A Slow Journey to Faster Times

ThebitterLemon

Duanington wrote: »

I was only thinking about the mental aspect of racing last night ( trying to distract my brain from the freezing rain hopping off my face), I often read "I'm not in race shape" or "I'm not racing fit" and other such comments on the various logs I follow.
I wonder how often we actually convince ourselves that we aren't in the kind of shape that brings PBs when in truth, most people here would have spent years training and building up to a level that allows them to perform at their best....are we really to believe that we can undo those kind of lifestyle changes ( because lets be honest, for a lot of us on here - it isn't just a few runs a week, it is a genuine lifestyle change) in a matter of weeks?

I saw you on the final stretch in St Anne's, you looked very relaxed and didn't look like you were going into the red at all and yet you ran sub 19 minutes ( which I'm sure would have been a big deal a year ago, right?)

I'm convinced that there is an element of training our minds to run through barriers in what we do - call it effort, pain, whatever but its that thing when you are running the last kilometer in a race, thinking or perhaps accepting you are running as fast as you can and yet if you REALLY REALLY push it and force the issue, surprise, surprise...there's a bit more in the legs....it hurts but it's there.
Each time we breach that barrier - that feeling becomes familiar and a little less daunting to take on.
I wonder how many times we just resign ourselves to the fact that the fitness isn't there when in fact, the real issue is that we're just not mentally prepared to start running those barriers yet.

Anyway, I don't think you're as far away as you think - in fact, I would say you'd run a completely different race now with that session in the bag.

Onwards and upwards!

Auld lads like Meno and I are never in "race shape",

Don't think you need to overthink it or try and PB everything in sight this early in your cycle P. That was a great session

TbL

yaboya1

ThebitterLemon wrote: »

Auld lads like Meno and I are never in "race shape",

Don't think you need to overthink it or try and PB everything in sight this early in your cycle P. That was a great session

TbL

Thanks.
Let me know when you're making your visit to St Anne's.
I'll try and get down to help the lads with the red carpet .

dublin runner

menoscemo wrote: »

Paralysis by analysis surely?

jebuz wrote: »

Get into a club

I am caught in two minds whether to wade in with my opinion but as I have met you and have run with you I will throw my hat into the ring. I wasn't too sure if I should comment as I think there is a big risk of information overload.

Put simply, you are putting too much pressure on yourself. You are self-coached (right?), run the majority of your sessions solo (maybe all-not including easy/recovery runs), currently not in a club and are training by heart rate. That's a whole lot of responsibility placed on your shoulders and in my opinion, way too much.

Options:

1. Join a Club

If you can even make one session a month you will see the difference. Probably the best desicion you will make in terms of development. Asides from that it breaks up the week. All you have to do is turn up and let someone else worry about the session etc. (never mind the great social aspect!)


2. Get a coach/liaise with a person you trust

I really feel you should strongly consider this as it takes a lot of pressure and responsibility off your shoulders. Running is tough enough so let someone else help you.

---

I wouldn't place any heed on your recent results. You really shouldn't be running well at the moment, you have just completed two marathons and a very productive training block. Simple solution is take a break from racing and concentrate on getting strong (Jaysus, I sound like my coach now!). The time for running well is next year, not now.

paddybarry

I think you would improve out of all recognition if you joined a club. I would join tomorrow morning if circumstances allowed.

menoscemo

Can I just put my oar in and recommend you join Tallaght :pac:.
Don't let Raycun come along here and say otherwise , If you join his club you'll just want to move to a real club when you get really good.

RayCun

menoscemo wrote: »

Can I just put my oar in and recommend you join Tallaght :pac:.
Don't let Raycun come along here and say otherwise , If you join his club you'll just want to move to a real club when you get really good.

:pac:
I thought yaboya was a northsider?

I'll just point out that in the Tallaght/Bros Pearse smackdown at this year's Dublin marathon, it was Brothers Pearse that walked away with the medals...:)

menoscemo

RayCun wrote: »

:pac:
I thought yaboya was a northsider?

I'll just point out that in the Tallaght/Bros Pearse smackdown at this year's Dublin marathon, it was Brothers Pearse that walked away with the medals...:)

Why did I think Clondalkin??

Oh Come off it Ray, we have elite runners in our club (Sean Connolly, Thomas Fitzpatrick etc) as well as county XC Champions in the ladies. Your only decent ever runner went off to join DSD

BTW your auld lads only won a medal because some of our Auld lads refused to be classified as such, our really Auld lads (M50) won medals if you want to go down that line....

Netwerk Errer

dublin runner wrote: »

I am caught in two minds whether to wade in with my opinion but as I have met you and have run with you I will throw my hat into the ring. I wasn't too sure if I should comment as I think there is a big risk of information overload.

Put simply, you are putting too much pressure on yourself. You are self-coached (right?), run the majority of your sessions solo (maybe all-not including easy/recovery runs), currently not in a club and are training by heart rate. That's a whole lot of responsibility placed on your shoulders and in my opinion, way too much.

Options:

1. Join a Club

If you can even make one session a month you will see the difference. Probably the best desicion you will make in terms of development. Asides from that it breaks up the week. All you have to do is turn up and let someone else worry about the session etc. (never mind the great social aspect!)


2. Get a coach/liaise with a person you trust

I really feel you should strongly consider this as it takes a lot of pressure and responsibility off your shoulders. Running is tough enough so let someone else help you.

---

I wouldn't place any heed on your recent results. You really shouldn't be running well at the moment, you have just completed two marathons and a very productive training block. Simple solution is take a break from racing and concentrate on getting strong (Jaysus, I sound like my coach now!). The time for running well is next year, not now.

+1. DR to the rescue!

RayCun

watch this space meno

yaboya1

Cheers for all the advice lads.
Seems like I might have to make some sort of New Year resolutions.

menoscemo wrote: »

Can I just put my oar in and recommend you join Tallaght :pac:.
Don't let Raycun come along here and say otherwise , If you join his club you'll just want to move to a real club when you get really good.

RayCun wrote: »

:pac:
I thought yaboya was a northsider?

I'll just point out that in the Tallaght/Bros Pearse smackdown at this year's Dublin marathon, it was Brothers Pearse that walked away with the medals...:)

menoscemo wrote: »

Why did I think Clondalkin??

I am (a bousy (ask Dubgal72)) from Clondalkin, but I'm living near the City Centre atm (northside :P)

RayCun

seriously, what you want is a club where you can get to the training sessions that interest you, with a group of runners just a little bit better than you. You're not going to be training with Thomas Fitzpatrick in Tallaght, or Sergiu Ciobanu in Clonliffe, and you don't want to be - no point in going on a tempo run with people who'll burn you off after a minute. But most clubs will have a fair range of midpackers, and most of them will be thinking about distance races, so you have lots to choose from

ger664

menoscemo wrote: »

Paralysis by analysis surely?

HADD training which yaboya1 is using is primarily done by HR. Whats the point in wearing/training with one if you are not going to look/compare the results. I agree don't get hung up on them but low end HR looked wrong.

yaboya1 wrote: »

I did wait for the HR to come back down to around 120bpm before I started the first interval, but maybe I shouldn't have done the strides?

Strides could well explain the slow pace/hr @ 130 and the warmup was long as well so maybe body was still in recovery from this during the first set of 2400's. Looking at that steady pace for HADD is probably 145 if you continue to train that way.

As others have said joining a club would be hugely beneficial to you as well as whatever club manages to secure your signature :rolleyes:

yaboya1

RayCun wrote: »

seriously, what you want is a club where you can get to the training sessions that interest you, with a group of runners just a little bit better than you. You're not going to be training with Thomas Fitzpatrick in Tallaght, or Sergiu Ciobanu in Clonliffe, and you don't want to be - no point in going on a tempo run with people who'll burn you off after a minute. But most clubs will have a fair range of midpackers, and most of them will be thinking about distance races, so you have lots to choose from

Just as a matter of interest, would Thomas Fitzpatrick be around my age (33) and did he used to run X-Country at school?
I remember seeing him at the Enniscorthy 10k and he looks very like the guy who used to streak off alone into the distance while we were battling it out for a top ten finish in my brief X-Country career :P

RayCun

just turned 33

menoscemo

yaboya1 wrote: »

Just as a matter of interest, would Thomas Fitzpatrick be around my age (33) and did he used to run X-Country at school?
I remember seeing him at the Enniscorthy 10k and he looks very like the guy who used to streak off alone into the distance while we were battling it out for a top ten finish in my brief X-Country career :P

I'd say that's probably him alright.

yaboya1

Wednesday 17th December - 105 minutes Easy
12.45 miles @ 8:26min/mile average (133bpm avg)

No real plan tonight. Just hit the road for some easy miles and decided to keep going. Kept the HR pretty even all the way, apart from the odd spike/trough due to hills & drops. They explain the skewed splits in some of the miles. Feel great now


Splits:

Mile 1 - 8:12
Mile 2 - 8:01
Mile 3 - 8:18
Mile 4 - 8:30
Mile 5 - 8:59
Mile 6 - 8:58
Mile 7 - 8:37
Mile 8 - 8:21
Mile 9 - 8:30
Mile 10 - 8:15
Mile 11 - 8:08
Mile 12 - 8:12
0.45 - 4:02

yaboya1

Thursday 18th December - 45 minutes Easy
5.14 miles @ 8:45min/mile average (133bpm avg)

Stayed away from the coast to try and avoid the hellish gale that's blowing outside. Unfortunately that was impossible no matter how far inland you went. Glad to have this done early in the day as I've a lot on later and may not have got out otherwise.


Splits:

Mile 1 - 8:26
Mile 2 - 9:02
Mile 3 - 8:52
Mile 4 - 8:39
Mile 5 - 8:44
0.14 - 1:20

yaboya1

Friday 19th December - 75 minutes Easy
8.57 miles @ 8:46min/mile average (136bpm avg)

Didn't get out for this until mid afternoon thanks to a major hangover. Knew from previous experience I'd feel much better after it, so headed out as soon as I had stopped feeling sorry for myself. A nice fresh breeze in my face from every direction was just what I needed. And guess what? I'm cured! :pac:


Splits:

Mile 1 - 8:36
Mile 2 - 8:29
Mile 3 - 8:29
Mile 4 - 9:03
Mile 5 - 9:22
Mile 6 - 8:44
Mile 7 - 8:39
Mile 8 - 8:52
0.57 - 4:49

yaboya1

Saturday 20th December - 60 minutes Easy
7.2 miles @ 8:20min/mile average (129bpm avg)

As soon as I got in from work tonight I headed straight back out the door, as I felt it would be a sin not to get a few miles done in the perfect conditions outside. For a change I wore the new HRM that Garmin had sent me, just to test it out. I felt I was making the same effort as the other night (130-135bpm), but the Garmin was hanging around 115-120 for the first couple of miles. It was about three miles before I even hit a high of 130, so it seems this one may be as reliable as the last one! Anyway I kept the effort easy, so no harm done. I'll go back to the Polar again for my next run.


Splits:

Mile 1 - 8:36
Mile 2 - 8:18
Mile 3 - 8:21
Mile 4 - 8:22
Mile 5 - 8:23
Mile 6 - 8:16
Mile 7 - 8:04
0.2 - 1:42

Murph_D

New HRM - glad you finally got a result there. Do you wet the contacts before you put it on? Could try both at the same time and see how they compare!

yaboya1

Murph_D wrote: »

New HRM - glad you finally got a result there. Do you wet the contacts before you put it on? Could try both at the same time and see how they compare!

Yeah after about a month of nagging :P
I wet them both before I get going. It wasn't as if it was hitting spikes & troughs though. It's like the Garmin gives a reading about 10bpm lower for some reason. I'm normally hovering around 130bpm, but was hovering around 120 for ages tonight. I might try them both for an experiment, but tbh I hate wearing one as it is. Two would be a right pain :O

yaboya1

Monday 22nd December - 75 minutes Steady
9m @ 8:20p/m average (146bpm avg)

I would have rathered do this on a much less windy day, but I live in Dublin and can't run at all tomorrow. So I decided to just grin and bear it. This session proves to me that I've pretty much already 'mastered' 145bpm and that I can probably go straight back to 150bpm for these sessions which is where I left off in the summer. The pace variation in some of the miles is completely down to the wind. No other reason. The 8th steady mile proves this with a similar split to the earlier ones, as I had shelter from the wind there again before it hit me head on again for the final split. My HR actually hit it's peaks during miles 6 & 7, the two slowest miles. I'll probably go easy on myself and stick to 145bpm for my Christmas morning Steady session (to be sure), and then get back to 150bpm starting from next week.


Splits:

Warm up mile - 8:19 (135bpm)

Mile 1 - 7:58
Mile 2 - 8:15
Mile 3 - 8:03
Mile 4 - 7:56
Mile 5 - 8:09
Mile 6 - 8:53
Mile 7 - 8:42
Mile 8 - 8:06
Mile 9 - 8:36

1 mile cool down - 9:05 (139bpm)

yaboya1

Tuesday 23rd December - 60 minutes Easy
7.28 miles @ 8:14min/mile average (133bpm avg)

What a difference a day no wind makes!
This run is almost identical to last Saturday's, but the splits are slightly quicker than yesterday's steady session despite the much lower HR. Shows you how much the wind can affect your effort levels. Delighted to get this in as I had no expectations of running at all today, so an hour was a real bonus. Lovely out there. I was too warm in sleeves at 9pm.


Splits:

Mile 1 - 8:09
Mile 2 - 8:29
Mile 3 - 8:19
Mile 4 - 7:57
Mile 5 - 8:21
Mile 6 - 8:12
Mile 7 - 8:10
0.28 - 2:25

yaboya1

Thursday 25th December - 75 minutes Steady
10m @ 7:33p/m average (146bpm avg)

I meant to get some easy miles in yesterday but with everything that was going on, it just never happened. Anyway, that left me fresh for another Steady session this morning. I got results far more like I was expecting this time. Some small variances due to hills/drops, wind behind/against but mostly a fairly steady HR and consistent splits. This convinces me of what I already suspected and I'll move up to 150bpm for my next Steady session. The next few days could be a complete write off for me, but I'm not going to worry about it since my goal race is not until the end of April :P

Happy Christmas to All!


Splits:

Warm up mile - 7:29 (135bpm)

Mile 1 - 7:05
Mile 2 - 7:29
Mile 3 - 7:42
Mile 4 - 7:29
Mile 5 - 7:32
Mile 6 - 7:41
Mile 7 - 7:33
Mile 8 - 7:48
Mile 9 - 7:37
Mile 10 -7:34

Cool down mile - 8:30 (139bpm)


p.s. Wtf is this Kilkeel/Crossmaglen Running about when you upload to Garmin Connect? I've never been to either??

Pacing Mule

yaboya1 wrote: »

Thursday 25th December - 75 minutes Steady
10m @ 7:33p/m average (146bpm avg)

I meant to get some easy miles in yesterday but with everything that was going on, it just never happened. Anyway, that left me fresh for another Steady session this morning. I got results far more like I was expecting this time. Some small variances due to hills/drops, wind behind/against but mostly a fairly steady HR and consistent splits. This convinces me of what I already suspected and I'll move up to 150bpm for my next Steady session. The next few days could be a complete write off for me, but I'm not going to worry about it since my goal race is not until the end of April :P

Happy Christmas to All!


Splits:

Warm up mile - 7:29 (135bpm)

Mile 1 - 7:05
Mile 2 - 7:29
Mile 3 - 7:42
Mile 4 - 7:29
Mile 5 - 7:32
Mile 6 - 7:41
Mile 7 - 7:33
Mile 8 - 7:48
Mile 9 - 7:37
Mile 10 -7:34

Cool down mile - 8:30 (139bpm)


p.s. Wtf is this Kilkeel/Crossmaglen Running about when you upload to Garmin Connect? I've never been to either??

Either have I but I've been running there all week too.

laura_ac3

I think all of boards have done all their training in kilkee for the last week.

Calvin Johnson

Happy Christmas

yaboya1

Friday 26th December - 60 minutes Easy
7 miles @ 8:37min/mile average (135bpm avg)

A horrible morning out there today. Still not bad for running, but dreary and depressing to look at. A stark contrast to yesterday's blue sky & cool, crisp, conditions. Managed to sweat off some of the Christmas Day excesses. Now it's time for some more and to lose win a fortune on the horses.....


Splits:

Mile 1 - 7:55
Mile 2 - 8:34
Mile 3 - 8:41
Mile 4 - 7:37
Mile 5 - 8:54
Mile 6 - 8:59
Mile 7 - 8:36

Itziger

yaboya1 wrote: »

Friday 26th December - 60 minutes Easy
7 miles @ 8:37min/mile average (135bpm avg)

A horrible morning out there today. Still not bad for running, but dreary and depressing to look at. A stark contrast to yesterday's blue sky & cool, crisp, conditions. Managed to sweat off some of the Christmas Day excesses. Now it's time for some more and to lose win a fortune on the horses.....


Splits:

Mile 1 - 7:55
Mile 2 - 8:34
Mile 3 - 8:41
Mile 4 - 7:37
Mile 5 - 8:54
Mile 6 - 8:59
Mile 7 - 8:36

Who do you fancy today Yaboya? Was thinking Dynaste e/w (I know it's not a bank breaker).

yaboya1

Itziger wrote: »

Who do you fancy today Yaboya? Was thinking Dynaste e/w (I know it's not a bank breaker).

Only seeing this now. Would have advised Dynaste at the prices too tbh, but I knew he'd struggle to beat the fav considering their head to head record.