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The dole

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1235

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    #122
    tails_naf
    Registered Users Posts: 861 ✭✭✭tails_naf


    Sin City wrote: »
    Get a better job

    Harsh.

    I'm glad to see there are people at least willing to pay their own way, even when the 'benefits' may be more attractive. It clearly shows the character of the person.

    The problem is the system - Not everyone can get 50k+ jobs - so would you prefer this person to copy the neighbour down the road and live off the state?


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    #123
    Melion
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,259 ✭✭✭✭Melion


    skafish wrote: »
    I'm paying for their lifestyle. And, in certain cases I could name, I'm paying for them to have a higher standard of living than I can afford for myself and my family.

    Take, for example, the woman living 2 doors down from me, living in a house the council are renting for her, claiming SW for herself and her daughter, who got pregnant at 16, and is now claiming her share of the single parent pot. 3 generations in the same house, at least 2 of whom will never contribute to our society.
    A new car every 2 years, 2 holidays last year. 3 large flat screen TVs, sky package (you can see them from the road), the works

    Meantime, we drive a 9 year old banger (no second car), have one 19in tv
    with terrestrial/Saorview only. We went on a holiday in 2007. Last year, we managed a weekend in west Clare, and another in Tipperary (Thanks, Supervalue).

    I've worked from the age of 16, part time while in school; paid my way through college (no free fees in my time), and have never been out of work, even though not always in my chosen field.

    Thats all well and good but what about people like myself on the dole.

    €188 a week
    €50 for my daughters school
    €75 for rent
    Half the shopping with my partner (€25/€30 each)
    Petrol
    Try and pay something off bills so they dont get cut off

    Am i a scumbag living off people like you?

    My sister, who i dont speak to, is living the highlife you mentioned. 3 kids, 3 different fathers, 3 years younger than me and i can guarantee she doesnt have to worry about feeding herself like i do. I wouldnt paint myself with the same brush as her.


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    #124
    Sin City
    Registered Users Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭Sin City


    tails_naf wrote: »
    Harsh.

    I'm glad to see there are people at least willing to pay their own way, even when the 'benefits' may be more attractive. It clearly shows the character of the person.

    The problem is the system - Not everyone can get 50k+ jobs - so would you prefer this person to copy the neighbour down the road and live off the state?

    Not everyone can get a job in the first place , but they seem to be fair game . That poster should be glad he has a job , I'm sure given the chance there are plenty of people on the dole who would do his job and not bitch about it,


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    #125
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    The whole modern problem now since the collapse is... Irish citizens are turning against each other in a vile way.

    You can go on and on about dole scroungers, but the crystal clarity fact of the matter is that we are all struggling, so instead of attacking a person on the dole, people should start attacking the structure of the corrupt banking system and government and give the rest of us trying to get by, a break.

    It's like the Joneses, except a lot worse.


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    #126
    tails_naf
    Registered Users Posts: 861 ✭✭✭tails_naf


    Melion wrote: »
    Thats all well and good but what about people like myself on the dole.

    €188 a week
    €50 for my daughters school
    €75 for rent
    Half the shopping with my partner (€25/€30 each)
    Petrol
    Try and pay something off bills so they dont get cut off

    Am i a scumbag living off people like you?

    My sister, who i dont speak to, is living the highlife you mentioned. 3 kids, 3 different fathers, 3 years younger than me and i can guarantee she doesnt have to worry about feeding herself like i do. I wouldnt paint myself with the same brush as her.

    Absolutely not - of course your situation is different from your sisters.
    Your situation is the REASON dole should exist (assuming you are looking to get off the dole), your sisters is the REASON the system should be overhauled.

    The whole idea of dole is that it should be temporary, but this country has not seemed to grasp that idea (though it does seem to be making baby steps in the right direction).

    Multiple previous governments created a situation so open to abuse, that we have generations of families living on it, with no intention of working. This is not good for them, and it is not good for us.


