Chevy Spark EV 90 miles range @100 kph

Joe 90

Joe 90 wrote: »

Of course the EV brigade totally ignore the inefficiencies in the power station, the transmission and the charging systems. They only talk about the efficiency of the electric motor.:)

I don't ignore it, but electric cars they still make much better use of fuel than petrol or diesel.

To be honest when the time comes and I can get an ev I'll certainly appreciate the low cost of driving. 50 Euro's would be around 2400 miles of electric driving !

thecomedian

[Deleted User] wrote: »

See the thing me getting 60-64 mpg is normal now to me and the hybrid driving is 2nd nature to me now I don't really think about it.

In fact not that many diesel automatics can get 64 mpg either never mind manual diesels.

But you could argue that if you drove them as the do when they test them you could get 60+ also.
Just saying its better to compare normal with normal.

As I said before the EVs won't be taken seriously until the range does 250 miles or so.

Sesshoumaru

What's this thread currently about? :pac:

Ah at last An EV driver to rescue me.

Help !

thecomedian

thecomedian wrote: »

But you could argue that if you drove them as the do when they test them you could get 60+ also.
Just saying its better to compare normal with normal.

As I said before the EVs won't be taken seriously until the range does 250 miles or so.

E'V's won't be taken seriously enough as long as they can pay for petrol and diesel ! that's the reality, more than anything.

Because even though when I tell people 50 Euro's is the same as 2100 or so miles ev driving they simply don't care because they can afford to pay for fuel. I ask when would you consider one and they say when i can't afford to drive a normal car, this is the most common answer I get, range being 2nd, it's not just the range it's how will I charge.

thecomedian

[Deleted User] wrote: »

E'V's won't be taken seriously enough as long as they can pay for petrol and diesel ! that's the reality, more than anything.

Because even though when I tell people 50 Euro's is the same as 2100 or so miles ev driving they simply don't care because they can afford to pay for fuel. I ask when would you consider one and they say when i can't afford to drive a normal car, this is the most common answer I get, range being 2nd, it's not just the range it's how will I charge.

I considered it to my wife, when I mentioned the range it put her off.

galwaytt

galwaytt wrote: »

by which I mean, where does the heat to heat the the battery come from, magically. Er...the battery...?...that'll be the.........same........battery is it ? IOW, the battery creates heat.........to heat itself.

It comes from the gridr, obviously, the current heater in the battery in the Leaf to protect from battery freezing to prevent loss of power on 2012+ models consumes 300 watts, it comes on at -10 Deg C That's hardly going to amount to much.

Active thermal management is different, I've no data on what the battery heater consumes in the Spark EV, I£ etc but I don't think it would be much.

Some leaf owners say that charging warms up the battery but I don't know if that's enough to increase range a lot ?

[/QUOTE]

By the way a car heater uses waste heat form a very inefficient engine that is sucking a lot of money out of your wallet.

Sesshoumaru

Deleted User wrote: »

Ah at last An EV driver to rescue me.

Help !

I really love my electric car. I can't imagine changing it any time soon! I highly recommend them for non-motorhead people who just want to get from A to B everyday. Those type of people are also the ones who probably wouldn't post on a motoring forum... So I think you're swimming up a waterfall here

That said, I do find myself thinking a lot about the Model S recently. With 3 kids, I love the idea of the seats in the boot for that extra little bit of space. I like gadgets and the 17" touch screen computer looks sweet, Google Maps navigation, web browser etc. The power, performance and range is nice as well. Sadly I can't afford one, but I think it could be the car to convert some motorheads.

Sesshoumaru

thecomedian wrote: »

I considered it to my wife, when I mentioned the range it put her off.

My wife and I sat down in front of Google Maps one night in 2011. We made a list of journeys we regularly make and just started mapping them and getting the distance traveled. We were surprised to find a single charge would suffice for the vast majority of days. It's still our only car and no regrets from either of us.

thecomedian

thecomedian wrote: »

I considered it to my wife, when I mentioned the range it put her off.

Yes but that's mainly because you can keep fuelling a normal car, the range being inconvenient or something she isn't willing to over come or even investigate because ye can afford petrol and diesel. Big difference.

She may not even be aware of the fast charge infrastructure already in place. And my guess is she doesn't care or about how long it takes to charge.

Sesshoumaru

http://www.joeduffybmw.ie/web/bmw-i3-preview-event/

BMW i3 can be seen in Joe Duffy tomorrow. It has one seat too less for my purposes, but I might go see it myself.

Sesshoumaru

Sesshoumaru wrote: »

I really love my electric car. I can't imagine changing it any time soon! I highly recommend them for non-motorhead people who just want to get from A to B everyday. Those type of people are also the ones who probably wouldn't post on a motoring forum... So I think you're swimming up a waterfall here

That said, I do find myself thinking a lot about the Model S recently. With 3 kids, I love the idea of the seats in the boot for that extra little bit of space. I like gadgets and the 17" touch screen computer looks sweet, Google Maps navigation, web browser etc. The power, performance and range is nice as well. Sadly I can't afford one, but I think it could be the car to convert some motorheads.

