9/11 anniversary, where were you when it happened and was it a conspiracy?

Karl Stein

Vomit wrote: »

The questions start when the laws of physics go out the window, and kind of snowball from there. But maybe you're right andg nobody in history ever conspires to deceive anyone, ever.

There are loads of conspiracies that proved to be true - the idea that a group of evil men planned the collapse of any of those towers by sneaking explosives into the buildings and managed to keep it secret

simply

doesn't

stand

to

reason.

Vomit

The non-conspiracy side seem less cerebral, less informed, less critically minded and more joky than the conspiracy side. Or maybe they fear ridicule if they admit that they don't buy the official story. That's ok...being ball-less isn't a criminal offence.

o1s1n

Vomit wrote: »

That question is secondary, because the video evidence shows that it did indeed happen. Even if you focus soley on WTC 7's collapse and Larry Silverstein's slip of the tongue, and subsequent lies when questioned about it, you have to admit conspiracy.

Really? Do you have video evidence of people planting explosives in the buildings?

That's amazing, you really should share that as it would put a lot of debate to rest.

Vomit

Charlie Rock wrote: »

There are loads of conspiracies that proved to be true - the idea that a group of evil men planned the collapse of any of those towers by sneaking explosives into the buildings and managed to keep it secret

simply

doesn't

stand

to

reason.

Why not? Because you can't imagine it happening? It's a funny world we live in...

paddy147

o1s1n wrote: »

So then how did a huge number of people plant a huge number of explosives in an extremely busy office and landmark without anyone noticing?

And how come not a single person involved in this huge exercise 'broke' and spilled the beans?

Because it didn't happen.

When they had to replace all the old coatings on the buildings inner steelwork and steel structure and respray a new fire coating on all the steelwork/steel structure.

That cost Silverstein ALOT of money to have done.:pac::pac:


It could possibly have happened that way.

o1s1n

Vomit wrote: »

The non-conspiracy side seem less cerebral, less informed, less critically minded and more joky than the conspiracy side. Or maybe they fear ridicule if they admit that they don't buy the official story. That's ok...being ball-less isn't a criminal offence.

Hah! I love the way conspiracy nuts pop a gasket and start getting all abusive and emotional when folks point out the errors in their wild fantasies - very entertaining

o1s1n

paddy147 wrote: »

When they had to replace all the old coatings on the buildings inner steelwork and steel structure and respray a new fire coating on all the steelwork/steel structure.

That cost Silverstein ALOT of money to have done.:pac::pac:


It could possibly have happened that way.

Okay - so on to the second part, how did they manage to put a crew together big enough to work on the largest controlled explosion of a building to ever take place, yet none of them leaked info about what had happened?

Was the demolition crew made up entirely of conspirators? I have to tip my hat to them for getting their hands so dirty :pac:

of course it wasnt a conspiricy.

are you beng sarcastic op????

( oh and just so you know i had 1 relation working inside the twin towers ( and as working there years ago when the first bomb hit)

i also had another 2 cousins working in the NYPD, who all lost friends and work co workers.
no it wasnt a conspiricy, of course it wasnt.

bilston

Vomit wrote: »

That question is secondary, because the video evidence shows that it did indeed happen. Even if you focus soley on WTC 7's collapse and Larry Silverstein's slip of the tongue, and subsequent lies when questioned about it, you have to admit conspiracy.

You really don't

paddy147

o1s1n wrote: »

Okay - so on to the second part, how did they manage to put a crew together big enough to work on the largest controlled explosion of a building to ever take place, yet none of them leaked info about what had happened?

Was the demolition crew made up entirely of conspirators? I have to tip my hat to them for getting their hands so dirty :pac:

CIA/FBI...who knows...thats the thing.

Nobody really knows or even will know.


Oh and Im not one of those "nuts" that you refer to above.


I dont know what really happened and never will either.

Vomit

o1s1n wrote: »

Hah! I love the way conspiracy nuts pop a gasket and start getting all abusive and emotional when folks point out the errors in their wild fantasies - very entertaining

Oh I've lost count of all the errors you've managed to point out! You should be proud of yourself!

Karl Stein

Vomit wrote: »

The non-conspiracy side....

Conspiracies do happen. Denying that would be as equally unreasonable as thinking that people sneaked explosives into the any of the WTC buildings and synchronized detonation with a bunch of Saudi Yahoos flying jet-liners into them.

