I dont watch any tv services in Ireland....

Mr Pseudonym

120_Minutes wrote: »

Of course I do, my question is leading. My analogue tv has an analogue tuner. the analogue signal is turned off never to return. My tv is neither broken nor is it capable of receiving a tv signal without external equipment.

So if i were to get rid of said equipment, under a technicality with the current wording of the legislation i should be exempt from the licence.

In fact, i'm surprised this hasnt been challenged yet in the courts.

Sorry, I forgot it had been turned off.

Daith

120_Minutes wrote: »

I know this. I'm talking about right now.

Oh in that case no.

Startup_Paul

I agree with what one of the posters on here said Public state funded TV should just be informative TV i.e. news, politics and if they cant afford it then dont be spending it on making average at best TV Shows (Love hate being a BIG exception) and buying in American TV shows etc.

And also if you dont use a TV or stream RTE to your laptop you should be exempt for paying for a licence. i.e. the car/tax analogy

The new licence we will have will have to pay (forgotten the name) is just another way to get more money from us.

And we will do the usual bitch on forums and just let it happen ;-)

STB

Mr Pseudonym wrote: »

I agree with your position, but think your comparison isn't entirely correct. The BBC is fabulously funded, but it also offers numerous services that we wouldn't expect of RTE (the numerous regional TV and Radio stations, the World Service, a massive global news network, etc.), and must broadcast them to a significantly larger number of people.

The only reason they can offer these services is that they are fabulousy funded. Outside the licence fee, their World Service is grant aided to the tune of £1.5 billion.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/annualreport/2013/executive/finances/licence_fee.html

At the moment we reap the benefits of being right next door as satellite signals do not stop at borders. This will all change in the future in the likely event that DTH is deployed via narrow sat beams.

The comparrisons between what we can do and what they do are for the monetary reasons alone, not comparable in terms of content provision. Likewise the PSBs have the envious job of keeping Irish people happy not British.

If people want to pay their money to the UK PSB, let them move there.

Mr Pseudonym

STB wrote: »

The only reason they can offer these services is that they are fabulousy funded. Outside the licence fee, their World Service is grant aided to the tune of £1.5 billion.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/annualreport/2013/executive/finances/licence_fee.html

At the moment we reap the benefits of being right next door as satellite signals do not stop at borders. This will all change in the future in the likely event that DTH is deployed via narrow sat beams.

The comparrisons between what we can do and what they do are for the monetary reasons alone, not comparable in terms of content provision. Likewise the PSBs have the envious job of keeping Irish people happy not British.

If people want to pay their money to the UK PSB, let them move there.

Regarding the first sentence: I'm aware of that. Hence, why comparisons are not always valid.

2013 is the last year that BBC received such a grant. £1.5bn amounts to all commercial income; World Service costs about £200m.

I don't understand this paragraph: "The comparrisons between what we can do and what they do are for the monetary reasons alone, not comparable in terms of content provision. Likewise the PSBs have the envious job of keeping Irish people happy not British."

lertsnim

120_Minutes wrote: »

Of course I do, my question is leading. My analogue tv has an analogue tuner. the analogue signal is turned off never to return. My tv is neither broken nor is it capable of receiving a tv signal without external equipment.

So if i were to get rid of said equipment, under a technicality with the current wording of the legislation i should be exempt from the licence.

In fact, i'm surprised this hasnt been challenged yet in the courts.

Analogue still exists on the UPC network so yes you would need to pay.

STB

Mr Pseudonym wrote: »

Regarding the first sentence: I'm aware of that. Hence, why comparisons are not always valid.

2013 is the last year that BBC received such a grant. £1.5bn amounts to all commercial income; World Service costs about £200m.

I don't understand this paragraph: "The comparrisons between what we can do and what they do are for the monetary reasons alone, not comparable in terms of content provision. Likewise the PSBs have the envious job of keeping Irish people happy not British."

Indeed. And the UK licence fee will no doubt go up as a result after the RC review. I thought they had til 2015 (WS costs run at £245m).

It means that I constantly see comparisons about the quality of UK PSB broadcasting content vs Irish PSB TV Broadcasting content. Producing television is obviously a costly business. There are a lot of programming ideas that go abroad as a result as they could never be afforded by the RTE.

Clarity: RTE broadcasting role is to reflect the democratic, social and cultural values of Irish society. The UK PSB's are not aimed at Ireland and I hate to see people post that they would rather pay their money to the BBC! I dont know about you but I am proud to be Irish and wouldnt use such a weak and narrowminded attitude to avoid paying the licence fee.