Indeed a Model S would be incredible. Even the 60kwh would have more than enough range. I don't know what price that will be yet, but it will be a lot no doubt.

Swimming up a waterfall is an understatement !

Sesshoumaru

Sesshoumaru wrote: »

http://www.joeduffybmw.ie/web/bmw-i3-preview-event/

BMW i3 can be seen in Joe Duffy tomorrow. It has one seat too less for my purposes, but I might go see it myself.

The I3 has some really cool gadgets inc the option of fully automatic city driving, can't wait to see a demo of that.

unkel

Sesshoumaru wrote: »

I highly recommend them for non-motorhead people who just want to get from AAA to AAB everyday

Sums it up nicely although I had to fix your post a bit :pac:

Matt Simis

Deleted User wrote: »

The I3 has some really cool gadgets inc the option of fully automatic city driving, can't wait to see a demo of that.

Joy of freedom and motoring died in you or never there then?
You flip flop from "it has so much torque its going to be super fun" to making statements that suggest you view cars as inconvenient appliances, as most of your peers seem to.

Matt Simis

Matt Simis wrote: »

Joy of freedom and motoring died in you or never there then?
You flip flop from "it has so much torque its going to be super fun" to making statements that suggest you view cars as inconvenient appliances, as most of your peers seem to.

Deleted User wrote: »

The I3 has some really cool gadgets inc the option of fully automatic city driving, can't wait to see a demo of that.

You think that if it's joyful to drive through congested towns and cities ?

Imagine a boring commute up the N7 Through Newlands Cross, and being able to set it to auto pilot ? That won't happen for a few years yet. But fully automatic city driving will be possible only in cities with the I3.

I think a lot of people would appreciate such technology, and all the people that get stuck for miles on the motorways because some fool rear ends someone else while texting would appreciate a lot less accidents.

Then when traffic is gone, back to manual. Great idea.

Max Power1

Deleted User wrote: »

You think that if it's joyful to drive through congested towns and cities ?

Imagine a boring commute up the N7 Through Newlands Cross, and being able to set it to auto pilot ? That won't happen for a few years yet. But fully automatic city driving will be possible only in cities with the I3.

I think a lot of people would appreciate such technology, and all the people that get stuck for miles on the motorways because some fool rear ends someone else while texting would appreciate a lot less accidents.

Then when traffic is gone, back to manual. Great idea.

:eek:

That will be the death knell for EVs if it ever happens. Dont need big brother driving me tyvm!
The death knell, for something that never took off.

It will take off al right, it will take time and they will introduce it slowly.

For instance some cars like the higher end German cars come with park assist as standard, and I can tell you it works extremely well in the A6, you still got to accelerate and break but it works well with automatic box the car does all the steering.

There is no way anyone could parallel park an big enough car like an A6, without the park assist nearly as fast as the computer, before you even try park it will tell you if it will fit or not. It's amazing but I couldn't stop laughing the first time I tried it.

But things like automatic cruise are already with us and is a 100 Euro option on the Golf. Setting your distance from the car in front the car will automatically speed up or slow down and in some cases bring you to a complete stop, if a car jumps in in front of you the cruise will slow down and keep the set distance all the time.

By 2015 all new cars are to be fitted with anti collision , and I bet that's the slow speed version that works at speeds below 20 mph or something.

So we're getting closer but they are doing it slowly to give people faith in the computer. I would assume the law doesn't allow fully automated driving yet anyway.

Don't forget Google's self driving Prisus's have clocked up well over 300,000 accident free miles, only one occasion was there an accident but that was after the driver took over. They are still driving around today.

Max Power1

Deleted User wrote: »

It will take off al right, it will take time and they will introduce it slowly.

For instance some cars like the higher end German cars come with park assist as standard, and I can tell you it works extremely well in the A6, you still got to accelerate and break but it works well with automatic box the car does all the steering.

There is no way anyone could parallel park an big enough car like an A6, without the park assist nearly as fast as the computer, before you even try park it will tell you if it will fit or not. It's amazing but I couldn't stop laughing the first time I tried it.

But things like automatic cruise are already with us and is a 100 Euro option on the Golf. Setting your distance from the car in front the car will automatically speed up or slow down and in some cases bring you to a complete stop, if a car jumps in in front of you the cruise will slow down and keep the set distance all the time.

By 2015 all new cars are to be fitted with anti collision , and I bet that's the slow speed version that works at speeds below 20 mph or something.

So we're getting closer but they are doing it slowly to give people faith in the computer. I would assume the law doesn't allow fully automated driving yet anyway.

Don't forget Google's self driving Prisus's have clocked up well over 300,000 accident free miles, only one occasion was there an accident but that was after the driver took over. They are still driving around today.

All of those are optional

Fully automatic driving will never happen. Not in my lifetime and I am 26. No way.

