New home sale in Belmont, Stepaside, Dublin 18

Bells 1978

NinjaTruncs wrote: »

How does a solicitors undertaking resolve that the land registry has has someone (person or company) down as the owner of the land an what protection does it give to the buyer?

Lets say the developers end up being unable to get the land in their name and the bank who is down as the owner asks you (the management company) to buy it from them or pay ground rent, what will the undertaking do to resolve this?

Edit: And in reference to the parking I can see there being serious issues in the future, the roads in phase one are very tight, not sure what they are like in the other phases but I would expect them to be the same. I doubt there is room for a car to park on the side of the road and left another pass, if will be fine while there are only two cars per household but I would expect there will end up being houses that have 3 or even 4 cars and I have no idea where these will go based on seeing phase one.

Hey, I'm sure that all of the issues will be resolved and the banks and solicitors acting won't allow the transactions proceed unless they are happy with everything - ultimately I'm sure the developers will wont everything sorted ASAP so they can sell the properties - I'm going leave it all to my solicitor & will sign if they are if the view the transaction can go ahead.
It will be interesting to see the development next weekend - from the thread it appears there is a launch but it is not mentioned on the sites for the development

Bells 1978

In relation to ground rents and residential developments - I think that the creation of ground rents was prohibited in 1978 but they can apply to commercial developments!

Jolisa94

Got an email from SherryFitz this morning, new launch coming up on the 15th & 16th.

3 beds starting from 350,000 for 101 sqm (from 335,000 last time and the houses were bigger, 107 sqm)

4 beds strating from 440,000 for 131 sqm (from 370,000 last time)

That's quite a jump, especially for the 4 beds.

_Kaiser_

Jolisa94 wrote: »

Got an email from SherryFitz this morning, new launch coming up on the 15th & 16th.

3 beds starting from 350,000 for 101 sqm (from 335,000 last time and the houses were bigger, 107 sqm)

4 beds strating from 440,000 for 131 sqm (from 370,000 last time)

That's quite a jump, especially for the 4 beds.

And the cycle begins again...

Seriously folks.. if we ever expect a properly functioning property market people need to stop buying into this. The prices have risen so much (in spite of them being smaller and the question marks about whether they even have the right to be selling houses on this land) because they know there are queues of people just waiting to "get back on the property ladder"

It HAS to start with the buyer!

NinjaTruncs

To be fair the email states there are "4 Show Homes" I take this to mean they are selling the show homes from the first 2 phases, which may be the reason for the price increases, it's common for 20K-25K to be added to a three bed show house to cover all the stuff they put in, the increase for the 4 beds is a bit much though, but again if there are only 4 houses for sale it could be some of the 4 beds that were close to 400K meaning you're being charged 40K for furnishings, still that's high imo to furnish a 4 bed house.

Jolisa94

Show houses were:

3 beds
Powerscourt (originally priced from 335k)
Laragh (originally priced from 355k)
Don't remember there being another 3 bed show house.

4 beds
Derrybawn (originally priced from 398k)
The show house for the Glencullen design (370k originally) is occupied now and the first version of the Laragh (365k originally) also seems to be occupied, so not sure what the other 4 bed might be, possibly the house that was used as the sales office.

So, if I’m right, on the 3 beds that’s 15K for the contents of the living room and the bedrooms and 42K on the 4 beds (all the tiling was included). Particularly on the 4 beds, that's a lot for furniture and fittings, so it seems to me that there is a price increase in there somewhere.

Bells 1978

Jolisa94 wrote: »

Show houses were:

3 beds
Powerscourt (originally priced from 335k)
Laragh (originally priced from 355k)
Don't remember there being another 3 bed show house.

4 beds
Derrybawn (originally priced from 398k)
The show house for the Glencullen design (370k originally) is occupied now and the first version of the Laragh (365k originally) also seems to be occupied, so not sure what the other 4 bed might be, possibly the house that was used as the sales office.

So, if I’m right, on the 3 beds that’s 15K for the contents of the living room and the bedrooms and 42K on the 4 beds (all the tiling was included). Particularly on the 4 beds, that's a lot for furniture and fittings, so it seems to me that there is a price increase in there somewhere.

- it could be the four bed detached on the site that are starting at that price?

cmore123

Latest for my solicitor - contract has arrived with them, but she says she has written to them for clarification "on a number of issues" and will advise me once the vendor's solicitor replies.

It really doesn't sound promising, and I too would urge others not to sign until all is sorted. I won't. If it doesn't resolve satisfactorily, I'm out - I'll be off to balbriggan or somewhere!

