What beer are we drinking this week, too?

drumswan

snowblind wrote: »

I agree that reviewing a beer and giving it a poor mark but not explaining that it was due to value is bad form. But once you lay out your reasons, ANY reasons are good enough, as it is a persons subjective opinion. Pretending that the flavour can be tasted without external factors contributing to it at all is much worse IMO

There are various loosely agreed standards for reviewing beer, local price is never included in them. How could anyone in different places compare opinions then? There is huge variance in the local price, and that debate should be kept separate from the actual quality of the beer IMO.

snowblind

drumswan wrote: »

There are various loosely agreed standards for reviewing beer, local price is never included in them. How could anyone in different places compare opinions then? There is huge variance in the local price, and that debate should be kept separate from the actual quality of the beer IMO.

Well I haven't agreed to such standards, are you talking about ratebeer for example? One reason I never started reviewing in a place like that is that I think it would suck my enjoyment out of beer drinking. I write on a discussion forum, where I can let the subjective and situational variances be apparent. Sometimes a beer just tastes better outside on a nice day. Imagine having to flex a bunch of facial muscles to try and not let that happen...

Lovely Bloke

Price doesn't affect taste, however, I expect a pricier beer to justify that price, and if I'm reviewing a beer that was relatively expensive that turned out to be a dud, I'd certainly mention that.

That price may be down to any number of factors, from malt content, rarer hops, distance traveled, tax, fancy bottle, whatever. To my mind, if I'm paying a premium price I expect a premium product.

Seaneh

snowblind wrote: »

Yep. And I'd expect a premium porter be full flavoured.

Like I wouldn't care about a gueuze being premium priced, they'll be mostly in the 5%-6% range anyways and good ones are special enough.

But like...there's an Anderson Valley Bourbon Barrel Stout similarly priced in the offies now. Sub-7% BA stout. Let me guess what it tastes like. A stout with quite a thin body and overpowering caramelly whiskey flavour? I'd be gladly proven wrong but I've been burned too many times. 200 Fathoms and Celebration have been the only successful Irish ones to me, for example.

I know a smoked porter ain't the same, but it still was quite thin bodied and didn't exactly shower me with complexity of flavour.

On the whiskey barrel stout theme, have you had the Goose Island Bourbon County? I think it's the best example of the style I've had so far.

The barrel aged celebration was just ridiculous though, amazing beer. Had it when it was released and again this christmas and it was just class with 2 years aging on it.

drumswan

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

That price may be down to any number of factors, from malt content, rarer hops, distance traveled, tax, fancy bottle, whatever. To my mind, if I'm paying a premium price I expect a premium product.

Alaskan Smoked Porter is a $6 bomber and produced as such. Holding it to different standards because of external local factors doesnt make any sense to me.

Im as interested in those factors as the next beer enthusiast, but they have nothing to do with the actual beer.

Price doesn't affect taste, however, I expect a pricier beer to justify that price

I not sure I follow. A beer is a beer, water, malt, hops and yeast mainly. It cant transform into something else to justify its pricetag depending on where its sold.

Would you say Westvleteren 12 tastes better, or that you have 'lower expectations' of it, when purchased direct from the Abbey for cheaper than when resold here? Of course not, so why does it work the other way around?

If a buy a pint of Punk IPA in Dublin on a Tuesday for 6.50 and another in Copenhagen on a Thursday for 8.50, is it a better beer in Dublin? No.

The poor gits in Scandinavia must hate beer if their expectations are based around pricetag.

Lovely Bloke

I don't buy Westy in Belgium, or BD in Scandinavia.

I buy beer in Dublin, in a few pubs and off licences that I frequent.

I base my purchasing habits on that, and I also base my "value for money" judgments on that baseline too.

For example. Westy 12 is what? approx €10-12 per bottle in Dublin, in most reasonably priced off licences. (based on €60 a brick, glasses included, McHugh's Artane, Summer 2012). So that's what I base my perception of that beer against. If I was in Belgium, and found it to be a euro a bottle, I'd buy 20 and bring them home thinking I'd gotten a bargain. I wouldn't buy it in Scandinavia for €60 per bottle. Does the beer change - nope, but in relation to other beers available in my locale.

If I go into an off-licence with €20 in my pocket I'm more than likely to buy 4 bottles of "average" priced beer (€3) plus something more expensive (€5+). I will definitely compare the prices of those beers when I am making a judgement on the quality of the beers. the quality of a beer, to me, is more than what it tastes like, it's down to how much pleasure it gives me for what I've paid for it - after all, I don't own a money tree, so I have to get up and go to work 5 days of the week to enable me to buy that beer, and there is a price v taste ratio that contributes to how much I enjoy the product. There are certain beers that I am willing to pay more for, and I do go back to them from time to time.

Other's that I've bought have been expensive, but I cannot justify paying that price for them, when a cheaper alternative is just as nice - in my mind the cheaper alternative is a better beer. It's cost me less to buy, it's cost the manufacturer less to get that beer to me.

snowblind

Seaneh wrote: »

On the whiskey barrel stout theme, have you had the Goose Island Bourbon County? I think it's the best example of the style I've had so far.

The barrel aged celebration was just ridiculous though, amazing beer. Had it when it was released and again this christmas and it was just class with 2 years aging on it.

Yep, Bourbon County is somewhat of a gold standard for me. Perfect example for when the caramel and whiskey notes are in harmony with the beer, same cannot be said about the O'Hara's and Franciscan Well offerings unfortunately. They are just cloying to me.

From BA ales, I would say that Founders Backwoods Bastard what Bourbon County does for stouts.

drumswan

snowblind wrote: »

Yep, Bourbon County is somewhat of a gold standard for me. Perfect example for when the caramel and whiskey notes are in harmony with the beer, same cannot be said about the O'Hara's and Franciscan Well offerings unfortunately.

