Shannon Airport Thread [Mod Warning in First Post]

Clareman

I snipped a few posts that were bickering, can we get back to a proper CIVIL discussion please.

JCX BXC

United airlines resumes their Newark service tomorrow.

Brennans Row

Three diversions to Shannon today due to fog in Knock.

Ryanair flight FR6673 Liverpool – Knock
Ryanair flight FR805 Stansted – Knock
Ryanair flight FR8142 Luton – Knock

JCX BXC

Brennans Row wrote: »

Three diversions to Shannon today due to fog in Knock.

Ryanair flight FR6673 Liverpool – Knock
Ryanair flight FR805 Stansted – Knock
Ryanair flight FR8142 Luton – Knock

First two of them returned to the UK with passengers bussed from Knock, the third operated to Luton but I'm unsure as to whether they had passengers.

Edit: The Luton flight flew empty, passengers weren't bussed from Knock.

Brennans Row

There must have been a large fleet of coaches involved.

Good logistics by Knock Airport.

JCX BXC

Brennans Row wrote: »

There must have been a large fleet of coaches involved.

Good logistics by Knock Airport.

Nothing to do with logistics by Knock Airport, it's all on Ryanair.

Good communication however, I find Shannon's online airport listings quite poor compared to Knocks.

Brennans Row

Shannon - Commercial Movements (IAA)

|Jan|Feb|Mar|Apr|May|Jun|Jul|Aug|Sept|Oct|Nov|Dec|Total
2015|1,253|1,026|1,277|1,454|1,725|2,169|2,058|1,728|1,780|1,645|1,283|1,312|18,710
2016|1,222|1,128|1,390|1,488|1,807|2,031|2,032|1,834|1,839|1,698|1,353|1,327|19,149
2017|1,291|1,215|1,429|1,446|1,776|1,975|1,949|1,885|1,778|1,796|1,440|1,316|19,296
2018|1,301|1,200|||||||||||
Change|+0.8%|-1.2%|||||||||||

highlydebased

Pax up 3.5% for January

https://amp.independent.ie/business/irish/economic-boom-fuels-rise-in-european-air-passengers-36698645.html?__twitter_impression=true

beefburrito

The only movement I see around the vicinity of Shannon Airport these days is an absolutely dangerous low flying Airbus flying around in circles.

There was a time when Shannon was the hub of air traffic in Ireland, you could visit the airport on a Sunday for dinner with your parents, and it was a buzzing with activity, it was a day out to go to the airport.

Now even the Hare's on the runway have even hobbled away.

I don't understand what's going on with their board, is it lack of interest ? Poor management or just bad luck ?

Shannon was once the jewel of the crown in the mid west.

Shannon development were doing a great service to the Midwest, employing locals paying good wages and looking after our visitors both tourist's and potential business partners, whats being done now ?

Does it need a shake up?

JCX BXC

FR4776 (RYR26ZV) MAN-SNN diverting to Dublin at the moment.

JCX BXC

beefburrito wrote: »

The only movement I see around the vicinity of Shannon Airport these days is an absolutely dangerous low flying Airbus flying around in circles.

What is your basis for saying the Airbus (of which is only flying today, first of it's type in Ireland) is dangerously low flying? Is this not an extremely strong claim? Have you contacted the IAA with your concerns?

There was a time when Shannon was the hub of air traffic in Ireland, you could visit the airport on a Sunday for dinner with your parents, and it was a buzzing with activity, it was a day out to go to the airport.

I don't recall a time in recent history where Shannon was the hub of air traffic, Dublin was always bigger. Nostalgia?

I don't understand what's going on with their board, is it lack of interest ? Poor management or just bad luck ?

Shannon was once the jewel of the crown in the mid west.

Shannon development were doing a great service to the Midwest, employing locals paying good wages and looking after our visitors both tourist's and potential business partners, whats being done now ?

Does it need a shake up?

What do you propose be done? Another sweetheart deal with Ryanair? Which will end in a few years, leaving the airport in an even worse position than it currently is? Perhaps we should break out of the open skies agreement and bring back the Shannon stopover, effectively destroying aviation in Ireland?

I'll be the first to point out issues with the airport and where I think improvements should be made, however everyone seems to complain without understanding what they're complaining about and without any hints of a solution. Especially so at another airport further south of Shannon.

beefburrito

JCX BXC wrote: »

What is your basis for saying the Airbus (of which is only flying today, first of it's type in Ireland) is dangerously low flying? Is this not an extremely strong claim? Have you contacted the IAA with your concerns?

No but I'm more familiar with Shannon than you ever was, are now and ever will be.