Its good to have a national broadcaster, its expensive to run and some people begrudge having to pay for it.

RTE are constantly dealing with ludicrous situations, the most recent of which is competing now with Sky TV for GAA matches and it looks like that Sky have bought the rights previously held by TV3. That means that some of our national sport cjhamionship games will only be available on a foreign subscription only TV service. This is only the start.....

Mr Pseudonym

STB wrote: »

Indeed. And the UK licence fee will no doubt go up as a result after the RC review. I thought they had til 2015 (WS costs run at £245m).

It means that I constantly see comparisons about the quality of UK PSB broadcasting content vs Irish PSB TV Broadcasting content. Producing television is obviously a costly business. There are a lot of programming ideas that go abroad as a result as they could never be afforded by the RTE.

Clarity: RTE broadcasting role is to reflect the democratic, social and cultural values of Irish society. The UK PSB's are not aimed at Ireland and I hate to see people post that they would rather pay their money to the BBC! I dont know about you but I am proud to be Irish and wouldnt use such a weak and narrowminded attitude to avoid paying the licence fee.

Its good to have a national broadcaster, its expensive to run and some people begrudge having to pay for it.

RTE are constantly dealing with ludicrous situations, the most recent of which is competing now with Sky TV for GAA matches and it looks like that Sky have bought the rights previously held by TV3. That means that some of our national sport cjhamionship games will only be available on a foreign subscription only TV service. This is only the start.....

I think the only reason UK license fee would increase is to account for inflation.

I largely disagree with you with regard to your distaste of foreign involvement, etc.

MilanPan!c

STB wrote: »

Indeed. And the UK licence fee will no doubt go up as a result after the RC review. I thought they had til 2015 (WS costs run at £245m).

It means that I constantly see comparisons about the quality of UK PSB broadcasting content vs Irish PSB TV Broadcasting content. Producing television is obviously a costly business. There are a lot of programming ideas that go abroad as a result as they could never be afforded by the RTE.

Clarity: RTE broadcasting role is to reflect the democratic, social and cultural values of Irish society. The UK PSB's are not aimed at Ireland and I hate to see people post that they would rather pay their money to the BBC! I dont know about you but I am proud to be Irish and wouldnt use such a weak and narrowminded attitude to avoid paying the licence fee.

Its good to have a national broadcaster, its expensive to run and some people begrudge having to pay for it.

RTE are constantly dealing with ludicrous situations, the most recent of which is competing now with Sky TV for GAA matches and it looks like that Sky have bought the rights previously held by TV3. That means that some of our national sport cjhamionship games will only be available on a foreign subscription only TV service. This is only the start.....

The only way the bolded part makes sense is if you think Irish society is an amalgamation of cheap UK knockoffs, imported US pop culture and humourless comedy.

I think Irish culture is much better than RTE is and can ever afford to be.

So we're forced to pay for some half-arsed crap, just so we can say we have a national broadcaster?

No thanks.

STB

MilanPan!c wrote: »

The only way the bolded part makes sense is if you think Irish society is an amalgamation of cheap UK knockoffs, imported US pop culture and humourless comedy.

I think Irish culture is much better than RTE is and can ever afford to be.

So we're forced to pay for some half-arsed crap, just so we can say we have a national broadcaster?

No thanks.

To you personally maybe. Look at the Market share of television in Ireland across all platforms.

RTE1 has a market share of 25%. Closely followed by TV3 and RTE2.

The BBC are under 10%.

120_Minutes

lertsnim wrote: »

Analogue still exists on the UPC network so yes you would need to pay.

As a non UPC customer can you explain? doesnt UPC require its own set top box?

MilanPan!c

STB wrote: »

To you personally maybe. Look at the Market share of television in Ireland across all platforms.

RTE1 has a market share of 25%. Closely followed by TV3 and RTE2.

The BBC are under 10%.

So wait:

RTE can never be as good as the BBC - due to money

RTE Is more popular than the BBC with the Irish, and you say that's it's because a percentage of the Irish would rather something worse and Irish than better and English.



Ok.

lertsnim

120_Minutes wrote: »

As a non UPC customer can you explain? doesnt UPC require its own set top box?

For analogue no set top box is needed. You connect the tv directly to the outlet on the wall.

STB

MilanPan!c wrote: »

So wait:

RTE can never be as good as the BBC - due to money

RTE Is more popular than the BBC with the Irish, and you say that's it's because a percentage of the Irish would rather something worse and Irish than better and English.



Ok.

