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Australian Open 2014

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    #242
    Mousewar
    Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭Mousewar


    same old same old.
    Federer hit precisely one first serve in the breaker.


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    #243
    loveacca
    Registered Users Posts: 118 ✭✭loveacca


    Come on Roger


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    #244
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,750 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Unforced error count sky high for Federer: Unforced errors 24. Nadal at 15 or so. That's the difference.


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    #245
    Mousewar
    Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭Mousewar


    It's simply outrageous that Nadal is allowed to take this MTO right before his opponent's serve.


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    #246
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,750 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Mousewar wrote: »
    It's simply outrageous that Nadal is allowed to take this MTO right before his opponent's serve.

    Match Time Out?


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    #247
    Mousewar
    Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭Mousewar


    medical


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    #248
    Alfred Borden
    Registered Users Posts: 10,012 ✭✭✭✭Alfred Borden


    watching exactly what i thought would happen and its gutting as a massive federer fan. Anytime federer faces Nadal, his unforced errors count is massive, so no difference here.


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    #249
    John.Icy
    Registered Users Posts: 2,013 ✭✭✭John.Icy


    There'll be no Grand slam title for any Swiss player at this rate.


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    #250
    Pighead
    Registered Users Posts: 14,182 ✭✭✭✭Pighead


    Raf32 wrote: »
    watching exactly what i thought would happen and its gutting as a massive federer fan. Anytime federer faces Nadal, his unforced errors count is massive, so no difference here.
    In saying that Rafa is playing some absolutely incredible tennis. He is back to his very best and his unreal returning is forcing Fed to go for big first serves which is bringing his 1st serve percentage down.

    As someone said yesterday in here Rafa is looking really good to pass out Roger's slam record.


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    #251
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    over now unleess a miracle happens. Has Nadal EVER lot a GS match when 2 sets up? - I would guess not.


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    #252
    Alfred Borden
    Registered Users Posts: 10,012 ✭✭✭✭Alfred Borden


    Pighead wrote: »
    In saying that Rafa is playing some absolutely incredible tennis. He is back to his very best and his unreal returning is forcing Fed to go for big first serves which is bringing his 1st serve percentage down.

    As someone said yesterday in here Rafa is looking really good to pass out Roger's slam record.

    Yup totally agree with this,nadal forcing federer to be aggressive is never going to end well for federer and its showing. Nadal looks the same player from a few years ago again and no signs of slowing down, definitely think he can pass his slam tally out if he wins this tournament out. Gutting but Federer wont be adding any more slams to his list for Rafa to chase.


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    #253
    the_monkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,556 ✭✭✭the_monkey


    walshb wrote: »
    Nadal goes to 14 slams should he win this one. Great chance at breaking Roger's slam record.

    It's not about a "great chance" it's going to happen.

    14, he'll win AT LEAST another 3 French Opens, and then AT LEAST a few from the rest ... I reckon he'll win about 22,23 slams in his career.

    Fair play to him - pains me to say it


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    #254
    Mousewar
    Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭Mousewar


    Federer's unforced error count is always going to be higher than Nadal's, even if he was to win. No point referencing that. Nadal is a defensive moonballer. He just punts the ball back in court and waits for his opponent to make a mistake. So he rarely has a high UE count. The point will generally end with a Federer error or a Federer winner. If Federer wins the match, both those numbers are high. If he loses, the UE is high and the winners low.
    Of course, it's almost impossible to get your winners higher than your UEs against a defensive grinder like Nadal on the slowest courts the sport has seen in its history.


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    #255
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,750 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Mousewar wrote: »
    Federer's unforced error count is always going to be higher than Nadal's, even if he was to win. No point referencing that. Nadal is a defensive moonballer..

    The point is that it gives Nadal a lot of games. It's massively important to reference it. Doesn't matter what Nadal is doing. They are unforced errors. Federer's problem. I would say that the count is mostly higher when he meets Nadal, making the point even more pertinent.


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    #256
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,750 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    the_monkey wrote: »
    It's not about a "great chance" it's going to happen.

    14, he'll win AT LEAST another 3 French Opens, and then AT LEAST a few from the rest ... I reckon he'll win about 22,23 slams in his career.