Wallander

We're getting some real pressure now to sign on our phase 3 house and in a bit of a dilemma. Solicitor says they are 99% satisfied that the registration will be sorted shortly as it's at the mapping stage. We are wondering whether it's worth continuing to refuse to sign for what we are told is a 1% risk of something unforeseen coming up at the final registration phase but at the same time uneasy to sign off until we have complete certainty bearing in mind what has been reported on this forum.

Jared20130204

Hi wallander,
In the same boat here.... I was talking to land registry guy today and he says there's an application pre this one that has to be sorted first and I have no idea when that will be sorted but hoping it can be done in days or we are out too...
Try to get your solicitor to see what the query on the registration is....then you would have better idea of risk.

Those going to launch...beware you may get stuck paying solicitors fees and no house at end of it cos these guys will try to force people to sign contracts with numerous issues....

Wallander

Thanks very much Jared, interesting to hear, let's hope it gets sorted soonish. Is there anyone else in the same situation? We're being threatened with getting our deposit returned but it's difficult to know if and when they would carry out this threat. Does anybody know of a deposit being returned for this issue?

Jared20130204

I suspect they are going to see how they get on this weekend with launch.... If they get people to pay over what our houses were sale agreed at ,they may just return deposits and sell at higher prices....all depends on how this weekend goes....
Anyone buying should look at property price register..9 houses sold in belmont already
...also houses still for sale in aikens village.... Check those prices!
I think the developers assume belmont will command higher prices than those houses all around .... Good luck to em!

nakom

Wallander wrote: »

We're getting some real pressure now to sign on our phase 3 house and in a bit of a dilemma. Solicitor says they are 99% satisfied that the registration will be sorted shortly as it's at the mapping stage. We are wondering whether it's worth continuing to refuse to sign for what we are told is a 1% risk of something unforeseen coming up at the final registration phase but at the same time uneasy to sign off until we have complete certainty bearing in mind what has been reported on this forum.

From whom are you getting pressure from? SF or from the builders? I left a deposit for a 2nd phase house and I haven't heard from anyone so far.
Maybe it's because I told my solicitor that until everything is sorted I won't sign.
Probably he's not even bothering me about pressure from them.

Your solicitor is happy about 99%. What about the AIB charge? Is he happy with what they said?

Wallander

Yes as far as I've been told all issues on any past charges or ownership issues have now been resolved and the final mapping phase is more of a formality. The pressure is coming from the developer's solicitors via our solicitor, the launch this weekend was mentioned between them seemingly implying what Jared said.

The main reason why we will wait is that I find it tough to marry this rosy view of a registration process very near its end to their response to our request for complete assurance on the issue, either by a clause that the registration must be done before closure or by allowing us to wait for registration before signing. They refused this and turned this pressure on us.

Shedzafew

I would say that this weekend will play a big part on how they will deal with the issue of existing deposits for houses that contracts are yet to be signed. If there is a large amount of interest for additional houses at the higher prices then why wouldn't the developers give back the existing deposits to people who haven't signed and sell to new buyers at the higher price? Don't get me wrong, I think this would be absolutely and completely wrong of them to do considering people genuinely do want to purchase the houses but not until the land registration issue is resolved. Unfortunately if you look at situation from the developers’ point of view it could make complete sense.

They get fresh purchasers in at a higher price and by the time it comes around to signing contracts the issue may or may not be resolved. If it is resolved then people will sign at the higher price. If not, as in previous phases people still may sign anyway whilst others hang tough until the issue is resolved. They essentially have nothing to lose apart from reputation and lets face it isn't that strong at present and there is no denying that at the moment the upper hand is well and truly with the seller in today's property market.

The above will depend on how much of a rise is seen in the average prices and the demand for the houses this weekend. From speaking with sherry fitz today they have received a large number of calls from people in relation to the development and they will not take booking deposits for any of the houses in the launch until Saturday.

Is anyone aware of the legal position of the people who have paid their booking deposits who are yet to sign? I know in the vast majority of cases the deposit can be returned for no reason but surely in this instance they have some form of case as they are yet to be provided with a clean contract/title.

Jared20130204

Hi all,

Shedzafew saying what we are all thinking I guess.... It's so true. All the power is with the seller. Regarding a case...I don't know but I would suspect it would need to be some sort of class action where a bunch of us get together to recoup legal expenses etc if the above happens after this weekend... Agent kept advising that we listen to our solicitors, whilst demanding we sign contracts....so everyone is caught between a rock and a hard place...can't sign because we ARE listening to our solicitors....it's a very unfair situation for all those that are just doing the right and correct thing.