On the other hand, the local ones are much cheaper, so they must be about even :P

snowblind

drumswan wrote: »

On the other hand, the local ones are much cheaper, so they must be about even :P

Nope. If there was a cheaper version that would be of the same quality, I would choose it over the other one any time.

I know you're being sarcastic, but still.

Let's say there are products A and B of the same style. Pricewise A = 2B

If A is clearly better than B, it has a distinctly different purpose for me. If I don't like B, I will never buy it, if it's still pretty good for its price, I might drink it on occasion and A on a SPECIAL occasion. If I write about these beers, I will mention this, because I find it is relevant in the geographical location I am. I do not expect someone in a different country to have the same parameters, or to agree with me.

If A and B are of similar quality or B is better, I will choose B every time. I will also mention this if I write or talk about the beer. I do not expect someone in a different country to have the same parameters, or to agree with me.

It is the power of language which can represent the different parameters, and a reader can then pick up on these and reflect their own situation to it. I would be much more suspicious of someone who appears to think their taste is objective or unaffected by anything outside 'taste'. Even a persons mood can have big effects on perception. I'm absolutely sure most people, including myself, will sometimes make the error of overestimating a more expensive beers quality, perhaps to justify the cost on an subconscious level.

drumswan

All very interesting. Is there a proviso for 'marking a beer up' for cheapness in this scheme?

If beer C is not as good but is significantly cheaper than both A & B will you drink that instead?

snowblind

drumswan wrote: »

All very interesting. Is there a proviso for 'marking a beer up' for cheapness in this scheme?

If beer C is not as good but is significantly cheaper than both A & B will you drink that instead?

The beers receive no mark. The system is unabashedly preferential and experiential and marks are delivered via language based sentence systems. Because If I was to pretend to be objective, scientific, whatever, I would have to do elaborate blind testings of all my beers but that would definitely take the fun out of drinking beer.

Sometimes I will drink cans of C (Bavaria), yes, as occasionally I feel like getting drunk but can't afford to be a snob about it!

Grayditch

I had the Kentucky Bourbon Barrel Stout. It was ok. The best part was the aftertaste that kicked in about 10 seconds after each sip.

Not a patch on Goose Island or Fransiscan Well, for me.

baron von something

About to tuck into a pack of brewdogs 'ipa is dead' which consists of:
comet
exp 366
amarillo
kohatu

Grayditch

Goose Island Christmas Ale, €1 out of date in Drinkstore. Gonna give it a go. Great beer when it's in date, that's for sure.

drumswan

Anchor Bigleaf Maple, cracking beer

adamski8

drumswan wrote: »

Anchor Bigleaf Maple, cracking beer

I really disliked the kind of sweetness it had

BaZmO*

adamski8 wrote: »

I really disliked the kind of sweetness it had

I wasn't much of a fan either. Didn't dislike though, just a bit underwhelmed by it.

adamski8

drumswan wrote: »

Anchor Bigleaf Maple, cracking beer

I really disliked the kind of sweetness it had

BaZmO*

Hey adamski8, what did you think of Anchor Bigleaf Maple?

Grayditch

Missus just gave me 6 Foam And Furys for my birthday, cause she says I talk some hilarious sh1te when I drink it.

I'll take that as a compliment and I'll take the beer

cunnifferous

Grayditch wrote: »

Missus just gave me 6 Foam And Furys for my birthday

Durty lady!

cunnifferous

Had some C No Evil from stone barrel on draft in the headline. Delicious IPA, they only seem to produce it occasionally, January was the last time I saw it. Hope they bottle it this time, much better than their flagship BOOM IPA which is pretty meh...

Ipso

Ballast Point's Big Eye IPA, lovely beer. Reminded me of Racer 5 and Lagunitas Maximus IPA.

quadrifoglio verde

Went to farringtons yesterday to try both founders porter and the Blacks/Beoir colab.
At first the bar man wasn't aware of the Beoir beer and told me it was out of stock since January :pac:, however I saw the tap and pointed to it. Lead to a very confused bar man.
What an amazing beer. Nice and hoppy and hides the 9% very well. Excellently balanced as well.
Its up there with OFAF, 200 fathoms and amberella for best Irish craft beer.
Blacks should look into making this a regular feature and if not, a very similar beer a regular feature.

Following that I had a founders Porter. Probably should have had it in isolation to the DIPA, or at least before hand, but still tasted mighty good.

Lovely Bloke

quadrifoglio verde wrote: »

Went to farringtons yesterday to try both founders porter and the Blacks/Beoir colab.
At first the bar man wasn't aware of the Beoir beer and told me it was out of stock since January :pac:, however I saw the tap and pointed to it. Lead to a very confused bar man.

This is the exact opposite experience to mine when I was in there on Sunday.

Got to the bar, barman asked me what I'd like

"A Beoir please"
"Thought so, sit down and I'll drop it over".

:cool:

baron von something

really enjoyed the exp 366 in brewdogs ipa is dead

drinking an odells 5 barrell pale ale.not bad

irish_goat

Great to hear Beoir#1 getting good reviews, really looking forward to getting my bottles now.

Heroditas

Had a Sabotage and Full Sail in Alfie Byrnes this evening.
First time having Sabotage on tap and it really is an amazing beer on tap, far superior than its bottled version.
Home now and tucking into an Einstok Pale Ale. Interesting.

Grayditch

Black's Kinsale Pale Ale. Bit disappointed in this, after their Black IPA being so nice. I don't really like it.

Grayditch

That €1 euro Goose Island Christmas Ale past it's date was too good to be true. All sugary and alcoholy...not in the way it's supposed to be.