    Fair play to him - pains me to say it

    Well, fatigue and injury and form are very important. 3 FO titles is probably a bit much. I would expect 2104 French title and maybe the US Open. Of course, Wimbledon is there for him, but I wouldn't be surprised if he failed at SW19. Novak's form will be instrumental in Nadals' fortunes.


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    #257
    Too Tough To Die
    Registered Users Posts: 2,056 ✭✭✭Too Tough To Die


    Yes, the better the opposition the more 'unforced' errors a player is likely to make. It's not rocket science.


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    #258
    Mousewar
    Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭Mousewar


    walshb wrote: »
    The point is that it gives Nadal a lot of games. It's massively important to reference it. Doesn't matter what Nadal is doing. They are unforced errors. Federer's problem. I would say that the count is mostly higher when he meets Nadal, making the point even more pertinent.

    It's higher because Nadal is defensive and just punts the ball back continuously. Against other players, they don't do that. They either miss themselves more or don't get to as many of federer's shots, both of which reduces Fed's overall UE count.
    And most of Fed's UEs against Nadal aren't UEs at all. They're the death rattle of a dying man who can't keep hitting the ball 30 times every rally and eventually just misses.


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    #259
    Alfred Borden
    Registered Users Posts: 10,012 ✭✭✭✭Alfred Borden


    The only hope that Nadal doesnt catch him is Djokovic getting back to his best imo.


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    #260
    Slashermcguirk
    Registered Users Posts: 1,980 ✭✭✭Slashermcguirk


    Where is djokovic when you need him. The only player who can stand up to nadal


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    #261
    the_monkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,556 ✭✭✭the_monkey


    Slashermcguirk wrote: »
    Where is djokovic when you need him. The only player who can stand up to nadal

    Unfortunately I think Djokovic has seen his best, I'm still saying he won't win another slam ...


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    #262
    John.Icy
    Registered Users Posts: 2,013 ✭✭✭John.Icy


    Nadal has the the best passing shot the sport will surely EVER see. Stunning.

    I don't really know how to feel. I'm used to it by now but I still just don't see how he can go from normal unforced error counts against everyone and against Nadal it's sky high. Must be 60 of them tonight? You can say it's the better player causing more errors but Murray is a good match for Nadal and there isn't 20 or more unforced errors between them.

    I do think Federers form is promising and he definitely has a good chance to keep beating Murray at the slams and I really think he could give Novak a game at Wimbledon (so long as he progresses through the rounds), but by god he hasn't a hope in hell if he meets Rafa in any slam.


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    #263
    Mousewar
    Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭Mousewar


    John.Icy wrote: »

    I don't really know how to feel. I'm used to it by now but I still just don't see how he can go from normal unforced error counts against everyone and against Nadal it's sky high. Must be 60 of them tonight? You can say it's the better player causing more errors but Murray is a good match for Nadal and there isn't 20 or more unforced errors between them.

    Again, if the ball keeps coming back at him because he's unable to hit winners past a defensive grinder like Nadal on slow courts then eventually he just misses.
    Against other players, he doesn't get to the point of hitting a so-called UE because the point is over, either through his winner or the opponent's error.


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    #264
    Rjd2
    Registered Users Posts: 12,021 ✭✭✭✭Rjd2


    John.Icy wrote: »

    I do think Federers form is promising and he definitely has a good chance to keep beating Murray at the slams and I really think he could give Novak a game at Wimbledon (so long as he progresses through the rounds), but by god he hasn't a hope in hell if he meets Rafa in any slam.

    Beating up a regressing tsonga and a player in Murray just coming back from an injury does not make a revival sadly. Totally outclassed tonight.


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    #265
    Pighead
    Registered Users Posts: 14,182 ✭✭✭✭Pighead


    Mousewar wrote: »
    Again, if the ball keeps coming back at him because he's unable to hit winners past a defensive grinder like Nadal on slow courts then eventually he just misses.
    Against other players, he doesn't get to the point of hitting a so-called UE because the point is over, either through his winner or the opponent's error.
    Think you're being a tad unfair on Nadal. He hit plenty of brilliant winners this morning. He hit that angled crosscourt forehand winner loads today. Obviously not as many winners as Roger but I doubt there was a whole lot between them.


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    #266
    Mousewar
    Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭Mousewar


    Pighead wrote: »
    Think you're being a tad unfair on Nadal. He hit plenty of brilliant winners this morning. He hit that angled crosscourt forehand winner loads today. Obviously not as many winners as Roger but I doubt there was a whole lot between them.

