Is rape always about power?

Three Seasons

There is a generalisation widely held that rape is about power and not sex.

I find it incredible that so many people are so certain of every rapists motivations.

Are these people some sort of rapist whisperers?

MadsL

I was pretty certain "rapist whisperer" would be a googlewhack. I got two results. Yep, there are people as nuts as the OP out there.

Fratton Fred

Three Seasons wrote: »

There is a generalisation widely held that rape is about power and not sex.

I find it incredible that so many people are so certain of every rapists motivations.

Are these people some sort of rapist whisperers?

Is hitting someone over the head with a frying pan about cooking?

Depends, are we talking legitimate or illegitimate rape?

Turtwig

Deleted User wrote: »

Depends, are we talking legitimate or illegitimate rape?

Legitimate rape being the rape by which women can't get pregnant of course.

Rape is a crime of violence using sex as the weapon.
I'm sure there are as many reasons for raping as there are rapists, but ultimately it's about power in one form or another, in my opinion.

CrazyRabbit

Rape is always about being an immoral, selfish & cowardly bastard.

mikom

Three Seasons wrote: »

Is rape always about power?

I knew a Father Clint Power once.

A Primal Nut

Probably a bit of both. I'd imagine that some rapists are weirdos who can't get laid and resort to rape. I'm sure they do get sexual enjoyment out of it (I'd guessing at least some of them do cum afterall which would verify the sexual pleasure motivation) but there are probably others who enjoy the power aspect (similar to people who get a thrill from torturing others).

ScumLord

There's nothing sexy about rape so it must be something else.

A Primal Nut

A Primal Nut wrote: »

Probably a bit of both. I'd imagine that some rapists are weirdos who can't get laid and resort to rape. I'm sure they do get sexual enjoyment out of it (I'd guessing at least some of them do cum afterall which would verify the sexual pleasure motivation) but there are probably others who enjoy the power aspect (similar to people who get a thrill from torturing others).

Sexual power over another is still power.

smash

Rape is no laughing matter!













Unless you're raping a clown!


Mod

Banned

Three Seasons

Candie wrote: »

Rape is a crime of violence using sex as the weapon.
I'm sure there are as many reasons for raping as there are rapists, but ultimately it's about power in one form or another, in my opinion.

You think it's always about power?

Why?

smcgiff

Wasn't there a serial killer in America that used to force his victims to perform oral sex on him and then hit shoot them as he, you know...

One victim got away because (with a gun pointed to her head) pretended to enjoy it and your man lost interest and walked away - without killing her.

I think that was a certain power trip.

Standard Toaster

This will end well....

Human motivations are rarely singular. No it's not always about power.

Donny5

MadsL wrote: »

I was pretty certain "rapist whisperer" would be a googlewhack. I got two results. Yep, there are people as nuts as the OP out there.

I got 7,250,000 results. Don't forget that you're not allowed use quotation marks for a Googlewhack.

Three Seasons

Three Seasons wrote: »

You think it's always about power?

Why?

Think what a rapist gains from the rape.

Sexual power over another, physical power over another, psychological power over another.

A rapist takes what he wants by force, that's using power. What he might want in an immediate sense might differ, but I'd guess that power is a factor one way or another, somewhere in the layers.

Gyalist

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Depends, are we talking legitimate or illegitimate rape?

Yeah, but remember that "some girls rape easy".

Three Seasons

Candie wrote: »

Think what a rapist gains from the rape.

Sexual power over another, physical power over another, psychological power over another.

A rapist takes what he wants by force, that's using power. What he might want in an immediate sense might differ, but I'd guess that power is a factor one way or another, somewhere in the layers.

How do you know power is their motivation though?

Maybe they just want sex so they rape as they have no morals?

Three Seasons

Three Seasons wrote: »

How do you know power is their motivation though?

Maybe they just want sex so they rape as they have no morals?

Do they use physical power to take that sex by force? Or psychological power in the form of threat? Overcome their victim sexually, exerting sexual power over their victim?

Power in it's physical, sexual or psychological form is still power.

Tombi!

I can't really think any of any reason it wouldn't be about or dominance over another person.
I was about to point out that "taking no for answer" means they want sex right there but... I realized that's also exerting power so I dunno, I'd wager 99% of them are about power in some form or another.

Three Seasons wrote: »

How do you know power is their motivation though?

Maybe they just want sex so they rape as they have no morals?

Prostitution or some random hookup in a club would be a better choice than rape, TBH.

mikom

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

Prostitution or some random hookup in a club would be a better choice than rape, TBH.

The rapist could be broke.

A Primal Nut

Candie wrote: »

Sexual power over another is still power.

Well yes and of course thats a factor. But there is an insinuation that sexual pleasure someone gets from consensual sex is somehow different from that which a rapist gets. The physical sensation is the same so I doubt it. Of course they enjoy the power too.

Tombi!

mikom wrote: »

The rapist could be broke.

You don't need money to pickup a random hookup.
Plus, I hear prostitutes do tabs now.

Dave!

I've long been skeptical about this conventional wisdom. It seems to me that rape happens for many reasons, but high up the list is sexual gratification, violence and control being the means by which that is achieved.

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

mikom

Dave! wrote: »

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

Bill Clinton, Monica Lewinsky, 4evr

Chuck Stone

Does it matter?

Tombi!

Dave! wrote: »

I've long been skeptical about this conventional wisdom. It seems to me that rape happens for many reasons, but high up the list is sexual gratification, violence and control being the means by which that is achieved.

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

But at the end of the day, let's say you rape a woman because she said "no" while you naked about to go at it... you clearly want to have sex but the moment you try using power to force her to have sex, it becomes more about power and less about sex.

dd972

I can never get my mind round the notion that only the victims of male rape in U.S Prisons are 'Gay' and the perpetrators aren't, (even with the stigma of being the bitch ) surely the perpetrators have to be that way inclined to be able to do that.

Three Seasons

Candie wrote: »

Do they use physical power to take that sex by force? Or psychological power in the form of threat? Overcome their victim sexually, exerting sexual power over their victim?

Power in it's physical, sexual or psychological form is still power.

Ok so then muggings are about power by using your logic.

Tombi!

Three Seasons wrote: »

Ok so then muggings are about power by using your logic.

Technically it is. It's stealing something from someone by force using power.

Three Seasons

Dave! wrote: »

I've long been skeptical about this conventional wisdom. It seems to me that rape happens for many reasons, but high up the list is sexual gratification, violence and control being the means by which that is achieved.

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

Completely agree, it seems like propaganda to me. Say something enough times and people will believe it.

Three Seasons

Three Seasons wrote: »

Ok so then muggings are about power by using your logic.

Rape give the rapist sexual satisfaction through the use of force (real or threatened).

Muggings satisfy the muggers desire for 'stuff'* through the use of force (real or threatened).

Both use the power of force or implied force to get what they want. In a mugging the mugger materially gains from his crime, in a rape the rapist gains nothing materially, but gains sexual dominance and satisfaction. They are fundamentally different crimes.

Three Seasons

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

Technically it is. It's stealing something from someone by force using power.

The motivation behind a mugging would usually be to acquire something from the person mugged. The fact that force and power are used is just matter of mechanics. A mugger usually just wants money or whatever, they don't care about the fact they used force to obtain it. That is just a byproduct.

kiffer

... is rape always about power?
Everyone is talking about the rapist... maybe for the rapist it's not about power or maybe it is... depending on what ever reasoning rapists use...

For the victim it's about power... having the power to say "No" stripped away. Power over their own body taken from them.

At least that's the way I understand it...

Tombi!

Three Seasons wrote: »

The motivation behind a mugging would usually be to acquire something from the person mugged. The fact that force and power are used is just matter of mechanics. A mugger usually just wants money or whatever, they don't care about the fact they used force to obtain it. That is just a byproduct.

But it's about using power to get what you want. It's not a matter of mechanics. It's a matter of choosing to mug someone, which involves choosing to attack them/coerce them

Three Seasons

Candie wrote: »

Rape give the rapist sexual satisfaction through the use of force (real or threatened).

Muggings satisfy the muggers desire for 'stuff'* through the use of force (real or threatened).

Both use the power of force or implied force to get what they want. In a mugging the mugger materially gains from his crime, in a rape the rapist gains nothing materially, but gains sexual dominance and satisfaction. They are fundamentally different crimes.

Your assuming the rapist gets sexual satisfaction from the power, how do you know that?

somefeen

What if its about sexual gratification from power?
Or just sexual gratification and using force to get it?
Or you know, just power or sex.

To the victim maybe its all about power, but to a rapist?

I don't see the point in claiming its all about power. To me its just something people say that sounds correct and modern but really its a very black and white point of view or people have it back to front.

I would lump that 'wisdom' in with 'gender is a social construct'. tbh

Three Seasons

Three Seasons wrote: »

Your assuming the rapist gets sexual satisfaction from the power, how do you know that?

Are you suggesting that rape doesn't involve sexual dominance over another? Taking sex by force is what rape IS.

If the rapist doesn't need the dominance to get his jollies, he wouldn't be a rapist, surely.

Tombi!

Candie wrote: »

Are you suggesting that rape doesn't involve sexual dominance over another? Taking sex by force is what rape IS.

If the rapist doesn't need the dominance to get his jollies, he wouldn't be a rapist, surely.

I think his argument is that it might not always be about power for the rapist but it can become that.
I mean if a girl says no and I rape her, that doesn't mean I set out with the intention of exerting power over her.

Dave!

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

But at the end of the day, let's say you rape a woman because she said "no" while you naked about to go at it... you clearly want to have sex but the moment you try using power to force her to have sex, it becomes more about power and less about sex.

I don't follow. Why wouldn't it still be about sex? Power would be a necessary tool which helps you to get the sex.

Tombi!

Dave! wrote: »

I don't follow. Why wouldn't it still be about sex? Power would be a necessary tool which helps you to get the sex.

Which then becomes less about sex and more about forcing her to have sex. So it becomes about power.

Galwayguy35

dd972 wrote: »

I can never get my mind round the notion that only the victims of male rape in U.S Prisons are 'Gay' and the perpetrators aren't, (even with the stigma of being the bitch ) surely the perpetrators have to be that way inclined to be able to do that.

Maybe in some cases rapists of men in prison may be gay but I doubt it would be the case all of the time.

Brutal Deluxe

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

I think his argument is that it might not always be about power for the rapist but it can become that.
I mean if a girl says no and I rape her, that doesn't mean I set out with the intention of exerting power over her.

I accept that, but rape and power are highly intertwined.

If a girl says no and you rape her, your intention may not be to exert power in the form of force, or your motivation may not be about power, but it's an inescapable ingredient in the mix. The sexual dominance of another is the assertion of power, as is physical dominance, psychological dominance etc.

A Primal Nut

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

Technically it is. It's stealing something from someone by force using power.

So power is the method, not the motivation.

Tombi!

A Primal Nut wrote: »

So power is the method, not the motivation.

And like Candie just said, if you want to have sex and the other person says no, it's still a vital part of it.
Method or motivation, it doesn't matter. Some cases of rape go from people setting out to rape which power is the motivation and others, end up with people refusing to accept no for an answer then rape, then it's still about power, even if that's the method used.

A Primal Nut

A Primal Nut wrote: »

So power is the method, not the motivation.

Agree with that.
I don't think we can understand why, we just know it's carried out by disgusting human beings who care about nobody but themselves.

A Primal Nut

A Primal Nut wrote: »

So its the method, not the motivation.

If someone wanted sex without the element of dominance, wouldn't they find another, easier or less criminal, way though?

Is it not the power of taking the sex through force that provides the excitement? Surely it's what makes sex be rape?

A Primal Nut

dd972 wrote: »

I can never get my mind round the notion that only the victims of male rape in U.S Prisons are 'Gay' and the perpetrators aren't, (even with the stigma of being the bitch ) surely the perpetrators have to be that way inclined to be able to do that.

Eh? Who said that victims of male rape in U.S. prisons are gay? That makes no sense.

Three Seasons

Candie wrote: »

Are you suggesting that rape doesn't involve sexual dominance over another? Taking sex by force is what rape IS.

If the rapist doesn't need the dominance to get his jollies, he wouldn't be a rapist, surely.

Taking a wallet by force is what mugging is.

Maybe the rapist just wants sex so they rape someone. Maybe it's quicker for the rapist to get sex through rape than conventional means or maybe the rapist wants to have sex with someone more attractive than they could otherwise obtain it.

Maybe the rapist at a party sees a drunk woman and sees it as an easier opportunity to get sex by raping her than alternative options. There are countless scenarios, im baffled by the assumption all rapists are motivated by power.

How do you know what goes on in every single rapists mind?

Tombi!

Three Seasons wrote: »

Taking a wallet by force is what mugging is.

Maybe the rapist just wants sex so they rape someone. Maybe it's quicker for the rapist to get sex through rape than conventional means or maybe the rapist wants to have sex with someone more attractive than they could otherwise obtain it.

Maybe the rapist at a party sees a drunk woman and sees it as an easier opportunity to get sex by raping her than alternative options. There are countless scenarios, im baffled by the assumption all rapists are motivated by power.

How do you know what goes on in every single rapists mind?

Generally speaking, rape is about power. With the sole exception of the "wont take no for an answer" scenario, I can't really see what it's not about power.
You set out to force someone to do something the you're setting out to exert your power of them. Even if you try to justify it, it doesn't change the actions.

As for the party thing, still a key element there. That person passed already can't say no, so you're using the fact they're powerless to say no/stop you