WTF am I doing in this rabbit hole?

I'm outa here. Enjoy.

leahyl

I was in school so didn't hear about it till I got home. My brother was watching it on tv and my mum came into the room and said "what film's that?" And he says "it isn't a film, that's live TV"

MRnotlob606

yes bush was nuts but i dont think he would do anything like that

RobertKK

I had a holiday booked for NY that month.

I was eating spaghetti bolognese with Sky news on, and the first tower with smoke pumping from it, then saw the second plane and wondered why it was flying so close, then shock...
Knew it was a terrorist attack, then thought of my holiday and how I was heading there and had been planning to go to the top of the WTC.
Then wondered if I was trapped... as people jumped to their death, what would I have done, jumped to my death or burn to death, not knowing the buildings would collapse.
I saw it first hand less than two weeks after, the smell of burning steel and concrete. There was still some vehicles near by that still had the dust on them. Lots of police in what was the biggest tourist attraction as most tourist things were still closed and firemen like ants with hoses spraying rumble many many storeys high.

There are a lot of conspiracies, but whatever, it was a human tragedy, where people went to work, were murdered, and for families, some never even got a body part to bury.

theGEM

I was one of the lads who planted the demolition charges in the twin towers. Went over on a J1 and spent the whole summer at it.

Busted Flat.

RobertKK wrote: »

I had a holiday booked for NY that month.

I was eating spaghetti bolognese with Sky news on, and the first tower with smoke pumping from it, then saw the second plane and wondered why it was flying so close, then shock...
Knew it was a terrorist attack, then thought of my holiday and how I was heading there and had been planning to go to the top of the WTC.
Then wondered if I was trapped... as people jumped to their death, what would I have done, jumped to my death or burn to death, not knowing the buildings would collapse.
I saw it first hand less than two weeks after, the smell of burning steel and concrete. There was still some vehicles near by that still had the dust on them. Lots of police in what was the biggest tourist attraction as most tourist things were still closed and firemen like ants with hoses spraying rumble many many storeys high.

There are a lot of conspiracies, but whatever, it was a human tragedy, where people went to work, were murdered, and for families, some never even got a body part to bury.

Am I missing something ?, burning steel and concrete ?????.

Hulk Hands

Charlie Rock wrote: »

Are people so fucking dumb that they believe the huge logistical exercise it is to bring down a building by controlled explosion could be done surreptitiously and without someone spilling the beans?

People's stupidity is more frightening than terrorism.

Does an office fire melting steel for the first time in history sound more plausible to you? Melting steel causing the collapse, yet the building still managed to fall at free fall speed? How does that work exactly?

I would call believing the exact official line is much more stupid than the believing the full blown conspiracy theory. There was almost certainly intelligence cock up's that we haven't been told about, ways this could have been prevented that haven't been brought to light. That alone would count as a conspiracy being proved correct, information the public should know that's being kept from them. People have different beliefs into how far the deception went, but that's their opinion and calling people idiotic for beliefs on something we don't truly know the facts of is idiotic itself. We still haven't had an independent report on this, and while some of the extreme theories are unlikely, the whole event has been so poorly explained to the public thus far that you can't blame people for questioning everything.

take everything

Last year of college. Started back earlier than other students (because of my course) and remember being alone for about a month in my college accomodation. Kinda eerie because all i can remember was wall-to-wall coverage of it on TV and in the papers for weeks on end.
Strange time.

theGEM

Hulk Hands wrote: »

Does an office fire melting steel for the first time in history sound more plausible to you? Melting steel causing the collapse, yet the building still managed to fall at free fall speed? How does that work exactly?

I would call believing the exact official line is much more stupid than the believing the full blown conspiracy theory. There was almost certainly intelligence cock up's that we haven't been told about, ways this could have been prevented that haven't been brought to light. That alone would count as a conspiracy being proved correct, information the public should know that's being kept from them. People have different beliefs into how far the deception went, but that's their opinion and calling people idiotic for beliefs on something we don't truly know the facts of is idiotic itself. We still haven't had an independent report on this, and while some of the extreme theories are unlikely, the whole event has been so poorly explained to the public thus far that you can't blame people for questioning everything.

Go to the engineering departments in UCD or Trinity and ask your questions to the structural engineering professors. Too many people ready to believe horse**** spouted by fcuking morons. Go read the NIST report.