    Not usually winners in any kind of meaningful sense. The opponent has been rallying him for about 5 minutes at that stage. It's usually just a put away past a soul-destroyed opponent or one stranded at the net who's only there because he's desperately searching for some way to end the torture of playing this guy.

    He never takes the initiative - he just finishes off people already beating by his grinding.


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    #267
    Slashermcguirk
    Registered Users Posts: 1,980 ✭✭✭Slashermcguirk


    Djokovic will finish with 10 slam I reckon. At least another oz and us open or 2 and should win 1 French, too good on clay not to. Still the only player to beat nadal 3 times on clay and was so close at the French last year
    the_monkey wrote: »
    Unfortunately I think Djokovic has seen his best, I'm still saying he won't win another slam ...


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    #268
    John.Icy
    Registered Users Posts: 2,013 ✭✭✭John.Icy


    Rjd2 wrote: »
    Beating up a regressing tsonga and a player in Murray just coming back from an injury does not make a revival sadly. Totally outclassed tonight sadly.

    Take from it what you will I guess. At the end of the day people can make of it what they want, Federer totally outclassed Murray for 2 and a half sets who was still playing well and not suffering in the slightest till the 4th set. Federer looked a class act against Tsonga too who at the end of the day is a player who can beat the best.

    Last year Federer was losing to players of Tsonga's standard and lower. Everyone was doubting him against Tsonga, 95% of people here gave him no chance against Murray and he got through it. Yes he was outclassed in the 2nd two sets (a tiebreak is hardly being outclassed lets be honest), but there was no tactical structure (total mess) and the backhand was nowhere near as solid as it's been and Federer drove I don't know how many shots into the net in a position where the point was up for grabs. It'll probably never happen against Nadal at a slam because there is a script these GS matches between them follows and it's not going to change unless Federer has a mental reset. But form is there and he's definitely taken a step forward and if he stays fit, there'll be more semi-finals and possibly a Wimbledon final pending if he can avoid Nadal as long as possible in draws.


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    #269
    Pighead
    Registered Users Posts: 14,182 ✭✭✭✭Pighead


    Mousewar wrote: »
    Not usually winners in any kind of meaningful sense. The opponent has been rallying him for about 5 minutes at that stage. It's usually just a put away past a soul-destroyed opponent or one stranded at the net who's only there because he's desperately searching for some way to end the torture of playing this guy.

    He never takes the initiative - he just finishes off people already beating by his grinding.
    Absolute nonsense. You are severely underestimating Rafa's power and accuracy. A lot of his passing shots may look easy but that's because the shot prior has been put right in the corner leaving his opponent scrambling to get it back and being forced out of position. Also to claim Nadal is a 'defensive moonballer' is laughable.


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    #270
    Pighead
    Registered Users Posts: 14,182 ✭✭✭✭Pighead


    John.Icy wrote: »
    Take from it what you will I guess. At the end of the day people can make of it what they want, Federer totally outclassed Murray for 2 and a half sets who was still playing well and not suffering in the slightest till the 4th set. Federer looked a class act against Tsonga too who at the end of the day is a player who can beat the best.

    Last year Federer was losing to players of Tsonga's standard and lower.
    Think it's a bit early to say that Roger has improved this season. You say he was losing to players like Tsonga last year but he actually beat Tsonga in the quarters in the Aussie Open as well in 2013.

    He lost to Murray in the Semi's last year but I think most people will agree that Murray at 2014 Aussie Open is not quite the same Murray who played at 2013 Aussie Open.

    I'll be very surprised if Roger wins any Slams this year (or ever again) and any improvements that may occur this year will be miniscule and not really worth talking about. In saying that he should improve on last years slam results given he went out so early in Wimbledon and the US Open.


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    #271
    Mousewar
    Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭Mousewar


    Pighead wrote: »
    Also to claim Nadal is a 'defensive moonballer' is laughable.

    What sport have you been watching for the last nine years? I've seen this guy play live. His shots clear the net by about 4 or 5 feet. He grinds his opponents down with long rallies where he just concentrates on keeping the ball in play until they make a mistake, aided by slow slow slow courts.
    Not sure where the confusion is.


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