the speed limit ) then a Garda could easily make that case to a judge and the person could get done for driving dangerously or driving without due care and attention without any need for mention of undertaking at all.

K.Flyer

CiniO wrote: »

Yes, you are the best example of driver I described above.
Nothing unusual, as most drivers here have no clue about this "no undertaking" law.

Well seeing as I have been driving on Irish and European roads with a full clean driving licence for over 32 years and I have never been pulled by the Garda for my manner of driving or ever received a fine for it, I imagine my interpretation of the RotR and how to apply them must be just fine.

mackerski

650Ginge wrote: »

My understanding is that you can pass on the left if the traffic in the left lane is moving faster than the traffic in the right lane.

The grey is the drivers who come up in the left lane move right to overtake and then move left out of the empty right lane to continue.

Back to driving school with you.

djimi

CiniO wrote: »

Generally yes.
But current law allows them to move faster if traffic is moving slowly.
So when cars are stock in traffic jam moving at 5km/h, bus can go faster undertaking them legally.
What he can't do legally, is doing 50km/h when cars do 40km/h.

You sure about that? Im pretty sure that buses can go any speed they want (within the limits obviously) irrespective of what the cars in the driving lanes are doing. While bus lanes are operational they are not part of the main driving carraigeway (ie private cars are not allowed to use them), so I have no idea why normal rules of undertaking would apply? If anything, a bus lane would follow the same rules as a slip road (seperate carraigeway on which its perfectly legal to pass cars that are on your right).