No I never said that.

It is you that the problem with the content on RTE, not me. What I said is that there a lot of original programming on BBC that costs a lot of money to make. Invariably the 66m population means that programme makers can demand more moolah.

What I said was that you are in the minority as RTE 1 have the highest share of channel viewing across all platforms @ 25%. The figures are available online from Nielsen or at least through sites like medialive. They would largely be used by advertisers.

Okay ?

MilanPan!c

STB wrote: »

No I never said that.

It is you that the problem with the content on RTE, not me. What I said is that there a lot of original programming on BBC that costs a lot of money to make. Invariably the 66m population means that programme makers can demand more moolah.

What I said was that you are in the minority as RTE 1 have the highest share of channel viewing across all platforms @ 25%. The figures are available online from Nielsen or at least through sites like medialive. They would largely be used by advertisers.

Okay ?

Just so we're clear.

The broadcaster that all of us has to pay for, at best, gets one out of four viewers.

And people such as yourself consider this a roaring success.

What percentage of people in the UK watch the BBC?

120_Minutes

lertsnim wrote: »

For analogue no set top box is needed. You connect the tv directly to the outlet on the wall.

Interesting. I did not know UPC maintained an analogue service.

Still, it doesnt affect me as i've no UPC nor the infrastructure for it. So my original point still stands......for me, if i got rid of sky, I would consider myself exempt from the licence, as i've no aerial or upc.

Elmo

MilanPan!c wrote: »

What percentage of people in the UK watch the BBC?

About the same precentage. One of the reasons for this is that both channels are mainstream and provide locals with local news. BBC's percent in Ireland should be looked at in terms of all it's services, the possibly get 10%.

Why don't you get rid of your tv 120 mins?

120_Minutes

Elmo wrote: »

Why don't you get rid of your tv 120 mins?

Y'know i've been thinking bout it, but as i have a mac and a apple tv, i do enjoy having a 42" monitor from time to time

I may just get rid of sky and dump the box....then no licence as I technically cant receive anything!

MilanPan!c

Elmo wrote: »

About the same precentage. One of the reasons for this is that both channels are mainstream and provide locals with local news. BBC's percent in Ireland should be looked at in terms of all it's services, the possibly get 10%.

Why don't you get rid of your tv 120 mins?

About the same?

Just three years ago almost 100% of people in the UK consumed at least 15 of BBC TV broadcasting per week:

http://downloads.bbc.co.uk/aboutthebbc/reports/pdf/audience_0711.pdf

Almost 70% listened to some BBC radio every week as well.

And here it's what? 25% for RTE?

Also tell me, what percentage of people in the UK watch RTE?

Edit:

Here's the figures from last year and surprisingly the percentage of viewers has actually increased since 2011:

http://downloads.bbc.co.uk/aboutthebbc/insidethebbc/howwework/accountability/pdf/summary_audience_information_january_march_2013.pdf

lertsnim

120_Minutes wrote: »

Y'know i've been thinking bout it, but as i have a mac and a apple tv, i do enjoy having a 42" monitor from time to time

I may just get rid of sky and dump the box....then no licence as I technically cant receive anything!

What then when the broadcasting charge comes into effect.

Cool_CM

celtic tiger 2011 wrote: »

I have to disagree there . I think their home produced stuff is **** and its a waste of the tax payers money considering very few people in this country understand Irish.

I take it that you've never watched Scannal so? They also subtitle it in case you don't speak/understand/want to understand Irish.

TheChizler

120_Minutes wrote: »

Y'know i've been thinking bout it, but as i have a mac and a apple tv, i do enjoy having a 42" monitor from time to time

I may just get rid of sky and dump the box....then no licence as I technically cant receive anything!

The licence is for owning a device capable of receiving and displaying a tv signal, nothing to do with whether the signal is there or not. If it was the case that you didn't need it if there was no signal getting to your tv then all the people in valleys in Kerry etc who couldn't get signal wouldn't have needed a licence.

You'd need a firearms licence even if you had no bullets, or motor tax if you're parked on the road with no petrol.

120_Minutes

lertsnim wrote: »

What then when the broadcasting charge comes into effect.

I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.

TheChizler wrote: »

The licence is for owning a device capable of receiving and displaying a tv signal, nothing to do with whether the signal is there or not. If it was the case that you didn't need it if there was no signal getting to your tv then all the people in valleys in Kerry etc who couldn't get signal wouldn't have needed a licence.

You'd need a firearms licence even if you had no bullets, or motor tax if you're parked on the road with no petrol.