I don't recall a time in recent history where Shannon was the hub of air traffic, Dublin was always bigger. Nostalgia?

You're completely wrong there, go back through the archives.

The Shannon region was a jewel in the crown of the Midwest.


What do you propose be done? Another sweetheart deal with Ryanair? Which will end in a few years, leaving the airport in an even worse position than it currently is? Perhaps we should break out of the open skies agreement and bring back the Shannon stopover, effectively destroying aviation in Ireland?

Your call not mine.

I'll be the first to point out issues with the airport and where I think improvements should be made, however everyone seems to complain without understanding what they're complaining about and without any hints of a solution. Especially so at another airport further south of Shannon.

I have no solution what so ever, because my post is a personal observation.

JCX BXC

beefburrito wrote: »

No but I'm more familiar with Shannon than you ever was, are now and ever will be.

Well that's just a cop out and debate shutting down comment, nevermind extremely petty. I think it's rather clear that this is not the case

You're completely wrong there, go back through the archives.

Other than possibly for a few years around when it was built, Dublin has always been far busier than Shannon. Yes Shannon had interesting transits like Aeroflot, but Dublin's traffic always triumphed.

I have no solution what so ever, because my post is a personal observation.

You half suggested the management needed (yet another) shakeup, which I would entirely disagree with. The current management seem to be perfectly adequate, the airports been separated from the DAA and has grown slightly since, as well as having subsequent shakeup. Eventually one realises management can only do so much, you cannot force airlines to fly to the airport.

Shannon today has over 13 scheduled flights, one of the quietest days of the winter. From tomorrow onwards it will become busier, gradually peaking around June/July. While 13 isn't significant, it's not too poor. As you can see above, movements and passenger numbers are on the up again, and the airports not doing particularly shabby. We still have some interesting transit traffic (such as the daily Kuwait and BA A318), and receive lots of other traffic, such as aircraft returning to lessor or flying to new leases, as well as coming in to use our busy maintenance services. It is also a very popular diversion airport.

You're not going to get back to the times of the early 90's the days of the transits and stopovers, as aircraft and political situations have both improved massively. It may be a pipe dream, but it's simply not realistic.

beefburrito

JCX BXC wrote: »

Well that's just a cop out and debate shutting down comment, nevermind extremely petty. I think it's rather clear that this is not the case



Other than possibly for a few years around when it was built, Dublin has always been far busier than Shannon. Yes Shannon had interesting transits like Aeroflot, but Dublin's traffic always triumphed.



You half suggested the management needed (yet another) shakeup, which I would entirely disagree with. The current management seem to be perfectly adequate, the airports been separated from the DAA and has grown slightly since, as well as having subsequent shakeup. Eventually one realises management can only do so much, you cannot force airlines to fly to the airport.

Shannon today has over 13 scheduled flights, one of the quietest days of the winter. From tomorrow onwards it will become busier, gradually peaking around June/July. While 13 isn't significant, it's not too poor. As you can see above, movements and passenger numbers are on the up again, and the airports not doing particularly shabby. We still have some interesting transit traffic (such as the daily Kuwait and BA A318), and receive lots of other traffic, such as aircraft returning to lessor or flying to new leases, as well as coming in to use our busy maintenance services. It is also a very popular diversion airport.

You're not going to get back to the times of the early 90's the days of the transits and stopovers, as aircraft and political situations have both improved massively. It may be a pipe dream, but it's simply not realistic.

Point taken.

Although it was good when it was going like clockwork.

Airport...Tourism...Local B&B's Guesthouses and hotel's...fishing was a huge attraction...historical sites..Pub's....road trip's...

Maybe it's the fact trends are changing.

I remember the angling potential alone was bringing in huge revenue which was well marketed during the 80's and 90's then it declined.

Shannon Development had a lot of offshoots..

JCX BXC

beefburrito wrote: »

Point taken.

Although it was good when it was going like clockwork.

Airport...Tourism...Local B&B's Guesthouses and hotel's...fishing was a huge attraction...historical sites..Pub's....road trip's...

Maybe it's the fact trends are changing.

I remember the angling potential alone was bringing in huge revenue which was well marketed during the 80's and 90's then it declined.

Shannon Development had a lot of offshoots..

Alot of the offshoots was due to American passengers effectively being forced into Shannon. It actually accustomed quite a bad name eventually as people were sick of being unnecessarily shuttled through the airport. While American numbers did fall off especially around 2010-2013, I've noticed a good increase in recent years, notiable certainly here in West Clare.

Shannon Development and Shannon airport are now under the same Semi-State company, is this a good idea or a bad idea? I don't know, but at least some synergy should be happening. They can benefit each other when investing in certain projects. One of my biggest gripes about the separation was the DAA taking Aer Rianta out of Shannon, it was an incredibly profitable and contributed alot to the local area.

Brennans Row

JCX BXC wrote: »

. . . . . One of my biggest gripes about the separation was the DAA taking Aer Rianta out of Shannon, it was an incredibly profitable and contributed alot to the local area.

You mean Aer Rianta International.

Shannon, Dublin and Cork were part of Aer Rianta.

Shannon set up and grew Aer Rianta international mainly for the Duty Free business world wide.

JCX BXC

Brennans Row wrote: »

You mean Aer Rianta International.

Shannon, Dublin and Cork were part of Aer Rianta.

Shannon set up and grew Aer Rianta international mainly for the Duty Free business world wide.

Yes I did mean Aer Rianta international. However Aer Rianta was renamed as the DAA many years ago so didn't think it necessary to put it's official title on an internet forum.

Brennans Row

Airbus A330-941neo training at Shannon today.

hobie14

I guess the aircraft being discussed was doing circuits as part of an Aer Lingus training session i.e. an A330 was around on Tuesday 13th March ....... it was no lower than 1350 ft in the circuit as far as I measured and under complete Shannon ATC control ...... I suppose the need for such training is a good sign ......
Personally I prefer seeing the private Boeing 747-800 that comes over for training from time to time ..... now that would certainly catch anyone's attention .....

Ps. How on earth did I say Air Lingus ...... oh well

JCX BXC

hobie14 wrote: »

I guess the aircraft being discussed was doing circuits as part of an Air Lingus training session i.e. an A330 was around on Tuesday 13th March ....... it was no lower than 1350 ft in the circuit as far as I measured and under complete Shannon ATC control

The A330-900 around on Tuesday was nothing to do with Aer Lingus.

Cookiemunster

hobie14 wrote: »

I guess the aircraft being discussed was doing circuits as part of an Air Lingus training session i.e. an A330 was around on Tuesday 13th March ....... it was no lower than 1350 ft in the circuit as far as I measured and under complete Shannon ATC control ...... I suppose the need for such training is a good sign ......
Personally I prefer seeing the private Boeing 747-800 that comes over for training from time to time ..... now that would certainly catch anyone's attention .....

There was an Aer Lingus A330 in late last week doing training, but Tuesday was one of Airbus' new A330 NEOs in from Toulouse to so some doing crosswind testing. Nothing to do with Aer Lingus.

JCX BXC

Reading back through the old threads in relation to when Shannon gained it's independence, and I found an interesting quote:

“We don’t intend to accept unsustainable growth with Ryanair. That was an issue in the past and we’re not going to go there again, we have to learn from the problems of the past."

Well, they went there and the obivous happened. Seems they've entered yet another FR deal, albeit at a smaller scale. Hopefully more sustainable, but the fact that LPL and BRS aren't operating through the winter isn't great.

On a note of interest, it looks like Shannon will, despite the cull of some services, grow a reasonable amount in passenger numbers again this year. A summary in the changes to services here:

Reductions

*Chicago (ORD) with United: Cut entirely
*Newark (EWR) with United: Cut from year round to March-October.
*Berlin (SXF) with Ryanair: Cut entirely
*Stockholm (ARN) with SAS: Cut entirely
*Zurich (ZRH) with Helvetic Airways: Season cut by around half, unsure of exact operations.
*New York (JFK) with Delta: Aircraft cut from 767 to 757.

Increases

*Toronto (YYZ) with Air Canada: NEW 3x weekly for summer from June.
*Reus (REU) with Ryanair: NEW 2x weekly for summer from April
*Bristol (BRS) with Ryanair: NEW 2x weekly for summer from May
*Liverpool (LPL) with Ryanair: NEW 3x weekly for summer from May
*Philadelphia (PHL) with American Airlines: Season increasing by a month, starting a month earlier.
*Stewart (SWF) with Norwegian: New for the first 7 months of 2018, and increasing to 3x weekly (from 2x weekly) from April.
*Providence (PVD) with Norwegian: New for first 7 months of 2018 and increasing to 4x weekly (from 2x weekly) from April.
*Manchester (MAN) with Ryanair: Increasing from 4x weekly to 6x weekly for Summer from May.

Aer Lingus' better timings and the daily birmingham which came into effect in March 2017 should help reduce the blow from the loss of Berlin for the first 3 months of this year.

NEW means that the route did not operate the previous year with that airline. I'm aware all of these new routes operated at some time in the past or operate currently, either under the same or another airline in the past or another airline currently.

Overall it looks the gains outdo the losses, hopefully more of it to come for 2019.