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    #127
    skafish
    Registered Users Posts: 392 ✭✭skafish


    Sin City wrote: »
    Not everyone can get a job in the first place , but they seem to be fair game . That poster doyle be glad he has a job , I'm sure given the chance there are plenty of people on the dole who would do his job and not bitch about it,

    I'm not complaining about my job....... I'm dam glad to have one, and I'm happy to able to support my family.

    Its not the job I'm bitching about, its the fact that my taxes are used to fund life styles I can't afford for people who have never contributed anything to society.

    There is work available.... read the post above about the local council looking for temporary staff.

    I'm not trying to sound high and mighty, just venting a bit at the scroungers, and yes, I realise that not everybody on SW falls into the same category,


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    #128
    skafish
    Registered Users Posts: 392 ✭✭skafish


    Melion wrote: »
    Thats all well and good but what about people like myself on the dole.

    €188 a week
    €50 for my daughters school
    €75 for rent
    Half the shopping with my partner (€25/€30 each)
    Petrol
    Try and pay something off bills so they dont get cut off

    Am i a scumbag living off people like you?

    My sister, who i dont speak to, is living the highlife you mentioned. 3 kids, 3 different fathers, 3 years younger than me and i can guarantee she doesnt have to worry about feeding herself like i do. I wouldnt paint myself with the same brush as her.

    Apologies, my comments, though broad were not intended for the majority of people on SW who are trying to find work.

    Why €50 PW for your daughters school?
    Why no rent allowance?


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    #129
    KyussBishop
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,797 ✭✭✭KyussBishop


    skafish wrote: »
    There is work available.... read the post above about the local council looking for temporary staff.
    No; there is not enough work available. A year and a half ago, there were 26 people for every job vacancy, i.e. only enough jobs for 1 out of 26 of the unemployed:
    6a00d8342f650553ef016300281718970d-500wi


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    #130
    Melion
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,259 ✭✭✭✭Melion


    skafish wrote: »
    Apologies, my comments, though broad were not intended for the majority of people on SW who are trying to find work.

    Why €50 PW for your daughters school?
    Why no rent allowance?

    I pay the €50 a week for her playschool instead of maintenance straight to her mother.

    The place I'm living in doesn't qualify for RA. There are no houses/apartnents/cardboard boxes anywhere in my town or vicinity that qualify for the ridiculous rates.


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    #131
    carpejugulum
    Registered Users Posts: 523 ✭✭✭carpejugulum


    Melion wrote: »
    Thats all well and good but what about people like myself on the dole.

    €188 a week
    €50 for my daughters school
    €75 for rent
    Half the shopping with my partner (€25/€30 each)
    Petrol
    You live a comfortable life while contributing nothing to the economy. That's something not even many employed people can say.


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    #132
    Sin City
    Registered Users Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭Sin City


    skafish wrote: »
    I'm not complaining about my job....... I'm dam glad to have one, and I'm happy to able to support my family.

    Its not the job I'm bitching about, its the fact that my taxes are used to fund life styles I can't afford for people who have never contributed anything to society.

    There is work available.... read the post above about the local council looking for temporary staff.

    I'm not trying to sound high and mighty, just venting a bit at the scroungers, and yes, I realise that not everybody on SW falls into the same category,

    Bear in mind that those who have no intention of getting a job are in the minority of those on the dole. The majority would jump at the chance of having a job thus paying their way and contributing to society and thereby looking after their mental health. What they dont need is those who are in employment looking down their noses at them and saying they should be cut off or have their income reduced if they cant find work after say six months in an economy where there are roughly about 26 people applying for one job.

    Most people are suffering in this economy, I have no idea how anyone can live a comfortable life on 188 a week. When you look at your own bills and are finding it hard to pay imagine what some one on the dole can pay it

    If you think that there are some people playing the system and getting more than they should , then report those who are breaking the law and leave those who are really in need and just about surviving alone


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    #133
    Sin City
    Registered Users Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭Sin City


    carpejugulum wrote: »
    You live a comfortable life while contributing nothing to the economy. That's something not even many employed people can say.

    Feel free to give him your job and you can take up the dole to live a "Comfortable life"


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    #134
    Melion
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,259 ✭✭✭✭Melion


    carpejugulum wrote: »
    You live a comfortable life while contributing nothing to the economy. That's something not even many employed people can say.

    As I have stated already in this thread. I worked for 11 years straight after school,I held 3 jobs at one stage, paying taxes every week. If you think I have a comfortable life, I invite you to try it for a month.


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    #135
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    carpejugulum wrote: »
    You live a comfortable life while contributing nothing to the economy. That's something not even many employed people can say.


    You think €63 a week after housing and child costs is comfortable?

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #136
    tails_naf
    Registered Users Posts: 861 ✭✭✭tails_naf


    Sin City wrote: »
    Bear in mind that those who have no intention of getting a job are in the minority of those on the dole. The majority would jump at the chance of having a job thus paying their way and contributing to society and thereby looking after their mental health. What they dont need is those who are in employment looking down their noses at them and saying they should be cut off or have their income reduced if they cant find work after say six months in an economy where there are roughly about 26 people applying for one job.

    Most people are suffering in this economy, I have no idea how anyone can live a comfortable life on 188 a week. When you look at your own bills and are finding it hard to pay imagine what some one on the dole can pay it

    If you think that there are some people playing the system and getting more than they should , then report those who are breaking the law and leave those who are really in need and just about surviving alone

    yeah, you are right it is a minority who have no intention of working, but about 40,000 fall into that category, which us something that cannot be ignored, minority or not!


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    #137
    Sin City
    Registered Users Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭Sin City


    tails_naf wrote: »
    yeah, you are right it is a minority who have no intention of working, but about 40,000 fall into that category, which us something that cannot be ignored, minority or not!

    Where did you get that statistic?


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    #138
    Melion
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,259 ✭✭✭✭Melion


    tails_naf wrote: »
    yeah, you are right it is a minority who have no intention of working, but about 40,000 fall into that category, which us something that cannot be ignored, minority or not!

    Where did you pull that number from?


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    #139
    carpejugulum
    Registered Users Posts: 523 ✭✭✭carpejugulum


    Sin City wrote: »
    The majority would jump at the chance of having a job.
    Definitely not any job, and that's one of the big problems.


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    #140
    KELTICKNIGHTT
    Registered Users Posts: 3,799 ✭✭✭KELTICKNIGHTT


    carpejugulum wrote: »
    Definitely not any job, and that's one of the big problems.

    a job should at very least allow people to live, pay there bills or rent, mortgage
    buy food, clothes,


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    #141
    Sin City
    Registered Users Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭Sin City


    carpejugulum wrote: »
    Definitely not any job, and that's one of the big problems.

    As long as the job was a full time paying job which would be better than the dole then yes, people would jump at it


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    #142
    Catkins407
    Closed Accounts Posts: 132 ✭✭Catkins407


    I would like to point out that if you are working you can also get benefits. For example you can get lone parents and Fis if you are a single parent and you can get fis if your married or shacked up and your income is under a certain limit. You also get a medical card. Usually given for three years at a time and if you don't qualify for a medical card you get a gp services card usually once your income is under a certain limit. You don't need any contributions to get those payments and usually these people are not really contributing much to society at all financially as they are getting most of it back in benefits. I know the payments have been dropped a little in recent years but you can still get both those payments.

    Also I worked for many years and did not go badgering students drinking their grant money in pubs for my tax money back. These self same students who emigrated after graduating and never had any intention of working in Ireland.
    Also I workedin a call centre that was littered with graduates all on low incomes getting lone parents and fis and not paying much back in the way of tax .