Karl Stein

Hulk Hands wrote: »

Does an office fire melting steel for the first time in history sound more plausible to you? Melting steel causing the collapse, yet the building still managed to fall at free fall speed? How does that work exactly?

It didn't melt the steel it softened it causing it to lose its rigidity which is perfectly plausible.

Let's turn this on its head. Do you really believe there were evil men there who were able to detonate explosives (that nobody had noticed being placed in the buildings and nobody came forward to tell the American people a great crime had been committed by their government) exactly where the aircraft impacted?

Really? Really?

Happyman42

I was there about a month after when George Bush came to visit Ground Zero, he came right up to me and shook my hand.
'Where are you from', says George
'Ireland', says I
'Oh', says George, 'what state is that in?
'About the same as here', says I.

DamagedTrax

i was on the sick from work and watching the 2nd plane hit over an afternoon coffee and a smoke.


... and building 7 just fell over too?

Really? Really?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWorDrTC0Qg

i'll not make any scientific claims but thats not how i expect fire damaged buildings to fall. and all 3 falling into what was basically their own footprint? coincidences happen all the time but i cant swallow that in this instance.

Hulk Hands

Charlie Rock wrote: »

It didn't melt the steel it softened it causing it to lose its rigidity which is perfectly plausible.

Let's turn this on its head. Do you really believe there were evil men there who were able to detonate explosives (that nobody had noticed being placed in the buildings and nobody came forward to tell the American people a great crime had been committed by their government) exactly where the aircraft impacted?

Really? Really?

No at this stage I believe terrorists flew planes into two buildings causing their collapse. I believe there's more than meets the eye regarding the WTC7 collapse, and would like a through independent report carried out into the biggest event in modern history.

Karl Stein

The tragic thing about the whole 'darn gubberment done it' movement is that it distracts energy away from discussing motives for the attacks.

If the motives get discussed it opens up a debate about US foreign policy and whether it serves the interests of the average American or not (not imo).

In the aftermath of 9/11 there was plenty of discussion on 'the who' (Saudis, Al Q) and 'the how' (hijacked planes, box cutters, flight training) but nothing on the why. The CTers aid in diverting discussion from the 'why' question and that does nothing but divert attention away from nasty side of US (and western) foreign policy in a volatile region.

gidget

I was in work in a Tour Operators at the time, only 3 months in the job! Busy working away at a desk with 4 other girls & one of my colleagues walks past ever so casually saying a plane's crashed into the WTC. All the managers gathered around the only tv in the office while the rest of us were left working. Our colleague kept us updated on what was happening as he was sitting near the managers office. Didn't get out of work till 5.30 that day & can remember travelling home on a bus with about 3 people on board, everyone in silence the whole way. Walked in the door at 6pm that evening & saw for the first time everything that had happened. Sat with my family for the rest of the night just watching the replays & trying to take in everything that happened & the sadness at the huge loss of lives.
Actually got made redundant from my job a month later, as business took a nosedive as a result of people cancelling flights/holidays.

brummytom

I was at the swimming baths with school. Teaching assistant was in the foyer listening to the radio, came in and whispered to our teacher. They made us swim to the shallow end and say a Hail Mary.


No, I don't think it was a conspiracy. Some of the theories I find somewhat plausible though, like United 93 being shot down before it hit the White House. I don't believe it for definite though.

paddy147

DamagedTrax wrote: »

i was on the sick from work and watching the 2nd plane hit over an afternoon coffee and a smoke.


... and building 7 just fell over too?

Really? Really?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWorDrTC0Qg

i'll not make any scientific claims but thats not how i expect fire damaged buildings to fall. and all 3 falling into what was basically their own footprint? coincidences happen all the time but i cant swallow that in this instance.

Every building that fell or was "pulled" meant that Larry Silversteins bank account rose up alot...:pac::pac:

kryogen

I had just gotten suspended from school, walked in the door and didn't get asked why I was there for the best part of two hours Id say!

Glued to the tv, I do think at best there was extreme negligence, and at worst, a part in it from the American side to give themselves the push necessary to fulfil their goals, internationally.

Edit: Building 7 really needs to be fully investigated btw

RobertKK

Busted Flat. wrote: »

Am I missing something ?, burning steel and concrete ?????.

It burned for over three months, you could smell the steel burning. Steel and concrete fused together from the intense heat was found in the rubble.