Just checked the info, and it states that an analogue tv with our without a saorview box still needs a licence. what utter wankery, they've already started the broadcasting act bull****. "oh i know the law says you must have a licence for a device capable of receiving a signal, but you have to have one for yours even though its not broken and it cant"

cúnts.

MilanPan!c

Cool_CM wrote: »

I take it that you've never watched Scannal so? They also subtitle it in case you don't speak/understand/want to understand Irish.

Good shows make it to air all the time on commercial stations. If Scannal is a good show - if - then it could easily find a budget on a commercial station.

Sans my tax dollars.

NormanNicetouch

MilanPan!c wrote: »

Good shows make it to air all the time on commercial stations. If Scannal is a good show - if - then it could easily find a budget on a commercial station.

Sans my tax dollars.

You do realise that you pay a compulsory marketing and advertising tax on every product or service you purchase if the company has a tv advertising budget? This is payable whether you have a tv or not. You can do a simple calculation by dividing TV3's advertising revenue by the number of households in Ireland to find the compulsory TV3 tax on goods and services per household. Then add on the UTVs, Channel 4s, Sky etc. It actually comes to far more than the RTE licence fee. And you pay it by stealth every time you go to the supermarket or pay your mobile phone bill. The idea that commercial television is 'free' is balderdash.

MilanPan!c

NormanNicetouch wrote: »

You do realise that you pay a compulsory marketing and advertising tax on every product or service you purchase if the company has a tv advertising budget? This is payable whether you have a tv or not. You can do a simple calculation by dividing TV3's advertising revenue by the number of households in Ireland to find the compulsory TV3 tax on goods and services per household. Then add on the UTVs, Channel 4s, Sky etc. It actually comes to far more than the RTE licence fee. And you pay it by stealth every time you go to the supermarket or pay your mobile phone bill. The idea that commercial television is 'free' is balderdash.

Of course. But again, I can choose what to buy, can I not?

I have no choice in whether or not I buy RTE.

NormanNicetouch

MilanPan!c wrote: »

Of course. But again, I can choose what to buy, can I not?

I have no choice in whether or not I buy RTE.

Of course you can choose what to buy and where to buy it though you'd need to avoid all the major supermarket chains, energy providers, mobile phone providers, drinks companies etc etc if you really wanted to get your tv for free or if you had no tv at all. Otherwise you are going to be paying a top up to cover their hefty television advertising budget for the 'free' commercial broadcasters.

MilanPan!c

NormanNicetouch wrote: »

Of course you can choose what to buy and where to buy it though you'd need to avoid all the major supermarket chains, energy providers, mobile phone providers, drinks companies etc etc if you really wanted to get your tv for free or if you had no tv at all. Otherwise you are going to be paying a top up to cover their hefty television advertising budget for the 'free' commercial broadcasters.

You still don't get it.

I have a choice with commercial tv, including not even having one.

With this "tax for crime dramas and pop radio stations" situation I'm paying for something I do not use, do not like and don't want.

If I buy a soda, I pay for their ads AND I get a soda.

With RTE I pay for their ads, I pay for their shows, I pay their celebrity presenters, and the rent on their offices and I get NOTHING.

NormanNicetouch

MilanPan!c wrote: »

You still don't get it.

I have a choice with commercial tv, including not even having one.

With this "tax for crime dramas and pop radio stations" situation I'm paying for something I do not use, do not like and don't want.

If I buy a soda, I pay for their ads AND I get a soda.

With RTE I pay for their ads, I pay for their shows, I pay their celebrity presenters, and the rent on their offices and I get NOTHING.

Why should you have to pay for the soda and their ads when all you wanted was a soda? You get no benefit from the ads but are still forced to pay for them. At least with RTE you have the option of benefiting by using their services. It is you who chooses not to do so.

shruikan2553

NormanNicetouch wrote: »

You do realise that you pay a compulsory marketing and advertising tax on every product or service you purchase if the company has a tv advertising budget? This is payable whether you have a tv or not. You can do a simple calculation by dividing TV3's advertising revenue by the number of households in Ireland to find the compulsory TV3 tax on goods and services per household. Then add on the UTVs, Channel 4s, Sky etc. It actually comes to far more than the RTE licence fee. And you pay it by stealth every time you go to the supermarket or pay your mobile phone bill. The idea that commercial television is 'free' is balderdash.

You pay based on how much it costs to make, plus profit and tax. The same with a TV. Your argument is closer to paying a yearly tax after I bought a bottle of something in case I may reuse the bottle.