    These payments are usually hassle free. No having to give bank statements to the sw every six months like you do if you are on lone parents and not working. Medicals cards given for 3 years at a time but if your on carers you have to begging to get it renewed every year for your seriously ill child. Oh and most of these people had private health insurance with their jobs but used the medical card anyway. Most of these people are working but are getting quite a lot in state benefits anyway. I had to leave my job due to my sons health but I was getting more per week from social welfare when I was working than I do now on carers.

    So if you want to spit your bile at people you better include all those people on low incomes and part timers who technically are working but taking a nice chunk from the state too. Go tell them how to live their lives too.


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    #143
    carpejugulum
    Registered Users Posts: 523 ✭✭✭carpejugulum


    Melion wrote: »
    More bull
    You already admitted you refused at least 2 offers.
    Sin City wrote: »
    As long as the job was a full time paying job which would be better than the dole then yes, people would jump at it
    If the dole can be higher than min wage, then the dole obviously needs to be cut.


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    #144
    Sin City
    Registered Users Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭Sin City


    carpejugulum wrote: »
    You already admitted you refused at least 2 offers.


    If the dole can be higher than min wage, then the dole obviously needs to be cut.

    Or minimum wage should be raised


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    #145
    carpejugulum
    Registered Users Posts: 523 ✭✭✭carpejugulum


    Sin City wrote: »
    Or minimum wage should be raised
    It actually should be cut along with welfare.


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    #146
    Sin City
    Registered Users Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭Sin City


    carpejugulum wrote: »
    It actually should be cut along with welfare.


    Only if the cost of living is reduced accordingly

    Also cutting the minimum wage will only mask the problem

    People might have jobs but they will be still be caught in the poverty trap
    Things wont have changed , sure the figures will look better but thats it

    As for welfare cuts, how are people to survive
    Most cant survive as it is, how do you expect them to survive with the cuts

    All well and good you saying to get a job, but if they cant. If they want to work but actually cant seem to get one, possibly due to the numbers who are applying to the same job, how are they to survive on reduced income? Seriously?


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    #147
    SCOOP 64
    Registered Users Posts: 5,236 ✭✭✭SCOOP 64


    carpejugulum wrote: »
    It actually should be cut along with welfare.

    But that might effect the poorest people in the country,you wouldn't want that.


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    #148
    Doublelime
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 165 ✭✭Doublelime


    I don't see why the lazy on the people would want to get off it. They can get the dole and during the week they can provide services in the black market so they don't have to pay income tax. It's a win win situation for them.


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    #149
    Sin City
    Registered Users Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭Sin City


    Doublelime wrote: »
    I don't see why the lazy on the people would want to get off it. They can get the dole and during the week they can provide services in the black market so they don't have to pay income tax. It's a win win situation for them.


    Yeah, cuz everyone on the dole is involved in the black market. They all work together and hatch plans on what to flog while down the old post office yeah?

    Come back to reality


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    #150
    firemansam4
    Registered Users Posts: 1,700 ✭✭✭firemansam4


    carpejugulum wrote: »
    You already admitted you refused at least 2 offers.

    Was that 2 job offers from abroad?? get off your high horse, you cant expect anyone to have to do that!!

    There are some very reasonable comments been made in here about a section of society who just sponge and have no real interest in finding a job.

    But some of the comments iv'e seen being made in my opinion are shameful, and expecting someone to have to leave the country and his family to find work is totally unrealistic!!


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    #151
    nesf
    Registered Users Posts: 27,645 ✭✭✭✭nesf


    firemansam4 wrote: »
    But some of the comments iv'e seen being made in my opinion are shameful, and expecting someone to have to leave the country and his family to find work is totally unrealistic!!

    I've family who've had to do exactly that. Their skills over so many years were so tightly focused in construction and related industries that there is no work for them here. None, they were willing to work anywhere in the country. The ones who moved were too old to realistically retrain (10 years or so to retirement) so they had to move to Dubai and similar to find work. A wife and several children were left behind in one case (the kids being secondary/college age).

    It's not unrealistic, it's the actual reality for some people. Which is horrible.


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