New Buyer

I have been following this thread for some time now and have been very interested in the issues raised as we also paid a booking deposit back in Oct. After time waiting on the contracts and more time spent querying all the issues that were raised here as well as other things we raised, I am happy to say we signed in the last few weeks. I am not going to go into the ins and outs of how we were confident signing because I honestly dont know enough about it to attempt to explain, and as I understand it its quiet complicated which is why I left that up to our very competent solicitor who went through absolutely everything in detail.There is alot of negativity on the forum and I can absolutely understand that people have concerns, it s huge buy which is why I have been looking into all issues raised the last few months. I just wanted to let people know that there are people signing and we have spoken to others who too have signed. It is everyone's own decision in the end but personally I think it is a great buy and gorgeous location so near the mountains while being accessible to all amenities including the luas. Best of luck to everyone that goes ahead with it.

cmore123

Folks and folkesses..

The AIB issues are not yet sorted, nor are others. On the plus side, none are beyond easy resolution, but on the negative side (and those viewing this weekend, PLEASE research thoroughly for your own sake!) my solicitor raised no less than sixteen issues with the vendor's solicitor just this week. One can only conclude the vendor's solicitor is either a total crook, or an idiot.....

sawdoubters

heres prices

https://www.propertypriceregister.ie/website/npsra/PPR/npsra-ppr.nsf/PPR-By-Date?SearchView&Start=1&SearchMax=0&SearchOrder=4&Query=%5Bdt_execution_date%5D%3E=01/06/2013%20AND%20%5Bdt_execution_date%5D%3C01/01/2014%20AND%20%5Baddress%5D=*Belmont,%20Stepaside*%20AND%20%5Bdc_county%5D=%22Dublin%22&County=Dublin&Year=2013&StartMonth=06&EndMonth=12&Address=Belmont,%20Stepaside

NinjaTruncs

So about 10 of the 60 houses sold have completed, looks like there are a lot of people waiting until the issues are resolved, and rightly so.

Shedzafew

Cmore can you please expand on your post? In what way is the AIB issue not resolved and what are the other issue that are unresolved apart from the land registration issue?

nakom

Shedzafew wrote: »

Cmore can you please expand on your post? In what way is the AIB issue not resolved and what are the other issue that are unresolved apart from the land registration issue?

AFAIK is a matter of interpretation. Our solicitors are given an answer about the AIB charge. Some accept the answer as valid, others, like mine, are not convinced and therefore require more clarification.

Enduro

There are plenty of other issues...

Just off the top of my head: There is a clause that says if there is a dispute over the interpretation of snagging then the builders can return the deposit and tell you to feck off. There is a clause that says if the builder runs into financial difficulties and is unable to complete the house then you still have to buy the incomplete house and cannot pull out (Can't understand how any bank would agree to that clause if it has been pointed out to them), and one or two related clauses putting the onus on the purchaser to satify himself about the financial viability of the builder. There are others, but I can't remember them off the top of my head.

I'm erring on the side of their solicitors being that lethal combination of arrogant and incompetant. They still haven't managed to give us a contract which has the correct plans on it, despite having spent god knows how long making up their ridiculous one-sided clauses.

Wallander

That's the first I hear about having to buy an incomplete house but I'll be certain to check that one so thanks for the info...

On the snagging I understand if you end up disputing what is classified as a major structural fault then you can try taking legal action to force them to rectify it or walk away. I guess that would always be the case to some degree but don't know how tight the interpretation is on these contracts compared to others. A friend of mine was about to buy a place a few years back when they detected possible pyrite issues, the builders were never going to pick up the bill for that as it came in from the supply chain so the best thing in that case was to walk away.

Dearg81

I'm going to the viewing tomorrow so I rang up Sherry Fitzgerald to see how many houses were up for sale in this phase. They said there was 30 3 bed houses for sale tomorrow. I don't think the show houses are for sale yet as has been previously stated in this thread as they will surely still need them until the last phase is complete.

I'm hoping there were won't be hundreds of people there tomorrow as I'd like to get a good look at the houses before I decide to buy.

What was the turn out like in other phases and were people putting deposits down as soon as they arrived?

Baileys4

For any of you interested in viewing tomorrow & potentially putting down a deposit, there are currently three people queuing onsite since before 7 this evening.....

Dearg81

Baileys4 wrote: »

For any of you interested in viewing tomorrow & potentially putting down a deposit, there are currently three people queuing onsite since before 7 this evening.....

That's just weird/scary! I wasn't planning on going up til 1:30pm.

NinjaTruncs

Out queing tonight, they could be dead by the morning.

Paddy1234

Does anybody know if there are any or how many 4 beds are on sale tomorrow?

Thanks

Dearg81

Paddy1234 wrote: »

Does anybody know if there are any or how many 4 beds are on sale tomorrow?

Thanks

Yea there's definitely some for sale, not sure how many though.