Also, I note Aer Lingus resumed JFK today.

RocketRaccoon

Just to clarify as fact.

There was an Aer Lingus a330 doing circuits on Tuesday lunchtime and it was very low.

There was an a330-900 in for training on Wednesday.

Shn99

JCX BXC wrote: »

Reading back through the old threads in relation to when Shannon gained it's independence, and I found an interesting quote:

“We don’t intend to accept unsustainable growth with Ryanair. That was an issue in the past and we’re not going to go there again, we have to learn from the problems of the past."

Well, they went there and the obivous happened. Seems they've entered yet another FR deal, albeit at a smaller scale. Hopefully more sustainable, but the fact that LPL and BRS aren't operating through the winter isn't great.

On a note of interest, it looks like Shannon will, despite the cull of some services, grow a reasonable amount in passenger numbers again this year. A summary in the changes to services here:

Reductions

*Chicago (ORD) with United: Cut entirely
*Newark (EWR) with United: Cut from year round to March-October.
*Berlin (SXF) with Ryanair: Cut entirely
*Stockholm (ARN) with SAS: Cut entirely
*Zurich (ZRH) with Helvetic Airways: Season cut by around half, unsure of exact operations.
*New York (JFK) with Delta: Aircraft cut from 767 to 757.

Increases

*Toronto (YYZ) with Air Canada: NEW 3x weekly for summer from June.
*Reus (REU) with Ryanair: NEW 2x weekly for summer from April
*Bristol (BRS) with Ryanair: NEW 2x weekly for summer from May
*Liverpool (LPL) with Ryanair: NEW 3x weekly for summer from May
*Philadelphia (PHL) with American Airlines: Season increasing by a month, starting a month earlier.
*Stewart (SWF) with Norwegian: New for the first 7 months of 2018, and increasing to 3x weekly (from 2x weekly) from April.
*Providence (PVD) with Norwegian: New for first 7 months of 2018 and increasing to 4x weekly (from 2x weekly) from April.
*Manchester (MAN) with Ryanair: Increasing from 4x weekly to 6x weekly for Summer from May.

Aer Lingus' better timings and the daily birmingham which came into effect in March 2017 should help reduce the blow from the loss of Berlin for the first 3 months of this year.

NEW means that the route did not operate the previous year with that airline. I'm aware all of these new routes operated at some time in the past or operate currently, either under the same or another airline in the past or another airline currently.

Overall it looks the gains outdo the losses, hopefully more of it to come for 2019.

Also, I note Aer Lingus resumed JFK today.

French charters also shelved for this summer

JCX BXC

Shn99 wrote: »

French charters also shelved for this summer

I'm not sure at what level they operated last year, since Air Méditerranée went under they've reduced significantly.

highlydebased

Travel Service did most of the French charters last year - CDG, Toulouse, Toulon etc.

Assume they'll just put these groups on a flight to DUB now and bring them down by bus. What a shame.

hobie14

Cookiemunster wrote: »

There was an Aer Lingus A330 in late last week doing training, but Tuesday was one of Airbus' new A330 NEOs in from Toulouse to so some doing crosswind testing. Nothing to do with Aer Lingus.

Thanks for that info .... the aircraft we saw was certainly flying in Aer Lingus colours .... now was it a 900? ..... not sure about that ....

hobie14

Brennans Row wrote: »

Airbus A330-941neo training at Shannon today.

$$$$$$ ...... I missed that

hobie14

RocketRaccoon wrote: »

Just to clarify as fact.

There was an Aer Lingus a330 doing circuits on Tuesday lunchtime and it was very low.

There was an a330-900 in for training on Wednesday.

Thanks for that .... we were operating close to Shannon on Tuesday and it indeed was Aer Lingus ...... was doing circuits right over us and have to say the guys really enjoyed it .. someone checked it on Fr24 I recall .......

Bit more info from a friend in Snn .... the Airbus A330 Neo was indeed in Shannon on Wednesday 14th March ..... painted in Airbus colours!

OfTheMarsWongs

hobie14 wrote: »

Thanks for that .... we were operating close to Shannon on Tuesday and it indeed was Aer Lingus ...... was doing circuits right over us and have to say the guys really enjoyed it .. someone checked it on Fr24 I recall .......

Bit more info from a friend in Snn .... the Airbus A330 Neo was indeed in Shannon on Wednesday 14th March ..... painted in Airbus colours!

Shannon Airport have pics on Twitter.

“The sky was blue around Shannon this morning with an @Airbus 330 NEO on test flight duty. #avgeeks #avgeek #airportlife #WingWednesday“

https://twitter.com/shannonairport/status/973938457864294401?s=21