If they make automatic (as in auto piloted) cars compulsory, I would take the bus. No point spending money on a car to not drive it!

Max Power1

Max Power1 wrote: »

All of those are optional

Fully automatic driving will never happen. Not in my lifetime and I am 26. No way.

If they make automatic (as in auto piloted) cars compulsory, I would take the bus. No point spending money on a car to not drive it!

The park assist in the brothers A6 wasn't optional. Now unless it came with a specific spec I've no idea.

No you'll always have the option to drive manually if you wish, but I guarantee there won't be many that will want to drive through congested towns and cities.

Or crawling traffic in a 5 mile tailback after an accident.

galwaytt

Max Power1 wrote: »

tollAll of those are optional

Fully automatic driving will never happen. Not in my lifetime and I am 26. No way.

If they make automatic (as in auto piloted) cars compulsory, I would take the bus. No point spending money on a car to not drive it!

...that'll be an automatically driven bus then, yeah? :pac:

Look, we can't even get the tags to work 100% reliably, so auto driving is a long way off. ...

6 years isn't that long. That's when Nissan and a few others reckon.

I do wonder how they would cope with no road markings, our back roads etc ? guess time will tell.

Matt Simis

Deleted User wrote: »

6 years isn't that long. That's when Nissan and a few others reckon.

I do wonder how they would cope with no road markings, our back roads etc ? guess time will tell.

Yes, in limited and specific rollouts in regions that have modified roads and where this has passed legal and regulatory frameworks. Which is a whole lot more than 6 years.

And also not at all suitable for the vast majority of road networks in countries like Ireland. It will all fall apart anyhow the first time there is a multiple car crash caused by autopilot.

You got to stop sipping the corporate PR coolaid!

Max Power1

galwaytt wrote: »

...that'll be an automatically driven bus then, yeah? :pac:

Look, we can't even get the tags to work 100% reliably, so auto driving is a long way off. ...

Yes the automatically driven bus, which I pay 2 something per trip and dont pay thousands in tax, insurance and fuel each year to drive for pleasure.

Matt Simis wrote: »

Yes, in limited and specific rollouts in regions that have modified roads and where this has passed legal and regulatory frameworks. Which is a whole lot more than 6 years.

And also not at all suitable for the vast majority of road networks in countries like Ireland. It will all fall apart anyhow the first time there is a multiple car crash caused by autopilot.

You got to stop sipping the corporate PR coolaid!

I think you are fighting a losing battle there :pac:

Zubeneschamali

Matt Simis wrote: »

Yes, in limited and specific rollouts in regions that have modified roads and where this has passed legal and regulatory frameworks. Which is a whole lot more than 6 years.

Kicking up dust on a boreen in Connemara wll still require manual control in 10 years, sure.

But the latest S-Class Merc has an active cruise control which steers the car to stay in lane as well as speeding up and slowing down with the car in front. You will see gadgets like that filtering down from higher end cars, just as ABS and ESP did, with more and more automation possible with each gadget.

Cruising on the motorway and slow city stop-start traffic are not very interesting kinds of driving - no-one will miss them when they are largely automated.

djimi

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

But the latest S-Class Merc has an active cruise control which steers the car to stay in lane as well as speeding up and slowing down with the car in front.

The idea of being on the same road as any car with any of this sort of gadget in it terrifies me to be honest. The potential for catastrophe if (when) it goes wrong is beyond frightening.

Max Power1

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Kicking up dust on a boreen in Connemara wll still require manual control in 10 years, sure.

But the latest S-Class Merc has an active cruise control which steers the car to stay in lane as well as speeding up and slowing down with the car in front. You will see gadgets like that filtering down from higher end cars, just as ABS and ESP did, with more and more automation possible with each gadget.

Cruising on the motorway and slow city stop-start traffic are not very interesting kinds of driving - no-one will miss them when they are largely automated.

This is optional
The car only does it *when you tell it to*

That's fine. What is being suggested is that driving be replaced by an automated process. That is not fine, imo, and I firmly believe that anyone who thinks otherwise is not a motoring enthusiast and has no place posting in a motoring forum

Zubeneschamali

Max Power1 wrote: »

This is optional
The car only does it *when you tell it to*

One of the CAR magazine guys was complaining recently that his Volvo has some sort of emergency brake accident-avoiding gadget which got confused and did an emergency stop in traffic when the driver in front pulled a (perfectly safe) U turn. But yes, he was able to turn the system off.

But you used to be able to turn off ABS and ESP/traction control when they were introduced, now not true on many cars.

Matt Simis

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

But you used to be able to turn off ABS and ESP/traction control when they were introduced, now not true on many cars.

Driver aids, as in they help the act of actively driving, are not comparable to autonomous self navigating vehicles. Such systems can only work in an all or nothing mode, not in a world which also features real drivers and cars, cyclists, pedestrians, tractors, dogs and sheep etc.

keithclancy

The only self driving bus i've seen that worked without problems was this thing: