New home sale in Belmont, Stepaside, Dublin 18

Shedzafew

I spoke with the department within the DLRCC that houses travellers on the halting site issue less than a month ago they said that it was almost certainly not going ahead as the council didn't own the land and that the travellers objected as the site was too overlooked. I don't know how so much has changed in the last few weeks. I will try and contact them again today and see what the story is.

Lillian123

Thanks NinjaTruncs for the reply, think I will take a drive up there this evening to see where it is, as can't seem to locate the sign on google street view. Thanks Shedzafew for chasing up with the DLRCC, I was thinking of ringing them to find out more information etc but if you could update here when you get some more feedback on the development that would be great!

nakom

Lillian123 wrote: »

Hi Jolisa,

Thanks for the information regarding the tiling etc. I just can't believe that about the halting site which will be very near the Belmont development, does anyone have exact google maps co-ordinates so we can see where the site is, that sort of changes things for us and is a real disappointment, what do you think? You could have anti-social behaviour and if you have children walking to school etc.

the one on the right:
https://maps.google.com/maps?client=ubuntu&channel=fs&oe=utf-8&q=53.262075,-6.227124&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x48670999ecd6d59d:0x6df95462ec428bde,53.262075,-6.227124&ei=zTfVUvzwIM2w7Aa-sIFg&ved=0CCkQ8gEwAA

Jorg_East

Check the Dun Laoghaire Rathdown County Development Plan 2010-2016 map: http://46.137.120.35/DLRDevelopmentPlan/DevPlanViewer.aspx. Unfortunately I cannot get a permalink to the exact location so you'll have to zoom in to the land that is exactly at the right as you enter in Aiken Village / Belmont from Enniskerry Road. You'll see that at the south side of that big piece of land there is a green triangle marked with TA, that's suppose to be the Traveller Accommodation site. The remaining of the land is marked with H which is Council Housing site.

So yes, the fact that they've approved the construction of the halting site is not very encouraging for future Belmont residents... me included.

Lillian123

Hi Nakom,

Thanks for that, I thought it was that site but wasnt sure whether it was further up the Enniskerry road. God that is so close to the development, how do people feel about it?

NinjaTruncs

Zoom in to this point and the sign should just be on your left

Lillian123

Thanks NinjaTruncs I see it now! What does a "4 bay site" mean is it 4 houses or room for caravans or what?

Jared20130204

HI All,

Thanks for all this.... That is quite a concern!! Reselling these houses down the line just go a whole lot harder! How disappointing. Haven't checked with solicitor on that annual management fee, but I was told by agent circa €100.....

nakom

Lillian123 wrote: »

Thanks NinjaTruncs I see it now! What does a "4 bay site" mean is it 4 houses or room for caravans or what?

Hi Lillian,

they're talking about houses

here is a document that explains a bit further.

2.4. Constraints on implementing the Traveller Accommodation Programme 2005-2008
2.4.1 Site ownership
A number of proposed sites identified in the Traveller Accommodation Programme 2005-2008 are not in the ownership of the Council. Many of these sites have been the subject of extensive negotiations over the years e.g. Enniskerry Road, Bird Avenue, UCD.
In the case of those sites which are in the Council’s ownership there were other constraints which have given rise to delays in developing them e.g. the location of Council depots at Mount Anville, awaiting infrastructure etc.

Enniskerry Road – negotiations are ongoing in relation to the acquisition of this site under a Part V agreement.

Jared20130204

Hi All,

Just on the Management fee. I checked with my solicitor and in the contract it mentions the first annual fee being €100, so it's bizarre that they're quoting others differently. My solicitor said it shouldn't be anymore than €100 for a housing estate. Apartment block management fees tend to be higher.

Lillian123

I think all of this changes the appeal of the Belmont estate as a safe place to raise a family, there is just so many issues with the development; difficulties dealing with SF, delay in getting the contract (which I am delighted about now as we can pull out with no penalty), problems with the contracts, the deeds, structural issues cited by some on here, no change policy, no proper front garden, annual maintenance fee higher than anticipated, social housing across the road, a halting site which will affect resale value in the future. The list goes on. I think this is the last straw for us and its time to walk away from owning a house here.

So disappointing.

Bells 1978

That's a pity - I don't think it is a halting site that is being constructed it is a small number of houses.

There is lots of traveller accommodation in and around many residential areas in Dublin. I am confused is the management fee €100 per annum or just for the first year?

Any idea when phase 3 is ready ??

camo

nakom wrote: »

Hi Camo,

which services will you get? AFAIK only TV is available, do you know if anything else is available?

I received a call from UPC today to tell me that their engineer visited the site and was told that Sky Conway 'had the contract for the area'. I told them that this was not the case as I live in a privately owned house and not an apartment block. I will be talking to my solicitor about this tomorrow.

Incidentally from talking to a few friends of the family I have heard nothing but negative reports about Sky Conway.

The Bishop Basher

As disappointing as it may be, it's a decision your likely to look back favourably on for many years and thank your lucky stars you dodged the bullet.

This thread is like a microcosm of the boom years all rolled up into 12 short pages.

When you make the largest purchase of your life, you should have absolute and complete reassurance regarding every single aspect of what you spend that money on.

If this thread is an example of the general willingness of people to part with cash regardless of the risks, unknowns and numerous red flags, then developers are in for another ride of their lives.

It really is incredibly concerning that we appear to have learned so little.

Bells 1978

Just wondering has anyone been informed that the house they purchased in brick is now going to be rendered?????????

PS building works look like they are full speed ahead up there - snag for phase 3 is planned for mid March which will more than likely be April!

Congrats to all who have moved in - how are the houses???

Jared20130204

Swanner wrote: »

As disappointing as it may be, it's a decision your likely to look back favourably on for many years and thank your lucky stars you dodged the bullet.

This thread is like a microcosm of the boom years all rolled up into 12 short pages.

When you make the largest purchase of your life, you should have absolute and complete reassurance regarding every single aspect of what you spend that money on.

If this thread is an example of the general willingness of people to part with cash regardless of the risks, unknowns and numerous red flags, then developers are in for another ride of their lives.

It really is incredibly concerning that we appear to have learned so little.

Hi Swanner,

YOu most definitely have a point on a house being the biggest purchase of ones life. I think the thread shows that alot of people do have real concerns and are trying to get all of these addressed before actually purchasing. I suspect most people on here will walk away if there is any pressure to sign without title deeds sorted.
As for all these other issues, well...if they get sorted it could still have value. With regard to a reminder of boom times....I can see your point. That's how my solicitor described the contract....."like one that had just stepped out of 2006!" To be honest, I have started the search all over for a new house, as I am unsure whether We'll go ahead.... Problem is there's just very little coming on the market in South County Dublin.
I'm amazed a journalist hasn't picked up on this thread though.... Because it really does look like We're heading back to those crazy days as you read through!

I do have confidence in my solicitor though. He has raised so many queries and seems to be getting somewhere with having them agree to resolve.
But it all boils down to the title deeds.... Until that ridiculously important point is sorted I don;t think my solicitor would give me a pen to sign, but boot me out his front door instead!

Lillian,

So sorry you've decided to walk away, but as Swanner says, you may have dodged a bullet. I grew up in the area and have family living very close by. Although it's changed drastically, I still have a nice feeling about it.

Best of luck with your hunt. I may well pass by you at viewings in the near future if this goes belly up.

Shedzafew

Well put Jared. I don't think this can realistically be compared to the boom times as during this era there was;
Banks willing to lend money to people who could not afford it (no longer happens)
Solicitors were willing to sign off on substandard/unclear contracts. (this no doubt still happens but has drastically decreased)
Purchasers willing to put their name to anything just to get a foot on the property ladder. (IMHO today's first time buyers are a lot more sophisticated and informed than they were in the past. The vast majority I know who have bought recently/looking to buy have been renting for a minimum of 2/3 years looking at the housing market and potential areas who have spent endless weekends attending viewings with a lot of familiar places).
I like Belmont, to me it represents great value for well built homes. I intend to purchase here when the land registration issue is resolved which I am told that the completion of this process is merely an admin exercise and should be sorted in the coming weeks. In relation to the other potential red flags I am going in with my eyes wide open. Here is my thought process for the major ones;
The contract issues can be ironed out by my solicitor until we are both satisfied. The vendor’s solicitors seem to be complete armatures. I would like to see New Generation spend the extra money to get one of the big firms in for the next phases.
The service charge was always going to be a factor. I was told it was going to be €100 for the 1st year and that it would more than likely increase to a few hundred euro in subsequent years. If this money is to be used to keep the area well lit, clean and tidy whilst maintaining the park to a good standard I am happy to pay it. I have young children and having a park like the one proposed on my doorstep would be invaluable.
The proposed traveller site. I was told by the DLRCC that this will more than likely not be going ahead. The council do not own the land and the travellers no not want the site as it is too exposed and overlooked. If the site was to go ahead it will not be for a number of years and at the end of the day it’s 4 housing bays going in, that will have one access point and will be more than likely walled off like the one opposite Bewleys Hotel on Sandyford road.
TV/ Broadband provider. If it is true that Sky Conway have exclusive rights to the development I will be annoyed. I can’t see this sticking. The last two places I have lived started off where there was only one provider and within a few months all UPC and Sky were both in the area.
The purpose of the above is not to justify my decision to buy in Belmont but to take people through my thought process. People need to make their own decisions, at the end of the day this thread is a bunch of strangers writing anything they like, true or false.
Finally, I think Sherry Fitz need to chime in here. I am 100% they are monitoring this thread and an official account being opened by them would offer transparency.

The Bishop Basher

Hi Jared20130204,

I think the main concern here is the shoddiness with which the developer appears to have approached all aspects of this development. If they're cutting corners and taking a lazy approach to the things you can see, what about the things you can't see and i'm particularly thinking of the build quality. No amount of discussion on here can resolve that and as with boom times, it's very often 6 months to a year down the road when the cracks appear and by then it's too late for the buyer.

I took a spin up there at the weekend and it appears to be the old school mentality of cramming as many units into 1 small space as possible with no regard for living space, parking etc.

I apppreciate that their are a lack of good properties available in South Dublin at the moment but it's seems clear that the developer knows this and is capitalising on the demand. In short, people are so anxious to buy that they'll overlook some "issues" and the developer knows this.

Call me an old cynic but i'm not buying the hamper either. That seems like a cynical ploy to keep current buyers quiet and onside.

Personally, if I was in the market, i would be walking away and waiting for something safer to come along, even if it meant spending a little more to have that peace of mind.

I hate the thought that developers can continue to get away with this kind of shoddiness but even moreso I hate seeing honest people ripped off.

I hope i'm wrong. I really do. But this thread is screaming red flags and the lack of a response to some of the more probing questions would indicate a lack of willingness for potential buyers to face up to the realities for fear of being put off. In otherwords, the hearts in some cases appear to be ruling the heads.

Best of luck to everyone already in and I sincerely hope it works out for everyone but please take an objective view of all the issues before committing to anything.

Shedzafew

Hi Swanner, can you elaborate on the "bad build quality". I have been in a number of the show houses up there and they seemed to be very well finished. A family member who is a QS has bought up here. He has had a number of parties inspect the property and they all said that they were built to a high standard. After moving in you also have 12 months to get the builders to repair and cracks/defects that may arise- this is bound to happen with 99% of new homes.

I know it sounds like I am going to great lengths to defend the development but this is not my intension. I want people to make up their own minds. In doing this I would prefer to stick to facts rather than offering their 2 cent on something that they may not know a huge amount about.

Lillian123

Ya I wondered that aswell why the papers haven't picked up on this thread and the return to the boom in SCD. Thanks Shedzafew for outlining your thought processes to do with the issues, maybe I am over reacting to the Social housing and traveller site. My partner thinks there is not many alternatives if we decide to walk away, even in North Dublin. We really want to live in an energy efficient house aswell. Do you know if the houses are covered by a 10 year structural bond?

Jared - can I ask you how long has it been since you received the contracts, to raise the issues and wait for updates etc?

Can anyone who has moved in update us on what the houses are like? Did you have to pay for any extras or could you make any changes to the choice of tiling etc (e.g. in the upstairs bathroom).

Thanks!

Shedzafew

Hi Lillian,

Family member who has bought did not make any alterations to tiling in kitchen or bathrooms. They said that the two foremen on site have been extremely accommodating in terms of accepting deliveries to the house and opening up the property for independent trade’s people he has hired to take measurements and install carpets & flooring. I will DM you their details if you like.

If you feel like you are settling for a house up there I most certainly would not proceed with the purchase. You will continually be looking up myhome/daft looking at properties that could have been.

Lillian123

Hi Shezafew,

Yes please PM those details. How long have you been waiting for updates on the contracts so far?

Wallander

Just on the traveller site issue - it's caused a lot of concern in my household as we're also at the contract stage. I've done a bit of research on existing traveller housing sites in South Dublin and while I think it has to be a bad thing if it goes ahead I have a few remarks that soften the blow, in my mind at least:

-All of the sites seem to be designed to be kept away from main roads with longish approach roads. The proposed site in Stepaside does seem rather small and bang on the main road, but I would expect an attempt to seal houses from view of that road. You might even get an approach road curving around to make it feel even more set back.

-There are no obvious signs of any great chaos, caravans or horses at these existing sites visible from Google Satellite. Of course that's only saying so much, but there's enough detail on the images to see the council is trying to keep a lid on things - I've seen a car-park style height gate on the approach road to one site which is presumably designed to keep caravans out.

-While I doubt the impact on house prices/reselling could be positive if this goes ahead, I feel it might not be a complete disaster based on other evidence. We saw a four-bed place in Blackrock which I've just now discovered backs almost right onto an existing traveller housing site. Location is very convenient for Blackrock Centre but the house was a fair bit smaller than what we are after at Belmont. Similar small garden. It was sold last month for 560k

Lillian123

Hi Wallander,

Thanks for your insight into the traveller site. I think you are right the entrance will probably be off the main Enniskerry road as it is at the end of that triangle site. I am thinking I will ring DLR county council today and ask about what is planned for the whole site, will update here what they say. Have you been waiting long since you first received the contracts, to get answers on the issues?

Jared20130204

Hi Lillian,

Contract came through early November. Issues sent back mid November, with main one being title deed issue.they reverted mid December answering queries and just advising that they have expedited Registration in the Land registration and will revert on that point.
They hadn't sent Home bond documentation either so part of that arrived last week, but wasn't complete so We have requested the complete documentation and sent a few more queries..... To be honest I would't worry too much about your contract and delays...Houses seem to be behind schedule and the Land registry don't seem to have expedited anything so not alot to be signing for right now!

cmore123

I'm worried again now.

Can any of the people involved in these houses really be trusted at all? First, the grass-cutting charge is €100, now it seems it will be six it eight times that. First, there seems little chance of an adjacent traveller site, now (if I read this correctly), it's as good as a done deal!

Having put down a deposit and awaiting a contract in the list, I just wonder now. If there's a spike in new house prices, what happens when things settle down, if I go to sell? Will I only be able to get less (déjà vu), if I can sell at all given proximity of a traveller site?

I have nothing against some travellers myself but that isn't the point. A potential buyer might.

Shedzafew

Cmore if you read correctly the halting site is far from a done deal. There are a number of proposed sites and if they all go ahead nearly all areas in South County Dublin will be in close proximity to at least one halting site. Why are people only finding out about the proposed site now? This has been discussed from the start of the thread and well documented in the media for years now.

The proposed maintenance fee is estimated to increase to between €300-€600, depending on the size of your house. This will pay for the park and general maintenance of the area also. Most housing estates across SCD have either an official or unofficial charge that is looked after by the residents association.

Jorg_East

The halting site is indeed something to be concerned about, but maybe not so much: it is small (only 4 bays) and relatively far from Belmont. As far as I know the remaining land north to the halting site is designated for council housing. This one is bigger and much closer to Belmont. Isn't this a bigger concern in your view?

M2014

Hi all, am I the only one who thinks Sherry Fitz are unofficially contributing to this thread already?

Shedzafew

If they are they are not doing a very good job!